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Re: [AtkinBoats] Present "box keel" designers?

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  • John Kohnen
    Dave Gerr has done some recent work on tunnel-stern V-bottom Seabright skiffs: http://www.gerrmarine.com/ ... -- John Missionaries, my
    Message 1 of 10 , Mar 31, 2007
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      Dave Gerr has done some recent work on tunnel-stern V-bottom Seabright
      skiffs:

      http://www.gerrmarine.com/

      On Sat, 31 Mar 2007 11:48:02 -0700, Fred wrote:

      > I am wondering if anyone is continuing the work of ATKIN in creating
      > new boats of the Sea Bright configuration?
      >
      > Any tank tests , or rules of thumb to the SB design?
      >
      > I have plans for River Belle , and her bottom is quite close to my
      > requirements , just needs to be stretched to 38.7 and narrowed to 7.6
      > beam.
      >
      > Will do it myself if there are no pros up to speed,but need to check.

      --
      John <jkohnen@...>
      Missionaries, my Dear! Don't you realize that missionaries are
      the divinely provided food for destitute cannibals? Whenever
      they are on the brink of starvation, Heaven in its infinite mercy
      send them a nice plump missionary. <Oscar Wilde>
    • sensationalknittedsocks
      I m familiar with the Gerr designs but think he failed to use the speed potential the Atkin boats had with low powered engines. With the flyweight diesel
      Message 2 of 10 , Apr 1, 2007
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        I'm familiar with the Gerr designs but think he failed to use the
        speed potential the Atkin boats had with low powered engines.

        With the flyweight diesel engines today a cruise of 18K to 24K should
        seem reasonable if 3nmpg were acceptable at 24K.

        At reduced speeds the range could be extended .

        Fred
      • Kenneth Grome
        ... Renn Tolman designed the Tolman Seabright Skiff and I m building the first one after the prototype. It s a brand new boat so plans will be available
        Message 3 of 10 , Apr 1, 2007
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          On Sunday 01 April 2007 02:48:02 am sensationalknittedsocks wrote:
          > I am wondering if anyone is continuing the work of ATKIN in creating
          > new boats of the Sea Bright configuration?


          Renn Tolman designed the Tolman Seabright Skiff and I'm building the first one
          after the prototype. It's a brand new boat so plans will be available
          eventually, but not until I have finished debugging them for Renn.

          Sincerely,
          Ken Grome
          Bagacay Boatworks
          www.bagacayboatworks.com
        • Kenneth Grome
          I think Dave Gerr got it right. Seabrights were never designed to go that fast. Atkin warned about trying to drive them faster than their design speeds, and
          Message 4 of 10 , Apr 1, 2007
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            I think Dave Gerr got it right.

            Seabrights were never designed to go that fast. Atkin warned about trying to
            drive them faster than their design speeds, and he had good reason to do so.

            I have read that once they exceed the design speed envelope their hulls do not
            trap the wake like they do at their design speeds, and this adversely affects
            handling.

            In other words, running them faster makes them dangerous.

            Sincerely,
            Ken Grome
            Bagacay Boatworks
            www.bagacayboatworks.com






            > I'm familiar with the Gerr designs but think he failed to use the
            > speed potential the Atkin boats had with low powered engines.
            >
            > With the flyweight diesel engines today a cruise of 18K to 24K should
            > seem reasonable if 3nmpg were acceptable at 24K.
          • Jay K. Jeffries
            I grew up in South Jersey and there were (may still be) high-powered (aka 427 Hemi with open, straight exhausts) modified Sea Bright skiff races on the
            Message 5 of 10 , Apr 1, 2007
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              I grew up in South Jersey and there were (may still be) high-powered (aka 427 Hemi with open, straight exhausts) modified Sea Bright skiff races on the Intercoastal when it was glass smooth. They were ungodly fast, crew sat at the transom wearing high collared racing life jackets, and you could hear them miles away. Any boat you run fast has adverse handling characteristics, it is a matter of the operator being able to anticipate necessary corrections, and being able to apply them fast enough.

              R/Jay





              Respectfully,

              Jay K. Jeffries

              Andros Is., Bahamas



              A skimmer afloat is but a submarine, so poorly built it will not plunge.



              -----Original Message-----
              From: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kenneth Grome
              Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 7:02 AM
              To: AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [AtkinBoats] Re: Present "box keel" designers?



              I think Dave Gerr got it right.



              Seabrights were never designed to go that fast. Atkin warned about trying to

              drive them faster than their design speeds, and he had good reason to do so.



              I have read that once they exceed the design speed envelope their hulls do not

              trap the wake like they do at their design speeds, and this adversely affects

              handling.



              In other words, running them faster makes them dangerous.



              Sincerely,

              Ken Grome

              Bagacay Boatworks

              www.bagacayboatworks.com













              > I'm familiar with the Gerr designs but think he failed to use the

              > speed potential the Atkin boats had with low powered engines.

              >

              > With the flyweight diesel engines today a cruise of 18K to 24K should

              > seem reasonable if 3nmpg were acceptable at 24K.











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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Sam Glasscock
              Phil Bolger has a number of box keel designs, as does Chespeake Marine Designs. I don t think any of them uses a reverse deadrise tunnel like Rescue Minor et
              Message 6 of 10 , Apr 1, 2007
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                Phil Bolger has a number of box keel designs, as does
                Chespeake Marine Designs. I don't think any of them
                uses a reverse deadrise tunnel like Rescue Minor et
                al, though.
                --- sensationalknittedsocks
                <sensationalknittedsocks@...> wrote:

                > Hi Gang,
                >
                > I am wondering if anyone is continuing the work of
                > ATKIN in creating
                > new boats of the Sea Bright configuration?
                >
                > Any tank tests , or rules of thumb to the SB design?
                >
                > I have plans for River Belle , and her bottom is
                > quite close to my
                > requirements , just needs to be stretched to 38.7
                > and narrowed to 7.6
                > beam.
                >
                > Will do it myself if there are no pros up to
                > speed,but need to check.
                >
                > FRED
                >
                >
                >
                >




                ____________________________________________________________________________________
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              • sensationalknittedsocks
                I think Dave Gerr got it right. Seabrights were never designed to go that fast. Atkin warned about trying to drive them faster than their design speeds, and
                Message 7 of 10 , Apr 2, 2007
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                  "I think Dave Gerr got it right.

                  Seabrights were never designed to go that fast. Atkin warned about
                  trying to drive them faster than their design speeds, and he had good
                  reason to do so.

                  Gerr in TNOB claims there still fine at SL 4

                  For a 36ft lwl that would be 24K ,,fine for me as it should be doable
                  in such a skinney hull at 8gph.

                  "I have read that once they exceed the design speed envelope their
                  hulls do not trap the wake like they do at their design speeds, and
                  this adversely affects handling.

                  In other words, running them faster makes them dangerous."


                  The only MoTorBoat article I have that talks about a boat run with a
                  2X sized re engine found the stern continued to lift , and submerged
                  too much stem , causing bow steering.
                  Atkins solution was simple strakes that lifted the bow , to maintain
                  the same attitude at the higher speeds.

                  Chine strakes cost HP to work, we are considering a trim tab set ,
                  that would work backwards from normal.

                  At low and medium speeds the tabs would allow the standard Atkin style
                  stern lift from the aft section.

                  At higher speed the stern could be lowered by opening (closing the
                  tabs) the aft outlet and not immersing the bow to excess.

                  At very high plaining speeds ,I'm sure the std V bottom with big dead
                  rise would work fine , but 24K is not a very high speed as SL4 is
                  still in the Semiplaining regime.


                  FF
                • thomasp118
                  Dave Gerr http://www.gerrmarine.com Some of Dave s designs which reflect the Atkin tunnel hulled, seabright skiff model:
                  Message 8 of 10 , Apr 11, 2007
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                    Dave Gerr

                    http://www.gerrmarine.com

                    Some of Dave's designs which reflect the Atkin tunnel hulled,
                    seabright skiff model:

                    http://gerrmarine.com/images/boat_images/power/gerr42tunnel/gerr42tunn
                    elD.GIF

                    (note the propellor in relation to the waterline)
                    http://gerrmarine.com/images/boat_images/power/gerr76/gerr76c.GIF

                    http://gerrmarine.com/images/boat_images/power/gerr47tunnel/gerr47tunn
                    elC.JPG

                    Best of luck!
                    ~Thomas Paulay



                    --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, Sam Glasscock
                    <glasscocklanding@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Phil Bolger has a number of box keel designs, as does
                    > Chespeake Marine Designs. I don't think any of them
                    > uses a reverse deadrise tunnel like Rescue Minor et
                    > al, though.
                    > --- sensationalknittedsocks
                    > <sensationalknittedsocks@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > Hi Gang,
                    > >
                    > > I am wondering if anyone is continuing the work of
                    > > ATKIN in creating
                    > > new boats of the Sea Bright configuration?
                    > >
                    > > Any tank tests , or rules of thumb to the SB design?
                    > >
                    > > I have plans for River Belle , and her bottom is
                    > > quite close to my
                    > > requirements , just needs to be stretched to 38.7
                    > > and narrowed to 7.6
                    > > beam.
                    > >
                    > > Will do it myself if there are no pros up to
                    > > speed,but need to check.
                    > >
                    > > FRED
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    ______________________________________________________________________
                    ______________
                    > Be a PS3 game guru.
                    > Get your game face on with the latest PS3 news and previews at
                    Yahoo! Games.
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                    >
                  • David
                    Also, check out the Mundoo series of boats (esp. M III) from Duck Flats, down in Australia. Cheers, David Graybeal Portland, OR Luck is the residue of design
                    Message 9 of 10 , Apr 11, 2007
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                      Also, check out the Mundoo series of boats (esp. M III) from Duck
                      Flats, down in Australia.

                      Cheers,
                      David Graybeal
                      Portland, OR

                      "Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey

                      *********************

                      --- In AtkinBoats@yahoogroups.com, Sam Glasscock
                      <glasscocklanding@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Phil Bolger has a number of box keel designs, as does
                      > Chespeake Marine Designs. I don't think any of them
                      > uses a reverse deadrise tunnel like Rescue Minor et
                      > al, though.
                      > --- sensationalknittedsocks
                      > <sensationalknittedsocks@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > Hi Gang,
                      > >
                      > > I am wondering if anyone is continuing the work of
                      > > ATKIN in creating
                      > > new boats of the Sea Bright configuration?
                      > >
                      > > Any tank tests , or rules of thumb to the SB design?
                      > >
                      > > I have plans for River Belle , and her bottom is
                      > > quite close to my
                      > > requirements , just needs to be stretched to 38.7
                      > > and narrowed to 7.6
                      > > beam.
                      > >
                      > > Will do it myself if there are no pros up to
                      > > speed,but need to check.
                      > >
                      > > FRED
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