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Re: Porcupine quills - used in period?

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  • squire009
    ... Porcupines are Old World, as well, Wiki says the name comes from the Middle French porc d épine thorny pork . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porcupine
    Message 1 of 7 , Sep 4, 2007
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      --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "Karen" <kareni@...> wrote:
      >
      > I have about a sandwich baggie full [they are in a plastic container,
      > fortunately] of porcupine quills. I looked and didn't see any use in
      > period, but I could have missed something...I know they were used by
      > Native Americans, but how about in Europe? Europeans were aware of
      > porcupines [vis-a-vis manticores and the porky's use as one of Louis
      > XII's symbols] but did they ever do anything besides admire the
      > porcupine's ability to fend off attackers?
      >
      > Eydís Gunnarsdóttir
      >

      Porcupines are Old World, as well, Wiki says the name comes from the
      Middle French porc d'épine "thorny pork".
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porcupine

      Alcyoneus
    • Sandra Dodd
      I m sorry I don t know the answer to the quill-use question, but am still on side business about porcupines. -=-Porcupines are Old World, as well, Wiki says
      Message 2 of 7 , Sep 4, 2007
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        I'm sorry I don't know the answer to the quill-use question, but am
        still on side business about porcupines.

        -=-Porcupines are Old World, as well, Wiki says the name comes from the
        Middle French porc d'épine "thorny pork".
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porcupine-=-

        That would be "thorny pig."

        There were porcupines in Europe, too (slightly different ones).
        http://www.sandiegozoo.org/animalbytes/t-porcupine.html

        Because I've recommended etymology, I want to expand a little bit.

        "Alligator" comes from Spanish, "el lagarto" and there was a very
        early period term in English, used in my first husband's name, James
        Alagarto of Duckford. But it doesn't mean there were alligators in
        Spain. Spanish explorers named them when they saw them (in Florida,
        I think), and the English explorers picked the name up from them.

        Telephone is a Greek word, but the ancient Greeks didn't have
        telephones. Still, there are times when citations of use of a word
        in period IS proof of the existence of the object or the concept.

        Some of the oldest things we have and use are words, and though some
        people don't care to sort the old words and phrases from the new
        ones, it's a fun hobby (and cheap!) for those who have the interest.

        AElflaed of Duckford
        Outlands



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Kathleen Keeler
        ... So, apparently parts of Europe had them available, but in contrast to North America, in the south, not the north. And as a terrestrial not arborial
        Message 3 of 7 , Sep 4, 2007
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          > > I have about a sandwich baggie full [they are in a plastic container,
          > > fortunately] of porcupine quills. I looked and didn't see any use in
          > > period, but I could have missed something...I know they were used by
          > > Native Americans, but how about in Europe? Europeans were aware of
          > > porcupines [vis-a-vis manticores and the porky's use as one of Louis
          > > XII's symbols] but did they ever do anything besides admire the
          > > porcupine's ability to fend off attackers?
          > >
          > > Eydís Gunnarsdóttir
          > >
          >
          > Porcupines are Old World, as well, Wiki says the name comes from the
          > Middle French porc d'épine "thorny pork".
          > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porcupine
          > <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porcupine>
          >
          > Alcyoneus
          >
          > _
          > According to my "Natural History of Europe" by Paul Hamlin: the
          > common or crested porcupine is found in south Italy and the central
          > Balkans. "a rodent with powerful gnawing teeth capable of tackling a
          > wide range of vegetable foodstuffs. ...dusk and noctural animals
          > living in cultivated areas."


          So, apparently parts of Europe had them available, but in contrast to
          North America, in the south, not the north. And as a terrestrial not
          arborial animal.

          (yahoo drives me crazy trying to edit to reply to messages. This is a
          test: as I write it's appearing along the right margin and now on the
          bottom. Suggestions welcome.)
          Agnes deLanvallei


          > _,_._,__



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Amy Heilveil
          I have not seen any references to these being used as scribal tools in Europe during the SCA time frame. Sorry. :( I m not the end all and be all of scribal
          Message 4 of 7 , Sep 4, 2007
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            I have not seen any references to these being used as scribal tools in
            Europe during the SCA time frame. Sorry. :( I'm not the end all and
            be all of scribal sources, but I'm fairly extensively read on the
            topic.

            OTOH, you could use them and envelope the 'holding' end in a fitted
            wooden tube. You'd get to use them and it wouldn't look odd.

            How are they for writing? I really like my fowl quills.

            Smiles,
            Despina de la just sticking my nose in for a minute
          • Diane Sawyer Dooley
            Try replying via web post. I d do it myself with this reply, but the government network I m on blocks access to Yahoo!Groups. Not Yahoo!Mail, not Yahoo!,
            Message 5 of 7 , Sep 4, 2007
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              Try replying via web post. I'd do it myself with this reply, but the government network I'm on blocks access to Yahoo!Groups. Not Yahoo!Mail, not Yahoo!, just Yahoo!Groups. Go figure.

              Tasha

              ----- Original Message ----
              From: Kathleen Keeler <kkeeler1@...>
              {snip}
              (yahoo drives me crazy trying to edit to reply to messages. This is a
              test: as I write it's appearing along the right margin and now on the
              bottom. Suggestions welcome.)
              Agnes deLanvallei

              {snip}



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            • Karen
              ... I suppose I should clarify; these aren t those humongous ones from African porcupines, these are the skinny little ones that you can cut off the ends and
              Message 6 of 7 , Sep 5, 2007
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                --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "Amy Heilveil" <amyheilveil@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > I have not seen any references to these being used as scribal tools in
                > Europe during the SCA time frame.

                I suppose I should clarify; these aren't those humongous ones from
                African porcupines, these are the skinny little ones that you can cut
                off the ends and use as essentially very long bugle beads. With a
                diameter of only about 3/64" and not a lot of tensile strength, they
                aren't very useful for writing. Wish they were; at least I could do
                something period with them.

                Eydís
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