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Re: [Asatru-U] Question about spells and sacred times.

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  • Tassie Burnette
    I don t know Charlotte but I hope someone answers you because it is something I would like to know too. You read everywhere that Freya practiced witchcraft
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 9, 2012
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      I don't know Charlotte but I hope someone answers you because it is
      something I would like to know too. You read everywhere that Freya
      practiced witchcraft but I have not found any details like the question
      you've asked. I would like to know too, because She is my "Lady"

      Joyfully In Frith
      Tassie


      On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 10:02 AM, herblady27 <herblady27@...> wrote:

      > **
      >
      >
      > This may seem like a silly question but I am really new to Asatru and am
      > working on becoming a student. I have not fully read through all the sagas
      > and Eddas yet and am looking for information on spells and times of the
      > month.
      >
      > Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
      > wanning of the moon and spellwork. I've not done a whole lot of research on
      > this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the sigificance
      > of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells or if spellwork
      > is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
      >
      > -Charlotte-
      >
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Sunlight
      Yes, I love Her, too. Stephen
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 10, 2012
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        Yes, I love Her, too.
        Stephen

        --- In Asatru-U@yahoogroups.com, Tassie Burnette <tassierandy@...> wrote:
        >
        > I don't know Charlotte but I hope someone answers you because it is
        > something I would like to know too. You read everywhere that Freya
        > practiced witchcraft but I have not found any details like the question
        > you've asked. I would like to know too, because She is my "Lady"
        >
        > Joyfully In Frith
        > Tassie
        >
        >
        > On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 10:02 AM, herblady27 <herblady27@...> wrote:
        >
        > > **
        > >
        > >
        > > This may seem like a silly question but I am really new to Asatru and am
        > > working on becoming a student. I have not fully read through all the sagas
        > > and Eddas yet and am looking for information on spells and times of the
        > > month.
        > >
        > > Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
        > > wanning of the moon and spellwork. I've not done a whole lot of research on
        > > this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the sigificance
        > > of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells or if spellwork
        > > is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
        > >
        > > -Charlotte-
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Doug Freyburger
        ... Welcome Charlotte! A technicality - Wicca does not define general pagan traditions no matter they claim to.  Their claims of Borgdom do not actually make
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 10, 2012
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          "herblady27" herblady27@... wrote:

          >
          >   Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the wanning of the moon and spellwork.

          Welcome Charlotte!

          A technicality - Wicca does not define general pagan traditions no matter they claim to.  Their claims of Borgdom do not actually make them Borg.  Hindu and Shinto at least pay Wicca no heed whatsoever and we resemble them at least as much as we resemble Wicca.


          > I've not done a whole lot of research on this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the significance of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells

          This part is fairly hard to answer because -


          > or if spellwork is considered a part of the Asatru faith.


          I offer a cliche' -

          Wicca is a magical system that just happens to come with a religion.

          Asatru is a religion that just happens to come with a couple of magical systems.

          In Asatru it's quite acceptable to never practice any magic of any sort and it's common for our folks to take that approach.  In my very limited experience of Wicca and eclectic Pagandom there are a very small number of folks who do it for devotional or cultural reasons without practicing some sort of magic as well.  In my experience of Asatru nearly everyone who arrives because they had interest in runes or seidhr develops and interest in dealing with the Aesir, Vanir and allied spirits.  What the percentage of heathens is who are disinterested in magic is I'm not sure.  It's a lot.  Maybe even more than half of folks more than ten years in.  The runes and seidhr have this way of working themselves in through the cracks to be included so the "never practice" part might not be literally true for most but the number with a magical focus appear to remain a minority.

          Okay, so moving into the minority.

          The year has a vast effect on devotional observances and some of them like Charming of the Plow are magical in nature.  To me this means it should be natural that the time of year matters in some other spells.  Because the seasons were so strong an influence on the lives of our ancients, and because they knew the lunar month did not come out even when counted against the year, lunar months have far less influence on the stories in the existing lore.  To me this means spells not about something the Moon does are unlikely to benefit from reference to Mani.

          Your monthly cycle is a different story.  Runes were colored with natural pigments like ocher and blood.  With blood it could matter.  I've heard such referenced in conversations but no one has admitted to me that they had used menstrual blood to color runes.  Stuff happens that does not get admitted to.  References are made for symbolic purposes without a need for the referenced physical action.  Runes are symbols.  With symbols references count.
        • egilhalson
          Has anyone heard of something called skin walking? I ve only read about it once on a website that I can t seem to find now, and even then, the info about it
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 10, 2012
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            Has anyone heard of something called "skin walking?" I've only read about it once on a website that I can't seem to find now, and even then, the info about it was obscure other than it was something Odin did to travel in the form of another animal.

            --- In Asatru-U@yahoogroups.com, Scott Mohnkern <mohnkern@...> wrote:
            >
            > I'm sure there are many different answers to this, but from my perspective,
            > there really isn't a specific "time of month or year" where "spell work" is
            > done.
            >
            > Is their "spell work" within the Asatru faith? There's definitely
            > historical evidence of it, you have the example's in Egil's saga as well as
            > the Germania (divination). You also have Seidhr, which has been compared
            > to shamanic practices, and Galdr.
            >
            > How prevalent is it? Arguably less in Asatru when compared with other
            > traditions. I've talked to many Asatruar that never engage in what you
            > would likely call "spell work." They don't perform divination using the
            > runes, or engage in other spell like practices.
            >
            > However, for others, it is an integral component of their ongoing
            > practice. Even for these people, the spell work never "overrides" the
            > other parts of the faith (blots, sumbels, and honoring the gods through
            > deeds).
            >
            > Perhaps the way to think of it is that spell work is generally asking for
            > the gods to help us, in a very specific way, and I've always said that the
            > Norse gods expect you to take care of your own house.
            >
            > Scott
            >
            > Scott Mohnkern
            >
            >
            > On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 11:02 AM, herblady27 <herblady27@...> wrote:
            >
            > > **
            > >
            > >
            > > This may seem like a silly question but I am really new to Asatru and am
            > > working on becoming a student. I have not fully read through all the sagas
            > > and Eddas yet and am looking for information on spells and times of the
            > > month.
            > >
            > > Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
            > > wanning of the moon and spellwork. I've not done a whole lot of research on
            > > this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the sigificance
            > > of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells or if spellwork
            > > is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
            > >
            > > -Charlotte-
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Doug Freyburger
            My reply does not appear in the web view of the group.  Resending.
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 11, 2012
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              My reply does not appear in the web view of the group.  Resending.



              ----- Original Message -----
              > From: Doug Freyburger <dfreybur@...>
              > To: Asatru-U <asatru-u@yahoogroups.com>
              > Cc:
              > Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 10:17 AM
              > Subject: Re: [Asatru-U] Question about spells and sacred times.
              >
              >& quot;herblady27" herblady27@... wrote:
              >
              >>
              >>    Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
              > wanning of the moon and spellwork.
              >
              > Welcome Charlotte!
              >
              > A technicality - Wicca does not define general pagan traditions no matter they
              > claim to.  Their claims of Borgdom do not actually make them Borg.  Hindu and
              > Shinto at least pay Wicca no heed whatsoever and we resemble them at least as
              > much as we resemble Wicca.
              >
              >
              >> I've not done a whole lot of research on this but am wondering if there
              > is anything in Asatru about the significance of certain times of the month or
              > year and when to do spells
              >
              > This part is fairly hard to answer because -
              >
              >
              >> or if spellwork is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
              >
              >
              > I offer a cliche' -
              >
              > Wicca is a magical system that just happens to come with a religion.
              >
              > Asatru is a religion that just happens to come with a couple of magical systems.
              >
              > In Asatru it's quite acceptable to never practice any magic of any sort and
              > it's common for our folks to take that approach.  In my very limited
              > experience of Wicca and eclectic Pagandom there are a very small number of folks
              > who do it for devotional or cultural reasons without practicing some sort of
              > magic as well.  In my experience of Asatru nearly everyone who arrives because
              > they had interest in runes or seidhr develops and interest in dealing with the
              > Aesir, Vanir and allied spirits.  What the percentage of heathens is who are
              > disinterested in magic is I'm not sure.  It's a lot.  Maybe even more
              > than half of folks more than ten years in.  The runes and seidhr have this way
              > of working themselves in through the cracks to be included so the "never
              > practice" part might not be literally true for most but the number with a
              > magical focus appear to remain a minority.
              >
              > Okay, so moving into the minority.
              >
              > The year has a vast effect on devotional observances and some of them like
              > Charming of the Plow are magical in nature.  To me this means it should be
              > natural that the time of year matters in some other spells.  Because the seasons
              > were so strong an influence on the lives of our ancients, and because they knew
              > the lunar month did not come out even when counted against the year, lunar
              > months have far less influence on the stories in the existing lore.  To me this
              > means spells not about something the Moon does are unlikely to benefit from
              > reference to Mani.
              >
              > Your monthly cycle is a different story.  Runes were colored with natural
              > pigments like ocher and blood.  With blood it could matter.  I've heard such
              > referenced in conversations but no one has admitted to me that they had used
              > menstrual blood to color runes.  Stuff happens that does not get admitted to. 
              > References are made for symbolic purposes without a need for the referenced
              > physical action.  Runes are symbols.  With symbols references count.
              >
            • Jeff Peck
              Skinwalking? Only in a native American context, and then those who were skinwalkers were pretty much the villains of the piece... Odin shapshifting comes up in
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 11, 2012
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                Skinwalking? Only in a native American context, and then those who
                were skinwalkers were pretty much the villains of the piece...
                Odin shapshifting comes up in the story of acquiring the mead of poetry,
                but that's about the only place that I can recall off the top of my head.
                Lyulf

                On 4/10/2012 2:12 PM, egilhalson wrote:
                > Has anyone heard of something called "skin walking?" I've only read about it once on a website that I can't seem to find now, and even then, the info about it was obscure other than it was something Odin did to travel in the form of another animal.
                >
                > --- In Asatru-U@yahoogroups.com, Scott Mohnkern<mohnkern@...> wrote:
                >> I'm sure there are many different answers to this, but from my perspective,
                >> there really isn't a specific "time of month or year" where "spell work" is
                >> done.
                >>
                >> Is their "spell work" within the Asatru faith? There's definitely
                >> historical evidence of it, you have the example's in Egil's saga as well as
                >> the Germania (divination). You also have Seidhr, which has been compared
                >> to shamanic practices, and Galdr.
                >>
                >> How prevalent is it? Arguably less in Asatru when compared with other
                >> traditions. I've talked to many Asatruar that never engage in what you
                >> would likely call "spell work." They don't perform divination using the
                >> runes, or engage in other spell like practices.
                >>
                >> However, for others, it is an integral component of their ongoing
                >> practice. Even for these people, the spell work never "overrides" the
                >> other parts of the faith (blots, sumbels, and honoring the gods through
                >> deeds).
                >>
                >> Perhaps the way to think of it is that spell work is generally asking for
                >> the gods to help us, in a very specific way, and I've always said that the
                >> Norse gods expect you to take care of your own house.
                >>
                >> Scott
                >>
                >> Scott Mohnkern
                >>
                >>
                >> On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 11:02 AM, herblady27<herblady27@...> wrote:
                >>
                >>> **
                >>>
                >>>
                >>> This may seem like a silly question but I am really new to Asatru and am
                >>> working on becoming a student. I have not fully read through all the sagas
                >>> and Eddas yet and am looking for information on spells and times of the
                >>> month.
                >>>
                >>> Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
                >>> wanning of the moon and spellwork. I've not done a whole lot of research on
                >>> this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the sigificance
                >>> of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells or if spellwork
                >>> is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
                >>>
                >>> -Charlotte-
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>
                >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >>
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >

                --
                We carry in our hearts the true country,
                and that cannot be broken.
                We travel in the steps of our ancestry,
                and that cannot be stolen.< "the Dead Heart" Midnight Oil>
              • Kevin Steffen
                Actually, Monsieur Merceau (spelling?? it s been 20 years since I studied it) in his text on shamanism shows that the techniques of the shaman were fairly
                Message 7 of 9 , Apr 12, 2012
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                  Actually, Monsieur Merceau (spelling?? it's been 20 years since I
                  studied it) in his text on shamanism shows that the techniques of the
                  shaman were fairly common around the world with minor cultural
                  differences. Wod'n (germanic tribal of Odhinn) could well be considered
                  a shaman since so many of the techniques attributed to him in the lore
                  are shamanistic. Skin walking differs from shapeshifting in one
                  minor aspect, skin walking is a trance or dream tool where shape
                  shifting is normally considered a physical manifestation. The dance
                  in a skin to represent an animal spirit is another facet of skin walking.

                  Why Freya would have to loan Loki (a renowned sexual shapeshifter) her
                  cloak of feathers so he could assume the form of a falcon is a minor
                  point I missed unless it is an inability of his to assume certain forms.

                  The assignment of the role of villain to the shaman is a cultural bias.
                  But then the shaman is one who works with the spirits and is not one
                  appropriate for polite cultured society. In Korea, they are women of
                  the undesirable element, and to have a man as a practicing shaman is
                  shocking. Yet in a couple Native American tribes, it is accepted that
                  the strongest shaman are those who are gender benders.

                  Night Winds

                  Jeff Peck wrote:
                  > Skinwalking? Only in a native American context, and then those who
                  > were skinwalkers were pretty much the villains of the piece...
                  > Odin shapshifting comes up in the story of acquiring the mead of poetry,
                  > but that's about the only place that I can recall off the top of my head.
                  > Lyulf
                  >
                  > On 4/10/2012 2:12 PM, egilhalson wrote:
                  >
                  >> Has anyone heard of something called "skin walking?" I've only read about it once on a website that I can't seem to find now, and even then, the info about it was obscure other than it was something Odin did to travel in the form of another animal.
                  >>
                  >> --- In Asatru-U@yahoogroups.com, Scott Mohnkern<mohnkern@...> wrote:
                  >>
                  >>> I'm sure there are many different answers to this, but from my perspective,
                  >>> there really isn't a specific "time of month or year" where "spell work" is
                  >>> done.
                  >>>
                  >>> Is their "spell work" within the Asatru faith? There's definitely
                  >>> historical evidence of it, you have the example's in Egil's saga as well as
                  >>> the Germania (divination). You also have Seidhr, which has been compared
                  >>> to shamanic practices, and Galdr.
                  >>>
                  >>> How prevalent is it? Arguably less in Asatru when compared with other
                  >>> traditions. I've talked to many Asatruar that never engage in what you
                  >>> would likely call "spell work." They don't perform divination using the
                  >>> runes, or engage in other spell like practices.
                  >>>
                  >>> However, for others, it is an integral component of their ongoing
                  >>> practice. Even for these people, the spell work never "overrides" the
                  >>> other parts of the faith (blots, sumbels, and honoring the gods through
                  >>> deeds).
                  >>>
                  >>> Perhaps the way to think of it is that spell work is generally asking for
                  >>> the gods to help us, in a very specific way, and I've always said that the
                  >>> Norse gods expect you to take care of your own house.
                  >>>
                  >>> Scott
                  >>>
                  >>> Scott Mohnkern
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>> On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 11:02 AM, herblady27<herblady27@...> wrote:
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>>> **
                  >>>>
                  >>>>
                  >>>> This may seem like a silly question but I am really new to Asatru and am
                  >>>> working on becoming a student. I have not fully read through all the sagas
                  >>>> and Eddas yet and am looking for information on spells and times of the
                  >>>> month.
                  >>>>
                  >>>> Its general pagan traditions such as wicca that teach the waxing and the
                  >>>> wanning of the moon and spellwork. I've not done a whole lot of research on
                  >>>> this but am wondering if there is anything in Asatru about the sigificance
                  >>>> of certain times of the month or year and when to do spells or if spellwork
                  >>>> is considered a part of the Asatru faith.
                  >>>>
                  >>>> -Charlotte-
                  >>>>
                  >>>>
                  >>>>
                  >>>>
                  >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >>>
                  >>>
                  >>
                  >> ------------------------------------
                  >>
                  >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >
                  >
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