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Alternative Oar locks

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  • bschless@rasco.com
    Amen on excess glue! Been rowing my 10 classic on the Concohd River, (MA) and it rows true. Now a silly question.. Has anyone evah mounted oar locks forwahd
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 11 3:43 PM
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      Amen on excess glue!

      Been rowing my 10' classic on the Concohd River, (MA)  and it rows true.  Now a silly question..

      Has anyone evah mounted oar locks forwahd of the rowin' position (towahd the bow) so you can push instead of pull, when it's important to see where you ah goin'??  I'm afeared of a branch poking through this silly fabric hull....

      Beau Schless
      President/CEO
      NOTEbookS Library Automation Systems
      Celebrating 15 years exceeding customers' expectations
      HTTP://WWW.RASCO.COM
      PH: 1.(978) 443-2996



      "Elliot Mednick" <elliot@...>
      Sent by: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com

      04/11/2008 02:36 PM

      Please respond to
      Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com

      To
      <Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com>
      cc
      Subject
      RE: [Airolite_Boats] Great globs of glue






      Hi Jud1929,

       

      I am in the process of building a Classic 14, and had built an Arrow 14 a few years ago.

       

      When you glue the ribs to the gunwales, you *must* clean the excess glue.  There are spacer blocks that you will later glue over the rib joints on which the inwales will attach.  The blocks won’t fit over the excess glue blobs.

       

      Epoxy is very strong as you well know.  Even the small amount on the surface area of two crossmembers will be stronger than the wood itself.  That’s infinitely strong for our purposes, and any more glue is a just a waste.  Furthermore, the rib joints won’t see that much stress, on a per-joint basis.  Between the number of joints distributed through the whole boat, and the Kevlar roving holding it all together, a lesser glue would be sufficient.

       

      In earlier versions of the boat kits (and for my Arrow), Platt supplied a polyurethane glue, like Gorilla Glue (actually “Excel”), just for the rib joints.  It was easier to apply because it was in a single bottle.  It is less strong than epoxy, but was deemed “good enough” for the rib joints.  I understand that Platt abandoned this because the glue expanded while setting and was hard to control the excess and to get a clean joint.  (There are also those who claim the expansion also caused a weakening of the joint, but, again, I think this was insignificant for what is needed in the rib joints).

       

      A good test is to take two rib pieces, glue them together crosswise, and then try to break the joint two days later.  You’ll find the wood breaks first.

       

      A long-winded way of saying “yes, clean up the excess”!

       

      Have fun!

      --Elliot

       

       

       

       

      From: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jud1929
      Sent:
      Friday, April 11, 2008 1:56 PM
      To:
      Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
      Subject:
      [Airolite_Boats] Great globs of glue

       

      Hello all,

      I am a member of club, the Ancient Mariners, that is building a
      Classic 12. We have access to a woodworking shop at our condo.The shop
      is a huge, very old barn with woodworking equipment accumulated over
      40 years or so.

      As you might imagine there are many opinions as to how each step
      should be carried out. So I thought I would seek still more opinions
      but from people who have had experience building.

      Question 1.
      Glue(Epoxy). Excess glue has not beeen removed at the joints formed by
      ribs and stingers or at almost any other place for that matter. The
      rational is the the extra glue will give additional strength. The
      question is, supposing the truth of the above statement, how much
      additional strength? and is such strength necessary for normal use.

      There are other questions, but I will post them in different messages
      so as to keep the subject matter straight.

      Thanks very much for your help.

       


    • bschless
      I m surprised by how strong the joints are on my 10 classic. I ve been out a couple of times, and now have complete confidence that my clean joints are
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 14 11:53 AM
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        I'm surprised by how strong the joints are on my 10' classic. I've
        been out a couple of times, and now have complete confidence that
        my "clean" joints are plenty strong (and my sloppy ones are just
        plain sloppy!)

        --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "jud1929" <jud1929@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello all,
        >
        > I am a member of club, the Ancient Mariners, that is building a
        > Classic 12. We have access to a woodworking shop at our condo.The
        shop
        > is a huge, very old barn with woodworking equipment accumulated over
        > 40 years or so.
        >
        > As you might imagine there are many opinions as to how each step
        > should be carried out. So I thought I would seek still more opinions
        > but from people who have had experience building.
        >
        > Question 1.
        > Glue(Epoxy). Excess glue has not beeen removed at the joints formed
        by
        > ribs and stingers or at almost any other place for that matter. The
        > rational is the the extra glue will give additional strength. The
        > question is, supposing the truth of the above statement, how much
        > additional strength? and is such strength necessary for normal use.
        >
        >
        > There are other questions, but I will post them in different
        messages
        > so as to keep the subject matter straight.
        >
        > Thanks very much for your help.
        >
      • jud1929
        Thank you very much for responding to my question. I really liked your suggestion to glue 2 pieces together to simulate a joint and break them. It was also a
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 18 5:57 PM
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          Thank you very much for responding to my question.

          I really liked your suggestion to glue 2 pieces together to simulate a
          joint and break them. It was also a tactful way of getting at the
          issue with other participants.

          Thanks again.

          Jud
        • Elliot Mednick
          Sorry for the mass email, but a person named Greg Paris has sent me two emails asking for GA Boat advice, but his email address is invalid. Greg, I don t even
          Message 4 of 14 , Oct 4, 2008
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            Sorry for the mass email, but a person named Greg Paris has sent me two
            emails asking for GA Boat advice, but his email address is invalid. Greg, I
            don't even see you on the Airolite member list. If you are reading this,
            please send me an alternate email address.

            Meanwhile, summer is over and there hasn't been much activity on this list.
            Did anyone use your GA boat this summer? I paddled my Arrow 14 around
            Rockland Harbor, Maine for a few days in August. I'm still working on
            finding the right placement for my feet, but otherwise the Arrow 14 rocks
            (literally, too -- it can get wobbly).

            I haven't been able to work on my Classic 14, but I expect to this fall.

            --Elliot
          • Joel Fairstein
            Elliot: No help here regarding Greg, sorry. I ve been out fishing in my Classic 10 two or three times a week all summer long and have yet to breach the Dacron.
            Message 5 of 14 , Oct 5, 2008
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              Elliot:

              No help here regarding Greg, sorry.

              I've been out fishing in my Classic 10 two or three times a week all summer long and have yet to breach the Dacron. 

              I wonder if anyone has had a major tear in the skin? (I've kept my fingers crossed and some sheet-size duct tape handy.)

              Joel

                

              On Oct 4, 2008, at 10:43 PM, Elliot Mednick wrote:

              Sorry for the mass email, but a person named Greg Paris has sent me two
              emails asking for GA Boat advice, but his email address is invalid. Greg, I
              don't even see you on the Airolite member list. If you are reading this,
              please send me an alternate email address.

              Meanwhile, summer is over and there hasn't been much activity on this list.
              Did anyone use your GA boat this summer? I paddled my Arrow 14 around
              Rockland Harbor, Maine for a few days in August. I'm still working on
              finding the right placement for my feet, but otherwise the Arrow 14 rocks
              (literally, too -- it can get wobbly).

              I haven't been able to work on my Classic 14, but I expect to this fall.

              --Elliot


            • noneof yourbusiness
              ... From: Elliot Mednick Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Looking for Greg Paris; happy autumn To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com Date:
              Message 6 of 14 , Oct 5, 2008
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                --- On Sat, 10/4/08, Elliot Mednick <elliot@...> wrote:
                From: Elliot Mednick <elliot@...>
                Subject: [Airolite_Boats] Looking for Greg Paris; happy autumn
                To: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Saturday, October 4, 2008, 10:43 PM

                Sorry for the mass email, but a person named Greg Paris has sent me two
                emails asking for GA Boat advice, but his email address is invalid. Greg, I
                don't even see you on the Airolite member list. If you are reading this,
                please send me an alternate email address.

                Meanwhile, summer is over and there hasn't been much activity on this list.
                Did anyone use your GA boat this summer? I paddled my Arrow 14 around
                Rockland Harbor, Maine for a few days in August. I'm still working on
                finding the right placement for my feet, but otherwise the Arrow 14 rocks
                (literally, too -- it can get wobbly).

                I haven't been able to work on my Classic 14, but I expect to this fall.

                --Elliot


              • Beau & Chris Schless
                BTW...Built a trolling rig on my 10...a donut made of mahogany epoxied to the middle floorboard right at the transom, then 2 brass screws on the middle
                Message 7 of 14 , Oct 5, 2008
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                  BTW...Built a "trolling" rig on my 10...a "donut" made of mahogany epoxied to the middle floorboard right at the transom,  then 2 brass screws on the middle top of the transom around 1" apart.  Place your fly rod in the donut, then 2 rubber bands around the rod at the 2 screws.  Voila!  Caught my first striper of the season that way!
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 6:26 AM
                  Subject: Re: [Airolite_Boats] Looking for Greg Paris; happy autumn

                  Elliot:

                  No help here regarding Greg, sorry.

                  I've been out fishing in my Classic 10 two or three times a week all summer long and have yet to breach the Dacron. 

                  I wonder if anyone has had a major tear in the skin? (I've kept my fingers crossed and some sheet-size duct tape handy.)

                  Joel

                    

                  On Oct 4, 2008, at 10:43 PM, Elliot Mednick wrote:

                  Sorry for the mass email, but a person named Greg Paris has sent me two
                  emails asking for GA Boat advice, but his email address is invalid. Greg, I
                  don't even see you on the Airolite member list. If you are reading this,
                  please send me an alternate email address.

                  Meanwhile, summer is over and there hasn't been much activity on this list.
                  Did anyone use your GA boat this summer? I paddled my Arrow 14 around
                  Rockland Harbor, Maine for a few days in August. I'm still working on
                  finding the right placement for my feet, but otherwise the Arrow 14 rocks
                  (literally, too -- it can get wobbly).

                  I haven't been able to work on my Classic 14, but I expect to this fall.

                  --Elliot


                • james_kingston
                  ... I have. I was paddling my GA kayak (not a Monfort design) through a shallow river offshoot that had seen severe flooding over the summer. I was levering
                  Message 8 of 14 , Oct 6, 2008
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                    > I wonder if anyone has had a major tear in the skin? (I've kept my
                    > fingers crossed and some sheet-size duct tape handy.)

                    I have. I was paddling my GA kayak (not a Monfort design) through a
                    shallow river offshoot that had seen severe flooding over the summer.
                    I was levering myself over a submerged log when a stub from where a
                    branch was previously attached stabbed through and left me with a 6
                    inch gash in the dacron.

                    The Gorilla tape I slapped on it (after a toweling off) carried me the
                    couple miles back to my car without incident.
                  • rueffingkidding
                    Unfotunate. Glad you made it back to your ride without further incident. Were you able to make a permanent repair later? Could you give us more forensic
                    Message 9 of 14 , Oct 7, 2008
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                      Unfotunate. Glad you made it back to your ride without further
                      incident. Were you able to make a permanent repair later? Could you
                      give us more "forensic" information (such as: One Dacron layer or
                      two? What was the sealing agent [latex paint, polyurethane varnish,
                      something else]? Stringer and cross-member spacing? Did you
                      triangulate with the recommended Kevlar roving?) This could help us
                      understand the effect of variations, as well as the weaknesses of the
                      original concept and designs... Thanks.

                      -Roland

                      --- In Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com, "james_kingston"
                      <james.kingston@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > I wonder if anyone has had a major tear in the skin? (I've kept my
                      > > fingers crossed and some sheet-size duct tape handy.)
                      >
                      > I have. I was paddling my GA kayak (not a Monfort design) through a
                      > shallow river offshoot that had seen severe flooding over the summer.
                      > I was levering myself over a submerged log when a stub from where a
                      > branch was previously attached stabbed through and left me with a 6
                      > inch gash in the dacron.
                      >
                      > The Gorilla tape I slapped on it (after a toweling off) carried me the
                      > couple miles back to my car without incident.
                      >
                    • James Kingston
                      Like I said, this is a non-Monfort design. It was done in a class at my local Community College. It was one layer of Dacron (the heaviest available,
                      Message 10 of 14 , Oct 8, 2008
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                        Like I said, this is a non-Monfort design. It was done in a class at
                        my local Community College. It was one layer of Dacron (the heaviest
                        available, apparently), with no roving. The rip ran from where it
                        stabbed through until it hit the plywood station, about 6 inches.

                        I used one coat of clear Poly-Brush to fill the fibers, then several
                        layers of water-based exterior spar urethane (Varathane 2501?).
                        Stringers spread about 6 inches, plywood stations about 24.

                        For a permanent repair, I used a sheet of Heat-N-Bond, and a few more
                        coats of Varathane. This has held up pretty well, though it is helped
                        by the fact that I left the gorilla tape on the inside in place.
                        Since this is where my feet rest, I didn't want to put extra stress on
                        the heat-n-bond.

                        James

                        On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 5:24 AM, rueffingkidding
                        <rueffingkidding@...> wrote:
                        > Unfotunate. Glad you made it back to your ride without further
                        > incident. Were you able to make a permanent repair later? Could you
                        > give us more "forensic" information (such as: One Dacron layer or
                        > two? What was the sealing agent [latex paint, polyurethane varnish,
                        > something else]? Stringer and cross-member spacing? Did you
                        > triangulate with the recommended Kevlar roving?) This could help us
                        > understand the effect of variations, as well as the weaknesses of the
                        > original concept and designs... Thanks.
                        >
                        > -Roland
                        >
                      • bschless@rasco.com
                        I stuck a nice wide screwdriver through my Classic 10 a week before launch time. I took some scrap dacron and glued it over the hole with SuperGlue. I was
                        Message 11 of 14 , Oct 8, 2008
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                          I stuck a nice wide screwdriver through my Classic 10' a week before launch time.  I took some scrap dacron and glued it over the hole with SuperGlue.  I was so darn mad with myself I hit it with a coat of spray clear polyeutethane and aid top heck with it.  That was six months ago.  In the meantime I've had it out in turbulent waves on the ocean (well, not too turbulent!) and fished til the stripers left, and nary a drop through the hole.  The boats will tend to leak a bit anyway; this coating isn't an exact science.  But I wouldn't worry about it.  Just patch it up and use it, and, as my buddy says "quit yer complainin'!".


                          Beau Schless
                          President/CEO
                          NOTEbookS Library Automation Systems
                          Celebrating 15 years exceeding customers' expectations
                          HTTP://WWW.RASCO.COM
                          PH: 1.(978) 443-2996



                          "James Kingston" <james.kingston@...>
                          Sent by: Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com

                          10/08/2008 06:16 PM

                          Please respond to
                          Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com

                          To
                          Airolite_Boats@yahoogroups.com
                          cc
                          Subject
                          Re: [Airolite_Boats] Re: Looking for Greg Paris; happy autumn






                          Like I said, this is a non-Monfort design. It was done in a class at
                          my local Community College. It was one layer of Dacron (the heaviest
                          available, apparently), with no roving. The rip ran from where it
                          stabbed through until it hit the plywood station, about 6 inches.

                          I used one coat of clear Poly-Brush to fill the fibers, then several
                          layers of water-based exterior spar urethane (Varathane 2501?).
                          Stringers spread about 6 inches, plywood stations about 24.

                          For a permanent repair, I used a sheet of Heat-N-Bond, and a few more
                          coats of Varathane. This has held up pretty well, though it is helped
                          by the fact that I left the gorilla tape on the inside in place.
                          Since this is where my feet rest, I didn't want to put extra stress on
                          the heat-n-bond.

                          James

                          On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 5:24 AM, rueffingkidding
                          <
                          rueffingkidding@...> wrote:

                          > Unfotunate. Glad you made it back to your ride without further
                          > incident. Were you able to make a permanent repair later? Could you
                          > give us more "forensic" information (such as: One Dacron
                          layer or
                          > two? What was the sealing agent [latex paint, polyurethane varnish,
                          > something else]? Stringer and cross-member spacing? Did you
                          > triangulate with the recommended Kevlar roving?) This could help us
                          > understand the effect of variations, as well as the weaknesses of
                          the
                          > original concept and designs... Thanks.
                          >
                          > -Roland
                          >


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