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Re: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods

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  • lon wells
    Frame less stitch and glue works well with smaller boats. Once a boat reaches the size of River Belle the hull loads and forces require the frames for the
    Message 1 of 16 , Apr 1 8:28 AM
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      Frame less stitch and glue works well with smaller
      boats. Once a boat reaches the size of River Belle the
      hull loads and forces require the frames for the
      structural integrity. Your plywood sections need to be
      supported.

      The other problem is the twist and distortion of the
      plywood required on the mold lines of a Seabright
      skiffs hull would be hard if not impossible to hold
      with stitch and glue.
      Lon

      --- Alan Boman <alan@...> wrote:

      > I am about to build a River Belle and have been
      > persuaded to use "Stitch and
      > Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames &
      > planks.
      >
      >
      >
      > Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Alan
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been
      > removed]
      >
      >




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    • Alan Boman
      George, The original planking specs are Double Diagonal White Cedar, inside 3/8 and outside 7/16 . We are proposing double diagonal 12mm marine ply. The
      Message 2 of 16 , Apr 1 4:52 PM
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        George,



        The original planking specs are Double Diagonal White Cedar, inside 3/8" and
        outside 7/16". We are proposing double diagonal 12mm marine ply.



        The bottom is specified as 1 3/4" White Oak, we are proposing double 19mm
        marine ply.



        The lower Skiff part of the hull will be made separately on moulds, with the
        fore and aft sections cold moulded as appropriate, then "stitched & glassed"
        into the remainder of the hull.



        The hull will be made on chipboard moulds the same shape and spacing as the
        original frames and, once turned over, internal plywood bulkheads lifted
        from the lofting and installed to suit the interior layout, (which is yet to
        be determined).



        Well, that's the plan at least... What do you think ?





        Alan



        -----Original Message-----
        From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of George C
        Sent: Wednesday, 2 April 2008 8:44 AM
        To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods



        Alan,

        Taking a design like the River Belle and converting to stitch and glue will
        require a sizeable amount of engineering, especially a 35' boat with a
        Seabright Skiff type hull. What type of hull planking does the plans
        specify: material, thickness?

        George

        ----- Original Message ----
        From: Alan Boman <alan@... <mailto:alan%40boman.com> >
        To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
        Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 8:20:23 PM
        Subject: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods

        I am about to build a River Belle and have been persuaded to use "Stitch and
        Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames & planks.

        Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?

        Alan

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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      • Len Schmitt
        I am building a Spermacetti ( another Atkins Sea Bright skiff) using Reuel Parker s Cold molded Boatbuilding. I have nt yet figured out how to marry the hull
        Message 3 of 16 , Apr 4 10:59 PM
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          I am building a Spermacetti ( another Atkins Sea Bright skiff) using Reuel Parker's Cold molded Boatbuilding. I have'nt yet figured out how to marry the hull to the box keel yet, but with the warmer weather coming I hope to come up with something soon.

          Len Schmitt

          Alan Boman <alan@...> wrote:
          I am about to build a River Belle and have been persuaded to use "Stitch and
          Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames & planks.

          Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?

          Alan

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






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        • Kenneth Grome
          If you re building them separately I might suggest 2-3 layers of biaxial tape embedded in epoxy ... a stitch and glue joint. This is how the tunnel stern
          Message 4 of 16 , Apr 4 11:13 PM
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            If you're building them separately I might suggest 2-3 layers of biaxial
            tape embedded in epoxy ... a stitch and glue joint. This is how the
            tunnel stern panels are held together on my Tolman Seabright skiff.

            Sincerely,
            Ken Grome
            Bagacay Boatworks
            www.bagacayboatworks.com


            > I am building a Spermacetti ( another Atkins Sea Bright skiff) using
            > Reuel Parker's Cold molded Boatbuilding. I have'nt yet figured out
            > how to marry the hull to the box keel yet, but with the warmer
            > weather coming I hope to come up with something soon.
          • Michael Walther
            Hi Alan, Researching something else, I just now came across this @ Devlin s Boatbuilding: How to Build Any Boat the Stitch-and-Glue Way or @
            Message 5 of 16 , Apr 13 2:44 AM
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              Hi Alan, Researching something else, I just now came across this @ Devlin's Boatbuilding: How to Build Any Boat the Stitch-and-Glue Way or @ http://www.devlinboat.com/ wish I'd thought of & found it sooner for you. You might say he the "King of Stitch and Glue". Good luck & don't forget to post progress reports with pix (I like pix:)) Thanks, Mike

              --- On Tue, 4/1/08, Alan Boman <alan@...> wrote:
              From: Alan Boman <alan@...>
              Subject: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods
              To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Tuesday, April 1, 2008, 3:20 AM











              I am about to build a River Belle and have been persuaded to use "Stitch and

              Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames & planks.



              Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?



              Alan



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


























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            • Alan Boman
              Hi Mike, Have located How to Build Any Boat the Stitch & Glue Way at Amazon and have ordered a copy - thanks for the info. Will let you (& group) know what
              Message 6 of 16 , Apr 16 1:49 AM
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                Hi Mike,



                Have located "How to Build Any Boat the Stitch & Glue Way" at Amazon and
                have ordered a copy - thanks for the info.



                Will let you (& group) know what it's like when I've had a read.



                Cheers





                Alan







                -----Original Message-----
                From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
                Behalf Of Michael Walther
                Sent: Sunday, 13 April 2008 7:15 PM
                To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods



                Hi Alan, Researching something else, I just now came across this @ Devlin's
                Boatbuilding: How to Build Any Boat the Stitch-and-Glue Way or @
                http://www.devlinbo <http://www.devlinboat.com/> at.com/ wish I'd thought of
                & found it sooner for you. You might say he the "King of Stitch and Glue".
                Good luck & don't forget to post progress reports with pix (I like pix:))
                Thanks, Mike

                --- On Tue, 4/1/08, Alan Boman <alan@... <mailto:alan%40boman.com> >
                wrote:
                From: Alan Boman <alan@... <mailto:alan%40boman.com> >
                Subject: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods
                To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
                Date: Tuesday, April 1, 2008, 3:20 AM

                I am about to build a River Belle and have been persuaded to use "Stitch and

                Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames & planks.

                Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?

                Alan

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]











                __________________________________________________
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                Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Michael Walther
                Hey Alan, Just found your message, glad it (info) might be helpful, hope so. Thanks for your response and hoping it s a good read & you enjoy it. I am looking
                Message 7 of 16 , Apr 16 3:34 AM
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                  Hey Alan, Just found your message, glad it (info) might be helpful, hope so. Thanks for your response and hoping it's a good read & you enjoy it. I am looking forward to your critique as well. Enjoy, Mike
                  Ps. This is my third attempt due to Yahoo screw ups. If this ends up as repeat, I apologize. And again, Enjoy, Mike

                  --- On Wed, 4/16/08, Alan Boman <alan@...> wrote:

                  > From: Alan Boman <alan@...>
                  > Subject: RE: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods
                  > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Wednesday, April 16, 2008, 8:49 AM
                  > Hi Mike,
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Have located "How to Build Any Boat the Stitch &
                  > Glue Way" at Amazon and
                  > have ordered a copy - thanks for the info.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Will let you (& group) know what it's like when
                  > I've had a read.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Cheers
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Alan
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
                  > [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
                  > Behalf Of Michael Walther
                  > Sent: Sunday, 13 April 2008 7:15 PM
                  > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Hi Alan, Researching something else, I just now came across
                  > this @ Devlin's
                  > Boatbuilding: How to Build Any Boat the Stitch-and-Glue Way
                  > or @
                  > http://www.devlinbo <http://www.devlinboat.com/>
                  > at.com/ wish I'd thought of
                  > & found it sooner for you. You might say he the
                  > "King of Stitch and Glue".
                  > Good luck & don't forget to post progress reports
                  > with pix (I like pix:))
                  > Thanks, Mike
                  >
                  > --- On Tue, 4/1/08, Alan Boman <alan@...
                  > <mailto:alan%40boman.com> >
                  > wrote:
                  > From: Alan Boman <alan@...
                  > <mailto:alan%40boman.com> >
                  > Subject: [AtkinBoats] Alternative Building Methods
                  > To: AtkinBoats@yahoogro
                  > <mailto:AtkinBoats%40yahoogroups.com> ups.com
                  > Date: Tuesday, April 1, 2008, 3:20 AM
                  >
                  > I am about to build a River Belle and have been persuaded
                  > to use "Stitch and
                  >
                  > Glue" method with plywood instead of sawn frames &
                  > planks.
                  >
                  > Has anyone any thoughts or better still experience ?
                  >
                  > Alan
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________
                  > Do You Yahoo!?
                  > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection
                  > around
                  > http://mail. <http://mail.yahoo.com> yahoo.com
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > No flaming, cursing, politics, religion or public mopery.
                  > Please be polite.
                  >
                  > If you set out to build an Atkin boat, please do not modify
                  > the plans. If you stray from the plans you do so at your own
                  > risk and Atkin & Co. will take no responsibility for the
                  > performance of the resulting boat.
                  >
                  > The current Atkin boat plans catalog is online at
                  > <http://www.atkinboatplans.com/>
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >

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                • Alan Boman
                  Hi Guys, I m building a River Belle 36 Tunnel Stern river boat, and I just put the last piece of the bottom in place and thought you might like a photo.
                  Message 8 of 16 , Mar 20, 2009
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                    Hi Guys,



                    I'm building a "River Belle" 36' Tunnel Stern river boat, and I just put the
                    last piece of the bottom in place and thought you might like a photo.



                    There is still a looooong way to go but it's nice to see a 65 year old
                    design coming into being; it's like a piece of history being resurrected
                    out of the mist. Mr William never intended this design for plywood & epoxy
                    (obviously), but the panels sit on the curves very nicely. A complement to
                    a lovely design.



                    There are more pictures and a log of construction to date at
                    "riverbelle.boman.biz" if you are interested in more detail.



                    Alan

                    South Australia



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Sgt Sak
                    Outstanding!!!, that is the design I am interested in building. I am currently building the garage that I will build the boat in. I am really grateful for the
                    Message 9 of 16 , Mar 21, 2009
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                      Outstanding!!!, that is the design I am interested in building. I am currently building the garage that I will build the boat in. I am really grateful for the pictures. I gives me an idea of the scale of the project.
                      Regards
                      Phil
                    • John Kohnen
                      Looks good Alan! I m pleased to see that on your Web page you mention that your boat was inspired by Wm. Atkin s design. I suppose this is a good time to
                      Message 10 of 16 , Mar 26, 2009
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                        Looks good Alan! I'm pleased to see that on your Web page you mention that
                        your boat was "inspired by" Wm. Atkin's design. I suppose this is a good
                        time to remind people that when they alter an Atkin design, it becomes
                        their design, not an Atkin boat, and the Atkins can't be blamed for any
                        peculiarities in the performance. But your boat looks good so far, Alan,
                        and I hope it works out well for you.

                        On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:41:52 -0700, Alan B wrote:

                        > ...
                        > I'm building a "River Belle" 36' Tunnel Stern river boat, and I just put
                        > the
                        > last piece of the bottom in place and thought you might like a photo.
                        > ...
                        > There are more pictures and a log of construction to date at
                        > "riverbelle.boman.biz" if you are interested in more detail.

                        --
                        John <jkohnen@...>
                        The denunciation of the young is a necessary part of the hygiene
                        of older people, and greatly assists the circulation of the
                        blood. <Logan Pearsall Smith>
                      • Alan Boman
                        Hi John, Your absolutely right. Although the changes I have made to Mr William s design are very minor, they have been very carefully thought about and are my
                        Message 11 of 16 , Mar 26, 2009
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                          Hi John,

                          Your absolutely right. Although the changes I have made to Mr William's
                          design are very minor, they have been very carefully thought about and are
                          my responsibility.

                          Below the waterline, the prop shaft angle is flattened a bit because I have
                          moved the engine forward and I have also offset the engine to Starboard
                          instead on Port because of its direction of rotation, and that's it.

                          Above the chine, I have changed the flat planked sides to curved clinker
                          with a raised sheer because it better suits frameless plywood construction.

                          We'll see how it works out.

                          Cheers

                          Alan

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On
                          Behalf Of John Kohnen
                          Sent: Friday, 27 March 2009 11:25 AM
                          To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] A "River Belle" starts to appear

                          Looks good Alan! I'm pleased to see that on your Web page you mention that
                          your boat was "inspired by" Wm. Atkin's design. I suppose this is a good
                          time to remind people that when they alter an Atkin design, it becomes
                          their design, not an Atkin boat, and the Atkins can't be blamed for any
                          peculiarities in the performance. But your boat looks good so far, Alan,
                          and I hope it works out well for you.

                          On Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:41:52 -0700, Alan B wrote:

                          > ...
                          > I'm building a "River Belle" 36' Tunnel Stern river boat, and I just put
                          > the
                          > last piece of the bottom in place and thought you might like a photo.
                          > ...
                          > There are more pictures and a log of construction to date at
                          > "riverbelle.boman.biz" if you are interested in more detail.

                          --
                          John <jkohnen@...>
                          The denunciation of the young is a necessary part of the hygiene
                          of older people, and greatly assists the circulation of the
                          blood. <Logan Pearsall Smith>


                          ------------------------------------

                          No flaming, cursing, politics, religion or public mopery. Please be polite.

                          If you set out to build an Atkin boat, please do not modify the plans. If
                          you stray from the plans you do so at your own risk and Atkin & Co. will
                          take no responsibility for the performance of the resulting boat.

                          The current Atkin boat plans catalog is online at
                          <http://www.atkinboatplans.com/>

                          Yahoo! Groups Links
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