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Re: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving

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  • David Greenberg
    The preamble to the Hammurabi laws will answer your question in relation to that set of laws. David Greenberg, Sociology Department, New York University ...
    Message 1 of 8 , Aug 16, 2012
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      The preamble to the Hammurabi laws will answer your question in relation to
      that set of laws. David Greenberg, Sociology Department, New York University

      On Wed, Aug 15, 2012 at 7:17 AM, Yigal Levin <yigal.levin@...> wrote:

      > **
      >
      >
      > Hello All,
      >
      > In the ANE, did kings who were considered to be lawgiviers (e.g. Hammurabi)
      > usually claim that the laws were given to them by the gods, or did they
      > usually claim that the gods gave them the authority to make laws? Can
      > anyone
      > point me to literature on the subject?
      >
      > Thank you,
      >
      > Dr. Yigal Levin
      >
      > The Israel and Golda Koschitzky
      >
      > Department of Jewish History
      >
      > Bar-Ilan University
      >
      > Ramat Gan. 52900
      >
      > ISRAEL
      >
      > <mailto:Yigal.Levin@...> Yigal.Levin@...
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Yigal Levin
      Dear Simi, Thanks for your reply. I wanted to get as wide a perspective as possible, and have received quite a few interesting and useful answers, mostly
      Message 2 of 8 , Aug 16, 2012
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        Dear Simi,

        Thanks for your reply. I wanted to get as wide a perspective as possible,
        and have received quite a few interesting and useful answers, mostly
        off-list - and thanks to all who replied. Obviously I know who the people at
        Bar-Ilan who deal with these subjects are.

        Yigal Levin

        -----Original Message-----
        From: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ANE-2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
        Simeon Chavel
        Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 8:35 AM
        To: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving

        Yigal,
        In those royal texts, the king says the deities charged him with a variety
        of responsibilities and he fulfilled them. Those duties include doing
        justice, but the deities do not dictate the terms or transmit specific laws.
        Only in the HB does the deity dictate laws -- of course not to a king but to
        a prophet. Many have written on this comparison, from a variety of points of
        view, e.g. Greenberg, Paul, Weinfeld. At Bar Ilan, there is no reason not to
        consult colleagues in the Dept of Bible, e.g., Ed Greenstein.
        Simi
        ---------------------
        Simeon Chavel
        Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
        The University of Chicago Divinity School
        tel.: +1.773.702.6387
        AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
        http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
        ---------------------

        On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:17 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:

        > Hello All,
        >
        > In the ANE, did kings who were considered to be lawgiviers (e.g.
        > Hammurabi) usually claim that the laws were given to them by the gods,
        > or did they usually claim that the gods gave them the authority to
        > make laws? Can anyone point me to literature on the subject?
        >
        > Thank you,
        >
        > Dr. Yigal Levin
        >
        > The Israel and Golda Koschitzky
        >
        > Department of Jewish History
        >
        > Bar-Ilan University
        >
        > Ramat Gan. 52900
        >
        > ISRAEL
        >
        > <mailto:Yigal.Levin@...> Yigal.Levin@...
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



        ------------------------------------

        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Simeon Chavel
        Gotcha. In that case, a few more titles: Hurowitz, Inu Anum Sirum Charpin, Hammurabi Charpin, Writing, Law etc. Finkelstein, The Ox That Gored Weinfeld,
        Message 3 of 8 , Aug 17, 2012
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          Gotcha. In that case, a few more titles:
          Hurowitz, Inu Anum Sirum
          Charpin, Hammurabi
          Charpin, Writing, Law etc.
          Finkelstein, The Ox That Gored
          Weinfeld, משפט וצדקה
          Wright, Inventing God's Law
          and the chapter on biblical law in Talshir, ספרות המקרא: מבואות ומחקרים, vol. 1.
          —————————————————————
          Simeon Chavel
          Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
          The University of Chicago Divinity School
          tel.: +1.773.702.6387
          AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
          http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
          —————————————————————

          On Aug 17, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:

          > Dear Simi,
          >
          > Thanks for your reply. I wanted to get as wide a perspective as possible,
          > and have received quite a few interesting and useful answers, mostly
          > off-list - and thanks to all who replied. Obviously I know who the people at
          > Bar-Ilan who deal with these subjects are.
          >
          > Yigal Levin
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ANE-2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
          > Simeon Chavel
          > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 8:35 AM
          > To: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving
          >
          > Yigal,
          > In those royal texts, the king says the deities charged him with a variety
          > of responsibilities and he fulfilled them. Those duties include doing
          > justice, but the deities do not dictate the terms or transmit specific laws.
          > Only in the HB does the deity dictate laws -- of course not to a king but to
          > a prophet. Many have written on this comparison, from a variety of points of
          > view, e.g. Greenberg, Paul, Weinfeld. At Bar Ilan, there is no reason not to
          > consult colleagues in the Dept of Bible, e.g., Ed Greenstein.
          > Simi
          > ---------------------
          > Simeon Chavel
          > Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
          > The University of Chicago Divinity School
          > tel.: +1.773.702.6387
          > AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
          > http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
          > ---------------------
          >
          > On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:17 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:
          >
          > > Hello All,
          > >
          > > In the ANE, did kings who were considered to be lawgiviers (e.g.
          > > Hammurabi) usually claim that the laws were given to them by the gods,
          > > or did they usually claim that the gods gave them the authority to
          > > make laws? Can anyone point me to literature on the subject?
          > >
          > > Thank you,
          > >
          > > Dr. Yigal Levin
          > >
          > > The Israel and Golda Koschitzky
          > >
          > > Department of Jewish History
          > >
          > > Bar-Ilan University
          > >
          > > Ramat Gan. 52900
          > >
          > > ISRAEL
          > >
          > > <mailto:Yigal.Levin@...> Yigal.Levin@...
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          > >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Simeon Chavel
          Btw, Yigal, in addition to Martha Roth s convenient edition of ANE law collections, Meir Malul now has one out in Hebrew (קובצי הדינים, הוצאת
          Message 4 of 8 , Aug 17, 2012
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            Btw, Yigal, in addition to Martha Roth's convenient edition of ANE law collections, Meir Malul now has one out in Hebrew (קובצי הדינים, הוצאת פרדס, 2010).
            Simi
            —————————————————————
            Simeon Chavel
            Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
            The University of Chicago Divinity School
            tel.: +1.773.702.6387
            AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
            http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
            —————————————————————

            On Aug 17, 2012, at 1:36 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:

            > Dear Simi,
            >
            > Thanks for your reply. I wanted to get as wide a perspective as possible,
            > and have received quite a few interesting and useful answers, mostly
            > off-list - and thanks to all who replied. Obviously I know who the people at
            > Bar-Ilan who deal with these subjects are.
            >
            > Yigal Levin
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ANE-2@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            > Simeon Chavel
            > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 8:35 AM
            > To: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: Re: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving
            >
            > Yigal,
            > In those royal texts, the king says the deities charged him with a variety
            > of responsibilities and he fulfilled them. Those duties include doing
            > justice, but the deities do not dictate the terms or transmit specific laws.
            > Only in the HB does the deity dictate laws -- of course not to a king but to
            > a prophet. Many have written on this comparison, from a variety of points of
            > view, e.g. Greenberg, Paul, Weinfeld. At Bar Ilan, there is no reason not to
            > consult colleagues in the Dept of Bible, e.g., Ed Greenstein.
            > Simi
            > ---------------------
            > Simeon Chavel
            > Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
            > The University of Chicago Divinity School
            > tel.: +1.773.702.6387
            > AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
            > http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
            > ---------------------
            >
            > On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:17 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:
            >
            > > Hello All,
            > >
            > > In the ANE, did kings who were considered to be lawgiviers (e.g.
            > > Hammurabi) usually claim that the laws were given to them by the gods,
            > > or did they usually claim that the gods gave them the authority to
            > > make laws? Can anyone point me to literature on the subject?
            > >
            > > Thank you,
            > >
            > > Dr. Yigal Levin
            > >
            > > The Israel and Golda Koschitzky
            > >
            > > Department of Jewish History
            > >
            > > Bar-Ilan University
            > >
            > > Ramat Gan. 52900
            > >
            > > ISRAEL
            > >
            > > <mailto:Yigal.Levin@...> Yigal.Levin@...
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            > >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Graham Hagens
            Keeping the perspective wide might also involve addressing the more complex question of the influence of  the Zoroastrian oral traditions on  Persian civic
            Message 5 of 8 , Aug 20, 2012
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              Keeping the perspective wide might also involve addressing the more complex question of the influence of  the Zoroastrian oral traditions on  Persian civic law.  The Zoroastrian religious laws which so influenced Judeo-Christianity were of course believed to have been dictated  to  Zoroaster by one of  Ahura Mazda's messengers,  Vohu Mana. 
               
              Graham Hagens
              Hamilton, ON


              ________________________________
              From: Yigal Levin <yigal.levin@...>
              To: ANE-2@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 2:36 AM
              Subject: RE: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving


               
              Dear Simi,

              Thanks for your reply. I wanted to get as wide a perspective as possible,
              and have received quite a few interesting and useful answers, mostly
              off-list - and thanks to all who replied. Obviously I know who the people at
              Bar-Ilan who deal with these subjects are.

              Yigal Levin

              -----Original Message-----
              From: mailto:ANE-2%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:ANE-2%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              Simeon Chavel
              Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 8:35 AM
              To: mailto:ANE-2%40yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [ANE-2] Question about lawgiving

              Yigal,
              In those royal texts, the king says the deities charged him with a variety
              of responsibilities and he fulfilled them. Those duties include doing
              justice, but the deities do not dictate the terms or transmit specific laws.
              Only in the HB does the deity dictate laws -- of course not to a king but to
              a prophet. Many have written on this comparison, from a variety of points of
              view, e.g. Greenberg, Paul, Weinfeld. At Bar Ilan, there is no reason not to
              consult colleagues in the Dept of Bible, e.g., Ed Greenstein.
              Simi
              ---------------------
              Simeon Chavel
              Assistant Professor of Hebrew Bible
              The University of Chicago Divinity School
              tel.: +1.773.702.6387
              AIM: simichavel / Skype: sbchavel
              http://divinity.uchicago.edu/faculty/chavel.shtml
              ---------------------

              On Aug 15, 2012, at 6:17 AM, Yigal Levin wrote:

              > Hello All,
              >
              > In the ANE, did kings who were considered to be lawgiviers (e.g.
              > Hammurabi) usually claim that the laws were given to them by the gods,
              > or did they usually claim that the gods gave them the authority to
              > make laws? Can anyone point me to literature on the subject?
              >
              > Thank you,
              >
              > Dr. Yigal Levin
              >
              > The Israel and Golda Koschitzky
              >
              > Department of Jewish History
              >
              > Bar-Ilan University
              >
              > Ramat Gan. 52900
              >
              > ISRAEL
              >
              > <mailto:mailto:Yigal.Levin%40biu.ac.il> mailto:Yigal.Levin%40biu.ac.il
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              ------------------------------------

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              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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