Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: [Authentic_SCA] Name Help!

Expand Messages
  • Heather Rose Jones
    ... There are a number of places you can go for help -- just make sure that the people you re asking understand if you want really historically authentic as
    Message 1 of 11 , Dec 30, 2003
      At 8:08 PM +0000 12/30/03, Kris wrote:
      >I've figured out a name - now how do I check to make sure it's
      >period? Any advice/links would be helpful!

      There are a number of places you can go for help -- just make sure
      that the people you're asking understand if you want "really
      historically authentic" as opposed to "good enough for SCA
      registration". The Academy of S. Gabriel specializes in advising
      people on high-authenticity names and armory, but the (we) are on a
      winter break at the moment and not accepting new clients. If you
      feel confident of your ability to use research materials, there are a
      lot of useful articles in the Medieval Names Archive
      <http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/>. The scaheralds mailing list
      is also a useful place to ask name questions, if you don't mind
      joining the list for the duration. Or you can ask about it here -- I
      know I'm not the only names geek on the list. As with any research
      question, the really tricky part is figuring out whose advice to put
      your trust in, and who is giving it a good shot but doesn't quite
      have the background.

      Tangwystyl
      --
      *****
      Heather Rose (you may now call me Doctor) Jones
      hrjones@...
      *****
    • Kris
      Thanks to everyone who responded! I m leaning towards a late 1200 s to middle 1300 s period - German. The name I came up with is: Holda (which means beloved)
      Message 2 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
        Thanks to everyone who responded! I'm leaning towards a late 1200's
        to middle 1300's period - German. The name I came up with is:

        Holda (which means beloved) Abendroth (which means a child born at
        the close of the day - from the German Abend (evening) and roth (red).

        So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?
        Thanks everyone!!!!
        Kris
        --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Heather Rose Jones
        <hrjones@s...> wrote:
        > At 8:08 PM +0000 12/30/03, Kris wrote:
        > >I've figured out a name - now how do I check to make sure it's
        > >period? Any advice/links would be helpful!
        >
        > There are a number of places you can go for help -- snip
      • Kirrily Robert
        ... I don t know your period very well at all, but the first thing that jumps out at me is that you seem to be focussing on meaning , and that wasn t a
        Message 3 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
          Kris wrote:
          > Thanks to everyone who responded! I'm leaning towards a late 1200's
          > to middle 1300's period - German. The name I came up with is:
          >
          > Holda (which means beloved) Abendroth (which means a child born at
          > the close of the day - from the German Abend (evening) and roth (red).
          >
          > So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?
          > Thanks everyone!!!!

          I don't know your period very well at all, but the first thing that
          jumps out at me is that you seem to be focussing on "meaning", and that
          wasn't a primary consideration for names through most of SCA period. In
          particular, the surname would probably not be constructed that way. The
          fact that you mention meanings suggests to me that you might have been
          looking at baby name books, or something like that, and those are a
          notoriously bad source for medieval names.

          What I would suggest is figuring out how names were commonly constructed
          during your period, and working from there, rather than finding a name
          and trying to back-document it.

          You will probably find that womens names are often saint's names, or
          variations on them. There are probably also other non-saint names used,
          but I'm not sure what the common ones would be in your period. If you
          look at the names here you will see what I mean:
          http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/german.shtml

          As for surnames, again it's not my period but a lot of them were
          probably patronymic (based on the father's name), or based on a trade or
          location. That is, they would be the German equivalent of "Johnson" or
          "Weaver". I think that location names were in the form "von whatever"
          so you could be (for instance) Mechtilde von Strassburg if you were from
          the city of Strassburg.

          If you have a particular interest in a certain geographic area, or a
          particular craft, or you really feel an affinity for a certain saint's
          story, or you know the patron saint of your area, these can all be good
          places to start with a name.

          When you go to submit your name, or indeed even just for your own
          reference, what you'll want to know is "how can I demonstrate that this
          name would have been used during my period?" Meanings of names may be
          interesting to you personally, but aren't considered by the college of
          heralds (unless it's relevant to the period naming practices). So to
          demonstrate that a name would have been used in period, you have to show
          that all the parts of it were used in period (usually by referencing a
          period source) and that the name as a whole conforms to period naming
          conventions (usually by describing the period naming conventions based
          on your understanding of period sources). To give an example of what I
          mean by the latter point: you couldn't be Mechtilde von
          Whatever-is-German-for-weaver because "von" means "from", and "from
          weaver" makes no sense - you would want to be "the weaver" instead.

          I hope that helps. I'm sure some people here will be able to give some
          more specific advice for German names than I can!

          Yours,

          Katherine




          --
          Goodwife Katherine Rowberd (mka Kirrily "Skud" Robert)
          katherine@... http://elizabethangeek.com/
          Caldrithig, Skraeling Althing, Ealdormere
          "The rose is red, the leaves are grene, God save Elizabeth our Queene"
        • Hasoferet@aol.com
          In a message dated 12/31/2003 8:24:39 AM Pacific Standard Time, ... Two questions--first, whether both names were in use in the area and time you re interested
          Message 4 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
            In a message dated 12/31/2003 8:24:39 AM Pacific Standard Time,
            kristine.mcguigan@... writes:


            > Holda (which means beloved) Abendroth (which means a child born at
            > the close of the day - from the German Abend (evening) and roth (red).
            >
            > So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?

            Two questions--first, whether both names were in use in the area and time
            you're interested in. Where did you find these?

            Second, whether the structure of the name is similarly appropriate-were
            surnames in use at the time and in the place.

            I can tell you what to find out, but I can't help you further...Germany is
            basically a large blank spot on the medieval map for me. ;)

            Raquel


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • sismith42
            ... Here s the st. Gabriel s page on German names... http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/german.shtml Steph
            Message 5 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
              > So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?
              > Thanks everyone!!!!

              Here's the st. Gabriel's page on German names...

              http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/german.shtml

              Steph
            • Kris
              I see what you mean - the differences between the meaning of the name and the structure. Gives me something to work with! :) Thanks!!!! teehee! k. ... 1200 s
              Message 6 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
                I see what you mean - the differences between the meaning of the name
                and the structure. Gives me something to work with! :)
                Thanks!!!! teehee!
                k.
                -- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, Kirrily Robert <skud@i...> wrote:
                > Kris wrote:
                > > Thanks to everyone who responded! I'm leaning towards a late
                1200's
                > > to middle 1300's period - German. snip
              • Kris
                Thanks! Based on where your links sent me... I can keep my given name (Kristine) but spelled period - Cristina That works for me, too! :) k.
                Message 7 of 11 , Dec 31, 2003
                  Thanks! Based on where your links sent me... I can keep my given name
                  (Kristine) but spelled period - Cristina
                  That works for me, too! :)
                  k.

                  --- In Authentic_SCA@yahoogroups.com, "sismith42" <sismith42@y...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > > So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?
                  > > Thanks everyone!!!!
                  >
                  > Here's the st. Gabriel's page on German names...
                  >
                  > http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/german.shtml
                  >
                  > Steph
                • Heather Rose Jones
                  ... Let s start with the background, since you undoubtedly know more about the research you ve already done on this than we do. Where did you find the idea
                  Message 8 of 11 , Jan 1, 2004
                    At 4:14 PM +0000 12/31/03, Kris wrote:
                    >Thanks to everyone who responded! I'm leaning towards a late 1200's
                    >to middle 1300's period - German. The name I came up with is:
                    >
                    >Holda (which means beloved) Abendroth (which means a child born at
                    >the close of the day - from the German Abend (evening) and roth (red).
                    >
                    >So - will it work? or is it too late for the period I've chosen?
                    >Thanks everyone!!!!

                    Let's start with the background, since you undoubtedly know more
                    about the research you've already done on this than we do. Where did
                    you find the idea for these name elements? What type of source was
                    it? What information did it give you about when and where these name
                    elements were used?

                    Do you have a particular region in Germany that you're interested in
                    (or that you already know the name elements were used in)?

                    (Since I'm not at home at the moment, the most I can help with is
                    leading questions.)

                    Tangwystyl
                    --
                    *****
                    Heather Rose (you may now call me Doctor) Jones
                    hrjones@...
                    *****
                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.