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Re: [APBR_analysis] Re: Kidd v. KJ and comparing eras

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  • Robert Bradley
    ... Personally, I think Johnson would be a better fit on the current team considering their weaknesses (which are scoring and perimeter shooting - two areas he
    Message 1 of 11 , Mar 8, 2001
      > This gets at Q#2 and I would tend to agree (not strongly). Looking
      > at the
      > current Suns team is a tougher call for me. I think Kidd is a very
      > important part of a good defense and KJ would hurt that. (Completely
      > ignoring the injury factor, too.)

      Personally, I think Johnson would be a better fit on the current team
      considering their weaknesses (which are scoring and perimeter shooting
      - two areas he has a big advantage over Kidd). Kidd would probably fit
      in much better on some teams such as Philadelphia or the Lakers where
      he would have a big scorer to compliment him. And I agree Kidd's a
      better defender, but smaller, quicker guards do give him a problem at
      times.

      Now who's better - Paul Westphal or Dennis Johnson? Talk about
      complete opposites....



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    • Dean Oliver
      ... Very opposite. I really will have to work to dig up their numbers. I m still accumulating old data through a source with the league. The Group database
      Message 2 of 11 , Mar 8, 2001
        --- In APBR_analysis@y..., Robert Bradley <bradleyrd13@y...> wrote:

        > Now who's better - Paul Westphal or Dennis Johnson? Talk about
        > complete opposites....
        >

        Very opposite. I really will have to work to dig up their numbers.
        I'm still accumulating old data through a source with the league. The
        Group database that we started with APBR has very incomplete
        individual turnover data and that's what my source is getting for me.
        For just these two players, I can hand enter the info, but it's a
        total of about 3200 man-seasons of individual turnovers I'm missing.

        I always respected Johnson's game more than Westphal's. But, frankly,
        I was pretty young when Westphal was in his heyday. And my judgment
        is somewhat clouded by my general disdain for Westphal's coaching
        style. I'll run the numbers soon.

        Dean Oliver
        Journal of Basketball Studies.
      • msg_53@hotmail.com
        ... For their careers: Westphal: sco 20.8, reb 2.5, ast 5.6, stl 1.7, TO 3.2, blk .4 DJohnson: 14.4 4.3 5.2 1.5 2.6 .7 regular
        Message 3 of 11 , Mar 8, 2001
          --- In APBR_analysis@y..., Robert Bradley <bradleyrd13@y...> wrote:
          > Now who's better - Paul Westphal or Dennis Johnson? Talk about
          > complete opposites....
          >
          For their careers:
          Westphal: sco 20.8, reb 2.5, ast 5.6, stl 1.7, TO 3.2, blk .4
          DJohnson: 14.4 4.3 5.2 1.5 2.6 .7

          regular season totals: Westphal 29.9, DJ 25.4
          playoff totals: Westphal 25.8, DJ 25.7

          Westphal was the more skilled player in general.
          Dennis Johnson played better under pressure and against greater
          competition.

          I rate DJ #66 alltime, Westphal #120
          >
          >
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        • Robert Bradley
          ... Johnson of course enjoyed a much longer period of productivity and was far superior defensively, Westphal was as good offensively as Maravich an Gervin in
          Message 4 of 11 , Mar 8, 2001
            > For their careers:
            > Westphal: sco 20.8, reb 2.5, ast 5.6, stl 1.7, TO 3.2, blk .4
            > DJohnson: 14.4 4.3 5.2 1.5 2.6 .7
            >
            > regular season totals: Westphal 29.9, DJ 25.4
            > playoff totals: Westphal 25.8, DJ 25.7
            >
            > Westphal was the more skilled player in general.
            > Dennis Johnson played better under pressure and against greater
            > competition.
            >
            > I rate DJ #66 alltime, Westphal #120

            Johnson of course enjoyed a much longer period of productivity and was
            far superior defensively, Westphal was as good offensively as Maravich
            an Gervin in the late 70s when he was playing in Phoenix before his
            foot problems began.

            An interesting trade - Westphal, the great offensive player, for
            Johnson the great defensive player. Obviously Phoenix got the better
            of the deal with Westphal's injury in Seattle, but up to that point I'd
            consider Westy superior.

            Did your alltime rating take into account longevity or team W-L record?
            (just curious)


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          • msg_53@hotmail.com
            To all who wonder: Mike Goodman s alltime rankings, based on statistics compiled since 1952, are based on standardized per-game averages, career totals,
            Message 5 of 11 , Mar 8, 2001
              To all who wonder: Mike Goodman's alltime rankings, based on
              statistics compiled since 1952, are based on standardized per-game
              averages, career totals, per-minute averages, and playoff performance.
              --- In APBR_analysis@y..., Robert Bradley <bradleyrd13@y...> wrote:
              >
              > Johnson of course enjoyed a much longer period of productivity and
              was
              > far superior defensively, Westphal was as good offensively as
              Maravich
              > an Gervin in the late 70s when he was playing in Phoenix before his
              > foot problems began.
              >
              > An interesting trade - Westphal, the great offensive player, for
              > Johnson the great defensive player. Obviously Phoenix got the
              better
              > of the deal with Westphal's injury in Seattle, but up to that point
              I'd
              > consider Westy superior.
              >
              > Did your alltime rating take into account longevity or team W-L
              record?
              > (just curious)
              >
              >
              > __________________________________________________
              > Do You Yahoo!?
              > Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail.
              > http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
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