- True. Take off and landing should be upright.. as they would have to be for a foot launch or landing. There are many issues with hang gliding safety thatMessage 1 of 44 , May 1, 2012View SourceTrue. Take off and landing should be upright.. as they would have to be for a foot launch or landing. There are many issues with hang gliding safety that don't necessarily apply to all prone aircraft. When a hang glider pilot lands he/she has to throw his feet back behind him in a position that makes it impossible to run. If everything is timed correctly then his feet come back under him during the flair. If not then he is going to get a mouthful of grass, sand or dirt and possibly bang his head on the keel. In an aerodynamically controlled aircraft there is no need for this act of heroism/faith. The feet remain under the pilot and there is no swing through keel bashing process. (On gliders like the Atos the pilot can even get in front of the glider and be sacked in the back of the neck - ouch!!) The pilot could still fall forward on landing, but would not necessary end up head first. There is also no long lever like a hang glider control frame that would cause the aircraft to turtle. With a couple of wheels in front the aircraft would simply slide to a stop if the pilot fell.
As for aerodynamics… well I fly a Tracer harness that is about level (not head down) with my hang glider and often look like a sack of potatoes. Although I never set any xc records I also don't usually have a problem staying up with those pilots in tricked out harnesses and gliders. (Well, at least not most of the time…) And although I do have neck problems I prefer flying prone for the sensation.
On Apr 30, 2012, at 8:32 PM, James wrote:
> Head first has some pluses; but they're not evident when you plough into
> the ground in that position. It's not a pretty sight.
> And if you're aiming for minimum drag I think you need to be slightly
> head down...
>> Posted by: "Sunny Stutzman" sunnystutzman@...
>> sunny_stutzman <http://profiles.yahoo.com/sunny_stutzman>
>> Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:08 pm (PDT)
>> I don't recall where I saw the video. I believe that he started with
>> the surfboard on his back and launched normally… then it dropped down
>> under his feet and somehow tied into the controls. Plenty of hang
>> glider pilots have stood in the control frame and steered with their
>> feet, so the idea isn't that far out. The problem is that like any new
>> control system there is a learning curve and most people enjoy
>> breathing too much to try such extreme diversions from the norm.
>> Personally, I think that head first is the best way to enjoy the
>> sensation of flight. (especially if you have a way to go upright for
>> landing and taking off…) I would love to see a prone air chair. Yes,
>> it kind of goes against the whole "chair" philosophy, but it would be
>> cool… maybe with a small positive angle to save the neck muscles.. I
>> really like Mike's early foot-launchers. It would be interesting to
>> revisit them with modern materials to get the weight down.
> Link to Airchair main page for archives, files and photos
> Link to Mike Sandlin's BUG (Basic Ultralight Glider) website
> Link to Wikipedia Airchair
> Yahoo! Groups Links
- Hi Bruce , I m going to try and draw something up to explain what I m thinking of with Upstanding Aviation ... but in the mean time Here s a song that got onMessage 44 of 44 , May 30, 2012View SourceHi Bruce ,I'm going to try and draw something up to explain what I'm thinking of with Upstanding Aviation ... but in the mean time Here's a song that got on Australian TV ....All the best Bud .http://youtu.be/qvjGldb6Uj8On 31/05/2012, at 1:42 AM, gpa bruce wrote:
Bud, I'm a music buff myself. However the only Instrument I play is the radio :-)
Do you have any youtubes of your music and what is your favorite genre to play? What instruments do you play? Not to sound mean, but I think I'd rather talk music with you than aviation :-)
BruceOn Wed, May 30, 2012 at 12:18 AM, BUD MANTHEY <budmanthey@...> wrote:
Hi Red ( I had a drummer called Red once) Thank You for Your link I enjoyed it very Much . I agree any neg G's would be very undesirable. But pos.G's would be Fine I'm sure ... Humane legs take a pounding in many sports. An out of control spin or strong thermal hit would also be an issue I'm sure .Thank You for Your Thoughts . All the best BUD.( I'm certainly not picturing any outside loops or inverted flight .......not at this stage anyway :)On 30/05/2012, at 1:37 AM, redatxmission wrote:
I hope you can see these considerations as just issues which you, as the designer, would need to resolve, and not as any attempt to "belittle" you, or be "naysaying" to your idea.
In any ultralight flight, negative G forces will be encountered. The "push" version (as when you exit lifting air, or enter sinking air) may be one or two Gs, and last for several seconds. The "slap" version (sharp-edged turbulence) is instantaneous, but can easily exceed that first number. Any foot-retainer system would need to hold you when suspended upside down, hanging at your full body weight, and able to hold you when one or two friends (at a minimum) grab you and hang on, also. Any lesser foot restraints would result in an ejection from the craft, in a negative G incident.
Any such external forces would probably break the balance of the pilot, and cause unwanted control inputs. Once a pilot has been knocked off their feet, how do you resume control (remember the foot restraints are still attached). Put on snow-ski boots, lock into the bindings of a pair of skis (or snowboard), and fall over. Then resume the controlled, standing position. Any injury-failure of the knees then would end the ability of the pilot to control flight. More turbulence is found at low altitudes, such as during the launch or landing, usually, so the time to recover control may be very limited.
The YouTube link below is a 3+ hour HG flight (condensed to just a few minutes). The pilot was flying prone, relaxed in a pod harness, and enjoying the scenery. Surfing may need a few minutes of control at most, but is it realistic for an hours-long flight? I have made 6+ hour flights on my HG, but I have to doubt that I'd be so relaxed and refreshed, after that much time standing on top of a surfboard. In the video, a small white dot tracks under the HG, showing the absolute altitude (AGL) of the glider. For best viewing, select the Full-Screen option:
--- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, BUD MANTHEY <budmanthey@...> wrote:
> Dear fanjules..
> Thank You for taking the time to think a little bit about this idea . I hope Your ready to be belittled By the less imaginative naysayers among us . Yes it would be a bit more draggy just as a hanglider pilot is when learning in 'hang' at least I'd be side on to the wind and would have the option to crouch down behind the rail/ ferring. Also it would have a slow slow stall speed.Still not enough drag to ground the concept. The rudder would be operated by a turn-table type arrangement from the back boot .Or rudder and ailerons could function together with the tilting of the board left and right . The craft could be powered or not . A parachute would be preferable as would a detachable quick release boot (as in snow board) . Nothing compares to the wonderful universal joy of standing UP and leaning into a 'corner' . With this Idea You could throw Yourself backwards ... useing the ailerons You could pull the Plane over with You into a roll or a half roll and then pull out using a front foot pull and a back foot push ... eg loop back to straight and level !!! shondells , stalls Mild spins, loops all completely possible !!! UPSTANDING AVIATION is the future I'm sure . Stand Up and Fly I say !!! all the best BUD MANTHEY BAND ( If I had the $$ skills and Time I'd do it Myself for Sure !!! )
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: gypsyglider
> > To: Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Monday, May 28, 2012 2:27 PM
> > Subject: [Airchairgroup] Re: Upstanding Aviation (flying surfboard)
> > I'm having a hard time beliving you are "for real",actually... I suspect this to be an elaborate jape with the group. I'm returning to ignore mode on it.
> > Garry
> > --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, BUD MANTHEY <budmanthey@> wrote:
> > No ... control will be needed from 3 axis ,,,, think Drifter or modified GOAT .