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Re: Whatever happened to RC and other small engines in Ai...

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  • flying.penguin711
    Hello all, ... with a powered paraglider I have been flying for 6 seasons the very same engine that Mike is using now for his Bloop. I have the same one, just
    Message 1 of 7 , May 1, 2011
      Hello all,

      > My Lazair had two Rotax 195, 9.5hp engines and flew great and never quit.

      >In 1923 the Wren Glider flew with a 3.6 HP

      with a powered paraglider I have been flying for 6 seasons the very same engine that Mike is using now for his Bloop. I have the same one, just with the tuned exhaust, giving 17HP when brand new. It was old when I bought it, so now in summer there is no real fun with it.

      It isn't a bad engine, does its job without any trouble, but I am not surprised to hear that Mike experiences thrust problems. Even with just that paraglider, the thrust is marginal. Back then in the good old days no one would carry a parachute, radio, electric start, helmet, boots and all the rest. And a pilot with 90+ kg would have been at least 8 feet tall. What I am trying to say is that with the skinny slim chaps of 1923 and without all the baggage, there was a lot more fun with a 15HP engine. I definitely never really thought about mounting my motor on one of my gliders.

      My hope is that it finally works out for Mike, at least he could fly near the coast in fall or winter where the air is more dense than up here.

      Cheers
      Hendrik

      *another remark on that pusher prop configuration; back then I went and cut off all flight suit zipper handles, because a flying comrade had one actually fall off and it went into his prop...
    • ¹Î¼®
      Hi Hendrik, So you have been flying that same engine back in good old Germany! I wish my little engine had had that tuned exhaust, it needed it! A little more
      Message 2 of 7 , May 1, 2011
        Hi Hendrik,
        So you have been flying that same engine back in good old Germany!
        I wish my little engine had had that tuned exhaust, it needed
        it! A little more push might have got me through. It was a lot
        of fun, though, hopping around on the runway, and so I gained a
        firm desire to fly with a motor and learn some new skills. It does
        make a huge difference in testing to be able to select nice
        weather in San Diego with the plane always assembled and
        ready to go, instead of out on the desert after a long drive and
        having to put the plane together in whatever weather comes along.

        I am expecting a new engine to arrive in a week or two, so I'll
        try to fly some tests to find out how much power a motor
        floater really needs. The Bloop gross weight is about 350 lbs.
        and it glides at maybe 8:1 at 28 mph. Based on that, I expect
        that any modern 20-25 HP paramotor power pack (engine with
        same prop as paramotor) will be right for me, and perhaps
        good for most other motor floaters and motorized airchairs.

        Mike Sandlin....San Diego California


        --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, "flying.penguin711" <hmaroske@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hello all,

        > with a powered paraglider I have been flying for 6 seasons the very same engine that Mike is using now for his Bloop. I have the same one, just with the tuned exhaust, giving 17HP when brand new. It was old when I bought it, so now in summer there is no real fun with it.
        >
        > It isn't a bad engine, does its job without any trouble, but I am not surprised to hear that Mike experiences thrust problems. Even with just that paraglider, the thrust is marginal. Back then in the good old days no one would carry a parachute, radio, electric start, helmet, boots and all the rest. And a pilot with 90+ kg would have been at least 8 feet tall. What I am trying to say is that with the skinny slim chaps of 1923 and without all the baggage, there was a lot more fun with a 15HP engine. I definitely never really thought about mounting my motor on one of my gliders.
        >
        > My hope is that it finally works out for Mike, at least he could fly near the coast in fall or winter where the air is more dense than up here.
        >
        > Cheers
        > Hendrik
        >
        > *another remark on that pusher prop configuration; back then I went and cut off all flight suit zipper handles, because a flying comrade had one actually fall off and it went into his prop...
        >
      • flyhighman@aol.com
        Most modern day paramotors complete with re-drive (reduction) and exhaust weigh in anywhere from 25 lbs for the TOP80 to 35 lbs (ish) for the Black Devil and
        Message 3 of 7 , May 1, 2011
          Most modern day paramotors complete with re-drive (reduction) and exhaust weigh in anywhere from 25 lbs for the TOP80 to 35 lbs (ish) for the Black Devil and Simonini (depending on the exhaust used).  Simonini's have several exhausts from various manufactures provided by Paramotor OEM's.  Hirth F33 will be slightly more as it's a 313cc engine.

          There are new manufactures out the such as HE, Ventor, RDM and of course Vittorazzi with engines ranging in 80 to 180 cc and a few higher (HE).

          Check out this site for PG and PPG information for up to date manufacturers.

          http://www.ojovolador.com/eng/links/

          One factor here...none are designed from tractor applications in case anyone gets a wild idea to front mount one!

          Scott Travers


          -----Original Message-----
          From: ¹Î¼® <ms7525@...>
          To: Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Mon, May 2, 2011 1:47 am
          Subject: [Airchairgroup] Re: Whatever happened to RC and other small engines in Ai...

           


          Hi Hendrik,
          So you have been flying that same engine back in good old Germany!
          I wish my little engine had had that tuned exhaust, it needed
          it! A little more push might have got me through. It was a lot
          of fun, though, hopping around on the runway, and so I gained a
          firm desire to fly with a motor and learn some new skills. It does
          make a huge difference in testing to be able to select nice
          weather in San Diego with the plane always assembled and
          ready to go, instead of out on the desert after a long drive and
          having to put the plane together in whatever weather comes along.

          I am expecting a new engine to arrive in a week or two, so I'll
          try to fly some tests to find out how much power a motor
          floater really needs. The Bloop gross weight is about 350 lbs.
          and it glides at maybe 8:1 at 28 mph. Based on that, I expect
          that any modern 20-25 HP paramotor power pack (engine with
          same prop as paramotor) will be right for me, and perhaps
          good for most other motor floaters and motorized airchairs.

          Mike Sandlin....San Diego California

          --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, "flying.penguin711" <hmaroske@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hello all,

          > with a powered paraglider I have been flying for 6 seasons the very same engine that Mike is using now for his Bloop. I have the same one, just with the tuned exhaust, giving 17HP when brand new. It was old when I bought it, so now in summer there is no real fun with it.
          >
          > It isn't a bad engine, does its job without any trouble, but I am not surprised to hear that Mike experiences thrust problems. Even with just that paraglider, the thrust is marginal. Back then in the good old days no one would carry a parachute, radio, electric start, helmet, boots and all the rest. And a pilot with 90+ kg would have been at least 8 feet tall. What I am trying to say is that with the skinny slim chaps of 1923 and without all the baggage, there was a lot more fun with a 15HP engine. I definitely never really thought about mounting my motor on one of my gliders.
          >
          > My hope is that it finally works out for Mike, at least he could fly near the coast in fall or winter where the air is more dense than up here.
          >
          > Cheers
          > Hendrik
          >
          > *another remark on that pusher prop configuration; back then I went and cut off all flight suit zipper handles, because a flying comrade had one actually fall off and it went into his prop...
          >

        • flying.penguin711
          Hi Mike, ... Yes, sure it was a surprise to see that thing on your Bloop :-) ... Just my experience as well. One day it was so hot and humid, when I hit wide
          Message 4 of 7 , May 2, 2011
            Hi Mike,

            > So you have been flying that same engine back in good old Germany!

            Yes, sure it was a surprise to see that thing on your Bloop :-)

            > I wish my little engine had had that tuned exhaust, it needed
            > it! A little more push might have got me through.

            Just my experience as well. One day it was so hot and humid, when I hit wide open throttle, I would go _down_... had to jump from one thermal to the next in order stay high enough for cross country.

            Other hot days, after three failed attempts I had to quit trying to launch... but as I said, in spring and fall, that little motor is a great fun to have. Just needs fuel and oil and from time to time a few strands of fresh grass :-)

            >It does
            > make a huge difference in testing to be able to select nice
            > weather in San Diego with the plane always assembled and
            > ready to go, instead of out on the desert after a long drive and
            > having to put the plane together in whatever weather comes along.

            Strong point in favor of a hangar. My powered paragliding was a _lot_ more effort trying to get into the air. Especially when the wind aloft gets flyable, there is usually no wind on the runway, turning a launch with that motor into a sport event.

            > I am expecting a new engine to arrive in a week or two, so I'll
            > try to fly some tests to find out how much power a motor
            > floater really needs.
            [...]
            >It was a lot
            > of fun, though, hopping around on the runway, and so I gained a
            > firm desire to fly with a motor and learn some new skills.

            This new engine is going to ROCK! They are going to have to pull you out of the air before sunset or you'll stay there :-) You'll have enough push for a decent climb and once in the air you can throttle down to save fuel and ease out the vibrations. My motor also has a tendency to overheat, with the tuned exhaust, so only short bursts with full throttle are permitted.

            >The Bloop gross weight is about 350 lbs.
            > and it glides at maybe 8:1 at 28 mph. Based on that, I expect
            > that any modern 20-25 HP paramotor power pack (engine with
            > same prop as paramotor) will be right for me, and perhaps
            > good for most other motor floaters and motorized airchairs.

            Definitively. I had been flying the SWING Powerplay L which is able to carry 350 pounds; my gross weight was 300 lbs. A very optimistic glide estimation would be 7:1 for the wing at 300lbs at cruise speed (22mph). Usually I've been flying at 23mph, max was 28mph, sometimes even 30mph. A 20-25HP engine would have been ideal.

            So, that BLOOP is going to be just GREAT STUFF to be in the air with.

            Wish you TONS OF FUN, and take your cam with you :-)

            Hendrik
          • mict04
            Hi, I was just thinking as I read, my Lazair still has the 98 CC Pioneer engines, at 1/2 the Rotac CCs. Also, just a coincidence, because I am trying to loose
            Message 5 of 7 , May 2, 2011
              Hi,

              I was just thinking as I read, my Lazair still has the 98 CC Pioneer engines, at 1/2 the Rotac CCs.

              Also, just a coincidence, because I am trying to loose weight, last evening after comming back from supper out with family,
              I took the time to weigh what I was carieing around in my pants.
              (cell phone, change, pens, keys and etc) 9 LBS.....No coat, just stuff in my pockets.

              I wonder if that Rotax is in good enough shape to use on my Lazair ?

              Michel



              --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, "flying.penguin711" <hmaroske@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hello all,
              >
              > > My Lazair had two Rotax 195, 9.5hp engines and flew great and never quit.
              >
              > >In 1923 the Wren Glider flew with a 3.6 HP
              >
              > with a powered paraglider I have been flying for 6 seasons the very same engine that Mike is using now for his Bloop. I have the same one, just with the tuned exhaust, giving 17HP when brand new. It was old when I bought it, so now in summer there is no real fun with it.
              >
              > It isn't a bad engine, does its job without any trouble, but I am not surprised to hear that Mike experiences thrust problems. Even with just that paraglider, the thrust is marginal. Back then in the good old days no one would carry a parachute, radio, electric start, helmet, boots and all the rest. And a pilot with 90+ kg would have been at least 8 feet tall. What I am trying to say is that with the skinny slim chaps of 1923 and without all the baggage, there was a lot more fun with a 15HP engine. I definitely never really thought about mounting my motor on one of my gliders.
              >
              > My hope is that it finally works out for Mike, at least he could fly near the coast in fall or winter where the air is more dense than up here.
              >
              > Cheers
              > Hendrik
              >
              > *another remark on that pusher prop configuration; back then I went and cut off all flight suit zipper handles, because a flying comrade had one actually fall off and it went into his prop...
              >
            • ekolbs
              I agree about many low cost two cycle engines available for use. My hang up is the PSRU (propeller speed reduction unit). A set of plans with specific details
              Message 6 of 7 , May 4, 2011
                I agree about many low cost two cycle engines available for use. My hang up is the PSRU (propeller speed reduction unit). A set of plans with specific details calling out bearing P/N, belt type and size, machine dimensions etc would be very useful. Can't be that hard to build, with the assistance of a machine shop, cheaper than comercially available units. I know I'm a little off topic of airchair but believe that many of us would find this very useful, even Mike on his motor airchair. Thanks for the input.

                --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, "gypsyinvader" <garrywarber@...> wrote:
                >
                > You guys must like to buy "bolt on and fly", and be very financially solvent. You could make your own from many available small engines. Mike could possibly re-use his redrive on another larger engine for a few hundred dollars... The pre-made jobbies are kinda spendy, to me.
                > Garry
                >
                > --- In Airchairgroup@yahoogroups.com, ¹Î¼® <ms7525@> wrote:
                > Hi Hendrik,
                > So you have been flying that same engine back in good old Germany! I wish my little engine had had that tuned exhaust, it needed it! A little more push might have got me through. It was a lot of fun, though, hopping around on the runway, and so I gained a firm desire to fly with a motor and learn some new skills. It does make a huge difference in testing to be able to select nice weather in San Diego with the plane always assembled and ready to go, instead of out on the desert after a long drive and
                > having to put the plane together in whatever weather comes along.
                > I am expecting a new engine to arrive in a week or two, so I'll try to fly some tests to find out how much power a motor floater really needs. The Bloop gross weight is about 350 lbs. and it glides at maybe 8:1 at 28 mph. Based on that, I expect that any modern 20-25 HP paramotor power pack (engine with same prop as paramotor) will be right for me, and perhaps good for most other motor floaters and motorized airchairs.
                > Mike Sandlin....San Diego California
                >
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