Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

A few questions about Wakeful

Expand Messages
  • tremont100
    Hello all, I m a first time poster. Greetings. I have been looking for a launch/utility design to build and have stumbled on the Atkin designs. From there I
    Message 1 of 5 , Mar 23, 2006
    • 0 Attachment
      Hello all,

      I'm a first time poster. Greetings.

      I have been looking for a launch/utility design to build and have
      stumbled on the Atkin designs. From there I have found Wakeful. It
      seems to fit the bill. I boat in the 1000 Islands area of the St.
      Lawrence in Gananoque, Ontario. Both sheltered and open water.
      Winds create more of a stiff chop in the islands as opposed to big
      open waves. I have always enjoyed the displacement hulls as they
      are comfortable at speed and don't pound. Is this such a design?
      Anyone seen a picture or know of any builds of this fine looking
      boat?

      I am ultimately looking for a 20-22 ft utility/launch that I can
      cruise around in. I like open boats. I like flatheads. I am
      hoping to get 18-20 mph and wonder if Wakeful could hit mid 20's in
      case of emergency. I have a Universal Explorer Six (100hp) but
      think its a bit too much weight for the boat (650ish?). I was
      thinking of a Gray 4-75hp or something similiar.

      Is the Wakeful for batten seam construction or could one get away
      with creative ply construction? It would be fun to plank it
      traditionally for the experience.

      I have looked at the skiffs and other utilities, but for some reason
      keep coming back to Wakeful. This will be my first true build - the
      size and scale feels right for me and my shop.

      Any general thoughts on the design, answers to the above inquiries
      or questions for me much appreciated. I'm sure I'll have more.

      Regards,

      Steve Hornsby
    • John Kohnen
      Welcome aboard Steve! Wakeful is a planing boat, not a displacement one. There are some very narrow Atkin motorboats that blur the distinction, but Wakeful is
      Message 2 of 5 , Mar 26, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        Welcome aboard Steve! Wakeful is a planing boat, not a displacement one.
        There are some very narrow Atkin motorboats that blur the distinction, but
        Wakeful is definitely in the planing category, a boat with her proportions
        has to be to get up to 20 mph. But she's pretty sharp forward and should
        live up to what Wm. Atkin says about her ability to go through rough
        water. I'll bet she'd work quite well in the 1000 Islands, giving a much
        smoother ride than the modern production boats.

        Wakeful might hit the mid 20s with enough power if you kept her light, but
        as always it's best to follow William's advice and not overpower her. The
        Explorer Six is way too much engine both in power and weight! If you want
        to use a Gray Marine, one of the 162 cu. in. fours would work well, they
        run from about 40 hp. for an old "lugger" model from the thirties on up to
        eighty or so hp. for a late model high-speed model. They weigh about 540
        lb. with reverse gear and are marinized Continental industrial engines, so
        most parts are easy to find. (I know so much about them because I picked
        up a couple for my old engine stash a couple of weeks ago <g>) I'd use one
        of the old "lugger" models myself, 20 mph. is plenty fast on the water and
        a low speed engine is a pleasant companion in a boat. A Gray 4-52 "lugger"
        turns up to all of 1,800 rpm. at peak power! :o)

        Wakeful has batten-seam planked topsides and a double planked bottom,
        diagonal for the inside layer and fore and aft on the outside -- 1/4"
        planks, 1/2" thickness altogether -- glued together. A bottom like that
        will live just fine on a trailer, and batten-seam planking will do pretty
        well too. There's no way you'll get sheets of plywood to wrap around
        Wakeful, but you could use plywood "planks" with battens on the topsides
        and a couple of layers of plywood "planks" or odd-shaped chunks (whatever
        fits) on the bottom. For a trailer boat I'd be inclined to do the bottom
        as designed using epoxy glue and 3/8" plywood planks on the topsides
        epoxied to the battens. If you use "real" lumber for the topside planking
        don't glue them to the battens, use a semi-permanent goop with a little
        flex to it, like 3M 4200.

        I hope you decide to build Wakeful. If you do, please keep the group
        informed of your progress.

        On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 10:34:18 -0800, Steve Hornsby wrote:

        > ...
        > I have been looking for a launch/utility design to build and have
        > stumbled on the Atkin designs. From there I have found Wakeful. It
        > seems to fit the bill. I boat in the 1000 Islands area of the St.
        > Lawrence in Gananoque, Ontario. Both sheltered and open water.
        > Winds create more of a stiff chop in the islands as opposed to big
        > open waves. I have always enjoyed the displacement hulls as they
        > are comfortable at speed and don't pound. Is this such a design?
        > Anyone seen a picture or know of any builds of this fine looking
        > boat?
        >
        > I am ultimately looking for a 20-22 ft utility/launch that I can
        > cruise around in. I like open boats. I like flatheads. I am
        > hoping to get 18-20 mph and wonder if Wakeful could hit mid 20's in
        > case of emergency. I have a Universal Explorer Six (100hp) but
        > think its a bit too much weight for the boat (650ish?). I was
        > thinking of a Gray 4-75hp or something similiar.
        >
        > Is the Wakeful for batten seam construction or could one get away
        > with creative ply construction? It would be fun to plank it
        > traditionally for the experience.
        > ...

        --
        John <jkohnen@...>
        One boat just leads to another. <John Kohnen>
      • tremont100
        Thanks John, The explaination is helpful. I was hoping she would run fairly flat at most speeds and sort of slink onto plane. I bet she is smooth in the
        Message 3 of 5 , Mar 29, 2006
        • 0 Attachment
          Thanks John,

          The explaination is helpful. I was hoping she would run fairly flat
          at most speeds and sort of slink onto plane. I bet she is smooth in
          the 10-15 mph range.

          I agree on the motor. A low speed 4 is attractive.

          I know that the Handy Billy is being built in ply these days.
          Double diagonal bottom with ply topsides.

          Sounds like a plan! I confirmed the details for ordering plans with
          Mrs. Atkins. I will let you know if I proceed.

          Thanks again,

          Steve

          --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "John Kohnen" <jkohnen@...> wrote:
          >
          > Welcome aboard Steve! Wakeful is a planing boat, not a
          displacement one.
          > There are some very narrow Atkin motorboats that blur the
          distinction, but
          > Wakeful is definitely in the planing category, a boat with her
          proportions
          > has to be to get up to 20 mph. But she's pretty sharp forward and
          should
          > live up to what Wm. Atkin says about her ability to go through
          rough
          > water. I'll bet she'd work quite well in the 1000 Islands, giving
          a much
          > smoother ride than the modern production boats.
          >
          > Wakeful might hit the mid 20s with enough power if you kept her
          light, but
          > as always it's best to follow William's advice and not overpower
          her. The
          > Explorer Six is way too much engine both in power and weight! If
          you want
          > to use a Gray Marine, one of the 162 cu. in. fours would work
          well, they
          > run from about 40 hp. for an old "lugger" model from the thirties
          on up to
          > eighty or so hp. for a late model high-speed model. They weigh
          about 540
          > lb. with reverse gear and are marinized Continental industrial
          engines, so
          > most parts are easy to find. (I know so much about them because I
          picked
          > up a couple for my old engine stash a couple of weeks ago <g>) I'd
          use one
          > of the old "lugger" models myself, 20 mph. is plenty fast on the
          water and
          > a low speed engine is a pleasant companion in a boat. A Gray 4-
          52 "lugger"
          > turns up to all of 1,800 rpm. at peak power! :o)
          >
          > Wakeful has batten-seam planked topsides and a double planked
          bottom,
          > diagonal for the inside layer and fore and aft on the outside --
          1/4"
          > planks, 1/2" thickness altogether -- glued together. A bottom like
          that
          > will live just fine on a trailer, and batten-seam planking will do
          pretty
          > well too. There's no way you'll get sheets of plywood to wrap
          around
          > Wakeful, but you could use plywood "planks" with battens on the
          topsides
          > and a couple of layers of plywood "planks" or odd-shaped chunks
          (whatever
          > fits) on the bottom. For a trailer boat I'd be inclined to do the
          bottom
          > as designed using epoxy glue and 3/8" plywood planks on the
          topsides
          > epoxied to the battens. If you use "real" lumber for the topside
          planking
          > don't glue them to the battens, use a semi-permanent goop with a
          little
          > flex to it, like 3M 4200.
          >
          > I hope you decide to build Wakeful. If you do, please keep the
          group
          > informed of your progress.
          >
          > On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 10:34:18 -0800, Steve Hornsby wrote:
          >
          > > ...
          > > I have been looking for a launch/utility design to build and have
          > > stumbled on the Atkin designs. From there I have found
          Wakeful. It
          > > seems to fit the bill. I boat in the 1000 Islands area of the
          St.
          > > Lawrence in Gananoque, Ontario. Both sheltered and open water.
          > > Winds create more of a stiff chop in the islands as opposed to
          big
          > > open waves. I have always enjoyed the displacement hulls as they
          > > are comfortable at speed and don't pound. Is this such a design?
          > > Anyone seen a picture or know of any builds of this fine looking
          > > boat?
          > >
          > > I am ultimately looking for a 20-22 ft utility/launch that I can
          > > cruise around in. I like open boats. I like flatheads. I am
          > > hoping to get 18-20 mph and wonder if Wakeful could hit mid 20's
          in
          > > case of emergency. I have a Universal Explorer Six (100hp) but
          > > think its a bit too much weight for the boat (650ish?). I was
          > > thinking of a Gray 4-75hp or something similiar.
          > >
          > > Is the Wakeful for batten seam construction or could one get away
          > > with creative ply construction? It would be fun to plank it
          > > traditionally for the experience.
          > > ...
          >
          > --
          > John <jkohnen@...>
          > One boat just leads to another. <John Kohnen>
          >
        • adharvey2
          Steve, I too have been a little confused by some of the Atkin utility/ runabouts and their respective relationships to the usual division between planing hulls
          Message 4 of 5 , Mar 30, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            Steve, I too have been a little confused by some of the Atkin utility/
            runabouts and their respective relationships to the usual division
            between planing hulls and displacement hulls. They do blur the line,
            as John says. I spent a considerable amount of time trying to figure
            out how Rosdave, a round bildge, practically double ended (on the
            waterline, anyway), relatively low powered boat could make 17 mph.
            Then I read an article by Dave Gerr in an old "Boatbuilder" about how
            narrow hulls can push the usual displacement speed/length ratio of 1.3
            (or whatever it is) significantly up and gave a formula for doing
            this. Sure enough if you have a stepson who knows how to work those
            numbers with fractional, negative exponents stuck to them, seemingly
            displacement hulls can go pretty darn fast!
            I also took a long look at Wakeful and I agree that's a tempting
            boat. Cool looks and 20mph too! I hope you build her.
            Andrew Harvey

            --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "tremont100" <tremont100@...> wrote:
            >
            > Thanks John,
            >
            > The explaination is helpful. I was hoping she would run fairly flat
            > at most speeds and sort of slink onto plane. I bet she is smooth in
            > the 10-15 mph range.
            >
            > I agree on the motor. A low speed 4 is attractive.
            >
            > I know that the Handy Billy is being built in ply these days.
            > Double diagonal bottom with ply topsides.
            >
            > Sounds like a plan! I confirmed the details for ordering plans with
            > Mrs. Atkins. I will let you know if I proceed.
            >
            > Thanks again,
            >
            > Steve
            >
            > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "John Kohnen" <jkohnen@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Welcome aboard Steve! Wakeful is a planing boat, not a
            > displacement one.
            > > There are some very narrow Atkin motorboats that blur the
            > distinction, but
            > > Wakeful is definitely in the planing category, a boat with her
            > proportions
            > > has to be to get up to 20 mph. But she's pretty sharp forward and
            > should
            > > live up to what Wm. Atkin says about her ability to go through
            > rough
            > > water. I'll bet she'd work quite well in the 1000 Islands, giving
            > a much
            > > smoother ride than the modern production boats.
            > >
            > > Wakeful might hit the mid 20s with enough power if you kept her
            > light, but
            > > as always it's best to follow William's advice and not overpower
            > her. The
            > > Explorer Six is way too much engine both in power and weight! If
            > you want
            > > to use a Gray Marine, one of the 162 cu. in. fours would work
            > well, they
            > > run from about 40 hp. for an old "lugger" model from the thirties
            > on up to
            > > eighty or so hp. for a late model high-speed model. They weigh
            > about 540
            > > lb. with reverse gear and are marinized Continental industrial
            > engines, so
            > > most parts are easy to find. (I know so much about them because I
            > picked
            > > up a couple for my old engine stash a couple of weeks ago <g>) I'd
            > use one
            > > of the old "lugger" models myself, 20 mph. is plenty fast on the
            > water and
            > > a low speed engine is a pleasant companion in a boat. A Gray 4-
            > 52 "lugger"
            > > turns up to all of 1,800 rpm. at peak power! :o)
            > >
            > > Wakeful has batten-seam planked topsides and a double planked
            > bottom,
            > > diagonal for the inside layer and fore and aft on the outside --
            > 1/4"
            > > planks, 1/2" thickness altogether -- glued together. A bottom like
            > that
            > > will live just fine on a trailer, and batten-seam planking will do
            > pretty
            > > well too. There's no way you'll get sheets of plywood to wrap
            > around
            > > Wakeful, but you could use plywood "planks" with battens on the
            > topsides
            > > and a couple of layers of plywood "planks" or odd-shaped chunks
            > (whatever
            > > fits) on the bottom. For a trailer boat I'd be inclined to do the
            > bottom
            > > as designed using epoxy glue and 3/8" plywood planks on the
            > topsides
            > > epoxied to the battens. If you use "real" lumber for the topside
            > planking
            > > don't glue them to the battens, use a semi-permanent goop with a
            > little
            > > flex to it, like 3M 4200.
            > >
            > > I hope you decide to build Wakeful. If you do, please keep the
            > group
            > > informed of your progress.
            > >
            > > On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 10:34:18 -0800, Steve Hornsby wrote:
            > >
            > > > ...
            > > > I have been looking for a launch/utility design to build and have
            > > > stumbled on the Atkin designs. From there I have found
            > Wakeful. It
            > > > seems to fit the bill. I boat in the 1000 Islands area of the
            > St.
            > > > Lawrence in Gananoque, Ontario. Both sheltered and open water.
            > > > Winds create more of a stiff chop in the islands as opposed to
            > big
            > > > open waves. I have always enjoyed the displacement hulls as they
            > > > are comfortable at speed and don't pound. Is this such a design?
            > > > Anyone seen a picture or know of any builds of this fine looking
            > > > boat?
            > > >
            > > > I am ultimately looking for a 20-22 ft utility/launch that I can
            > > > cruise around in. I like open boats. I like flatheads. I am
            > > > hoping to get 18-20 mph and wonder if Wakeful could hit mid 20's
            > in
            > > > case of emergency. I have a Universal Explorer Six (100hp) but
            > > > think its a bit too much weight for the boat (650ish?). I was
            > > > thinking of a Gray 4-75hp or something similiar.
            > > >
            > > > Is the Wakeful for batten seam construction or could one get away
            > > > with creative ply construction? It would be fun to plank it
            > > > traditionally for the experience.
            > > > ...
            > >
            > > --
            > > John <jkohnen@>
            > > One boat just leads to another. <John Kohnen>
            > >
            >
          • Kenneth Grome
            Yes displacement hulls can go very fast, here s a modern example of the concept: http://boatdesign.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/529/limit/views or
            Message 5 of 5 , Mar 30, 2006
            • 0 Attachment
              Yes displacement hulls can go very fast, here's a modern example of the concept:

              http://boatdesign.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/529/limit/views

              or

              http://tinyurl.com/7lk7z

              Kenneth Grome
              Bagacay Boat Works






              On Thu, 30 Mar 2006 22:05:42 -0000, adharvey2 wrote:
              > Steve, I too have been a little confused by some of the Atkin utility/
              > runabouts and their respective relationships to the usual division
              > between planing hulls and displacement hulls. They do blur the line,
              > as John says. I spent a considerable amount of time trying to figure
              > out how Rosdave, a round bildge, practically double ended (on the
              > waterline, anyway), relatively low powered boat could make 17 mph.
              > Then I read an article by Dave Gerr in an old "Boatbuilder" about how
              > narrow hulls can push the usual displacement speed/length ratio of 1.3
              > (or whatever it is) significantly up and gave a formula for doing
              > this. Sure enough if you have a stepson who knows how to work those
              > numbers with fractional, negative exponents stuck to them, seemingly
              > displacement hulls can go pretty darn fast!
            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.