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Historical studies of Player Ratings

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  • Leo Walsh
    ... teams drafting the best players available in the draft. Do you have any books, references or formulas to recommend that would help me detrimine the best
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 18, 2003
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      --- ssims22000 <ssims2@...> wrote:
      > Hi,
      >
      > I'm attempting to play a historical replay based on
      teams drafting the best players available in the
      draft.

      Do you have any books, references or formulas to
      recommend that would help me detrimine the best
      players in each draft?

      Any direction would be greatly appreciated.

      Thank you in advance,

      Leo Walsh

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    • Mike G
      ... Apologies to Simmy for failing to respond (or failing to see) a previous post on this subject. Here s *one* rating based on what I call career equivalent
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 18, 2003
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        --- In APBR_analysis@yahoogroups.com, Leo Walsh <lojowo@y...> wrote:
        >
        > --- ssims22000 <ssims2@i...> wrote:
        > > Hi,
        > >
        > > I'm attempting to play a historical replay based on
        > teams drafting the best players available in the
        > draft.
        >
        > Do you have any books, references or formulas to
        > recommend that would help me detrimine the best
        > players in each draft?
        >
        > Any direction would be greatly appreciated.
        >
        > Thank you in advance,
        >
        > Leo Walsh

        Apologies to Simmy for failing to respond (or failing to see) a
        previous post on this subject.

        Here's *one* rating based on what I call 'career equivalent totals'.
        This system attempts to 'standardize' career totals by accounting for
        the various milieus (i.e., era, team styles) in which the totals were
        accumulated.

        I'll be happy to explain further or just pass along the spreadsheets.

        This list will be pretty short for some early years. It also hasn't
        been updated for a year or two. It includes only players who amassed
        10,000 or more 'equivalent' points + rebounds + etc.

        (I guess the cutoff changes to 15,000 at some point; I've also found
        one error, in 1989, but I don't have time to track it down. So
        consider this a sample..)

        1953
        15987 Carl Braun
        10855 Earl Lloyd
        26842
        1954
        23044 Clyde Lovellette
        17928 George Yardley
        15051 Ray Felix
        10821 Jack George
        66844
        1955
        40542 Bob Pettit
        24754 Johnny Kerr
        16064 Gene Shue
        15768 Larry Costello
        14492 Frank Ramsey
        111620
        1956
        23984 Jack Twyman
        16735 Tom Gola
        13791 Kenny Sears
        12590 Walter Dukes
        8556 Maurice Stokes
        75656
        1957
        40742 Bill Russell
        24770 Cliff Hagan
        22868 Richie Guerin
        20429 Tom Heinsohn
        16893 Willie Naulls
        125702
        1958
        23907 Sam Jones
        23907
        1959
        39390 Elgin Baylor
        30604 Hal Greer
        18628 Guy Rodgers
        17239 Wayne Embry
        10732 Connie Dierking
        10089 K.C. Jones
        126682
        1960
        60802 Wilt Chamberlain
        28284 Bailey Howell
        20637 Dick Barnett
        19889 Johnny Green
        19302 Rudy LaRusso
        11274 Tom Hawkins
        11196 Dave Gambee
        171384
        1961
        44627 Oscar Robertson
        40353 Jerry West
        28604 Lenny Wilkens
        19291 Bob Boozer
        14848 Satch Sanders
        14380 Don Ohl
        11710 Darrall Imhoff
        10346 Al Attles
        184159
        1962
        35100 Walt Bellamy
        17887 Ray Scott
        15707 Tom Meschery
        11051 Adrian Smith
        79745
        1963
        41194 John Havlicek
        28761 Chet Walker
        26543 Zelmo Beaty
        24801 Dave Debusschere
        23216 Bill Bridges
        18508 Don Nelson
        17721 Leroy Ellis
        14293 Kevin Loughery
        12951 Terry Dischinger
        207988
        1964
        28596 Nate Thurmond
        28052 Jerry Lucas
        16627 Gus Johnson
        13389 Don Kojis
        86664
        1965
        25975 Paul Silas
        21517 Willis Reed
        19579 Happy Hairston
        18687 Jeff Mullins
        17201 Joe Caldwell
        13518 Walt Hazzard
        12568 Larry Jones
        129045
        1966
        36776 Rick Barry
        26389 Gail Goodrich
        25293 Billy Cunnngham
        20338 Dick VanArsdale
        17148 Jerry Sloan
        17119 Tom VanArsdale
        14266 Jim Washington
        13331 Jon McGlocklin
        12439 Keith Erickson
        183099
        1967
        25288 Dave Bing
        23947 Lou Hudson
        19025 Bob Love
        17926 Archie Clark
        17691 Jack Marin
        16630 Dick Snyder
        16626 Cazzie Russell
        16228 Freddie Lewis
        12310 Clyde Lee
        11640 Jim Barnett
        10439 John Block
        10352 Bill Melchionni
        198102
        1968
        28601 Walt Frazier
        23812 Earl Monroe
        20983 Louie Dampier
        19565 Mel Daniels
        17840 Connie Hawkins
        16890 Jimmy Jones
        15769 Roger Brown
        143460
        1969
        45587 Elvin Hayes
        29856 Wes Unseld
        23460 Ron Boone
        98903
        1970
        75001 Kareem
        26007 Bob Dandridge
        25721 Spencer Haywood
        22036 Jo Jo White
        17942 Norm Van Lier
        16752 Mack Calvin
        15236 Willie Wise
        198695
        1971
        41200 Dan Issel
        34452 Bob Lanier
        27811 Dave Cowens
        25375 Billy Paultz
        25303 Nate Archibald
        24947 Calvin Murphy
        24173 Sam Lacey
        20630 Rudy Tomjanovich
        20319 Pete Maravich
        19198 Charlie Scott
        18794 John Johnson
        282202
        1972
        52525 Julius Erving
        49025 Artis Gilmore
        28753 George McGinnis
        23451 Randy Smith
        20850 Fred Brown
        20127 Sidney Wicks
        17878 Mike Newlin
        17393 Tom Owens
        17165 Dave Robisch
        15961 Clifford Ray
        263128
        1973
        35815 George Gervin
        30420 Bob McAdoo
        20325 Paul Westphal
        17383 Jim Chones
        15578 James Silas
        15549 Don Buse
        135070
        1974
        25683 Caldwell Jones
        20281 Larry Kenon
        18049 Swen Nater
        64013
        1975
        52972 Moses Malone
        27495 Maurice Lucas
        25196 Bobby Jones
        23415 Jamaal Wilkes
        21314 Mickey Johnson
        20616 John Drew
        20457 Truck Robinson
        19707 Billy Knight
        19035 Scott Wedman
        15035 Brian Winters
        245242
        1976
        27048 Alvan Adams
        23828 Gus Williams
        22511 World Free
        22167 Dan Roundfield
        18047 David Thompson
        17374 Darryl Dawkins
        16592 Junior Bridgeman
        16230 Mark Olberding
        16106 Ricky Sobers
        179903
        1977
        48340 Robert Parish
        35694 Alex English
        33928 Adrian Dantley
        29983 Dennis Johnsn
        19420 John Lucas
        167365
        1978
        34672 Jack Sikma
        27439 Walter Davis
        27168 Bernard King
        23457 James Edwards
        23149 Marques Johnson
        20912 Norm Nixon
        20639 Cedric Maxwell
        18712 Tree Rollins
        18327 Robert Reid
        17341 Greg Ballard
        17133 Rickey Green
        16930 Otis Birdsong
        16055 Ray Williams
        15932 Brad Davis
        297866
        1979
        28832 Maurice Cheeks
        26942 Reggie Theus
        23972 Mychal Thompson
        19373 Mike Mitchell
        18892 Purvis Short
        16086 Wayne Cooper
        15523 Terry Tyler
        15465 Mike Richardson
        15408 Dave Corzine
        15186 John Long
        195679
        1980
        44626 Larry Bird
        44300 Magic Johnson
        23221 Bill Cartwright
        22040 Sidney Moncrief
        19383 Vinnie Johnson
        17927 Michael Cooper
        17038 David Greenwood
        16531 Calvin Natt
        16507 Cliff Robinson I
        15881 Jim Paxson
        237454
        1981
        34312 Kevin McHale
        29905 Bill Laimbeer
        21143 Kiki Vanderweghe
        19690 Mike Gminski
        19094 James Donaldson
        18533 Rick Mahorn
        18486 JoeBarry Carroll
        15964 Darrell Griffith
        15210 Larry Smith
        192337
        1982
        35344 Buck Williams
        34280 Isiah Thomas
        31213 Larry Nance
        30212 Tom Chambers
        27198 Mark Aguirre
        26353 Eddie Johnson
        25046 Rolando Blackman
        22914 Danny Ainge
        21373 Herb Williams
        19233 Orlando Woolridge
        16984 Dan Schayes
        16226 Kelly Tripucka
        15825 Alton Lister
        322201
        1983
        37745 Dominique Wilkins
        32948 Terry Cummings
        29146 James Worthy
        21317 Ricky Pierce
        20286 Sleepy Floyd
        20240 Lafayette Lever
        17668 Mark Eaton
        16845 Paul Pressey
        16512 LaSalle Thompson
        212707
        1984
        40993 Clyde Drexler
        29413 Derek Harper
        27432 Dale Ellis
        25403 Byron Scott
        21944 Jeff Malone
        20306 Glenn Rivers
        19681 Thurl Bailey
        18312 Rodney McCray
        16625 Sedale Threatt
        15240 Mark West
        235349
        1985
        54666 Michael Jordan
        53688 Hakeem Olajuwon
        48938 Charles Barkley
        46087 John Stockton
        32920 Otis Thorpe
        29928 Sam Perkins
        28852 Kevin Willis
        23573 Jerome Kersey
        19739 Alvin Robertson
        18106 Vern Fleming
        16719 Antoine Carr
        16286 Jay Humphries
        15303 Craig Ehlo
        404805
        1986
        59000 Karl Malone
        45786 Patrick Ewing
        30612 Detlef Schrempf
        29206 Terry Porter
        29158 Charles Oakley
        27882 Chris Mullin
        27236 Joe Dumars
        26467 A.C. Green
        21168 Xavier McDaniel
        19057 Tyrone Corbin
        18971 Wayman Tisdale
        17701 Gerald Wilkins
        17684 Benoit Benjamin
        15715 Michael Adams
        15117 Spud Webb
        400760
        1987
        30911 Jeff Hornacek
        24840 Ron Harper
        24701 Dennis Rodman
        21538 Chuck Person
        21100 HotRod Williams
        21092 Mark Price
        20065 Brad Daugherty
        17034 Dell Curry
        16439 Johnny Newman
        15981 Nate McMillan
        213701
        1988
        38788 Scottie Pippen
        32974 Reggie Miller
        29042 Horace Grant
        26769 Kevin Johnson
        21068 Armon Gilliam
        20035 Derrick McKey
        17709 Muggsy Bogues
        17060 Kenny Smith
        16563 Olden Polynice
        220008
        1989
        27540 Mark Jackson
        26785 Mitch Richmond
        24995 Rod Strickland
        24650 Hersey Hawkins
        23408 Rik Smits
        20965 Dan Majerle
        19732 Danny Manning
        18115 John Starks
        17947 Avery Johnson
        17616 Rony Seikaly
        17312 Grant Long
        16265 Vernon Maxwell
        255330
        1990
        38409 David Robinson
        28812 Shawn Kemp
        24703 Tim Hardaway
        24651 Glen Rice
        23319 Mookie Blaylock
        23271 Vlade Divac
        22992 Cliff RobinsonII
        19339 Nick Anderson
        18388 Anthony Mason
        17524 Sean Elliott
        241408
        1991
        27531 Gary Payton
        19505 Derrick Coleman
        17374 Kendall Gill
        16184 Elden Campbell
        14182 Tyrone Hill
        94776
        1992
        23232 Dikembe Mutombo
        20315 Larry Johnson
        18343 Steve Smith
        16867 Terrell Brandon
        16426 Dale Davis
        16352 Kenny Anderson
        111535
        1993
        29991 Shaquille O'Neal
        22567 Alonzo Mourning
        16654 Christi Laettner
        16070 Latrell Sprewell
        15871 Tom Gugliotta
        14723 C.Weatherspoon
        115876
        1994
        16211 Penny Hardaway
        15781 Chris Webber
        14296 Nick Van Exel
        13937 Allan Houston
        13834 Toni Kukoc
        74059
        1995
        17806 Grant Hill
        13235 Jason Kidd
        13162 Glenn Robinson
        12501 Eddie Jones
        11969 Juwan Howard
        9588 Jalen Rose
        78261
        1996
        13221 Kevin Garnett
        11056 Mike Finley
        10885 Damon Stoudamire
        10490 Antonio McDyess
        10482 Arvydas Sabonis
        9523 Rasheed Wallace
        9486 Jerry Stackhouse
        75143
        1997
        10495 Allen Iverson
        8954 Antoine Walker
        8775 Stephon Marbury
        8450 Ray Allen
        8057 Kobe Bryant
        44731
        1998
        10172 Tim Duncan
        7382 Shareef A-Raheem
        17554


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      • Leo Walsh
        Thanks Mike, Thanks for your help. This rating will probably help also in determining the value of the player after his career has begun. I m sure I ll run
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 18, 2003
        • 0 Attachment
          Thanks Mike,

          Thanks for your help.

          This rating will probably help also in determining the
          value of the player after his career has begun.

          I'm sure I'll run into the situation that I will have
          too many minutes on one team while not enough on
          another.

          I'll also run into the situation that I have two small
          forwards ( for example ) and will have to move someone
          to balance out the minutes played.

          I'll have to balance minutes played somehow.
          --- Mike G <msg_53@...> wrote:
          > --- In APBR_analysis@yahoogroups.com, Leo Walsh
          > <lojowo@y...> wrote:
          > >
          > > --- ssims22000 <ssims2@i...> wrote:
          > > > Hi,
          > > >
          > > > I'm attempting to play a historical replay
          > based on
          > > teams drafting the best players available in the
          > > draft.
          > >
          > > Do you have any books, references or formulas to
          > > recommend that would help me detrimine the best
          > > players in each draft?
          > >
          > > Any direction would be greatly appreciated.
          > >
          > > Thank you in advance,
          > >
          > > Leo Walsh
          >
          > Apologies to Simmy for failing to respond (or
          > failing to see) a
          > previous post on this subject.
          >
          > Here's *one* rating based on what I call 'career
          > equivalent totals'.
          > This system attempts to 'standardize' career totals
          > by accounting for
          > the various milieus (i.e., era, team styles) in
          > which the totals were
          > accumulated.
          >
          > I'll be happy to explain further or just pass along
          > the spreadsheets.
          >
          > This list will be pretty short for some early years.
          > It also hasn't
          > been updated for a year or two. It includes only
          > players who amassed
          > 10,000 or more 'equivalent' points + rebounds + etc.
          >
          > (I guess the cutoff changes to 15,000 at some point;
          > I've also found
          > one error, in 1989, but I don't have time to track
          > it down. So
          > consider this a sample..)
          >
          > 1953
          > 15987 Carl Braun
          > 10855 Earl Lloyd
          > 26842
          > 1954
          > 23044 Clyde Lovellette
          > 17928 George Yardley
          > 15051 Ray Felix
          > 10821 Jack George
          > 66844
          > 1955
          > 40542 Bob Pettit
          > 24754 Johnny Kerr
          > 16064 Gene Shue
          > 15768 Larry Costello
          > 14492 Frank Ramsey
          > 111620
          > 1956
          > 23984 Jack Twyman
          > 16735 Tom Gola
          > 13791 Kenny Sears
          > 12590 Walter Dukes
          > 8556 Maurice Stokes
          > 75656
          > 1957
          > 40742 Bill Russell
          > 24770 Cliff Hagan
          > 22868 Richie Guerin
          > 20429 Tom Heinsohn
          > 16893 Willie Naulls
          > 125702
          > 1958
          > 23907 Sam Jones
          > 23907
          > 1959
          > 39390 Elgin Baylor
          > 30604 Hal Greer
          > 18628 Guy Rodgers
          > 17239 Wayne Embry
          > 10732 Connie Dierking
          > 10089 K.C. Jones
          > 126682
          > 1960
          > 60802 Wilt Chamberlain
          > 28284 Bailey Howell
          > 20637 Dick Barnett
          > 19889 Johnny Green
          > 19302 Rudy LaRusso
          > 11274 Tom Hawkins
          > 11196 Dave Gambee
          > 171384
          > 1961
          > 44627 Oscar Robertson
          > 40353 Jerry West
          > 28604 Lenny Wilkens
          > 19291 Bob Boozer
          > 14848 Satch Sanders
          > 14380 Don Ohl
          > 11710 Darrall Imhoff
          > 10346 Al Attles
          > 184159
          > 1962
          > 35100 Walt Bellamy
          > 17887 Ray Scott
          > 15707 Tom Meschery
          > 11051 Adrian Smith
          > 79745
          > 1963
          > 41194 John Havlicek
          > 28761 Chet Walker
          > 26543 Zelmo Beaty
          > 24801 Dave Debusschere
          > 23216 Bill Bridges
          > 18508 Don Nelson
          > 17721 Leroy Ellis
          > 14293 Kevin Loughery
          > 12951 Terry Dischinger
          > 207988
          > 1964
          > 28596 Nate Thurmond
          > 28052 Jerry Lucas
          > 16627 Gus Johnson
          > 13389 Don Kojis
          > 86664
          > 1965
          > 25975 Paul Silas
          > 21517 Willis Reed
          > 19579 Happy Hairston
          > 18687 Jeff Mullins
          > 17201 Joe Caldwell
          > 13518 Walt Hazzard
          > 12568 Larry Jones
          > 129045
          > 1966
          > 36776 Rick Barry
          > 26389 Gail Goodrich
          > 25293 Billy Cunnngham
          > 20338 Dick VanArsdale
          > 17148 Jerry Sloan
          > 17119 Tom VanArsdale
          > 14266 Jim Washington
          > 13331 Jon McGlocklin
          > 12439 Keith Erickson
          > 183099
          > 1967
          > 25288 Dave Bing
          > 23947 Lou Hudson
          > 19025 Bob Love
          > 17926 Archie Clark
          > 17691 Jack Marin
          > 16630 Dick Snyder
          > 16626 Cazzie Russell
          > 16228 Freddie Lewis
          > 12310 Clyde Lee
          > 11640 Jim Barnett
          > 10439 John Block
          > 10352 Bill Melchionni
          > 198102
          > 1968
          > 28601 Walt Frazier
          > 23812 Earl Monroe
          > 20983 Louie Dampier
          > 19565 Mel Daniels
          > 17840 Connie Hawkins
          > 16890 Jimmy Jones
          > 15769 Roger Brown
          > 143460
          > 1969
          > 45587 Elvin Hayes
          > 29856 Wes Unseld
          > 23460 Ron Boone
          > 98903
          > 1970
          > 75001 Kareem
          > 26007 Bob Dandridge
          > 25721 Spencer Haywood
          > 22036 Jo Jo White
          > 17942 Norm Van Lier
          > 16752 Mack Calvin
          > 15236 Willie Wise
          > 198695
          > 1971
          > 41200 Dan Issel
          > 34452 Bob Lanier
          > 27811 Dave Cowens
          > 25375 Billy Paultz
          > 25303 Nate Archibald
          > 24947 Calvin Murphy
          > 24173 Sam Lacey
          > 20630 Rudy Tomjanovich
          > 20319 Pete Maravich
          > 19198 Charlie Scott
          > 18794 John Johnson
          >
          === message truncated ===


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