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Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)

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  • lisa blair
    Salve, I have made Caroemun in large batches and frozen it in ice trays. Just put them in ziplock after they freeze to keep them from absorbing freezer odors.
    Message 1 of 5 , Apr 1, 2011
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      Salve,

      I have made Caroemun in large batches and frozen it in ice trays. Just put them in ziplock after they freeze to keep them from absorbing freezer odors.

      Kept in an airtight container out of light, Juniper berries should keep for several year. I rotate out all of my spices about every two years.

      I use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in their own fat in a slow roaster.

      Gwenwhyvar


      Correus wrote:

      Ave Everyone!

      Per Lucia - "Concentrate grape juice?"

      I thought about using this - straight from the container. I wonder if it would be too sweet.

      Per Lori T. - "I make a larger batch and then freeze it in small amounts in Ziplocs for later use. What dish are you making?"

      I have done this in the past but haven't done it with Roman ingredients like this. When Sally's book 'Cooking Apicius' first came out I made batches of Adapted fish sauce, Defrutum and Caroenum. I've never been sure how long the stuff lasts in the fridge so I threw it out and never really replaced it.

      Also - passum.... Does anyone else out there use Manischewitz?

      The recipe I'm looking at is Isicia omentata. In this recipe several sources say to add about 2 Tbs of Caroenum to the meat, however, Sally G., as well as Giacosa, say to cook the meat IN the Caroenum.

      Now for another question in regard to this recipe - Omentum a.k.a Caul Fat. How many of you use this or do you substitute it for something else? Flower & Rosenbaum suggest tinfoil or grease-proof paper, something to keep the juices in. Seems to me the caul fat would add an extra layer of flavor.

      One last thing - Myrtle berries / Juniper berries. I need to find mine, there around here somewhere. Anyone have any idea of the shelf life for these? What would be a good substitute for them?

      Vale -
      Correus


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Correus
      Gwenwhyvar - I think I will make a batch and freeze it as well. My juniper berries I know are in a cool dark place if they didn t get thrown out accidentally.
      Message 2 of 5 , Apr 1, 2011
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        Gwenwhyvar -

        I think I will make a batch and freeze it as well.

        My juniper berries I know are in a cool dark place if they didn't get thrown out accidentally.

        Okay, now for the Omentata. 

        You said "use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in their own fat in a slow roaster".  Do you add the Caroenum to the meat or do you roast the meat in the Caroenum?

        Vale -
        Correus



        --- On Fri, 4/1/11, lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...> wrote:

        From: lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...>
        Subject: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)
        To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Friday, April 1, 2011, 11:56 AM







         









        Salve,



        I have made Caroemun in large batches and frozen it in ice trays. Just put them in ziplock after they freeze to keep them from absorbing freezer odors.



        Kept in an airtight container out of light, Juniper berries should keep for several year. I rotate out all of my spices about every two years.



        I use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in their own fat in a slow roaster.



        Gwenwhyvar


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Lori Tishgart
        I have done the same thing with freezing my homemade Defrutum too and it works very well. Regarding the juniper berries, they do keep a very long time. I
        Message 3 of 5 , Apr 1, 2011
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          I have done the same thing with freezing my homemade Defrutum too and it works
          very well. Regarding the juniper berries, they do keep a very long time. I
          have mused that even after a couple of years on the shelf, I wonder if I am
          actually recreating a more authentic flavor using the older spices. After all,
          it took quite awhile for spices to reach their final customer in the Roman
          Empire and, most likely, did not travel under the ideal shipping conditions nor
          stored in airtight containers on a cool, dark shelf after they were purchased.
          Enjoy the Omentata! Lori T.



          ________________________________
          From: Correus <correus@...>
          To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Fri, April 1, 2011 11:07:12 AM
          Subject: Re: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)


          Gwenwhyvar -

          I think I will make a batch and freeze it as well.

          My juniper berries I know are in a cool dark place if they didn't get thrown out
          accidentally.

          Okay, now for the Omentata.

          You said "use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in
          their own fat in a slow roaster". Do you add the Caroenum to the meat or do you
          roast the meat in the Caroenum?

          Vale -
          Correus

          --- On Fri, 4/1/11, lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...> wrote:

          From: lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...>
          Subject: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)
          To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Friday, April 1, 2011, 11:56 AM



          Salve,

          I have made Caroemun in large batches and frozen it in ice trays. Just put them
          in ziplock after they freeze to keep them from absorbing freezer odors.

          Kept in an airtight container out of light, Juniper berries should keep for
          several year. I rotate out all of my spices about every two years.

          I use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in their
          own fat in a slow roaster.

          Gwenwhyvar

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Correus
          Lori - I think you might be on to something in regard to the shelf life/strength of spices in the Roman word - especially those spices that came from the far
          Message 4 of 5 , Apr 2, 2011
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            Lori -

            I think you might be on to something in regard to the shelf life/strength of spices in the Roman word - especially those spices that came from the far flung areas of the Empire!

            BTW - my Juniper berries were tossed.  I talked to the wife and she remembers me doing this because they looked like they had gotten moldy some how.   Now I need to either buy more - which is a pain in my area - or find a substitute.

            Vale -
            Correus

            --- On Fri, 4/1/11, Lori Tishgart <ltishgart@...> wrote:

            From: Lori Tishgart <ltishgart@...>
            Subject: Re: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)
            To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Friday, April 1, 2011, 2:27 PM
















             









            I have done the same thing with freezing my homemade Defrutum too and it works

            very well. Regarding the juniper berries, they do keep a very long time. I

            have mused that even after a couple of years on the shelf, I wonder if I am

            actually recreating a more authentic flavor using the older spices. After all,

            it took quite awhile for spices to reach their final customer in the Roman

            Empire and, most likely, did not travel under the ideal shipping conditions nor

            stored in airtight containers on a cool, dark shelf after they were purchased.

            Enjoy the Omentata! Lori T.



            ________________________________

            From: Correus <correus@...>

            To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com

            Sent: Fri, April 1, 2011 11:07:12 AM

            Subject: Re: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)



            Gwenwhyvar -



            I think I will make a batch and freeze it as well.



            My juniper berries I know are in a cool dark place if they didn't get thrown out

            accidentally.



            Okay, now for the Omentata.



            You said "use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in

            their own fat in a slow roaster". Do you add the Caroenum to the meat or do you

            roast the meat in the Caroenum?



            Vale -

            Correus



            --- On Fri, 4/1/11, lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...> wrote:



            From: lisa blair <gwenhwyvar@...>

            Subject: [Apicius] Re: Isicia Omentata and Other Items (was Caroenum)

            To: Apicius@yahoogroups.com

            Date: Friday, April 1, 2011, 11:56 AM



            Salve,



            I have made Caroemun in large batches and frozen it in ice trays. Just put them

            in ziplock after they freeze to keep them from absorbing freezer odors.



            Kept in an airtight container out of light, Juniper berries should keep for

            several year. I rotate out all of my spices about every two years.



            I use meat with a high fat content for Omentata and cook them slowly in their

            own fat in a slow roaster.



            Gwenwhyvar



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