Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [Authentic_SCA] Re: onionskin dyeing WAS: dye, cheap and easy (in Jan. 20...

Expand Messages
  • Amy Heilveil
    On saffron dying.... In the groups photos section, the file named Bogdan and Despina, second row, third picture, named Dorthea . The sleeves that are yellow
    Message 1 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
    • 0 Attachment
      On saffron dying....
      In the groups photos section,
      the file named Bogdan and Despina,
      second row, third picture,
      named 'Dorthea'.
      The sleeves that are yellow are saffron dyed. I did 4 yards of habitoi silk
      and less than an ounce of saffron; this is the color it came out. I was very
      pleased. It hasn't faded in the sunlight any of the times I've worn the
      outfit.
      Hope this helps,
      Smiles,
      Despina de la really liked the color


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • borderlands15213
      Isn t now, or very soon, pomegranate season? Seems to me a non-SCA friend starts getting antsy right about this time of year for his annual pomegranate orgy.
      Message 2 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
      • 0 Attachment
        Isn't now, or very soon, pomegranate season? Seems to me a non-SCA
        friend starts getting antsy right about this time of year for his
        annual pomegranate orgy.

        Yseult the Gentle

        --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "dona_violante"
        <dona_violante@c...> wrote:
        >
        > > Note: *if* you can afford it, saffron makes a pleasant yellow
        dye.
        > It's
        > > hideously expensive, though.
        >
        > You can find saffron cheaper if you go to an ethnic grocer, BUT
        make
        > sure that what you are buying really is saffron. If it's "powdered
        > saffron" don't do it! And safflower petals are sometimes marketed
        > as "Azafran" as though they were saffron as well, and you won't get
        > nearly the same results.
        >
        > But as long as we're talking about yellow dyes from food stuffs,
        don't
        > pomegranate rinds give yellow as well? (If you can find them,
        anyway -
        > I haven't seen pomegranates in my local stores in forever.)
        >
        > Cheers,
        > Violante
        > http://www.spanishpeacock.com/violante.htm
      • dona_violante
        ... Onions are probably fine, and ... from, but I can ... Pomegranate comes from French pomme de Granada , aka, Grandan Apple . Turmeric was also available
        Message 3 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
        • 0 Attachment
          > Since my persona is Spanish, saffron is a logical dye choice.
          Onions are probably fine, and
          > aren't pomegranates Mediteranean? I don't know where turmeric comes
          from, but I can
          > handle this level of potential dissonance for now.

          Pomegranate comes from French "pomme de Granada", aka, "Grandan
          Apple". Turmeric was also available in medieval Spain (as an import,
          I believe). Yellow could also be achieved with weld, Avignon Berry
          (aka Dyer's Buckthorn), and an Old World plant called "smoke tree"
          which apparently dyed similarly to the New World dye, fustic. And if
          later period is OK, fustic is definitely an option. I've heard you
          can get yellow from black oak bark as well.

          Now, just because something *could* be used to dye fiber, doesn't
          necessarily mean it was used for that. As has already been pointed
          out, turmeric isn't necessarily light fast and saffron was probably
          too expensive for general use.

          That still doesn't answer your question about what you should use for
          this particular project...but it gives you an idea of the variety of
          dyes that would have been available. ;)

          (Guess who's currently working on a Tournaments Illuminated article
          about the dyestuffs of medieval Spain...?)

          Cheers,
          Violante
          http://www.spanishpeacock.com/violante.htm
        • dona_violante
          ... Onions are probably fine, and ... from, but I can ... Pomegranate comes from French pomme de Granada , aka, Grandan Apple . Turmeric was also available
          Message 4 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
          • 0 Attachment
            > Since my persona is Spanish, saffron is a logical dye choice.
            Onions are probably fine, and
            > aren't pomegranates Mediteranean? I don't know where turmeric comes
            from, but I can
            > handle this level of potential dissonance for now.

            Pomegranate comes from French "pomme de Granada", aka, "Grandan
            Apple". Turmeric was also available in medieval Spain (as an import,
            I believe). Yellow could also be achieved with weld, Avignon Berry
            (aka Dyer's Buckthorn), and an Old World plant called "smoke tree"
            which apparently dyed similarly to the New World dye, fustic. And if
            later period is OK, fustic is definitely an option. I've heard you
            can get yellow from black oak bark as well.

            Now, just because something *could* be used to dye fiber, doesn't
            necessarily mean it was used for that. As has already been pointed
            out, turmeric isn't necessarily light fast and saffron was probably
            too expensive for general use.

            That still doesn't answer your question about what you should use for
            this particular project...but it gives you an idea of the variety of
            dyes that would have been available. ;)

            (Guess who's currently working on a Tournaments Illuminated article
            about the dyestuffs of medieval Spain...?)

            Cheers,
            Violante
            http://www.spanishpeacock.com/violante.htm
          • lilinah@earthlink.net
            ... Turmeric is a rhizome related to ginger that grows in Southeast Asia. It has been cultivated by humans for so long that there are no wild cultivars. For a
            Message 5 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
            • 0 Attachment
              Joya wrote:
              >I don't know where turmeric comes from, but I can
              >handle this level of potential dissonance for now.

              Turmeric is a rhizome related to ginger that grows in Southeast Asia.
              It has been cultivated by humans for so long that there are no wild
              cultivars.

              For a little info and photos see:
              <http://www.uni-graz.at/~katzer/engl/generic_noframe.html?Curc_lon.html>

              In cooking turmeric is NO substitute for saffron. While both have a
              powerful yellow color, saffron adds a remarkable fragrance and
              flavor. Turmeric isn't flavorless - in fact, it can be a bit bitter -
              but in the quantities usually called for it is essentially flavorless
              and is used chiefly to add color.

              To the best of my knowledge, turmeric doesn't seem to have been
              imported to Europe much in SCA period. It would have been seen as a
              poor substitute for saffron, unless it had medicinal uses, which it
              does in Southeast Asia.

              --
              Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
              the persona formerly known as Anahita
            • kittencat3@aol.com
              Weld was *the* yellow dyestuff of choice for medieval Europe...I believe goldenrod as a dyeplant is an American import. But I could be wrong :) Sarah
              Message 6 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                Weld was *the* yellow dyestuff of choice for medieval Europe...I believe
                goldenrod as a dyeplant is an American import. But I could be wrong :)

                Sarah


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • sue_clemenger
                Going on four years now. It s not quite the same level of screaming yellow it was, but it s still pretty strong. --maire ... before ... and linen
                Message 7 of 17 , Aug 30, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Going on four years now. It's not quite the same level of screaming
                  yellow it was, but it's still pretty strong.
                  --maire

                  --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, kittencat3@a... wrote:
                  > How long has the color lasted? I've seen turmeric-dyed linen bleach
                  before
                  > my eyes on a sunny day, and the same thing happened to silk, wool,
                  and linen
                  > samples in the A&S exhibition at Pennsic. Very interesting.
                  >
                  > Thanks.
                  >
                  > Sarah Davies
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • willo
                  ... Now I really want to try a really scientific experiment with turmeric to see what happens for myself. :) Ladies, do you recall the details of your
                  Message 8 of 17 , Aug 31, 2005
                  • 0 Attachment
                    --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "sue_clemenger" <sue_clemenger@y...> wrote:
                    > Going on four years now. It's not quite the same level of screaming
                    > yellow it was, but it's still pretty strong.
                    > --maire
                    >
                    > --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, kittencat3@a... wrote:
                    > > How long has the color lasted? I've seen turmeric-dyed [silk, wool,
                    > > and linen] bleach... on a sunny day

                    Now I really want to try a really "scientific" experiment with turmeric to see what happens
                    for myself. :) Ladies, do you recall the details of your techniques? Maybe there were
                    differences in dyestuffs, mordants, times, and/or temps? Or perhaps water quality/
                    hardness/softness has an effect? Could UV levels be wildly different in your respective
                    locations?

                    But for now, I've got to get back to sewing, or I will be undressed this weekend. Science
                    must wait.

                    --Joya
                  • Katherine Throckmorton
                    ... Let me see....I used a new bag of tumeric from a Indian grocery. I don t recall the exact proportions but I probobly used 1/2 a cup to a cup in 3-4
                    Message 9 of 17 , Aug 31, 2005
                    • 0 Attachment
                      > Ladies, do you recall the details of your
                      > techniques? Maybe there were
                      > differences in dyestuffs, mordants, times, and/or temps? Or perhaps
                      > water quality/
                      > hardness/softness has an effect? Could UV levels be wildly
                      > different in your respective
                      > locations?


                      Let me see....I used a new bag of tumeric from a Indian grocery. I don't recall the exact proportions but I probobly used 1/2 a cup to a cup in 3-4 gallons of water. I was dying about 1 yard of medium weight linen. I simmered the whole thing for a couple of hours, then rinsed the fabric out in cold water once it had cooled to lukewarm.
                      I live in Arizona and the sunbonnet that I made (for ACW, not SCA) was worn at events in AZ and New Mexico. This means very hard water and high UV. I wore the bonnet to 4 or 5 weekend events over the course of a year and then stopped.
                      I stopped because there was something about the color that bugged horses, which can be a safety issue at larger ACW events. By the end of the year the bonnet was perhaps *slightly* lighter, but not much.

                      -Katherine
                      >
                      > But for now, I've got to get back to sewing, or I will be undressed
                      > this weekend. Science
                      > must wait.
                      >
                      > --Joya



                      Every weekend, we gather hundreds of people together, none of whom have had enough sleep.
                      -Robin's Unified Theory of SCA Dynamics


                      --
                      _______________________________________________

                      Search for businesses by name, location, or phone number. -Lycos Yellow Pages

                      http://r.lycos.com/r/yp_emailfooter/http://yellowpages.lycos.com/default.asp?SRC=lycos10
                    • ranvaig@columbus.rr.com
                      ... Safflower is a poor substitute for saffron in cooking, but Safflower is a period dye in its own right. It contains both a yellow and a red pigment and was
                      Message 10 of 17 , Sep 3, 2005
                      • 0 Attachment
                        >
                        >You can find saffron cheaper if you go to an ethnic grocer, BUT make
                        >sure that what you are buying really is saffron. If it's "powdered
                        >saffron" don't do it! And safflower petals are sometimes marketed
                        >as "Azafran" as though they were saffron as well, and you won't get
                        >nearly the same results.

                        Safflower is a poor substitute for saffron in cooking, but Safflower
                        is a period dye in its own right. It contains both a yellow and a
                        red pigment and was usually processed to obtain the red dye. I've
                        seen comments that it is not entirely lightfast, but I'm not sure if
                        that is the red or the yellow. It also has been used as a cosmetic
                        and food color.

                        ranvaig
                      • lilinah@earthlink.net
                        ... Do you have any more info on safflower s use in cosmetics? I m especially interested in Southwest Asia (aka Middle East), South Asia, and Central Asia. --
                        Message 11 of 17 , Sep 4, 2005
                        • 0 Attachment
                          ranvaig wrote:
                          >Safflower is a poor substitute for saffron in cooking, but Safflower
                          >is a period dye in its own right. It contains both a yellow and a
                          >red pigment and was usually processed to obtain the red dye. I've
                          >seen comments that it is not entirely lightfast, but I'm not sure if
                          >that is the red or the yellow. It also has been used as a cosmetic
                          >and food color.

                          Do you have any more info on safflower's use in cosmetics? I'm
                          especially interested in Southwest Asia (aka Middle East), South
                          Asia, and Central Asia.
                          --
                          Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
                          the persona formerly known as Anahita
                        • kittencat3@aol.com
                          Neither of the safflower dyes is lightfast. And it is a tremendous bother to process out the yellow dye to get the pink, especially when brazilwood produces
                          Message 12 of 17 , Sep 4, 2005
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Neither of the safflower dyes is lightfast. And it is a tremendous bother to
                            process out the yellow dye to get the pink, especially when brazilwood
                            produces just about the same shades and is much more convenient to use.

                            Sarah Davies


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • dona_violante
                            ... bother to ... brazilwood ... use. ... Yeah but...it sounds like such fun to try! http://reconstructinghistory.com/japanese/safflower.html It s on my dyeing
                            Message 13 of 17 , Sep 6, 2005
                            • 0 Attachment
                              > Neither of the safflower dyes is lightfast. And it is a tremendous
                              bother to
                              > process out the yellow dye to get the pink, especially when
                              brazilwood
                              > produces just about the same shades and is much more convenient to
                              use.
                              >

                              Yeah but...it sounds like such fun to try!

                              http://reconstructinghistory.com/japanese/safflower.html

                              It's on my dyeing to-do list. But then, so are a lot of other
                              dyes! ;)

                              Cheers,
                              Violante
                              http://www.spanishpeacock.com/violante.htm
                            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.