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"under "and "over" rated in new performance rankings

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  • Joe
    ... new performance ratings revised to incorporate most of your feedback. all these guys yield higher rating numbers, especially billups, ginobili and arroyo.
    Message 1 of 66 , Mar 7, 2004
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      --- In APBR_analysis@yahoogroups.com, "Mike G" <msg_53@h...> wrote:
      > Part 2
      >
      > Here are players I'd rank among the top 50 that Joe didn't rank so
      > highly: old perf/rank new perf rating
      > Carter,Vince SF Tor 11.48 / 62 13.15
      > Billups,Chauncey PG Det 11.57 / 59 13.82
      > Francis,Steve PG Hou 10.30 / 82 11.24
      > Ginobili,Emanuel SG SA 10.66 / 72 14.74
      > Wade,Dwyane PG Mia 11.17 / 65 12.70
      > Arroyo,Carlos PG Uta 8.37 / 118 12.12
      > Mashburn,Jamal SF NO 12.12 / 54 12.01
      > Jones,Eddie SG Mia 11.10 / 67 11.83
      >
      >>
      > And this short list is all comprised of 'smaller' players. Their
      > assists are (IMO) undervalued.

      new performance ratings revised to incorporate most of your feedback.
      all these guys yield higher rating numbers, especially billups,
      ginobili and arroyo. new rank not included because i havent caculated
      pace and defense adjustment that far down the player list.
      >
      >
      > Here's a list of other players that I think you've got underrated
      > (the numeric column is a rough index of the magnitude):
      > old perf /rank new perf /rank
      > 0.83 Kidd,Jason PG NJ 15.13 / 25 18.16 / 19
      > 0.83 Iverson,Allen SG Phi 14.16 / 35 13.64 /
      > 0.83 Davis,Baron PG NO 13.79 / 39 14.46
      > 0.83 Cassell,Sam PG Min 14.75 / 32 17.35 / 25
      > 0.84 O'Neal,Jermaine PF Ind 16.36 / 20 19.15 / 13
      > 0.87 Ming,Yao C Hou 15.87 / 21 20.42 / 6
      > 0.89 Artest,Ron SF Ind 12.57 / 51 14.35
      > 0.89 Duncan,Tim PF SA 23.12 / 3 26.23 / 3
      > 0.90 Marbury,Stephon PG NY 14.56 / 34 14.37
      > 0.91 Odom,Lamar SF Mia 14.86 / 29 15.86
      >
      > >
      >
      > And players I'd say you've got 'overrated':
      > old perf / rank new perf/ rank
      > 1.20 Finley,Michael SG Dal 15.02 / 27 14.28
      > 1.20 Brown,P.J. PF NO 13.76 / 40 15.37
      > 1.16 Miller,Brad C Sac 18.77 / 9 18.81 / 14
      > 1.16 Stojakovic,P SF Sac 20.95 / 5 19.16 / 12
      > 1.15 Thomas,Kenny PF Phi 13.89 /38 15.63
      > 1.14 Jamison,Antawn SF Dal 13.63 /41 16.74 /26
      > 1.14 Boozer,Carlos PF Cle 18.33 /10 20.05 / 8
      > 1.13 Wallace,Ben PF Det 18.04 / 11 19.73 / 9
      > 1.12 Marion,Shawn SF Phe 17.92 / 13 16.45 / 27
      > 1.12 Nowitzki,Dirk PF Dal 19.17 / 7 18.60 / 16
      > 1.11 Dampier,Erick C GS 15.86 / 22 18.63 / 15
      > 1.10 Lewis,Rashard SF Sea 14.23 / 34 14.13 /
      >

      new formula moves rating in that direction of your assessment in
      many cases.
      >
    • nickouli5
      I will agree that Manu has been gambling since about mid-season when he moved to the bench more than he did in the beggining of the season (in fact much more).
      Message 66 of 66 , Mar 23, 2004
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        I will agree that Manu has been gambling since about mid-season when
        he moved to the bench more than he did in the beggining of the season
        (in fact much more).

        I actually thought he cut down on the gambling A LOT from last
        season, but there was a game in New Orleans, when he came off the
        bench and did it at a crucial point of the game and might have been a
        huge reason the Spurs lost the game. He usually never made those
        type of mistakes down the stretch of games.

        Either way, I think he is generally a very solid defender. Even
        though he gambles a bit these days, he still creates a lot of
        turnovers via charges and steals.

        And about 2001, I know Bowen was not around. But I was trying to
        kind of hint towards the TWIN TOWER approach maybe being the primary
        reason an SG/SF always is in the top TENDEX defensive ratings since
        2001 (maybe even before that) if we were to check.

        If Bowen is the reason for the SG's being held so low, then why is
        the SG production PER at a net positive at +2.5? And negative at the
        SF position (or was once close to it)? He certainly doesn't put up
        LARGE PER and Turkoglu altough is scoring more these days and
        grabbing rebounds, I would have to assume Manu, Turk, AND Bowen are
        all playing solid defense. If there is any weakness in the D its
        with Parker slightly, and even MORE SO at the backup PG position for
        the Spurs.

        Of course the two 7 footer approach helps them all become a little
        more risky etc..... But I don't see how Manu and Hedo cannot being
        doing solid defensively, when the PER, defensive ratings are solid
        across the board? Isn't it safe to conclude the Spurs are getting
        reasonable production on both ends with the THREE MAN ROTATIOn at the
        SG and SF? And the reason the SF might be low is solely because of
        Bowens lack of scoring at times?
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