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Re:Army rations and gazpacho

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  • ChannonM@xxx.xxx
    I have found some info on gazpacho and it s origins indicating that it was based on the rations for Roman soldiers. I ve been beating the bushes for more,
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 28, 1999
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      I have found some info on gazpacho and it's origins indicating that it was
      based on the rations for Roman soldiers. I've been beating the bushes for
      more, especially a list of rations if possible. I've contacted some
      re-enactment groups with no luck so far. Does any one have any help on this
      matter.

      Thanks.

      Channon
    • Robert Sulentic
      I dunno about gazpacho, since tomatoes were unknown to the Romans, (or can you make gazpacho with out tomatoes?) Anyway, This is a list of foodstuffs mentioned
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 28, 1999
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        I dunno about gazpacho, since tomatoes were unknown to the Romans, (or can
        you make gazpacho with out tomatoes?)

        Anyway, This is a list of foodstuffs mentioned in the Vindolanda tablets,
        which you can read more about in "Life and Letters on the Roman Frontier" by
        Alan K. Bowman. (Vindolanda was a fort garrisoned by Belgian auxiliaries on
        Hadrian's wall).

        Acetum Sour wine? Vinegar?
        Alium(?) Garlic
        Alliatum Garlic Paste
        Amulum(?) Meal
        Apua Small fish
        Avena Fodder
        Axungia Pork fat
        Bracis Cereal
        Buturum(?) Butter
        Callum Pork-crackling
        Caprea Roe-deer
        Cervesa Beer
        Cervina Venison
        Condimenta Spices
        Conditum Pickling liquor
        Fabae Beans
        Faex(?) Lees of wine
        Frumentum Wheat
        (H)alica Semolina
        (Caro)hircina(?) Goat meat
        Hordeum Barley
        Lardum Lard
        Lens(?) Lentils
        Ligusticum Lovage
        Malum Apple
        Mel Honey
        Mulsum Wine and Honey
        Muria Fish-sauce
        Offella Pork cutlet
        Oleum Oil
        Olivae Olives
        Ostria Oysters
        Ova Eggs
        Panis Bread
        Perna Ham
        Piper Pepper
        Porcellum Young pig
        Prunolum(?) Plum
        Pullus Chicken
        Radices Radishes
        Sal Salt
        Spica Cereal
        Turta Twisted loaf
        Vinum Wine
        Ungella Pig's trotter

        Now the first gazpacho reciepe I looked up (from "The Joy of Cooking") lists
        as ingedients:

        Cucumber
        Green Bell Pepper
        Onion
        Parsley leaves
        Tomatoes
        Tomato juice
        red wine vinegar
        olive oil
        garlic
        jalapeno pepper
        salt

        Doesn't look like they were eating anything resembling it in Brittania.

        Hochachtungsvoll,
        RNS
        Visit the Regiment Von Donop at: http://www.netaxs.com/~gothic/VonDonop.html
        Visit the Company of Select Marksmen at:
        http://www.globalserve.net/~lougheed/CSM_ID/
        -----Original Message-----
        From: ChannonM@... <ChannonM@...>
        To: Apicius@onelist.com <Apicius@onelist.com>
        Date: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 6:43 PM
        Subject: [Apicius] Re:Army rations and gazpacho


        >From: ChannonM@...
        >
        >I have found some info on gazpacho and it's origins indicating that it was
        >based on the rations for Roman soldiers. I've been beating the bushes for
        >more, especially a list of rations if possible. I've contacted some
        >re-enactment groups with no luck so far. Does any one have any help on this
        >matter.
        >
        >Thanks.
        >
        >Channon
        >
        >>The best antique Roman recipes are at:
        http://www.dplanet.ch/users/julien.courtois/orgy/index.html
      • Weingarten
        Channon, Can you make gazpacho without tomatoes? I always understood tomatoes came from the New World and would have been unknown to the Romans. On Roman army
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 29, 1999
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          Channon,

          Can you make gazpacho without tomatoes? I always understood tomatoes came
          from the New World and would have been unknown to the Romans.

          On Roman army food: R. W. Davies 'The Roman military diet' in the journal
          Britannia vol 2 (1971) 122-42.
          BA Knights, CA Dickson, JH Dickson and DJ Breeze 'Evidence concerning the
          Roman military diet at Bearsdon, Scotland in the 2nd century AD.' in the
          Journal of Archaeological Science vol 10 (1983) 139-52. If I remember
          correctly, the second reference relates to an analysis made of the contents
          of Roman army latrines!

          If you can't get hold of these journals, DJ Breeze, B Dobson 'Hadrian's
          Wall' (Penguin,3rd ed 1987) has a short section on army rations under
          the heading 'Life on the wall: health.'
          They list 'basic food carried on campaign': bacon fat, biscuit, poor quality
          wine (the 'vinegar' offered to Jesus on the cross), wheat (generally made
          into wholemeal bread or porridge) and also cheese. Meat was eaten when
          available, but it was difficult to transport, alive or dead. Barley bread
          was substituted for wheat as a punishment. The diet in a stationary camp or
          fort would be more varied according to local conditions. One Roman officer
          at the fort of Vindolanda on Hadrian's Wall wrote letters ordering 50
          oysters, for example, to supplement his rations.

          Good luck

          Susan Weingarten
          Tel Aviv University





          At 18:36 28/09/99 EDT, ChannonM@... wrote:
          >From: ChannonM@...
          >
          >I have found some info on gazpacho and it's origins indicating that it was
          >based on the rations for Roman soldiers. I've been beating the bushes for
          >more, especially a list of rations if possible. I've contacted some
          >re-enactment groups with no luck so far. Does any one have any help on this
          >matter.
          >
          >Thanks.
          >
          >Channon
          >
          >>The best antique Roman recipes are at:
          http://www.dplanet.ch/users/julien.courtois/orgy/index.html
          >
          >
        • ChannonM@xxx.xxx
          Hi everyone, the gazpacho I ve been working with is a Spanish (specifically Andalusian) dish using olive oil, garlic, bread crumbs etc. This dish can be traced
          Message 4 of 5 , Sep 29, 1999
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            Hi everyone,

            the gazpacho I've been working with is a Spanish (specifically Andalusian)
            dish using olive oil, garlic, bread crumbs etc. This dish can be traced back
            through the Middle ages and according to the author of the book this recipe
            originates from it was
            Exerpt from "A Taste of Andalusia"
            "Gazpacho, in one form or another, is nearly as old as these hills. It
            probably derives from a Roman dish, a gruel of bread and oil. The name
            gazpacho may come from the Latin caspa, meaning fragments or little pieces,
            referring to the breadcrumbs which are such an essential ingredient. The
            Moorish influence is evident too, especially in some of the variations on the
            basic theme, such as ajo blanco, made with ground almonds.
            Of course, none of those forerunners of gazpacho contained tomatoes,
            considered basic today. That�s because tomatoes were unknown in Spain, until
            after the discovery of the New World"


            Here is the recipe;

            AJO BLANCO CON UVAS
            White Garlic Soup With Grapes
            200 g stale bread, crusts removed
            200 g almonds, blanched and skinned
            3 cloves garlic
            150 ml extra virgin olive oil
            5 tbsp wine vinegar
            2 tsp salt
            1 litre water
            150 g muscatel grapes, seeded
            .
            This white gazpacho, typical of M�laga, is usually made with ground almonds,
            preferably "green" or freshly harvested ones. In the springtime, ground fava
            beans (habas) are substituted. If it�s too early in the summer for grapes,
            chopped apple or melon can be substituted. This would traditionally be made
            by crushing the almonds to a paste in a brass mortar. The processor leaves
            them grainier,so, If desired, the soup can be sieved.
            Soak the bread in water until softened, squeeze it out and put in a blender
            or processor with the almonds and garlic. Blend to a smooth paste, adding a
            little water if necessary. With the motor running, add the oil in a slow
            stream, then the vinegar and salt. Beat in some of the water, then pour the
            mixture into a tureen, wooden bowl or pitcher and add the remaining water.
            Taste for seasoning, adding more salt or vinegar if needed. The soup should
            be fairly tangy. Serve immediately or chill the soup. Stir before serving
            into bowls garnished with grapes.


            I am trying to promote Roman cooking to the Medieval reenactment group, and
            am attempting to establish links between the two.

            Any input here folks?

            Channon
          • Gideon Nisbet
            ... There s nothing un-Roman about the ground almonds. Apicius uses them at least once (possibly many times) as a flour to thicken sauces.
            Message 5 of 5 , Sep 29, 1999
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              On Wed, 29 Sep 1999 ChannonM@... wrote:

              > "Gazpacho, in one form or another, is nearly as old as these hills. It
              ...
              > referring to the breadcrumbs which are such an essential ingredient. The
              > Moorish influence is evident too, especially in some of the variations on the
              > basic theme, such as ajo blanco, made with ground almonds.

              There's nothing un-Roman about the ground almonds. Apicius uses them
              at least once (possibly many times) as a 'flour' to thicken sauces.
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