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players ranked by team

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  • Mike G
    Since most of us are only familiar with one team, or a few; and since some of us can t update their ratings in under 30 minutes... For brevity, the cutoff is
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 22, 2002
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      Since most of us are only familiar with one team, or a few; and since
      some of us can't update their ratings in under 30 minutes...

      For brevity, the cutoff is 200 minutes.


      35.9 Abdur-Rahim,Shar Atl
      34.5 Robinson,Glenn Atl
      31.0 Terry,Jason Atl
      28.6 Ratliff,Theo Atl
      23.1 Henderson,Alan Atl
      19.6 Newble,Ira Atl
      37.7 Pierce,Paul Bos
      33.6 Walker,Antoine Bos
      24.5 Williams,Shammon Bos
      24.0 Delk,Tony Bos
      23.3 Battie,Tony Bos
      18.9 Williams,Eric Bos
      18.0 Baker,Vin Bos
      13.8 Mccarty,Walter Bos
      32.2 Marshall,Donyell Chi
      30.7 Rose,Jalen Chi
      25.3 Williams,Jay Chi
      24.4 Chandler,Tyson Chi
      20.0 Curry,Eddy Chi
      15.3 Robinson,Eddie Chi
      15.1 Hassell,Trenton Chi
      36.7 Ilgauskas,Zydrun Cle
      29.5 Davis,Ricky Cle
      25.1 Miles,Darius Cle
      24.5 Hill,Tyrone Cle
      20.9 Jones,Jumaine Cle
      18.0 Coles,Bimbo Cle
      17.7 Palacio,Milt Cle
      41.7 Nowitzki,Dirk Dal
      38.2 Nash,Steve Dal
      32.7 Finley,Michael Dal
      30.9 Bradley,Shawn Dal
      23.6 Najera,Eduardo Dal
      23.3 Williams,Walt Dal
      31.0 Posey,James Den
      28.9 Hilario,Nene Den
      28.5 Howard,Juwan Den
      23.7 Blount,Mark Den
      19.4 Satterfield,Kenn Den
      17.2 Bowen,Ryan Den
      38.3 Hamilton,Richard Det
      29.3 Wallace,Ben Det
      26.9 Robinson,Cliff Det
      26.2 Billups,Chauncey Det
      25.9 Williamson,Corli Det
      24.0 Barry,Jon Det
      23.4 Atkins,Chucky Det
      12.3 Curry,Michael Det
      31.2 Jamison,Antawn GS
      30.6 Arenas,Gilbert GS
      29.8 Dampier,Erick GS
      27.3 Richardson,Jason GS
      26.6 Murphy,Troy GS
      23.8 Foyle,Adonal GS
      18.8 Dunleavy,Mike GS
      43.5 Francis,Steve Hou
      27.6 Griffin,Eddie Hou
      26.5 Mobley,Cuttino Hou
      25.1 Thomas,Kenny Hou
      38.1 O'Neal,Jermaine Ind
      34.6 Miller,Brad Ind
      34.0 Artest,Ron Ind
      25.4 Tinsley,Jamaal Ind
      23.0 Mercer,Ron Ind
      22.9 Bender,Jonathan Ind
      22.3 Harrington,Al Ind
      35.7 Brand,Elton LAC
      29.2 Miller,Andre LAC
      27.4 Olowokandi,Micha LAC
      24.1 Maggette,Corey LAC
      18.5 Piatkowski,Eric LAC
      17.3 Dooling,Keyon LAC
      14.4 Jaric,Marko LAC
      43.7 Bryant,Kobe LAL
      23.4 Shaw,Brian LAL
      23.3 Walker,Samaki LAL
      22.6 Medvedenko,Stan LAL
      21.3 George,Devean LAL
      21.3 Horry,Robert LAL
      21.0 Fox,Rick LAL
      15.4 Fisher,Derek LAL
      30.5 Gasol,Pau Mem
      27.8 Gooden,Drew Mem
      27.6 Swift,Stromile Mem
      24.1 Williams,Jason Mem
      21.2 Giricek,Gordan Mem
      19.6 Wright,Lorenzen Mem
      17.6 Battier,Shane Mem
      17.2 Person,Wesley Mem
      28.6 Jones,Eddie Mia
      25.7 Grant,Brian Mia
      23.7 Best,Travis Mia
      22.7 Allen,Malik Mia
      21.6 Butler,Caron Mia
      31.9 Allen,Ray Mil
      30.4 Cassell,Sam Mil
      29.2 Kukoc,Toni Mil
      27.6 Redd,Michael Mil
      23.0 Thomas,Tim Mil
      18.3 Mason,Anthony Mil
      41.3 Garnett,Kevin Min
      26.3 Hudson,Troy Min
      25.3 Nesterovic,Rados Min
      20.9 Gill,Kendall Min
      20.9 Trent,Gary Min
      19.6 Woods,Loren Min
      18.5 Peeler,Anthony Min
      18.0 Strickland,Rod Min
      42.4 Kidd,Jason NJ
      28.9 Kittles,Kerry NJ
      28.3 Jefferson,Richar NJ
      26.1 Martin,Kenyon NJ
      24.5 Mutombo,Dikembe NJ
      24.3 Harris,Lucious NJ
      22.5 Rogers,Rodney NJ
      17.2 Williams,Aaron NJ
      34.7 Mashburn,Jamal NO
      33.0 Davis,Baron NO
      29.1 Brown,P.J. NO
      24.9 Magloire,Jamaal NO
      21.9 Wesley,David NO
      19.8 Alexander,Courtn NO
      31.9 Thomas,Kurt NY
      28.5 Houston,Allan NY
      22.2 Eisley,Howard NY
      20.1 Weatherspoon,Cla NY
      17.7 Anderson,Shandon NY
      14.3 Harrington,Othel NY
      43.0 Mcgrady,Tracy Orl
      33.4 Hill,Grant Orl
      25.9 Miller,Mike Orl
      23.5 Armstrong,Darrel Orl
      20.9 Kemp,Shawn Orl
      19.2 Garrity,Pat Orl
      17.4 Burke,Pat Orl
      14.9 Vaughn,Jacque Orl
      37.5 Iverson,Allen Phi
      29.7 Vanhorn,Keith Phi
      26.9 Mckie,Aaron Phi
      26.9 Skinner,Brian Phi
      25.0 Snow,Eric Phi
      24.7 Macculloch,Todd Phi
      22.2 Buckner,Greg Phi
      33.3 Marion,Shawn Pho
      32.6 Marbury,Stephon Pho
      29.9 Hardaway,Anferne Pho
      26.6 Stoudemire,Amare Pho
      22.4 Gugliotta,Tom Pho
      33.6 Wallace,Rasheed Por
      31.5 Anderson,Derek Por
      26.2 Wells,Bonzi Por
      22.9 Pippen,Scottie Por
      22.0 Patterson,Ruben Por
      21.2 Stoudamire,Damon Por
      20.4 Davis,Dale Por
      38.9 Webber,Chris Sac
      31.6 Jackson,Bobby Sac
      29.6 Divac,Vlade Sac
      28.1 Clark,Keon Sac
      26.8 Stojakovic,Predr Sac
      25.9 Christie,Doug Sac
      21.4 Jones,Damon Sac
      21.0 Turkoglu,Hidaye Sac
      38.3 Duncan,Tim San
      30.9 Robinson,David San
      30.8 Rose,Malik San
      28.0 Jackson,Stephen San
      26.1 Parker,Tony San
      19.7 Ginobili,Emanuel San
      14.3 Bowen,Bruce San
      40.5 Payton,Gary Sea
      32.6 Lewis,Rashard Sea
      28.1 Barry,Brent Sea
      27.9 Mason,Desmond Sea
      24.4 Radmanovic,Vlad Sea
      19.6 Drobnjak,Predrag Sea
      28.5 Williams,Alvin Tor
      25.4 Lenard,Voshon Tor
      24.0 Davis,Antonio Tor
      22.1 Peterson,Morris Tor
      21.8 Williams,Jerome Tor
      20.5 Hunter,Lindsey Tor
      35.7 Malone,Karl Uta
      33.6 Kirilenko,Andrei Uta
      32.0 Harpring,Matt Uta
      31.5 Stockton,John Uta
      23.9 Padgett,Scott Uta
      23.0 Jackson,Mark Uta
      22.3 Ostertag,Greg Uta
      17.3 Cheaney,Calbert Uta
      15.5 Stevenson,Deshaw Uta
      15.3 Collins,Jarron Uta
      37.3 Stackhouse,Jerry Was
      34.7 Jordan,Michael Was
      27.3 Brown,Kwame Was
      23.6 Lue,Tyronn Was
      22.7 Hughes,Larry Was
      19.4 Haywood,Brendan Was
      18.9 Russell,Bryon Was
    • Dean Oliver
      ... since ... Mike -- Is there a possible way to get at a team value? I just averaged the individual numbers for each team and came up with a number. I m not
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 22, 2002
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        --- In APBR_analysis@y..., "Mike G" <msg_53@h...> wrote:
        > Since most of us are only familiar with one team, or a few; and
        since
        > some of us can't update their ratings in under 30 minutes...
        >

        Mike --

        Is there a possible way to get at a team value? I just averaged the
        individual numbers for each team and came up with a number. I'm not
        sure how meaningful it is, esp since it is only the players with >200
        minutes. It also doesn't correlate all that well with team success.
        The Warriors rank pretty high by your numbers but not overall, as a
        gross example.

        Rank Tm AvgMSG Win%
        1 Dal 31.7 1.000
        2 Hou 30.7 0.600
        3 Pho 29.0 0.556
        4 Sea 28.9 0.667
        5 Atl 28.8 0.545
        6 Ind 28.6 0.900
        7 Sac 27.9 0.692
        8 Phi 27.6 0.667
        9 NO 27.2 0.727
        10 GS 26.9 0.308
        11 San 26.9 0.667
        12 NJ 26.8 0.667
        13 Mil 26.7 0.500
        14 Was 26.3 0.545
        15 Det 25.8 0.750
        16 Por 25.4 0.500
        17 Uta 25.0 0.462
        18 Den 24.8 0.182
        19 Orl 24.8 0.538
        20 Cle 24.6 0.167
        21 Mia 24.5 0.200
        22 Bos 24.2 0.636
        23 LAL 24.0 0.250
        24 Min 23.9 0.538
        25 LAC 23.8 0.333
        26 Tor 23.7 0.364
        27 Chi 23.3 0.333
        28 Mem 23.2 0.000
        29 NY 22.5 0.200

        Is there a better way to do this?

        DeanO
      • Mike G
        I don t hold too much hope for correlating any rankings with W-L pct. Certainly not this early in the year. Rather, I propose striving to match teams point
        Message 3 of 3 , Nov 22, 2002
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          I don't hold too much hope for correlating any rankings with W-L
          pct. Certainly not this early in the year.

          Rather, I propose striving to match teams' point differential to
          their players' stats. Even after 82 games, there's a fairly large
          variation in W-L / W-pct. correlation.

          What I've done is add all players' contributions based on this
          formula:

          min*rating/36 ,

          where rating is the number on those lists I submitted.

          I did this a few days ago, and found plenty of non-correlation.
          Here's how my teams ranked relative to how I would 'predict' their
          performance, based on individual stats:

          The average team has 169 player-index-points (PIP).

          From most-underrated (by me) to most-overrated.

          Tm. PIP ppg. pred error
          Cle 164 -9.2 -2.4 -6.8
          GSW 178 -2.0 +4.3 -6.3
          Phi 186 +4.0 +8.7 -4.7
          LAL 170 -3.1 +0.4 -3.5
          Pho 175 -0.6 +2.8 -3.4
          Mem 154 -11. -7.6 -3.1
          LAC 162 -6.0 -3.6 -2.4
          Ind 189 +8.3 10.1 -1.8
          Atl 175 +1.2 +2.9 -1.7
          Sea 185 +6.6 +8.2 -1.6
          Min 164 -3.6 -2.6 -1.0
          Uta 165 -2.9 -2.1 -0.8
          NYK 154 -8.2 -7.4 -0.8
          Sac 182 +6.0 +6.4 -0.4
          Bos 168 -1.0 -0.6 -0.4
          NJN 181 +6.5 +6.1 +0.4
          Dal 197 14.4 13.9 +0.5
          Chi 157 -5.1 -6.0 +0.9
          NOH 177 +4.8 +3.9 +0.9
          Hou 171 +2.3 +0.8 +1.5
          Mia 148 -9.2 -11. +1.5
          SAS 172 +3.4 +1.3 +2.1
          Mil 171 +3.0 +0.8 +2.2
          Por 162 -1.0 -3.5 +2.5
          Orl 164 +0.3 -2.3 +2.6
          Tor 151 -5.8 -8.8 +3.0
          Was 172 +5.5 +1.4 +4.1
          Den 144 -6.5 -13. +6.2
          Det 167 +5.9 -1.1 +7.0

          So Detroit is winning by 5.9 ppg, yet I would expect them to be
          losing by 1.1 ppg. And they are doing 7 ppg better than my
          prediction.

          My question is: what do teams near the top of the list have in
          common? And from the bottom of the list?



          --- In APBR_analysis@y..., "Dean Oliver" <deano@r...> wrote:
          > Is there a possible way to get at a team value? I just averaged
          the
          > individual numbers for each team and came up with a number. I'm
          not
          > sure how meaningful it is, esp since it is only the players with
          >200
          > minutes. It also doesn't correlate all that well with team
          success.
          > The Warriors rank pretty high by your numbers but not overall, as a
          > gross example.
          >
          > Rank Tm AvgMSG Win%
          > 1 Dal 31.7 1.000
          > 2 Hou 30.7 0.600
          > 3 Pho 29.0 0.556
          > 4 Sea 28.9 0.667
          > 5 Atl 28.8 0.545
          > 6 Ind 28.6 0.900
          > 7 Sac 27.9 0.692
          > 8 Phi 27.6 0.667
          > 9 NO 27.2 0.727
          > 10 GS 26.9 0.308
          > 11 San 26.9 0.667
          > 12 NJ 26.8 0.667
          > 13 Mil 26.7 0.500
          > 14 Was 26.3 0.545
          > 15 Det 25.8 0.750
          > 16 Por 25.4 0.500
          > 17 Uta 25.0 0.462
          > 18 Den 24.8 0.182
          > 19 Orl 24.8 0.538
          > 20 Cle 24.6 0.167
          > 21 Mia 24.5 0.200
          > 22 Bos 24.2 0.636
          > 23 LAL 24.0 0.250
          > 24 Min 23.9 0.538
          > 25 LAC 23.8 0.333
          > 26 Tor 23.7 0.364
          > 27 Chi 23.3 0.333
          > 28 Mem 23.2 0.000
          > 29 NY 22.5 0.200
          >
          > Is there a better way to do this?
          >
          > DeanO
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