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Re: Shamanism & Biblical Drug Induced Trances

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  • John
    Holly and Ian You would be interested in Julian Jaynes work on The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind . Janes wrote that ancient
    Message 1 of 11 , Apr 1, 2012
      Holly and Ian

      You would be interested in Julian Jaynes' work on "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind".

      Janes wrote that ancient humans before roughly 1200 BC were not reflectively meta-conscious (Aware of awareness) and instead of having meta-consciousness, these humans were constituted by what Jaynes calls the "bicameral mind". For bicameral humans, when habit did not suffice to handle novel stimuli and stress rose at the moment of decision, neural activity in the "dominant" (left) hemisphere was modulated by auditory verbal hallucinations originating in the so-called "silent" (right) hemisphere (particularly the right temporal cortex), which were heard as the voice of a god and immediately obeyed.

      Jaynes argued that the change from bicamerality to consciousness (linguistic meta-cognition) occurred over a period of centuries beginning around 1200 BC. The selection pressure for Jaynesian consciousness as a means for cognitive control is due, in part, to chaotic social disorganizations and the development of new methods of behavioral control such as writing. According to Jaynes, ancient people in the bicameral state of mind would have experienced the world in a manner that has some similarities to that of a schizophrenic. Rather than making conscious evaluations in novel or unexpected situations, the person would hallucinate a voice or "god" giving admonitory advice or commands and obey without question.

      Jaynes built a case for this hypothesis that human brains existed in a bicameral state until as recently as 3000 years ago by citing evidence from many diverse sources including historical literature. He took an interdisciplinary approach, drawing data from many different fields.[2] Jaynes asserted that, until roughly the times written about in Homer's Iliad, humans did not generally have the self-awareness characteristic of consciousness as most people experience it today. Rather, the bicameral individual was guided by mental commands believed to be issued by external "gods" — commands which were recorded in ancient myths, legends and historical accounts. This is exemplified not only in the commands given to characters in ancient epics but also the very muses of Greek mythology which "sang" the poems: the ancients literally heard muses as the direct source of their music and poetry.

      For example, in the Iliad and sections of the Old Testament no mention is made of any kind of cognitive processes such as introspection, and there is no apparent indication that the writers were self-aware. According to Jaynes, the older portions of the Old Testament (such as the Book of Amos) have few or none of the features of some later books of the Old Testament (such as Ecclesiastes) as well as later works such as Homer's Odyssey, which show indications of a profoundly different kind of mentality — an early form of consciousness. However the Epic of Gilgamesh, considered by many historians to be the oldest known recorded story (ca. 2000-2100 BC), features characters whose actions are deeply rooted in introspection and dream analysis. The injunctions of Ptahhotep and the admonitions of Ipu-wer from Egypt also show that bicamerality had by then broken down in Egypt.

      In ancient times, Jaynes noted, gods were generally much more numerous and much more anthropomorphic than in modern times, and speculates that this was because each bicameral person had their own "god" who reflected their own desires and experiences.[3] He also noted that in ancient societies the corpses of the dead and statues of the gods were often treated as though alive (being seated, dressed and even fed) and argued that the dead bodies were presumed to be still living and the source of auditory hallucinations (see ancestor worship). This adaptation to the village communities of 100 individuals or more formed the core of religion. Unlike today's hallucinations, the voices of ancient times were structured by cultural norms to produce a seamlessly functioning society. In Ancient Greek culture there is often mention of the Logos, which is a very similar concept. It was a type of guiding voice that was heard as from a seemingly external source.

      Jaynes inferred that these "voices" came from the right brain counterparts of the left brain language centres—specifically, the counterparts to Wernicke's area and Broca's area. These regions are somewhat dormant in the right brains of most modern humans, but Jaynes noted that some studies show that auditory hallucinations correspond to increased activity in these areas of the brain.

      It is very interesting.

      Regards

      John

      --- In AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com, "Holly" <gmrf@...> wrote:
      >
      > Joh & Ian:
      >
      > Here is a fasinating article on the connection between ancient rock art as representations of the trances of shamans. The rock art was used as a portal to an alternate universe of demons, beasts, enemies etc. The dots and and other signs are representations of the initial stages of the trance. Here is the article:
      >
      > http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arch/10_5_96/bob2.htm
      >
      > After I read the article, I wondered if frankincense or myrrh could be used to induce trances. Apparently, these resins can induce a trance along with the help of dancing, drums, cymbals and flutes. All of these intruments as well as the above incense are mentioned in the OT:
      >
      > Exd 30:23 Take thou also unto thee principal spices, of pure myrrh five hundred [shekels], and of sweet cinnamon half so much, [even] two hundred and fifty [shekels], and of sweet calamus two hundred and fifty [shekels],
      >
      >
      > Exd 30:24 And of cassia five hundred [shekels], after the shekel of the sanctuary, and of oil olive an hin:
      >
      > This article confirms that the above spices can induce a trance and are especially effective when inhaled and accompanied by cymbals, drums, flutes and chanting:
      >
      > http://books.google.com/books?id=ROcBMDUXCMoC&pg=PA484&lpg=PA484&dq=trance+induced+inhalation+frankincense+myrrh&source=bl&ots=eCU5Pne-UQ&sig=ygAkAkfus5b-drcV7sPfIjKlKKw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RRt2T7eqJM_3ggfA_tHSDg&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=trance%20induced%20inhalation%20frankincense%20myrrh&f=false
      >
      > These are the Biblical instruments:
      >
      > http://www.musicofthebible.com/instruments.htm
      >
      > This is fascinating information. The Hebrews were burning this stuff to induce a trance. This is probably the source of the pillar of fire and the cloud that led the Hebrews thru the wilderness. They were led by a shaman whose trance induced state told them where to go. The incense vapor is the cloud that filled the tabernacle tent.:
      >
      > Exd 34:5 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD.
      >
      > Exd 40:34 ¶ Then a cloud covered the tent of the congregation, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
      >
      > Exd 40:35 And Moses was not able to enter into the tent of the congregation, because the cloud abode thereon, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
      >
      > Lev 16:2 And the LORD said unto Moses, Speak unto Aaron thy brother, that he come not at all times into the holy [place] within the vail before the mercy seat, which [is] upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat
      >
      > Evidently, inhaling too much of this stuff could cause death. This certainly explains the visions in the holy of holies. They were burning an trance inducing mixture incense and herbs.
      >
      > Thought?
      > Holly
      >
    • John
      Hi Holly It has been shown that artists tend to work more thoroughly with the right hemisphere of the brain that involves gestalt pattern recognition, than do
      Message 2 of 11 , Apr 1, 2012
        Hi Holly

        It has been shown that artists tend to work more thoroughly with the right hemisphere of the brain that involves gestalt pattern recognition, than do the normal people.

        It has also been found that trances, and hallucinatory experiences originate in the same way. In our culture, the left hemisphere is so dominant that many people cannot access this capacity, and artists are, as a result, viewed as "a little mad".

        Regards

        John

        --- In AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com, willphoenix1@... wrote:
        >
        > I would say it is almost a certainty.
        >
        > Regards,
        >
        > William Apple
        > Sent from my U.S. Cellular BlackBerry® smartphone
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: "Holly" <gmrf@...>
        > Sender: AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com
        > Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 13:42:16
        > To: <AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com>
        > Reply-To: AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: ABH Re: Shamanism & Biblical Drug Induced Trances
        >
        > Ian:
        >
        > Here are famous visual artists that used hallucinogens as opium, alcohol and marijuana to enhance their skills: Salvador Dali, Eugene Delacroix, Pablo Picasso, Vincent Van Gogh, Jackson Pollock, Paul Gauguin,Francis Bacon, Edward Burra, Edvard Munch, Willem De Kooning, Mark Rothko and Amedeo Modigliani to mention a few. The list of other famous artists as authors, musicians, actors etc. who use drugs to "enhance" their performance skills is almost endless. Obviously this pre-historic practice of drug induced visions which translated into sophisticated art is still practiced today. I wouldn't dismiss os easily this theory that cave art may have been an expression of trance induced vison.
        >
        > Take Care
        > Holly
        >
        > --- In AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com, Ian Onvlee <sambacats@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi Holly,
        > >
        > > I certainly have my thoughts about this "trance" thing you bring up. It is one of the older theories about the Paleolithic artists and it has failed the test of scrutiny. I really wonder why people cannot imagin cave painters as perfectly sane, wide awake, and mathematically and literary capable human beings like you and me, and always have to think of them as being stupid and in trance or in a near death state of mind, eating halucinating mushrooms, in order to be able to paint like a Picasso.
        > >
        > >
        > > I can assure you that nothing of the kind is true. These people who painted and chisled the animals and symbols followed a geometric and astronomical ingeniously thought out plan, which would be impossible if they were in trance. They had technics to get to the highest places of the caves, which required a lot of scaffolding and hard work, which would have been impossible if they were in trance. I have collected a lot of material that proves that these artists already even had a standard measure that ended up at Stonehenge in Southern England, Bretagne in Northern France, and last but not least in Egypt at the Pyramids of Gizah. Not that I was planning to reveal that material in any way, but just to say that Shamanism had nothing to do with these paintings, symbols and other visual artwork, and no shaman was staring in trance at the painted walls either. Prehistoric Shamans were not painters, and it is hardly likely that they were in constant trance as
        > > much as the Pope is today. There was no need for being in trance, and there is no need for it today, not in any church, synagoge or university.
        > >
        > > As for the musical instruments, yes, the flute and the lute, and the bowstring viola, are indeed very old instruments, going back to Paleolithic times. Of course there were and will always be a number of people who were drug addicts. There are people who smoke and others who don't. Those who do don't get things done right. Paleolithic humans were just as joyous and happy as we are when  music is being played, and  they certainly would danced on the music more often and in community than we tend to do these days. We sit and sit behind our computer and even forget to communicate with our spouse or children instead, and are suddenly confronted with a file for divorce because of discommunication and boredom. Or else we hang out with the TV and forget our surroundings just the same. The ones in trance are we ourselves, when we constantly stare focused into our computer- or tv screen. But these early people could only communicate face to face, which was much
        > > more exciting than stupidly lying around stoned. A shaman was required to do his job and to communicate face to face as one may expect from any normal human being. I see no evidence for hallucinating theories, and I don't see any evidence of it in the verses in the Bible you cite either. The job of a shaman was not smoking marihuana, inhaling incense or whatever. Those are modern ideas made popular by authors who know nothing about shamanism. They mix things up with spiritism, hypnotism, drug addiction, ufology et cetera. A shaman has other, perfectly rational technics and they also use musical methods to intuitively get to the bottom of a problem.
        > >
        > >
        > > The bottom line is. that Cave art and Shamanism were unrelated. They require totally different skills. The painters could not have been measuring, calculating, painting and scaffolding in a state of trance. Neither were the shamans in trance. They simple performed a dance or some other ritual or played the flute or a drum, looked into the sky and watched the stars rise and set, until an answer to a problem came to mind. One shamanistic technic is akin to modern-day radionica, now used in the homeopathy, and it is still used by many African so-called "witchdoctors" when they want to precribe a cure for some illness. It's not something I can explain here in a few words. Nobody goes into a trance for this technic. Shamans all remain perfectly awake. It's a physical technic they perform. A bit of incense may perhaps have given the necessary impression of holiness for the respect the shaman wants for his work, but I don't see more usage than that that it
        > > seems to smell nice to some.  
        > >
        > >
        > > Regards,
        > > Ian
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ________________________________
        > > From: Holly <gmrf@>
        > > To: AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com
        > > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2012 11:06 PM
        > > Subject: ABH Re: Shamanism & Biblical Drug Induced Trances
        > >
        > >
        > >  
        > > Joh & Ian:
        > >
        > > Here is a fasinating article on the connection between ancient rock art as representations of the trances of shamans. The rock art was used as a portal to an alternate universe of demons, beasts, enemies etc. The dots and and other signs are representations of the initial stages of the trance. Here is the article:
        > >
        > > http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arch/10_5_96/bob2.htm
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Ian Onvlee
        John, Thanks for the reference, but alas, I m not into psychological or psychopathic speculations and I don t believe a single word of Julian Jaynes theory.
        Message 3 of 11 , Apr 1, 2012
          John,

          Thanks for the reference, but alas, I'm not into psychological or psychopathic speculations and I don't believe a single word of Julian Jaynes' theory. For one thing it is impossible to reconstruct the human mind of the past of any individual, let alone of all humans in the world collectively. People's minds are unpredictable. And the psychotic disease of hearing voices is still very common. The fact that certain people became writers and followed certain views does not mean anything more than that. For instance, not so long ago it was required that every book contained positive remarks about God and/or Jesus. So much that even books about mathematics were not to be accepted, unless they began with mentioning the supremacy of God. Does that mean that 19th century AD people were bicameral or even real believers? Of course not. It's a mechanism of the time, not some psychotic state of anybody's mind. The only evidence we have is that humans of the past
          were exactly like us since at least circa 200,0000 BC, and there is not a single piece of evidence that their mindset was in any way different than ours either. Of course they did not have TV and mobile phones and more, but they did have a normal brain like ours. The two halves of the brain have always been in balance and complementing each other. There were and always will be sick people, handicapped people, thieves, murderers and what not, and as far as we can prove anything, nothing has changed in the way people are human. The change of consciousness after 1200 BC proposed by Julian Jaynes' is an illusion. It is his personal way of reading non-existing ideas into early texts. These texts do not indicate anything looking even remotely like bicameralism, let alone that these early texts can speak for all humans. They only speak for the authors and the way they were expected to write.


          I rather stay with both feet on the ground. I don't believe in speculations on twilight zones, other dimensions, time-warps, ufo's, aliens, shape-shifters, mind-shifters and so on. It's all in the mind. A little bit of imagination is like the salt and pepper in your dish, the sugar and milk in your coffee, but too much of it only spoils your dinner and coffee.


          Regards,
          Ian
           



          ________________________________
          From: John <jdcroft@...>
          To: AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Sunday, April 1, 2012 9:22 AM
          Subject: ABH Re: Shamanism & Biblical Drug Induced Trances


           
          Holly and Ian

          You would be interested in Julian Jaynes' work on "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind".

          Janes wrote that ancient humans before roughly 1200 BC were not reflectively meta-conscious (Aware of awareness) and instead of having meta-consciousness, these humans were constituted by what Jaynes calls the "bicameral mind". For bicameral humans, when habit did not suffice to handle novel stimuli and stress rose at the moment of decision, neural activity in the "dominant" (left) hemisphere was modulated by auditory verbal hallucinations originating in the so-called "silent" (right) hemisphere (particularly the right temporal cortex), which were heard as the voice of a god and immediately obeyed.

          Jaynes argued that the change from bicamerality to consciousness (linguistic meta-cognition) occurred over a period of centuries beginning around 1200 BC. The selection pressure for Jaynesian consciousness as a means for cognitive control is due, in part, to chaotic social disorganizations and the development of new methods of behavioral control such as writing. According to Jaynes, ancient people in the bicameral state of mind would have experienced the world in a manner that has some similarities to that of a schizophrenic. Rather than making conscious evaluations in novel or unexpected situations, the person would hallucinate a voice or "god" giving admonitory advice or commands and obey without question.

          Jaynes built a case for this hypothesis that human brains existed in a bicameral state until as recently as 3000 years ago by citing evidence from many diverse sources including historical literature. He took an interdisciplinary approach, drawing data from many different fields.[2] Jaynes asserted that, until roughly the times written about in Homer's Iliad, humans did not generally have the self-awareness characteristic of consciousness as most people experience it today. Rather, the bicameral individual was guided by mental commands believed to be issued by external "gods" — commands which were recorded in ancient myths, legends and historical accounts. This is exemplified not only in the commands given to characters in ancient epics but also the very muses of Greek mythology which "sang" the poems: the ancients literally heard muses as the direct source of their music and poetry.

          For example, in the Iliad and sections of the Old Testament no mention is made of any kind of cognitive processes such as introspection, and there is no apparent indication that the writers were self-aware. According to Jaynes, the older portions of the Old Testament (such as the Book of Amos) have few or none of the features of some later books of the Old Testament (such as Ecclesiastes) as well as later works such as Homer's Odyssey, which show indications of a profoundly different kind of mentality — an early form of consciousness. However the Epic of Gilgamesh, considered by many historians to be the oldest known recorded story (ca. 2000-2100 BC), features characters whose actions are deeply rooted in introspection and dream analysis. The injunctions of Ptahhotep and the admonitions of Ipu-wer from Egypt also show that bicamerality had by then broken down in Egypt.

          In ancient times, Jaynes noted, gods were generally much more numerous and much more anthropomorphic than in modern times, and speculates that this was because each bicameral person had their own "god" who reflected their own desires and experiences.[3] He also noted that in ancient societies the corpses of the dead and statues of the gods were often treated as though alive (being seated, dressed and even fed) and argued that the dead bodies were presumed to be still living and the source of auditory hallucinations (see ancestor worship). This adaptation to the village communities of 100 individuals or more formed the core of religion. Unlike today's hallucinations, the voices of ancient times were structured by cultural norms to produce a seamlessly functioning society. In Ancient Greek culture there is often mention of the Logos, which is a very similar concept. It was a type of guiding voice that was heard as from a seemingly external source.

          Jaynes inferred that these "voices" came from the right brain counterparts of the left brain language centres—specifically, the counterparts to Wernicke's area and Broca's area. These regions are somewhat dormant in the right brains of most modern humans, but Jaynes noted that some studies show that auditory hallucinations correspond to increased activity in these areas of the brain.

          It is very interesting.

          Regards

          John

          --- In AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com, "Holly" <gmrf@...> wrote:
          >
          > Joh & Ian:
          >
          > Here is a fasinating article on the connection between ancient rock art as representations of the trances of shamans. The rock art was used as a portal to an alternate universe of demons, beasts, enemies etc. The dots and and other signs are representations of the initial stages of the trance. Here is the article:
          >
          > http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arch/10_5_96/bob2.htm
          >
          > After I read the article, I wondered if frankincense or myrrh could be used to induce trances. Apparently, these resins can induce a trance along with the help of dancing, drums, cymbals and flutes. All of these intruments as well as the above incense are mentioned in the OT:
          >
          > Exd 30:23 Take thou also unto thee principal spices, of pure myrrh five hundred [shekels], and of sweet cinnamon half so much, [even] two hundred and fifty [shekels], and of sweet calamus two hundred and fifty [shekels],
          >
          >
          > Exd 30:24 And of cassia five hundred [shekels], after the shekel of the sanctuary, and of oil olive an hin:
          >
          > This article confirms that the above spices can induce a trance and are especially effective when inhaled and accompanied by cymbals, drums, flutes and chanting:
          >
          > http://books.google.com/books?id=ROcBMDUXCMoC&pg=PA484&lpg=PA484&dq=trance+induced+inhalation+frankincense+myrrh&source=bl&ots=eCU5Pne-UQ&sig=ygAkAkfus5b-drcV7sPfIjKlKKw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RRt2T7eqJM_3ggfA_tHSDg&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=trance%20induced%20inhalation%20frankincense%20myrrh&f=false
          >
          > These are the Biblical instruments:
          >
          > http://www.musicofthebible.com/instruments.htm
          >
          > This is fascinating information. The Hebrews were burning this stuff to induce a trance. This is probably the source of the pillar of fire and the cloud that led the Hebrews thru the wilderness. They were led by a shaman whose trance induced state told them where to go. The incense vapor is the cloud that filled the tabernacle tent.:
          >
          > Exd 34:5 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD.
          >
          > Exd 40:34 ¶ Then a cloud covered the tent of the congregation, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
          >
          > Exd 40:35 And Moses was not able to enter into the tent of the congregation, because the cloud abode thereon, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
          >
          > Lev 16:2 And the LORD said unto Moses, Speak unto Aaron thy brother, that he come not at all times into the holy [place] within the vail before the mercy seat, which [is] upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat
          >
          > Evidently, inhaling too much of this stuff could cause death. This certainly explains the visions in the holy of holies. They were burning an trance inducing mixture incense and herbs.
          >
          > Thought?
          > Holly
          >




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Attila Csanyi
          Each believer still has his/her own god developing and occupying locations in their cortical circuits like a file in a computer.
          Message 4 of 11 , Apr 3, 2012
            Each believer still has his/her own "god" developing and occupying locations in their cortical circuits like a file in a computer.


            ________________________________
            From: John <jdcroft@...>
            To: AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Sunday, April 1, 2012 1:22 AM
            Subject: ABH Re: Shamanism & Biblical Drug Induced Trances


             
            Holly and Ian

            You would be interested in Julian Jaynes' work on "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind".

            Janes wrote that ancient humans before roughly 1200 BC were not reflectively meta-conscious (Aware of awareness) and instead of having meta-consciousness, these humans were constituted by what Jaynes calls the "bicameral mind". For bicameral humans, when habit did not suffice to handle novel stimuli and stress rose at the moment of decision, neural activity in the "dominant" (left) hemisphere was modulated by auditory verbal hallucinations originating in the so-called "silent" (right) hemisphere (particularly the right temporal cortex), which were heard as the voice of a god and immediately obeyed.

            Jaynes argued that the change from bicamerality to consciousness (linguistic meta-cognition) occurred over a period of centuries beginning around 1200 BC. The selection pressure for Jaynesian consciousness as a means for cognitive control is due, in part, to chaotic social disorganizations and the development of new methods of behavioral control such as writing. According to Jaynes, ancient people in the bicameral state of mind would have experienced the world in a manner that has some similarities to that of a schizophrenic. Rather than making conscious evaluations in novel or unexpected situations, the person would hallucinate a voice or "god" giving admonitory advice or commands and obey without question.

            Jaynes built a case for this hypothesis that human brains existed in a bicameral state until as recently as 3000 years ago by citing evidence from many diverse sources including historical literature. He took an interdisciplinary approach, drawing data from many different fields.[2] Jaynes asserted that, until roughly the times written about in Homer's Iliad, humans did not generally have the self-awareness characteristic of consciousness as most people experience it today. Rather, the bicameral individual was guided by mental commands believed to be issued by external "gods" — commands which were recorded in ancient myths, legends and historical accounts. This is exemplified not only in the commands given to characters in ancient epics but also the very muses of Greek mythology which "sang" the poems: the ancients literally heard muses as the direct source of their music and poetry.

            For example, in the Iliad and sections of the Old Testament no mention is made of any kind of cognitive processes such as introspection, and there is no apparent indication that the writers were self-aware. According to Jaynes, the older portions of the Old Testament (such as the Book of Amos) have few or none of the features of some later books of the Old Testament (such as Ecclesiastes) as well as later works such as Homer's Odyssey, which show indications of a profoundly different kind of mentality — an early form of consciousness. However the Epic of Gilgamesh, considered by many historians to be the oldest known recorded story (ca. 2000-2100 BC), features characters whose actions are deeply rooted in introspection and dream analysis. The injunctions of Ptahhotep and the admonitions of Ipu-wer from Egypt also show that bicamerality had by then broken down in Egypt.

            In ancient times, Jaynes noted, gods were generally much more numerous and much more anthropomorphic than in modern times, and speculates that this was because each bicameral person had their own "god" who reflected their own desires and experiences.[3] He also noted that in ancient societies the corpses of the dead and statues of the gods were often treated as though alive (being seated, dressed and even fed) and argued that the dead bodies were presumed to be still living and the source of auditory hallucinations (see ancestor worship). This adaptation to the village communities of 100 individuals or more formed the core of religion. Unlike today's hallucinations, the voices of ancient times were structured by cultural norms to produce a seamlessly functioning society. In Ancient Greek culture there is often mention of the Logos, which is a very similar concept. It was a type of guiding voice that was heard as from a seemingly external source.

            Jaynes inferred that these "voices" came from the right brain counterparts of the left brain language centres—specifically, the counterparts to Wernicke's area and Broca's area. These regions are somewhat dormant in the right brains of most modern humans, but Jaynes noted that some studies show that auditory hallucinations correspond to increased activity in these areas of the brain.

            It is very interesting.

            Regards

            John

            --- In AncientBibleHistory@yahoogroups.com, "Holly" <gmrf@...> wrote:
            >
            > Joh & Ian:
            >
            > Here is a fasinating article on the connection between ancient rock art as representations of the trances of shamans. The rock art was used as a portal to an alternate universe of demons, beasts, enemies etc. The dots and and other signs are representations of the initial stages of the trance. Here is the article:
            >
            > http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arch/10_5_96/bob2.htm
            >
            > After I read the article, I wondered if frankincense or myrrh could be used to induce trances. Apparently, these resins can induce a trance along with the help of dancing, drums, cymbals and flutes. All of these intruments as well as the above incense are mentioned in the OT:
            >
            > Exd 30:23 Take thou also unto thee principal spices, of pure myrrh five hundred [shekels], and of sweet cinnamon half so much, [even] two hundred and fifty [shekels], and of sweet calamus two hundred and fifty [shekels],
            >
            >
            > Exd 30:24 And of cassia five hundred [shekels], after the shekel of the sanctuary, and of oil olive an hin:
            >
            > This article confirms that the above spices can induce a trance and are especially effective when inhaled and accompanied by cymbals, drums, flutes and chanting:
            >
            > http://books.google.com/books?id=ROcBMDUXCMoC&pg=PA484&lpg=PA484&dq=trance+induced+inhalation+frankincense+myrrh&source=bl&ots=eCU5Pne-UQ&sig=ygAkAkfus5b-drcV7sPfIjKlKKw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=RRt2T7eqJM_3ggfA_tHSDg&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=trance%20induced%20inhalation%20frankincense%20myrrh&f=false
            >
            > These are the Biblical instruments:
            >
            > http://www.musicofthebible.com/instruments.htm
            >
            > This is fascinating information. The Hebrews were burning this stuff to induce a trance. This is probably the source of the pillar of fire and the cloud that led the Hebrews thru the wilderness. They were led by a shaman whose trance induced state told them where to go. The incense vapor is the cloud that filled the tabernacle tent.:
            >
            > Exd 34:5 And the LORD descended in the cloud, and stood with him there, and proclaimed the name of the LORD.
            >
            > Exd 40:34 ¶ Then a cloud covered the tent of the congregation, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
            >
            > Exd 40:35 And Moses was not able to enter into the tent of the congregation, because the cloud abode thereon, and the glory of the LORD filled the tabernacle.
            >
            > Lev 16:2 And the LORD said unto Moses, Speak unto Aaron thy brother, that he come not at all times into the holy [place] within the vail before the mercy seat, which [is] upon the ark; that he die not: for I will appear in the cloud upon the mercy seat
            >
            > Evidently, inhaling too much of this stuff could cause death. This certainly explains the visions in the holy of holies. They were burning an trance inducing mixture incense and herbs.
            >
            > Thought?
            > Holly
            >




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