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[Authentic_SCA] Re: Zibelline, or 'flea furs', of 'fur pelts', etc.

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  • Sharon L. Krossa
    ... Of course, it could also just be that they thought they were cool and there was no significance beyond simply fashion. Consider -- what was the deep
    Message 1 of 4 , Aug 1, 2004
      >--- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "demontsegur"
      ><demontsegur@y...> wrote:
      > > She then began to research symbolic possibilities and came up
      > > with the idea that the weasel family of animals tended to bear
      > > fertility associations. A good number of the portraits she showed
      > > us
      > > included children in them, which certainly does not hurt her
      > > theory.

      Of course, it could also just be that they thought they were cool and
      there was no significance beyond simply fashion. Consider -- what was
      the deep symbolic meaning and significance for early 20th century
      women wearing similar furry animals as stoles? Beyond "I'm wealthy
      enough to have one of these", that is?

      Generally I think it is a mistake to look for symbolic meaning (or
      practical use) in cases where contemporary records give us no
      specific reason to think there was any symbolic meaning (or practical
      use). That sort of thing is what led an earlier generation of
      historians to make the apparently baseless claim that zibellini were
      for the purpose of attracting fleas away from the body.

      Sometimes a frivolous clothing accessory is just a frivolous clothing
      accessory.

      Euphrick
      --
      Sharon L. Krossa, skrossa-ml@...
    • Sharon L. Krossa
      At 8:25 PM +0000 8/1/04, demontsegur wrote regarding Tawny Sherrill s ... I take it she also did not find any 16th century references that suggested the people
      Message 2 of 4 , Aug 1, 2004
        At 8:25 PM +0000 8/1/04, demontsegur wrote regarding Tawny Sherrill's
        paper given at Kalamazoo this year:
        >She also
        >consulted the leading flea expert in the US (apparently there IS a
        >scientist known for this) who confirmed that these furs could NOT
        >have been used as a way to guide fleas away from the body, as a flea
        >will always choose warm, living flesh over dead fur any day of the
        >week.

        I take it she also did not find any 16th century references that
        suggested the people of that time thought they had anything to do
        with fleas?

        BTW, you used both <zibelline> and <zibellini> as the plural form in
        your post. I've found <zibellini> at various Italian sites dealing
        with furs, so I've been assuming that the <-i> ending is the correct
        plural. Can you clarify which plural spelling was used by Prof.
        Sherrill?

        Affrick

        PS Hmm, you learn something interesting every day. After doing a web
        search on <zibellini> and getting thousands of hits (many in Italian)
        and one for <zibelline> getting just over a hundred, looking at some
        of the <zibelline> hits it seems that it is (also?) an English word,
        often spelled <zibeline>, that means "<adj.> 1. of or pertaining to
        the sable. --<n.> 2 the fur of the sable. 3. a thick woolen cloth
        with a flattened hairy nap." (definition taken from _Webster's
        Encyclopedic Unabridged Dictionary of the English Language_)
        --
        Sharon L. Krossa, skrossa-ml@...
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