Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Black Fly building log.

Expand Messages
  • pjacobs55
    Well, that was worth a lot more than 2 cents!!! I m saving you message and will look into your suggestions. I like the idea of finding a heavier Dacron, too.
    Message 1 of 7 , Feb 3, 2010
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      Well, that was worth a lot more than 2 cents!!! I'm saving you message and will look into your suggestions. I like the idea of finding a heavier Dacron, too.
      Thanks!
      Peter.

      --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "aolsmile42" <peteringramjones@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Peter,
      >
      > Here's mt 2 cents worth. The nylon as described in Rober Morris' book would be a tougher ooption for sure, especially coated with the Urethane that Corey Freedman uses at skinboats. I've used this twice now as well as building several of Platt's designs. Bear in mind that the Nylon will not shrink anything like the Dacron. The Nylon has to be sewn on TIGHT....and not like Robert Morris suggests unless you can get it REALLY tight. Best shrinkage is achieved by wetting down the Nylon and then stitching as tight as possible while keeping it wet all the time. Final tautness is achieved once it dries and this is a one time only process, ie: you can't re-wet it and expect more.....
      >
      > And I gan't see how you're going to get a stitch pull in covering a Black Fly.
      >
      > My suggestion is to find a heavier Dacron and stick to Plat's method, OR use GABoats Dacron and use Corey Freedman's Urethane.
      >
      > Cheers
      >
      > Peter
      >
      > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "pjacobs55" <prjacobs@> wrote:
      > >
      > > For those interested, I'm keeping a running log of the construction process of the Black Fly on my blog at
      > > http://www.sintacha.com
      > >
      > > Meanwhile, I ordered the Kevlar roving from Bette Monfort today. I haven't decided whether to skin with Dacron or Ballistic Nylon, as recommended in Robert Morris's book "Building Skin-on-Frame Boats".
      > >
      > > As I plan to use it as a tender in Pacific Northwest waters, the nylon sounds like it might be tougher. Lots of time left to decide!
      > >
      > > Peter.
      > >
      >
    • Elliot Mednick
      Some of us doubled up on the Dacron on the very bottom, as described by Platt. Use a sheet of Heat n Bond between the layers, and make sure the grain of the
      Message 2 of 7 , Feb 3, 2010
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment

        Some of us doubled up on the Dacron on the very bottom, as described by Platt.  Use a sheet of Heat’n Bond between the layers, and make sure the grain of the second layer is at a bias from the first layer.  I have an Arrow 14, and  I paddle on the rocky coast of Maine.  I launch by sitting down while it is still on rocks on the shore and push away, so it scrapes along the rocks.  No tears (or tears: -) yet.

         

        --Elliot

         

         

        From: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of pjacobs55
        Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 12:30 PM
        To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Black Fly building log.

         

         

        Well, that was worth a lot more than 2 cents!!! I'm saving you message and will look into your suggestions. I like the idea of finding a heavier Dacron, too.
        Thanks!
        Peter.

        --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "aolsmile42" <peteringramjones@...> wrote:

        >
        > Hi Peter,
        >
        > Here's mt 2 cents worth. The nylon as described in Rober Morris' book
        would be a tougher ooption for sure, especially coated with the Urethane that Corey Freedman uses at skinboats. I've used this twice now as well as building several of Platt's designs. Bear in mind that the Nylon will not shrink anything like the Dacron. The Nylon has to be sewn on TIGHT....and not like Robert Morris suggests unless you can get it REALLY tight. Best shrinkage is achieved by wetting down the Nylon and then stitching as tight as possible while keeping it wet all the time. Final tautness is achieved once it dries and this is a one time only process, ie: you can't re-wet it and expect more.....
        >
        > And I gan't see how you're going to get a stitch pull in covering a Black
        Fly.
        >
        > My suggestion is to find a heavier Dacron and stick to Plat's method, OR
        use GABoats Dacron and use Corey Freedman's Urethane.
        >
        > Cheers
        >
        > Peter
        >
        > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com,
        "pjacobs55" <prjacobs@> wrote:
        > >
        > > For those interested, I'm keeping a running log of the construction
        process of the Black Fly on my blog at
        > > http://www.sintacha.com
        > >
        > > Meanwhile, I ordered the Kevlar roving from Bette Monfort today. I
        haven't decided whether to skin with Dacron or Ballistic Nylon, as recommended in Robert Morris's book "Building Skin-on-Frame Boats".
        > >
        > > As I plan to use it as a tender in Pacific Northwest waters, the
        nylon sounds like it might be tougher. Lots of time left to decide!
        > >
        > > Peter.
        > >
        >

         

      • pjacobs55
        I didn t know heat n bond comes in sheets ... this is all new to me! I m still trying to source a heavier Dacron than the 3.7oz avaiable at the Montfort web
        Message 3 of 7 , Feb 3, 2010
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          I didn't know heat'n bond comes in sheets ... this is all new to me!
          I'm still trying to source a heavier Dacron than the 3.7oz avaiable at the Montfort web site. Maybe it does not exist?

          Also, I just realized I glued the skeg on, when I needed to do it AFTER the skin is on :-( I think I can persuade it off with my Japanese pull saw.

          Ah, the joys of being an amateur!

          Peter.


          --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Elliot Mednick" <elliot@...> wrote:
          >
          > Some of us doubled up on the Dacron on the very bottom, as described by Platt. Use a
          > sheet of Heat'n Bond between the layers, and make sure the grain of the second layer
          > is at a bias from the first layer. I have an Arrow 14, and I paddle on the rocky
          > coast of Maine. I launch by sitting down while it is still on rocks on the shore and
          > push away, so it scrapes along the rocks. No tears (or tears: -) yet.
          >
          >
          >
          > --Elliot
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > From: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of pjacobs55
          > Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 12:30 PM
          > To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Black Fly building log.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Well, that was worth a lot more than 2 cents!!! I'm saving you message and will look
          > into your suggestions. I like the idea of finding a heavier Dacron, too.
          > Thanks!
          > Peter.
          >
          > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Airolite_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ,
          > "aolsmile42" <peteringramjones@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi Peter,
          > >
          > > Here's mt 2 cents worth. The nylon as described in Rober Morris' book would be a
          > tougher ooption for sure, especially coated with the Urethane that Corey Freedman
          > uses at skinboats. I've used this twice now as well as building several of Platt's
          > designs. Bear in mind that the Nylon will not shrink anything like the Dacron. The
          > Nylon has to be sewn on TIGHT....and not like Robert Morris suggests unless you can
          > get it REALLY tight. Best shrinkage is achieved by wetting down the Nylon and then
          > stitching as tight as possible while keeping it wet all the time. Final tautness is
          > achieved once it dries and this is a one time only process, ie: you can't re-wet it
          > and expect more.....
          > >
          > > And I gan't see how you're going to get a stitch pull in covering a Black Fly.
          > >
          > > My suggestion is to find a heavier Dacron and stick to Plat's method, OR use
          > GABoats Dacron and use Corey Freedman's Urethane.
          > >
          > > Cheers
          > >
          > > Peter
          > >
          > > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Airolite_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ,
          > "pjacobs55" <prjacobs@> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > For those interested, I'm keeping a running log of the construction process of
          > the Black Fly on my blog at
          > > > http://www.sintacha.com
          > > >
          > > > Meanwhile, I ordered the Kevlar roving from Bette Monfort today. I haven't
          > decided whether to skin with Dacron or Ballistic Nylon, as recommended in Robert
          > Morris's book "Building Skin-on-Frame Boats".
          > > >
          > > > As I plan to use it as a tender in Pacific Northwest waters, the nylon sounds
          > like it might be tougher. Lots of time left to decide!
          > > >
          > > > Peter.
          > > >
          > >
          >
        • Elliot Mednick
          If you have a Jo-Ann fabric store in your area, http://www.joann.com/joann/catalog/productdetail.jsp?pageName=search
          Message 4 of 7 , Feb 3, 2010
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment

            If you have a Jo-Ann fabric store in your area, http://www.joann.com/joann/catalog/productdetail.jsp?pageName=search&flag=true&PRODID=prd2980.  Otherwise, many sewing shops and craft stores have it.  A sheet was included in the Arrow 14 partial kit, but then I went and bought more. 

            You don’t have to double up on the entire skin.  Just the bottom where it would rub against non-water.  Water itself can’t hurt even a single layer of the regular stuff.  I would guess that a double-cover of Dacron with a HeatNBond sheet binding them  would be stronger than a heavier Dacron sheet.  If you layer one sheet with a 45-degree bias (or so), then you have a great rip-stop capability.  Any holes won’t continue to tear because there will be no grain.

             

            From: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of pjacobs55
            Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 6:10 PM
            To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Black Fly building log.

             

             

            I didn't know heat'n bond comes in sheets ... this is all new to me!
            I'm still trying to source a heavier Dacron than the 3.7oz avaiable at the Montfort web site. Maybe it does not exist?

            Also, I just realized I glued the skeg on, when I needed to do it AFTER the skin is on :-( I think I can persuade it off with my Japanese pull saw.

            Ah, the joys of being an amateur!

            Peter.

            --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "Elliot Mednick" <elliot@...> wrote:

            >
            > Some of us doubled up on the Dacron on the very bottom, as described by
            Platt. Use a
            > sheet of Heat'n Bond between the layers, and make sure the grain of the
            second layer
            > is at a bias from the first layer. I have an Arrow 14, and I paddle on the
            rocky
            > coast of Maine. I launch by sitting down while it is still on rocks on the
            shore and
            > push away, so it scrapes along the rocks. No tears (or tears: -) yet.
            >
            >
            >
            > --Elliot
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > From: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
            [mailto:Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com] On
            > Behalf Of pjacobs55
            > Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 12:30 PM
            > To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Black Fly building log.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Well, that was worth a lot more than 2 cents!!! I'm saving you message and
            will look
            > into your suggestions. I like the idea of finding a heavier Dacron, too.
            > Thanks!
            > Peter.
            >
            > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
            <mailto:Airolite_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ,
            > "aolsmile42" <peteringramjones@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi Peter,
            > >
            > > Here's mt 2 cents worth. The nylon as described in Rober Morris' book
            would be a
            > tougher ooption for sure, especially coated with the Urethane that Corey
            Freedman
            > uses at skinboats. I've used this twice now as well as building several of
            Platt's
            > designs. Bear in mind that the Nylon will not shrink anything like the
            Dacron. The
            > Nylon has to be sewn on TIGHT....and not like Robert Morris suggests
            unless you can
            > get it REALLY tight. Best shrinkage is achieved by wetting down the Nylon
            and then
            > stitching as tight as possible while keeping it wet all the time. Final
            tautness is
            > achieved once it dries and this is a one time only process, ie: you can't
            re-wet it
            > and expect more.....
            > >
            > > And I gan't see how you're going to get a stitch pull in covering a
            Black Fly.
            > >
            > > My suggestion is to find a heavier Dacron and stick to Plat's method,
            OR use
            > GABoats Dacron and use Corey Freedman's Urethane.
            > >
            > > Cheers
            > >
            > > Peter
            > >
            > > --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
            <mailto:Airolite_Boats%40yahoogroups.com> ,
            > "pjacobs55" <prjacobs@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > For those interested, I'm keeping a running log of the
            construction process of
            > the Black Fly on my blog at
            > > > http://www.sintacha.com
            > > >
            > > > Meanwhile, I ordered the Kevlar roving from Bette Monfort today.
            I haven't
            > decided whether to skin with Dacron or Ballistic Nylon, as recommended in
            Robert
            > Morris's book "Building Skin-on-Frame Boats".
            > > >
            > > > As I plan to use it as a tender in Pacific Northwest waters, the
            nylon sounds
            > like it might be tougher. Lots of time left to decide!
            > > >
            > > > Peter.
            > > >
            > >
            >

             

          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.