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  • Andrew Boo-z
    Hello, this is my first e-mail to this Yahopo group. Please accept my humble presence here as I sit back to listen for a while before participating myself.
    Message 1 of 11 , Aug 30, 2004
      Hello, this is my first e-mail to this Yahopo group. Please accept my humble presence here as I sit back to listen for a while before participating myself.

      -Andy B. (previously Aulus Exomnius Andrumus)

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    • julian wilson
      It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving XVth Century copy.
      Message 2 of 11 , Aug 30, 2004
        It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving XVth Century copy.
        Fortunately someone pointed us in the direction of Project Gutenberg, so we already have the downloadable text.

        In "oure Tymes" the book was a "Number One Bestseller", and we'd really like to work-up a reasonable facsimile for display to the MoP at our events next season, alongside a contemporary-style board set out with reproduction XVth Cent Chessmen.
        Any possible sources of reproduction late-medieval chess men would also be helpful - I have some illustrations but don't fancy trying to carve a repro set myself - too many other projects to complete before May, 2005.
        Julian,
        of "The Company of The Duke's Leopards",
        in "olde" Jersey


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      • Greg Lindahl
        ... Gutenberg s HTML edition has a lot of woodcuts, but not the front page. I can ask the people who made it, but odds are it wasn t there in the reprint that
        Message 3 of 11 , Aug 30, 2004
          On Mon, Aug 30, 2004 at 07:52:18PM +0100, julian wilson wrote:

          > It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in
          > the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving
          > XVth Century copy.

          Gutenberg's HTML edition has a lot of woodcuts, but not the front
          page. I can ask the people who made it, but odds are it wasn't
          there in the reprint that Gutenberg used.

          -- Gregory
        • Christopher Bogs
          ... I believe that books, at the time, were generally bought as a set of loose pages, which one then took to a binder to have bound to order, according to
          Message 4 of 11 , Aug 30, 2004
            > It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in the
            > direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving XVth
            > Century copy.

            I believe that books, at the time, were generally bought as a set of loose
            pages, which one then took to a binder to have bound to order, according to
            one's taste and budget. The cover, then, would vary depending on by whom it
            was bound and what style the original owner desired it to be covered in.

            That also means, of course, that if you find a 15th century book cover that
            you like, you can use it as a source for your re-creation without worrying
            what actual book it originally covered. Many covers do not age well,
            though, and lots of period manuscripts were re-covered later on for
            conservation purposes (they worried about conserving the contents more than
            the cover!) so it's always important to find out if a manuscript's cover is
            original or not.

            Yrs.,
            Christoph
            ----------------------------------------
            Christopher Bogs | Christopher Jameson
            Philadelphia, PA | Barony of Bhakail, EK
            ----------------------------------------
            Don't tell my parents I'm in the SCA --
            They think I'm running guns for a biker gang.
          • Lady_Lark_Azure
            ... the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving XVth Century copy. ... Gutenberg, so we already have the downloadable text. I
            Message 5 of 11 , Aug 30, 2004
              --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, julian wilson <smnco37@y...>
              wrote:
              > It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in
              the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving
              XVth Century copy.
              > Fortunately someone pointed us in the direction of Project
              Gutenberg, so we already have the downloadable text.

              I immediately went to the site for the Beinecke Library at Yale and
              the Morgan Library in NYC, because they're the two incunabula sources
              I think of first. I didn't find the book you wanted, but the Morgan
              now has an online catalog which is new:

              http://corsair.morganlibrary.org/webvoy.htm

              Should be useful for us.

              Isabeau
            • Wendy
              ... the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving XVth Century copy. Well... don t forget that from that time period, the cover is
              Message 6 of 11 , Aug 31, 2004
                --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, julian wilson <smnco37@y...>
                wrote:
                > It would be really really appreciated if anyone could point us in
                the direction of a downloadable picture of the cover of a surviving
                XVth Century copy.

                Well... don't forget that from that time period, the "cover" is
                likely to be whatever leather or vellum the owner had the leaves
                bound into. You probably want the first text leaf or the title-page,
                not the cover.

                Here's a single image online, but I don't know if it's the first
                image:
                http://www.chessmate.com/images/caxton.jpg

                Also, here's a leaf from the third chapter, with illustration:
                http://www.imagesonline.bl.uk/britishlibrary/controller/subjectidsear
                ch?id=7965&idx=1&start=1

                -Sabine
              • Wendy
                Sorry, posted a bit too soon (and failed to notice the other replies re. covers!)... anyway, you might want to note that the usual title given for this piece
                Message 7 of 11 , Aug 31, 2004
                  Sorry, posted a bit too soon (and failed to notice the other replies
                  re. covers!)... anyway, you might want to note that the usual title
                  given for this piece is _Game and Playe of the Chess_ (game spelled
                  as in modern English, no "y"). Another facsimile edition was titled
                  simply _The Game of Chess_.

                  There's an original copy at the British Library, so you might be
                  able to get permission to see it; also, Rutgers University seems to
                  have a microform of that BL original online, but it's restricted to
                  students and faculty members -- if you can find a student or faculty
                  member willing to get you into the system, that might be easiest.

                  -Sabine
                • julian wilson
                  Dear Sabine, TYVM for your help. The Gutenberg Project gives us the text, & there are several suitable on-line downloadable fonts we can use to reprint that;
                  Message 8 of 11 , Aug 31, 2004
                    Dear Sabine,
                    TYVM for your help.
                    The Gutenberg Project gives us the text, & there are several suitable on-line downloadable fonts we can use to reprint that; and similar references have provided the internal woodcuts which could be inserted as appropriate. We have obtained a very nice replica paper by special order through the good offices of a local Printer & Stationer who is fascinated by our proposed project.
                    Your points re- original book covers have also been noted - however it would still help us to see pictures of the outside of an early copy, - or is that proves to be impossible, - at least to see pictures of XVth Century bindings of another early book - so that we have something on which to model our own re-creation. So I guess we have to keep looking - perhaps we'll be able to get someone in to see that British Library copy.None of our group know anyone with connections to Rutgers U. - we are very isolated here on our little granite rock, 15 miles off the French coast.
                    Gratefully,
                    Julian,
                    in "olde" Jersey

                    Wendy <SabineKdL@...> wrote:
                    Sorry, posted a bit too soon (and failed to notice the other replies
                    re. covers!)... anyway, you might want to note that the usual title
                    given for this piece is _Game and Playe of the Chess_ (game spelled
                    as in modern English, no "y"). Another facsimile edition was titled
                    simply _The Game of Chess_.

                    There's an original copy at the British Library, so you might be
                    able to get permission to see it; also, Rutgers University seems to
                    have a microform of that BL original online, but it's restricted to
                    students and faculty members -- if you can find a student or faculty
                    member willing to get you into the system, that might be easiest.

                    -Sabine

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                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • julian wilson
                    Thanks to everyone who has replied so far to my enquiry under this head. Your helpful replies are much appreciated. Julian, in olde Jersey ... ALL-NEW
                    Message 9 of 11 , Aug 31, 2004
                      Thanks to everyone who has replied so far to my enquiry under this head. Your helpful replies are much appreciated.
                      Julian,
                      in "olde Jersey"



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                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Lynne Lowe
                      Dear Julian, Your project sound fascinating! You may not have any connections with Rutgers University but why not write to them? They are a public institution
                      Message 10 of 11 , Aug 31, 2004
                        Dear Julian,
                        Your project sound fascinating! You may not have
                        any connections with Rutgers University but why not
                        write to them? They are a public institution after
                        all, being a State (New Jersey) University, they are
                        open to requests for information. Explain your
                        project, note your "Old Jersey" connection and the
                        educational uses for what you are doing. Check out
                        their website and look for somebody in the History
                        Department that covers your time period or in the
                        Library that you could write to. The worst they could
                        say is "no".
                        Best wishes,
                        Alycia D'Alcyone
                        (Who lives in "New" Jersey)

                        --- julian wilson <smnco37@...> wrote:

                        > Dear Sabine,
                        > TYVM for your help.
                        > The Gutenberg Project gives us the text, & there are
                        > several suitable on-line downloadable fonts we can
                        > use to reprint that; and similar references have
                        > provided the internal woodcuts which could be
                        > inserted as appropriate. We have obtained a very
                        > nice replica paper by special order through the good
                        > offices of a local Printer & Stationer who is
                        > fascinated by our proposed project.
                        > Your points re- original book covers have also been
                        > noted - however it would still help us to see
                        > pictures of the outside of an early copy, - or is
                        > that proves to be impossible, - at least to see
                        > pictures of XVth Century bindings of another early
                        > book - so that we have something on which to model
                        > our own re-creation. So I guess we have to keep
                        > looking - perhaps we'll be able to get someone in to
                        > see that British Library copy.None of our group know
                        > anyone with connections to Rutgers U. - we are very
                        > isolated here on our little granite rock, 15 miles
                        > off the French coast.
                        > Gratefully,
                        > Julian,
                        > in "olde" Jersey
                        >
                        > Wendy <SabineKdL@...> wrote:
                        > Sorry, posted a bit too soon (and failed to notice
                        > the other replies
                        > re. covers!)... anyway, you might want to note that
                        > the usual title
                        > given for this piece is _Game and Playe of the
                        > Chess_ (game spelled
                        > as in modern English, no "y"). Another facsimile
                        > edition was titled
                        > simply _The Game of Chess_.
                        >
                        > There's an original copy at the British Library, so
                        > you might be
                        > able to get permission to see it; also, Rutgers
                        > University seems to
                        > have a microform of that BL original online, but
                        > it's restricted to
                        > students and faculty members -- if you can find a
                        > student or faculty
                        > member willing to get you into the system, that
                        > might be easiest.
                        >
                        > -Sabine
                        >



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                      • Lady_Lark_Azure
                        I m not sure if you already have the knowledge, but if you need information on bookbinding, there is a Complete Anachronist , an SCA publication, on it. It s
                        Message 11 of 11 , Sep 1, 2004
                          I'm not sure if you already have the knowledge, but if you need
                          information on bookbinding, there is a "Complete Anachronist", an SCA
                          publication, on it. It's #85 (1996) and can be ordered from the SCA
                          web site. The person who wrote it used to live in my local shire.

                          Isabeau
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