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Re: [Authentic_SCA] Re: onionskin dyeing

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  • annikki@comcast.net
    So after making lots of red cabbage juice for a classroom science lab this morning, and given the onion skin dyeing thread... I have to ask... Red cabbage ---
    Message 1 of 7 , Aug 31 7:00 AM
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      So after making lots of red cabbage juice for a classroom science lab this morning, and given the onion skin dyeing thread... I have to ask...

      Red cabbage --- period or not? What else would you add, not knowing much about dyeing (mordant is the word I'm looking for, I think)? What color does it end up? Maybe someday I might make red cabbage juice for fun and not work!

      Adele
    • Amy Heilveil
      ... Yes, it s period. I have no idea if it was ever used for dying though. Smiles, Despina de la German food mmmmmmm [Non-text portions of this message have
      Message 2 of 7 , Aug 31 7:12 AM
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        >
        > Red cabbage --- period or not? What else would you add, not knowing much
        > about dyeing (mordant is the word I'm looking for, I think)? What color does
        > it end up? Maybe someday I might make red cabbage juice for fun and not
        > work!

        Yes, it's period. I have no idea if it was ever used for dying though.
        Smiles,
        Despina de la German food mmmmmmm


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Susan B. Farmer
        ... I don t know -- I ll have to see what I can find out. HOwever, according to this web page (presented without references) the first mention of red cabbage
        Message 3 of 7 , Aug 31 7:45 AM
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          Quoting annikki@...:

          > So after making lots of red cabbage juice for a classroom science lab
          > this morning, and given the onion skin dyeing thread... I have to
          > ask...
          >
          > Red cabbage --- period or not? What else would you add, not knowing
          > much about dyeing (mordant is the word I'm looking for, I think)?
          > What color does it end up? Maybe someday I might make red cabbage
          > juice for fun and not work!
          >

          I don't know -- I"ll have to see what I can find out. HOwever,
          according to this web page (presented without references) the first
          mention of red cabbage is 1570 in England.
          <http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/plantanswers/publications/vegetabletravelers/cabbage.html>

          Now, it's a page on the Texas A&M web site, so I'd say that the
          information has a higher-than-average probability for being correct.

          Trivial point that may affect dying -- all red and blue plant pigments
          (with one exception) are a class of compounds called Anthocyanins. It's
          the pH that determines whether the color is red or blue (think pink and
          blue hydrangeas!). The exception is found in the members of the
          Caryophyllaceae -- the Pink/Carnation family -- those red pigments are
          a class of compounds called betalains.

          This information could be useful in that if a dying process works for
          one anthosyanin based pigment, it is likely possible that that same
          "recipe" will produce similar results on another anthocyanin-based
          pigment. It would at least be a good starting point.

          Jerusha
          -----
          Susan Farmer
          sfarmer@...
          University of Tennessee
          Department of Ecology and Evolutionary Biology
          http://www.goldsword.com/sfarmer/Trillium/
        • Katherine Throckmorton
          ... Period. If you have _The Well Dressed Peasant_ by Drea Leed, there is a red cabbage (as well as a couple of green ones) on the cover. The cover
          Message 4 of 7 , Aug 31 8:53 AM
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            >
            > Red cabbage --- period or not?

            Period. If you have _The Well Dressed Peasant_ by Drea Leed, there is a red cabbage (as well as a couple of green ones) on the cover. The cover illustration is taken from "Market Woman with a vegtable stall" by Pieter Aertsen painted c. 1567.
            >
            >What else would you add, not
            > knowing much about dyeing (mordant is the word I'm looking for, I
            > think)? What color does it end up? Maybe someday I might make red
            > cabbage juice for fun and not work!

            I've heard that regardless of mordant, cabbage juice gives a very pretty and very fugative, purple, but I haven't tested it to find out.

            -Katherine

            Every weekend, we gather hundreds of people together, none of whom have had enough sleep.
            -Robin's Unified Theory of SCA Dynamics


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          • dona_violante
            ... pretty and very fugative, purple, but I haven t tested it to find out. Based on what I ve read, it sounds like most plant juices are fugitive, including
            Message 5 of 7 , Aug 31 9:27 AM
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              >
              > I've heard that regardless of mordant, cabbage juice gives a very
              pretty and very fugative, purple, but I haven't tested it to find out.

              Based on what I've read, it sounds like most plant "juices" are
              fugitive, including berry juices.

              Now, *bug* juices...that's a different story. ;)

              Cheers,
              Violante
              http://www.spanishpeacock.com/violante.htm
            • Lady_Lark_Azure
              ... Okay, that one made me do a double take, since the lady of our house refers to Cool-Aid and such drinks as bug juice . I do know that Tumeric turns
              Message 6 of 7 , Aug 31 11:25 AM
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                >
                > Now, *bug* juices...that's a different story. ;)
                >
                Okay, that one made me do a double take, since the lady of our house
                refers to Cool-Aid and such drinks as "bug juice".

                I do know that Tumeric turns Tupperware a nice yellow ;)

                I've seen some of the colors Thora Sharptooth has come up with from
                the period dyestuffs (frequently grown in her garden). There were
                some really wonderful saturated yellows and greens. Here's the link
                to her textiles page. Scroll down for the links on dying.

                http://www.cs.vassar.edu/~capriest/textileres.html

                She gives both bibliographies and period dyestuffs.


                Isabeau
              • lilinah@earthlink.net
                ... Period for eating, yes. Period for dyeing, i really doubt it. It s very fugitive. The dye color varies in acidic and alkaline environments. I ve used it to
                Message 7 of 7 , Aug 31 6:48 PM
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                  Adele wrote:
                  >So after making lots of red cabbage juice for a classroom science
                  >lab this morning, and given the onion skin dyeing thread... I have
                  >to ask...
                  >
                  >Red cabbage --- period or not? What else would you add, not knowing
                  >much about dyeing (mordant is the word I'm looking for, I think)?
                  >What color does it end up? Maybe someday I might make red cabbage
                  >juice for fun and not work!

                  Period for eating, yes.

                  Period for dyeing, i really doubt it. It's very fugitive. The dye
                  color varies in acidic and alkaline environments. I've used it to dye
                  Easter eggs with some vinegar - made a nice light blue. It may stain
                  your clothes but it doesn't really dye them...

                  Back to onion skins - i've used them to make a wide range of colors
                  from medium warm yellow-brown, to bright yellow, to orange. The color
                  rather depends on the material you're dyeing, what mordants you use,
                  the minerals in your water, the concentration of the dye bath, how
                  long you leave it in the dye bath, etc.

                  But from what i can tell, onion skins weren't used much in period.
                  --
                  Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
                  the persona formerly known as Anahita
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