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Interesting Point

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  • Lloyd Friedman
    According to Jewish tradition Judaism is passed from the mother. Why? because so many woman were raped, that the father could not be determined. When my
    Message 1 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
      According to Jewish tradition Judaism is passed from the mother. Why? because so many woman were raped,
      that the father could not be determined. When my daughter Alli wanted to do Alyia, she had to prove
      her mother was Jewish. I asked the interviewer, "are you Jewish?" she said yes. I said "prove it".
      She shrugged me off. I showed her my reform Rabbi's wedding certificate.  Not good enough she said.
      I said "if my Church of England wife's grandmother was Jewish, does that make her mother Jewish and therefore her mother Jewish?"
      That ended the conversation and my daughter went to Israel.
      Of course, today we know that the Jewish gene, if there is one, is passed by the father. So will the Jewish law change?
      I doubt it. Lloyd Donald Friedman.
    • busycee2
      ... woman were raped, ... had to prove ... it . ... enough she said. ... Jewish and therefore her mother Jewish? ... will the Jewish law change? ... But
      Message 2 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
        --- In Ashkenazi-Q@yahoogroups.com, "Lloyd Friedman" <lloydon@...> wrote:
        >
        > According to Jewish tradition Judaism is passed from the mother. Why? because so many
        woman were raped,
        > that the father could not be determined. When my daughter Alli wanted to do Alyia, she
        had to prove
        > her mother was Jewish. I asked the interviewer, "are you Jewish?" she said yes. I said "prove
        it".
        > She shrugged me off. I showed her my reform Rabbi's wedding certificate. Not good
        enough she said.
        > I said "if my Church of England wife's grandmother was Jewish, does that make her mother
        Jewish and therefore her mother Jewish?"
        > That ended the conversation and my daughter went to Israel.
        > Of course, today we know that the Jewish gene, if there is one, is passed by the father. So
        will the Jewish law change?
        > I doubt it. Lloyd Donald Friedman.
        >
        But everyone thought that the sex of a child was determined by the mother. If she couldn't
        give a husband a son, he could divorce her or in biblical times, take another wife or
        concubine.
      • NADENE GOLDFOOT
        But, if the mother is Jewish, regardless of when she became Jewish, as long as she is a recognized Jew, her children are Jewish, so she is passing down her
        Message 3 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
          But, if the mother is Jewish, regardless of when she became Jewish, as long as she is a recognized Jew, her children are Jewish, so she is "passing down her Jewishness" and that is how it has been done for at least several hundred years or more.  
           
          The mother has the most influence on the children in education.  She is also the one who "passes down Jewishness"  this way.  In the past, she was always in the picture, at home influencing the children. 
           
          I believe the law has changed with reform Jews.  If you have one parent Jewish you are Jewish.  Others still go with having a Jewish mother. 
           
          Being there are only 7 markers for mtdna, it's harder to tell if the mother was Jewish by dna, but I do have several papers of people studying Jewish women and their dna.  That will prove interesting. 
          Nadene
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 6:50 AM
          Subject: [Ashkenazi-Q] Interesting Point

          According to Jewish tradition Judaism is passed from the mother. Why? because so many woman were raped,
          that the father could not be determined. When my daughter Alli wanted to do Alyia, she had to prove
          her mother was Jewish. I asked the interviewer, "are you Jewish?" she said yes. I said "prove it".
          She shrugged me off. I showed her my reform Rabbi's wedding certificate.  Not good enough she said.
          I said "if my Church of England wife's grandmother was Jewish, does that make her mother Jewish and therefore her mother Jewish?"
          That ended the conversation and my daughter went to Israel.
          Of course, today we know that the Jewish gene, if there is one, is passed by the father. So will the Jewish law change?
          I doubt it. Lloyd Donald Friedman.

        • Rebekah Canada
          Hi Nadene, mtDNA has more than 7 markers.:-) Perhaps there is something that I can help explain? Rebekah
          Message 4 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
            Hi Nadene,

            mtDNA has more than 7 markers.:-) Perhaps there is something that I
            can help explain?

            Rebekah
          • NADENE GOLDFOOT
            Hi Rebecca, I meant 7 types, like in the Eve book. Helena was one of them. Yes, we had the 12 marker test. I was curious to see if my Swedish heritage would
            Message 5 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
              
              Hi Rebecca,
              I meant 7 types, like in the Eve book.  Helena was one of them.  Yes, we had the 12 marker test.  I was curious to see if my Swedish heritage would show a Q, but it turned out to be H.  Her family had been in Lumsheden, Sweden for a long period, ever since the 1700's that is recorded.
              Nadene
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 2:55 PM
              Subject: Re: [Ashkenazi-Q] Interesting Point

              Hi Nadene,

              mtDNA has more than 7 markers.:-) Perhaps there is something that I
              can help explain?

              Rebekah

            • Rebekah Canada
              Hi, That was an interesting book. There are several different types of H now. In Dr. Behar s newest paper he named out to H30. For H1 he took things out to
              Message 6 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
                Hi,

                That was an interesting book. There are several different types of H
                now. In Dr. Behar's newest paper he named out to H30. For H1 he took
                things out to H1p. That makes things much more interesting than just
                the 7.:-)

                On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 5:50 PM, NADENE GOLDFOOT <goldfoot1@...> wrote:
                > 
                >
                > Hi Rebecca,
                > I meant 7 types, like in the Eve book. Helena was one of them. Yes, we had
                > the 12 marker test. I was curious to see if my Swedish heritage would show

                > a Q, but it turned out to be H. Her family had been in Lumsheden, Sweden
                > for a long period, ever since the 1700's that is recorded.
                > Nadene
              • NADENE GOLDFOOT
                I ll put that on my list of another dna test to do. My, there s no end. I have the history of how Lumsheden was settled. It could make another interesting
                Message 7 of 7 , Jun 19, 2008
                  
                  I'll put that on my list of another dna test to do.  My, there's no end.  I have the history of how Lumsheden was settled.  It could make another interesting book. 
                  Nadene
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 4:28 PM
                  Subject: Re: [Ashkenazi-Q] Interesting Point

                  Hi,

                  That was an interesting book. There are several different types of H
                  now. In Dr. Behar's newest paper he named out to H30. For H1 he took
                  things out to H1p. That makes things much more interesting than just
                  the 7.:-)

                  On Thu, Jun 19, 2008 at 5:50 PM, NADENE GOLDFOOT <goldfoot1@verizon. net> wrote:
                  > 
                  >
                  > Hi Rebecca,
                  > I meant 7 types, like in the Eve book. Helena was one of them. Yes, we had
                  > the 12 marker test. I was curious to see if my Swedish heritage would show

                  > a Q, but it turned out to be H. Her family had been in Lumsheden, Sweden
                  > for a long period, ever since the 1700's that is recorded.
                  > Nadene

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