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RE: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat

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  • Alan Boman
    Remember:- You are not old until your dreams are replaced by regrets.... Alan ... From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
    Message 1 of 22 , Jul 11, 2008
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      Remember:-



      You are not old until your dreams are replaced by regrets....





      Alan



      -----Original Message-----
      From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
      Behalf Of Gordon
      Sent: Saturday, 12 July 2008 1:34 AM
      To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat



      That is OK
      I am here for the next build of either a Geroge Buehlers heavy 29 to 33 ft
      or a Atkins design same thing for when I try for the Oldest ATW record if I
      even live to be 81 yrs old. But that gives me 14 years in planning and
      building. Some will say that is a pipe dream but my who life has been one
      Dream after another. I have worked hard all my life making my dreams come
      true like many others I think. Even going to college later after I was
      married with 3 kids and holding down a full time job as a machinist at
      McDonald Douglas Aircraft and only getting a few hrs sleep was not easy but
      it had to be done or my future would have not been as good as it has.

      If I had room I would quote some of tristan Jones writings about having
      dreams, I saved all his books for last and they are good. "Ice" especially.
      I have read probably every cruising book available over the past 25 yrs,
      many before I ever bought my first sailboat. My insperation was Tania Aebi
      and now I share emails with her 20 yrs after she sailed around the world as
      a young 18 yrs old.

      Gordon

      Always a Dream

      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Mike Dolph
      To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
      Sent: Friday, July 11, 2008 8:42 AM
      Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat

      I would discount arrogance as a cause of friction here Gordon; it
      really has a significantly different meaning and measure for Gordo.
      He's a Brazilian who's native language is Portuguese. There is plenty
      of arrogance here and there but there it's meaning makes his advice
      more like a fatherly admonition than a cutdown.

      Gordo is in the planning stages of building a traditional Atkin's
      sloop; like translating white oak into a locally obtainable wood
      useful for steam bending or to balance that strip planking over
      laminated frames in locally obtainable woods.

      I give him extra credit for reaching over thousands of miles and a
      whole culture to glean what he needs from forums like this. He's just
      trying to be friendly and learn, he's not trying to make trouble.
      He's also here for on topic reasons since his project is an Atkins design.

      Mike Dolph

      --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com,
      "Gordon" <gordon@...> wrote:
      >
      > Arrogant
      >
      > I don't know, probably am.
      > I was called a Prima Donna way back when I was Model Maker,
      Designer, and shop supervisor for Riggen MFG
      > (Slot Cars). That was 30 yrs before they put me in the Slot Car Hall
      Of fame http://www.slotcars <http://www.slotcars.org/hallofame/>
      .org/hallofame/
      > Less than 100 people made it. Have been sailing for over 23 yrs and
      owned 4 sailboats but learn each time I go out, Just like my Golf game.
      >
      > You have a nice day. It is raining cats and dogs now, Moonson
      Weather and my building table and Spray backbone are going through
      it's first storm right now.
      >
      > Gordon Brimhall
      >
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: gordocutter_1
      > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
      > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 6:11 PM
      > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
      >
      >
      > You understand everything wrong buddy! I'm not criticizing you, or
      > telling that your beautiful little boat will sink or capsize. You
      > don't need to be sentimental, or rude. All I did was a comment about
      > an article that I read about the boat of Slocum. In fact I was
      > trying to demonstrate my respect for such a great challenge like
      > yours. I'll not get into an discursion about what I do or not with
      > my life, but I do have some years of sea and one thing I can tell
      > you, you should keep that arrogance a little lower cause THAT can
      > kill you or sink any boat. God luck with your project.
      >
      > Adaucto Mello
      >
      > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com,
      "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Always somebody like you around.
      > > Got to remember mine is only 9 ft long so it
      > > has 1/4th the same chances to capsize
      > > But it also has positive flotation and will not sink
      > >
      > > smile
      > >
      > > So tell me what have you done in your life challanging?
      > >
      > > I know it would be safer to just sit and watch TV or spend my time
      > on forums
      > > telling other people their boat is going to sink
      > >
      > > Gordon
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: gordocutter_1
      > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
      > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 9:16 AM
      > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
      > >
      > >
      > > What a tremendous challenge you're going into! I saw the page! I
      > was
      > > always interested in the history of Slocum, and also about his
      > boat,
      > > after all lots of people like the Joshua lines, but I read
      > something
      > > disturbing about her, its seems that in strong conditions of
      > weather
      > > a boat of her lines and dimensions became unstable and can
      > capsize
      > > and not get right side up again, that was one of the explanation
      > > about the disappear of Slocum in his last journey. This was a
      > study
      > > made by an naval arquitet I read in a article in the web, don't
      > know
      > > if it's true.
      > >
      > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com>
      ups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Not building a mold and all I have are lines in 1" = 1 ft
      > scale
      > > that I am coming up with the lofting numbers from. Building it
      > the
      > > old way plank on frame multi chine. I could lay the frames out
      > > deducting for the plank thickness but my question was does it
      > make a
      > > difference? To me it does not.
      > > >
      > > > This is a one of a kind boat anyway and if you think real hard
      > you
      > > can say it is a Mini Spray and I got the lines from Bruce
      > Roberts
      > > Gratus, lines only and nothing else. Building to George Buehlers
      > > methods. You can see the project at www.aroundinten.org
      > > >
      > > > Thanks for your comments
      > > >
      > > > Gordon
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: javadave2
      > > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
      > > > Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 2:50 PM
      > > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Well, it may not matter too much if you added an inch of beam,
      > > but
      > > > you could run into a number of other issues without doing the
      > > > deducted body plan. For example, if you built your moulds off
      > of
      > > the
      > > > outside of the planking on the body plan, that would change
      > your
      > > stem
      > > > and keel in profile, and the corresponding rabbet and bearding
      > > > lines. I don't know how much this would affect the Spray
      > design.
      > > It
      > > > probably would be much easier to pattern the moulds off of the
      > > inside
      > > > of the planking than trying to make a bunch of adjustments to
      > > the
      > > > keel and stem, veering from the design. Or, if you've already
      > > built
      > > > your moulds, you could draw the inner plank lines on them and
      > > recut
      > > > to those lines.
      > > >
      > > > Good luck, hope this helps!
      > > > Dave
      > > >
      > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com>
      ups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > How much does it matter if you allow for the planking from
      > the
      > > > layout offset lines? I am building a small 9' 6" Josh Slocum
      > > Spray
      > > > and laying out my frames I really don't care if the extra 1/2"
      > > > planking or what ever I use makes my boat a little fatter.
      > > > >
      > > > > Gordon
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: javadave2
      > > > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com>
      ups.com
      > > > > Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:38 AM
      > > > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > The body plan in the design plans for Vintage (as with most
      > > > design
      > > > > plans) are drawn to the outside of the planking. On the
      > loft,
      > > > > the 'deducted body plan' are the additional lines drawn to
      > the
      > > > inside
      > > > > of the planking. The moulds are patterned from these lines.
      > > Are
      > > > > there other terms for 'deducted body plan'?
      > > > > Dave
      > > > >
      > > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com>
      ups.com, "hotwizard44"
      > > <hotwizard44@>
      > > > > wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com>
      ups.com, "John Kohnen"
      > <jkohnen@>
      > > > wrote:
      > > > > > >There are many things I don't know about lofting. What's
      > > > > a 'deducted
      > > > > > body plan'?
      > > > > > > David Clemmer has created an excellent photo essay of
      > the
      > > > > building of
      > > > > > a
      > > > > > > Vintage:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > http://tinyurl. <http://tinyurl.com/6y8hee> com/6y8hee
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > They're doing it Right!
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > --
      > > > > > > John <jkohnen@>
      > > > > > > School days, I believe, are the unhappiest in the whole
      > > span
      > > > of
      > > > > > > human existence . They are full of dull, unintelligible
      > > tasks,
      > > > > > > new and unpleasant ordinances, brutal violations of
      > common
      > > > sense
      > > > > > > and common decency. <H. L. Mencken>
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • gordocutter_1
      Hello Mike!How are you? Thank you for the kindly words, its seems that you reach what I was trying to say, I don t know why I was misinterpreted by Gordon but
      Message 2 of 22 , Jul 13, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        Hello Mike!How are you? Thank you for the kindly words, its seems
        that you reach what I was trying to say, I don't know why I was
        misinterpreted by Gordon but I'll sure be more careful for now on
        if I make any comment on the group.

        --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Dolph" <johndolph@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > I would discount arrogance as a cause of friction here Gordon; it
        > really has a significantly different meaning and measure for
        Gordo.
        > He's a Brazilian who's native language is Portuguese. There is
        plenty
        > of arrogance here and there but there it's meaning makes his advice
        > more like a fatherly admonition than a cutdown.
        >
        > Gordo is in the planning stages of building a traditional Atkin's
        > sloop; like translating white oak into a locally obtainable wood
        > useful for steam bending or to balance that strip planking over
        > laminated frames in locally obtainable woods.
        >
        > I give him extra credit for reaching over thousands of miles and a
        > whole culture to glean what he needs from forums like this. He's
        just
        > trying to be friendly and learn, he's not trying to make trouble.
        > He's also here for on topic reasons since his project is an Atkins
        design.
        >
        > Mike Dolph
        >
        > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Arrogant
        > >
        > > I don't know, probably am.
        > > I was called a Prima Donna way back when I was Model Maker,
        > Designer, and shop supervisor for Riggen MFG
        > > (Slot Cars). That was 30 yrs before they put me in the Slot Car
        Hall
        > Of fame http://www.slotcars.org/hallofame/
        > > Less than 100 people made it. Have been sailing for over 23 yrs
        and
        > owned 4 sailboats but learn each time I go out, Just like my Golf
        game.
        > >
        > > You have a nice day. It is raining cats and dogs now, Moonson
        > Weather and my building table and Spray backbone are going through
        > it's first storm right now.
        > >
        > > Gordon Brimhall
        > >
        > >
        > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > From: gordocutter_1
        > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
        > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 6:11 PM
        > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
        > >
        > >
        > > You understand everything wrong buddy! I'm not criticizing
        you, or
        > > telling that your beautiful little boat will sink or capsize.
        You
        > > don't need to be sentimental, or rude. All I did was a comment
        about
        > > an article that I read about the boat of Slocum. In fact I was
        > > trying to demonstrate my respect for such a great challenge
        like
        > > yours. I'll not get into an discursion about what I do or not
        with
        > > my life, but I do have some years of sea and one thing I can
        tell
        > > you, you should keep that arrogance a little lower cause THAT
        can
        > > kill you or sink any boat. God luck with your project.
        > >
        > > Adaucto Mello
        > >
        > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Always somebody like you around.
        > > > Got to remember mine is only 9 ft long so it
        > > > has 1/4th the same chances to capsize
        > > > But it also has positive flotation and will not sink
        > > >
        > > > smile
        > > >
        > > > So tell me what have you done in your life challanging?
        > > >
        > > > I know it would be safer to just sit and watch TV or spend
        my time
        > > on forums
        > > > telling other people their boat is going to sink
        > > >
        > > > Gordon
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > From: gordocutter_1
        > > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2008 9:16 AM
        > > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > What a tremendous challenge you're going into! I saw the
        page! I
        > > was
        > > > always interested in the history of Slocum, and also about
        his
        > > boat,
        > > > after all lots of people like the Joshua lines, but I read
        > > something
        > > > disturbing about her, its seems that in strong conditions of
        > > weather
        > > > a boat of her lines and dimensions became unstable and can
        > > capsize
        > > > and not get right side up again, that was one of the
        explanation
        > > > about the disappear of Slocum in his last journey. This was
        a
        > > study
        > > > made by an naval arquitet I read in a article in the web,
        don't
        > > know
        > > > if it's true.
        > > >
        > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > Not building a mold and all I have are lines in 1" = 1 ft
        > > scale
        > > > that I am coming up with the lofting numbers from. Building
        it
        > > the
        > > > old way plank on frame multi chine. I could lay the frames
        out
        > > > deducting for the plank thickness but my question was does
        it
        > > make a
        > > > difference? To me it does not.
        > > > >
        > > > > This is a one of a kind boat anyway and if you think real
        hard
        > > you
        > > > can say it is a Mini Spray and I got the lines from Bruce
        > > Roberts
        > > > Gratus, lines only and nothing else. Building to George
        Buehlers
        > > > methods. You can see the project at www.aroundinten.org
        > > > >
        > > > > Thanks for your comments
        > > > >
        > > > > Gordon
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > From: javadave2
        > > > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 2:50 PM
        > > > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Well, it may not matter too much if you added an inch of
        beam,
        > > > but
        > > > > you could run into a number of other issues without doing
        the
        > > > > deducted body plan. For example, if you built your moulds
        off
        > > of
        > > > the
        > > > > outside of the planking on the body plan, that would
        change
        > > your
        > > > stem
        > > > > and keel in profile, and the corresponding rabbet and
        bearding
        > > > > lines. I don't know how much this would affect the Spray
        > > design.
        > > > It
        > > > > probably would be much easier to pattern the moulds off of
        the
        > > > inside
        > > > > of the planking than trying to make a bunch of adjustments
        to
        > > > the
        > > > > keel and stem, veering from the design. Or, if you've
        already
        > > > built
        > > > > your moulds, you could draw the inner plank lines on them
        and
        > > > recut
        > > > > to those lines.
        > > > >
        > > > > Good luck, hope this helps!
        > > > > Dave
        > > > >
        > > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "Gordon" <gordon@>
        wrote:
        > > > > >
        > > > > > How much does it matter if you allow for the planking
        from
        > > the
        > > > > layout offset lines? I am building a small 9' 6" Josh
        Slocum
        > > > Spray
        > > > > and laying out my frames I really don't care if the extra
        1/2"
        > > > > planking or what ever I use makes my boat a little fatter.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Gordon
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > > From: javadave2
        > > > > > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > > Sent: Monday, July 07, 2008 9:38 AM
        > > > > > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Re: How To Build A Wooden Boat
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > The body plan in the design plans for Vintage (as with
        most
        > > > > design
        > > > > > plans) are drawn to the outside of the planking. On the
        > > loft,
        > > > > > the 'deducted body plan' are the additional lines drawn
        to
        > > the
        > > > > inside
        > > > > > of the planking. The moulds are patterned from these
        lines.
        > > > Are
        > > > > > there other terms for 'deducted body plan'?
        > > > > > Dave
        > > > > >
        > > > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "hotwizard44"
        > > > <hotwizard44@>
        > > > > > wrote:
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "John Kohnen"
        > > <jkohnen@>
        > > > > wrote:
        > > > > > > >There are many things I don't know about lofting.
        What's
        > > > > > a 'deducted
        > > > > > > body plan'?
        > > > > > > > David Clemmer has created an excellent photo essay
        of
        > > the
        > > > > > building of
        > > > > > > a
        > > > > > > > Vintage:
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > http://tinyurl.com/6y8hee
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > They're doing it Right!
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > --
        > > > > > > > John <jkohnen@>
        > > > > > > > School days, I believe, are the unhappiest in the
        whole
        > > > span
        > > > > of
        > > > > > > > human existence . They are full of dull,
        unintelligible
        > > > tasks,
        > > > > > > > new and unpleasant ordinances, brutal violations of
        > > common
        > > > > sense
        > > > > > > > and common decency. <H. L. Mencken>
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        >
      • javadave2
        Hope to see you at the Port Townsend Wooden Boat festival! We just got the sail fitted yesterday and should have the Magic Wing there Friday morning:
        Message 3 of 22 , Sep 1, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          Hope to see you at the Port Townsend Wooden Boat festival! We just
          got the sail fitted yesterday and should have the Magic Wing there
          Friday morning:

          http://www.woodenboat.org/boats/Boat_Detail.aspx?processID=561

          Pictures will be posted to the site next week.

          Dave

          --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, "John Kohnen" <jkohnen@...> wrote:
          >
          > David Clemmer has created an excellent photo essay of the building
          of a
          > Vintage:
          >
          > http://tinyurl.com/6y8hee
          >
          > They're doing it Right!
          >
          > --
          > John <jkohnen@...>
          > School days, I believe, are the unhappiest in the whole span of
          > human existence . They are full of dull, unintelligible tasks,
          > new and unpleasant ordinances, brutal violations of common sense
          > and common decency. <H. L. Mencken>
          >
        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.