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Re: [Authentic_SCA] Re: The problem with "saffron"

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  • Andrea Huwydd Lycsenbwrg
    ... This does sound yummy. I ll have to try it. I should have been more specific, though, about what I was looking for.... In the late 12th century, Gerald of
    Message 1 of 29 , May 9, 2005
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      --- glaukopisathene <phoenissa@...> wrote:
      > --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Andrea Huwydd
      > Lycsenbwrg
      > <huwydd@y...> wrote:
      > >
      > > Does anyone have a recipe for a dish made with
      > milk
      > > and saffron?
      > >
      > > Andrea
      >
      > Oooh! I have a really tasty one that I just tried
      > last week.

      This does sound yummy. I'll have to try it.

      I should have been more specific, though, about what
      I was looking for.... In the late 12th century,
      Gerald of Wales wrote down what he was told by a
      priest who used to visit the Little People as a boy:
      "They never ate meat or fish. They lived on various
      milk dishes, made up into junkets flavoured with
      saffron."

      Now, if they didn't eat meat, I can't see them making
      an actual junket, which is coagulated with rennet, so
      I interpret that as simply some sort of pudding or
      cheese-type dish.

      Andrea



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    • Andrea Huwydd Lycsenbwrg
      ... 12th century Wales. Given the dearth of period Welsh cookbooks, however, the approved method seems to be to pick up references to whatever food one can in
      Message 2 of 29 , May 9, 2005
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        --- jeffrey.heilveil@... wrote:
        >
        > > Does anyone have a recipe for a dish made with
        > milk
        > > and saffron?
        > >
        > > Andrea
        >
        > From what time period?

        12th century Wales. Given the dearth of period Welsh
        cookbooks, however, the approved method seems to be to
        pick up references to whatever food one can in the
        literature, look for the recipes closest in
        chronology and geography which fit the parameters
        given, and extrapolate like mad. So 13th-15th century
        English would be right on target!

        Darioles are custard pies
        > that are done with saffron.
        > But if I recall correctly, they are 13th - 15th
        > (somewhere in there. I
        > can't remember this morning, it's been a long day
        > already) English.

        A google search for "darioles" yielded a number of
        hits, all in French (which I will start learning after
        I'm reasonably competent in Middle Welsh and Latin).
        However, "daryoles" netted me a number of recipes,
        some version of which should work quite nicely. Thaks
        for the tip.

        Given that the Welsh did not have "bread", that is,
        wheat bread (English/French commentators did not feel
        that flat oakcakes qualified) the Little People would
        most likely have made a crustless custard. Did they
        have eggs? Elidyr doesn't mention any sort of
        domestic fowl, but I suppose one could postulate
        either wild bird eggs or eggs "borrowed" from their
        neighbors.

        Andrea



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      • Heather Rose Jones
        ... It would probably be worthwhile to discover what the original Latin term was that is being translated as junket . It will give you a more accurate
        Message 3 of 29 , May 9, 2005
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          At 10:53 AM -0700 5/9/05, Andrea Huwydd Lycsenbwrg wrote:

          > I should have been more specific, though, about what
          >I was looking for.... In the late 12th century,
          >Gerald of Wales wrote down what he was told by a
          >priest who used to visit the Little People as a boy:
          >"They never ate meat or fish. They lived on various
          >milk dishes, made up into junkets flavoured with
          >saffron."
          >
          >Now, if they didn't eat meat, I can't see them making
          >an actual junket, which is coagulated with rennet, so
          >I interpret that as simply some sort of pudding or
          >cheese-type dish.

          It would probably be worthwhile to discover what the original Latin
          term was that is being translated as "junket". It will give you a
          more accurate starting point for your extrapolations. (If I knew,
          I'd tell you, but I haven't yet managed to track down my own copy of
          the original text of Gerald's works.)

          Tangwystyl
          --
          --
          Heather Rose Jones
          heather.jones@...
        • Andrea Huwydd Lycsenbwrg
          ... Good point. Meanwhile, though, since another translation renders the phrase made up into messes with saffron , I suspect the term is not all that
          Message 4 of 29 , May 19, 2005
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            --- Heather Rose Jones <heather.jones@...>
            wrote:


            >
            > It would probably be worthwhile to discover what the
            > original Latin
            > term was that is being translated as "junket".

            Good point. Meanwhile, though, since another
            translation renders the phrase "made up into messes
            with saffron", I suspect the term is not all that
            specific.

            Andrea

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