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Re: Ah, bartering --an idea

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  • wodeford
    ... I have any ... You just have to be imaginative about what constitutes valuable bartering capital. We ve already talked about trading material goods for
    Message 1 of 29 , Jul 30 5:48 PM
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      --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "Iolanthe" <darklyviolet@y...>
      wrote:
      > I think it's a great idea. I'd love to take part, but I don't think
      I have any
      > skills worth bartering with.

      You just have to be imaginative about what constitutes valuable
      bartering capital. We've already talked about trading material goods
      for services. It doesn't necessarily have to be raw materials a
      craftsman wants, it can be a plate of fudge or a case of beer. Make
      that good beer.

      Think about what skills you do have. How can you make them work for
      you? Can you wash dishes? Can you pitch a tent? Can you watch
      somebody's kids for an hour or so? These may be services you can
      trade, although these obviously work best when you're dealing with
      your local folks rather than listmembers across the country.

      I bet you can come up with something.

      Tuppenceworth,
      Jehanne de Wodeford
    • Melissa
      There is actually an SCA Barter list...but it s pretty dead. I think it s called WARBarter or something of the sort. If you made a new one, I would be in on it
      Message 2 of 29 , Jul 30 5:53 PM
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        There is actually an SCA Barter list...but it's pretty dead. I think
        it's called WARBarter or something of the sort.

        If you made a new one, I would be in on it *snap* that :D I love
        bartering, not only because I get stuff and get practice making stuff,
        but because then you meet new people :D things=relationships that way!

        Elspeth the Social :D

        >
        > ***snip***
        >
        > > How about we create a barter pool for the list? Email me things
        > you'd
        > > like to have/made and what you're willing to barter it for. I'll
        > > create a spread sheet and post it.
        >
        > ***snip***
        >
        > > What do folks think?
        > >
        > > Isabeau
        >
        > Personally, I *love* this idea. I truly appreciate that you are
        > offering your time and resources to create and upkeep it. I wonder
        > though, if there is a way to simply start a new discussion group
        > based upon it, to save you the work? I've never started one, so I
        > don't exactly know the perks and options available, but since there
        > is a 'garb4sale' group, I just thought it might work.... even though
        > I'd much rather have a nice and tidy spreadsheet. :D
        >
        > I hope your mega fundraiser goes well, and that you have a wonderful
        > Pennsic trip (I still haven't made it to one.. but SOMEDAY.. oh yes,
        > someday), because when you get back I'll have a list!! :)
        >
        > L. Keterlyn
      • Heather Rose Jones
        ... Keep in mind that skills aren t the only thing that can be bartered -- tedious unskilled gruntwork is also a barterable item. Suppose someone is
        Message 3 of 29 , Jul 30 6:08 PM
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          At 12:09 AM +0000 7/31/05, Iolanthe wrote:
          >I think it's a great idea. I'd love to take part, but I don't think
          >I have any
          >skills worth bartering with.

          Keep in mind that skills aren't the only thing that can be bartered
          -- tedious unskilled gruntwork is also a barterable item. Suppose
          someone is interested in an entirely hand-made whatsit but doesn't
          have either the time or patience to hand-whatsit for the necessary
          duration. You might be able to take their materials and whatsit away
          the hours in exchange for them doing something more concentrated in
          time but requiring specialized skills.

          Just as a random example: fingerloop braiding requires relatively
          little skill once you've learned the basics, but it can be tedious,
          especially if you were making enough cordage to lace a gown or tie up
          your points or something similar. It's the sort of product that it
          would be hard to price at what the labor is worth, but might well be
          barterable to someone who valued the end product enough.

          Another random example: handsewing seams and hems. Patience rather
          than skill is the keyword, and it might be fairly easy to find
          someone with the skills to design and cut garments for both of you in
          exchange for unskilled sewing labor, with both of you getting more
          authentic garments out of the bargain.

          Tangwystyl
          --
          *****
          Heather Rose Jones
          heather.jones@...
          <http://heatherrosejones.com>
          *****
        • Sharon L. Krossa
          ... I suggest, instead of doing it as an excel sheet, you take advantage of the existing database function provided to Authentic_SCA by Yahoo Groups:
          Message 4 of 29 , Jul 30 7:31 PM
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            At 6:12 PM +0000 7/30/05, Lady_Lark_Azure wrote:
            >Okay, so here's an idea and I'm willing to do the legwork on it (after
            ...
            >How about we create a barter pool for the list? Email me things you'd
            >like to have/made and what you're willing to barter it for. I'll
            >create a spread sheet and post it. That way you can look through what
            >other people can do and see if you can match up. You already know that
            >it's an authentically minded pool of people.

            I suggest, instead of doing it as an excel sheet, you take advantage
            of the existing database function provided to Authentic_SCA by Yahoo
            Groups: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Authentic_SCA/database>

            That way, you won't have to do much maintaining, but instead each
            individual could add and update their own entires. (The work part
            would be to figure out what sorts of fields should be in the database
            to make it most useful. At a minimum I suggest name, contact, &
            location info, what you're willing to do, and what you'd like to
            acquire.)

            Several people have suggested making another mailing list for
            bartering, but I see a lot of disadvantages of such an approach,
            especially if the name and description of it doesn't include the
            "Authentic" concept. I think without it, it could become minefield
            for those with the goal of using barter to acquire more authentic kit.

            Also, just in general if you already have the target audience in a
            mailing list/online group, including a bartering database as a
            feature of that group increases the chance that relevant parties will
            discover it and use it -- while if it is separate, it's more likely
            that many in the target audience won't ever hear of it.

            And it also occurs to me to ask: what would be discussed in the
            mailing list part of a bartering mailing list? Actual bartering
            arrangements should be arranged privately between the two parties
            involved, so you don't need a mailing list for that, just a database
            of potential parties and what they're offering to barter and what
            they'd like to acquire by barter.

            So, as said, I suggest using the Authentic_SCA group's database
            feature to make a bartering database.

            Affrick
            --
            Sharon L. Krossa, skrossa-ml@...
          • ketamina06
            ... think ... Exactly! At an event in Idaho several years ago, the fellow I was with and I showed up in our broken down-ish van. On the long drive there from
            Message 5 of 29 , Jul 30 8:31 PM
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              --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "wodeford" <wodeford@y...> wrote:
              > --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "Iolanthe" <darklyviolet@y...>
              > wrote:
              > > I think it's a great idea. I'd love to take part, but I don't
              think
              > I have any
              > > skills worth bartering with.
              >
              > You just have to be imaginative about what constitutes valuable
              > bartering capital. We've already talked about trading material goods
              > for services. It doesn't necessarily have to be raw materials a
              > craftsman wants, it can be a plate of fudge or a case of beer. Make
              > that good beer.

              Exactly! At an event in Idaho several years ago, the fellow I
              was 'with' and I showed up in our broken down-ish van. On the long
              drive there from SW Washington state, we had an emergency stop for a
              serious engine problem, and basically spent all our money fixing it on
              the way. Not only that, I also sprained my ankle mildly along the way
              (don't jump out of the van Ket, you clutz).

              So, with nothing more than our camping gear and a bit of food, we
              bartered for what we needed... at first I thought I had nothing to
              share and hated the thought of begging for necessary needs (we'd
              brought money for purchased meals; it was a long event and several
              really good food merchants were there and we thought we'd treat
              ourselves).

              Turns out I did of course have things to trade. One was helping to
              teach a class, impromtu, on making Scotch eggs, and of course they
              were a huge hit so many fighters and nobles commissioned the
              delightful meal-in-the-hand as barter. It ended up being one of my
              favourite and most memorable events. :)

              L. Keterlyn, who seems to be in a rambling mood today.
            • Mary Taran
              ... I m currently in a barter arrangement with a lady in another Kingdom. I m making her a pavilion and she s paying for the labor by supplying the canvas to
              Message 6 of 29 , Jul 30 10:16 PM
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                At 06:08 PM 7/30/2005, you wrote:

                >At 12:09 AM +0000 7/31/05, Iolanthe wrote:
                > >I think it's a great idea. I'd love to take part, but I don't think
                > >I have any
                > >skills worth bartering with.

                I'm currently in a barter arrangement with a lady in another Kingdom. I'm
                making her a pavilion and she's paying for the labor by supplying the
                canvas to make my new one at the same time she gets hers. She is
                reimbursing me in cash for the non-canvas bits (hub, spokes, tent stakes,
                etc.), but all of the labor costs are being managed by provision of
                non-cash items.

                Mary


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              • m d b
                ... of ... I m ... I for one would be happy with that barter:) Hooray!!! Heheh, actually I ve been thinking about the bartering this before I came back to read
                Message 7 of 29 , Jul 31 7:57 AM
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                  > I only wonder if my skills are worth much to anyone. I'm only a
                  > beginning seamstress, and that's my best SCA skill. OTOH, I sew
                  > exclusively by hand and could, for example, offer to hand-sew seams
                  of
                  > a garment someone else drafted and cut. Would that appeal to anyone?
                  > (I do tend toward perfectionism, and my stiches are quite small and
                  > regular. I think. <smile>)
                  > I find the cutting part of sewing completely horrifying--so afraid
                  I'm
                  > destroying my beautiful fabrics for nothing. The cost of buying nice
                  > fabric before being a skilled seamstress, perhaps? :)

                  I for one would be happy with that barter:) Hooray!!!

                  Heheh, actually I've been thinking about the bartering this before I
                  came back to read the list (I read it via the yahoogroups site)
                  because I want a lovely cutlery set for my late period Dutch (German
                  border) persona. They hang from girdles and can be seen in woodcuts
                  and portraits of women, very groovy little talking points.

                  But haven't been able to think of what I could barter (possibly a
                  portrait in the style of a woodcut by Jost Amman....) But you made me
                  realise I do have a skill to barter with: cutting and fitting. I
                  *love* drafting, especially with period consruction (I think the most
                  modern drafting/draping techniques I use are early 20thC;) )

                  I just helped somone with that recently. She made the garb up I fitted
                  and gave hints on how to cut the fabric and materials for support etc.

                  It was actually a nice lesson as well. There are things I would like
                  to have done to make the garb match my ideal, but had to back off
                  because I wasn't the one going to wear it or make use of the remaining
                  fabric;) My lessons in this were different to hers.

                  Willemyne van Nymegen
                  http://glittersweet.com
                • Diane Thompson
                  If anyone is interested in bartering.....I am Diane Thompson, I own/and operate Blackthistle Designs...I specialize in Celtic Renn and Scottish .....I have
                  Message 8 of 29 , Jul 31 10:26 AM
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                    If anyone is interested in bartering.....I am Diane Thompson, I own/and operate Blackthistle Designs...I specialize in Celtic Renn and Scottish .....I have been out of business essentially for a bit as my son and I lot everything in a fire in April...I did not however lose anything to do with my business as it was in another building...my son and I now have a home, I was able to rent something, but we have nothing in it,,,,money is a major issue,,my insurance has denied my claim and I have to go through an attorney and sue a Breach of Faith,,,this will possibly take awhile...in the meantime, we need everything and anything and I would be happy to sew, design, embroider, I do custom embroidery hand and/or machine....SCA garb or mundane...if anyone needs anything,,,,please consider us...thanks...


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                  • msgilliandurham
                    ... That s a *wonderful* skill, very valuable. Or if you were willing to hand sew trim or hems, those activities would find even more folks interested in your
                    Message 9 of 29 , Jul 31 10:58 AM
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                      --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "willo" <willolevin@y...> wrote:
                      > >[...] OTOH, I sew
                      > > exclusively by hand and could, for example, offer to
                      > > hand-sew seams of a garment someone else drafted and cut. Would
                      > > that appeal to anyone?

                      That's a *wonderful* skill, very valuable. Or if you were willing to
                      hand sew trim or hems, those activities would find even more folks
                      interested in your work. Go for it!

                      > --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "m d b" <vcairistiona@h...>
                      wrote:
                      > [...] But you made me
                      > realise I do have a skill to barter with: cutting and fitting.
                      > I *love* drafting, especially with period consruction (I think
                      > the most modern drafting/draping techniques I use are early 20thC;

                      Heck, you could barter that skill by making *mundane* clothes for
                      people! or rather the patterns. I am very fussy about the fit of my
                      clothes, and am rather an odd shape. Unhappily we live half-way across
                      the planet from each other ...

                      Gillian Durham
                    • Carmen Beaudry
                      ... (snip) ... Don t rule out non-SCA skills for your bartering. I trade sewing with the person who cuts and colors my hair. I ve also traded car work for
                      Message 10 of 29 , Jul 31 4:34 PM
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                        > At 12:09 AM +0000 7/31/05, Iolanthe wrote:
                        >>I think it's a great idea. I'd love to take part, but I don't think
                        >>I have any
                        >>skills worth bartering with.
                        >
                        > Keep in mind that skills aren't the only thing that can be bartered
                        > -- tedious unskilled gruntwork is also a barterable item. Suppose
                        > someone is interested in an entirely hand-made whatsit but doesn't
                        > have either the time or patience to hand-whatsit for the necessary
                        > duration. You might be able to take their materials and whatsit away
                        > the hours in exchange for them doing something more concentrated in
                        > time but requiring specialized skills.
                        (snip)

                        > Tangwystyl

                        Don't rule out non-SCA skills for your bartering. I trade sewing with the
                        person who cuts and colors my hair. I've also traded car work for sewing,
                        have a friend who's traded cooking for electrical work, etc.

                        Melusine
                      • jeffrey.heilveil@ndsu.edu
                        ... I think you underestimate the amount of time that people have for things. I know a number of people who are VERY interested in doing things authentically,
                        Message 11 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                          > So, what does someone with no money and no barterable skills do for an
                          > authentic kit? I am capable of making most things myself, it just
                          > takes me a very, very long time.

                          I think you underestimate the amount of time that people have for things.
                          I know a number of people who are VERY interested in doing things
                          authentically, like libraries, but don't have the time to hunt down
                          documentation for things. People like this must exist in your geographic
                          area as well (your personal geography, not that of your persona).

                          So if you are willing to hunt down documentation for them for their stuff,
                          and provide the documentation for what you want them to make (the latter
                          of which I routinely do when I barter), you should do fine.

                          Bogdan


                          -----------------------------------------------------------
                          Jeffrey S. Heilveil, Ph.D.
                          Postdoctoral Fellow
                          Department of Biological Sciences
                          North Dakota State University
                          Stevens Hall
                          Fargo, ND 58105
                          jeffrey.heilveil@...
                        • Laura Morgan
                          Yeah...we live in a town where the town grew up around a very old university. There is no parking associated with the library at all...and no public parking.
                          Message 12 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                            Yeah...we live in a town where the town grew up around a very old university. There is no parking associated with the library at all...and no public parking. absolutely none. you have to have some sort of university pass to park anywhere in that district of town. I have gone there several times and just considerred the parking ticket to be the fee for doing my research. But I still hate doing it because, technically you are breaking the law.

                            you never know what people's situations are.

                            as an aside...I just love how much great documentation is now available on the web. When I think back to when I first got started...okay I'm gonna stop with that thought because I am going to turn into my grandmother "when I was a kid, I had to walk uphill to school both ways in the freezing cold with no shoes..."

                            but really...Everyone who has contributed to the wealth now available, THANKYOU!!!

                            Laura





                            jeffrey.heilveil@... wrote:
                            > So, what does someone with no money and no barterable skills do for an
                            > authentic kit? I am capable of making most things myself, it just
                            > takes me a very, very long time.

                            I think you underestimate the amount of time that people have for things.
                            I know a number of people who are VERY interested in doing things
                            authentically, like libraries, but don't have the time to hunt down
                            documentation for things. People like this must exist in your geographic
                            area as well (your personal geography, not that of your persona).

                            So if you are willing to hunt down documentation for them for their stuff,
                            and provide the documentation for what you want them to make (the latter
                            of which I routinely do when I barter), you should do fine.

                            Bogdan


                            -----------------------------------------------------------
                            Jeffrey S. Heilveil, Ph.D.
                            Postdoctoral Fellow
                            Department of Biological Sciences
                            North Dakota State University
                            Stevens Hall
                            Fargo, ND 58105
                            jeffrey.heilveil@...



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                          • Laura Morgan
                            I am not sure that they made a distinction between fulling and felting...anybody know? I always was under the impression that there were just different
                            Message 13 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                              I am not sure that they made a distinction between fulling and felting...anybody know? I always was under the impression that there were just different degrees of fulling....

                              but if you want to heavilly full a woolen object, sometimes it makes it easier to throw some tennis balls into the drier with it to help it along.

                              In period, they sometimes fulled ut so much that they were able to raise a nap on the surface of the fabric. way cool!

                              the peirod method involved people stomping on it with their bare feet, I believe. so if you want to try the period method, you might want to get some friends involved and ply them with alchohol and some dance music.

                              you just need friction, heat, and moisture...
                              Laura


                              Melissa wrote:





                              Felted wool works just as well as a garter as fulled wool, IMHO. I've
                              used both, with pretty equivalent results.

                              Margaret Northwode, Evangelist of the Holy Fabric Trinity


                              Laura Morgan
                              with Aubrey & Booga





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                            • hawkhurstmanor@yahoo.com
                              If I may, I am new to the list but know a bit about felting/fulling. Felting is the layering of wool roving which is wet and worked wit the hands through
                              Message 14 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                                If I may, I am new to the list but know a bit about felting/fulling. Felting is the layering of wool roving which is wet and worked wit the hands through several steps into a layer that can be cut and/or shaped. Fulling is taking a woven wool fabric or piece of knitted work and soaking and working until the fibers connect and create more of a single piece rather than a network of yarn or thread. If you have seen the recent series on the History channel being a fuller was considered one of the worst jobs in history. The fulling was done in half barrels of mixed urines and it was stomped with the feet much like grapes. Nasty....but necessary to produce a fabric without drafts.

                                Elyn

                                Laura Morgan <valkerie1000@...> wrote:
                                I am not sure that they made a distinction between fulling and felting...anybody know? I always was under the impression that there were just different degrees of fulling....

                                but if you want to heavilly full a woolen object, sometimes it makes it easier to throw some tennis balls into the drier with it to help it along.

                                In period, they sometimes fulled ut so much that they were able to raise a nap on the surface of the fabric. way cool!

                                the peirod method involved people stomping on it with their bare feet, I believe. so if you want to try the period method, you might want to get some friends involved and ply them with alchohol and some dance music.

                                you just need friction, heat, and moisture...
                                Laura


                                Melissa wrote:





                                Felted wool works just as well as a garter as fulled wool, IMHO. I've
                                used both, with pretty equivalent results.

                                Margaret Northwode, Evangelist of the Holy Fabric Trinity


                                Laura Morgan
                                with Aubrey & Booga





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                              • Dianne and Greg
                                ... Or some willing children---we made felt as a children s activity at Southern Region (EK) Spring War Practice last spring and it was a huge hit! Laurensa
                                Message 15 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                                  > you just need friction, heat, and moisture...
                                  > Laura
                                  >


                                  Or some willing children---we made felt as a children's activity at Southern
                                  Region (EK) Spring War Practice last spring and it was a huge hit!

                                  Laurensa
                                • Tiffany Brown
                                  ... I have seen two hours of research into the topic of your choice given as a prize for a fighter auction tourney. Teffania
                                  Message 16 of 29 , Aug 1, 2005
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                                    On 8/1/05, jeffrey.heilveil@... <jeffrey.heilveil@...> wrote:

                                    > So if you are willing to hunt down documentation for them for their stuff,
                                    > and provide the documentation for what you want them to make (the latter
                                    > of which I routinely do when I barter), you should do fine.

                                    I have seen "two hours of research into the topic of your choice"
                                    given as a prize for a fighter auction tourney.

                                    Teffania
                                  • lilinah@earthlink.net
                                    ... There is a clear distinction between felting and fulling. Felting is done with somewhat cleaned wool, which has been carded to align the fibers. The
                                    Message 17 of 29 , Aug 2, 2005
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                                      Laura Morgan wrote:
                                      >I am not sure that they made a distinction between fulling and
                                      >felting...anybody know? I always was under the impression that
                                      >there were just different degrees of fulling....

                                      There is a clear distinction between felting and fulling.

                                      Felting is done with somewhat cleaned wool, which has been carded to
                                      align the fibers. The felting process takes essentially raw fiber and
                                      creates a textile from it.

                                      Fulling is done to an already created textile - such as weaving,
                                      knitting, etc. - made of wool yarn.
                                      --
                                      Urtatim (that's err-tah-TEEM)
                                      the persona formerly known as Anahita
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