I agree with you on all points.. I've recently had issues with neighbors who
because they dislike cats decided to call animal control on my household,
even though we're within the legal limit on number and ours are healthy and
well taken care of, yet they let their dog run loose all the time.. People
need to examine their own shit to make sure it doesn't stink before digging
in someone elses..
] On Behalf Of
Sent: Sunday, May 09, 2010 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [80sBBS] Re: Busted BBSes of the 1980s --> Bombs and other
Incendiary Devices - Question
On Sun, May 9, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Steve Radich <stever@...
<mailto:stever%40bitshop.com> > wrote:
> I don't mean to be overly negative about your post, but I want to point
out two things:
> 1) If the world followed this philosophy Hitler would be in power, it
wasn't "our" business to stop him from killing Germans (Jews, Polish, etc.).
It started as German citizens they didn't want - clearly within "their"
business by the above definition. Yes, expanded and I don't want to get the
thread off to history - just pointing out at the beginning it wasn't the
world's business and I don't think anyone would say the world would be a
better place if everyone minded their own business.
I think the concept of "leave us alone" is predicated upon the context
of "victimless crimes," which is what we're talking about here. The
point about Hitler is that he was not minding his own business and was
in fact committing a crime which makes it everyone's business, the
same way when a rapist is victimizing someone, it's all of our
But this doesn't really cover the snotnosed busybody little
tattletales in our culture who don't understand boundaries. And I
would extend this to politics too, and the amount of intrusion into
our lives the crimes of the few have justified in the minds of so
many. Liberty's price is that you don't get a perfectly antiseptic,
padded-room society. A little danger comes with it. It's still a
bargain in my opinion. Liberty ought to exist in an environment of
reason, anyway, which gives a common framework for our dealings with
> 2) There's a saying: "Evil will prevail when good men do nothing" -
Edmund Burke is apparently the author.
Right, except to some people smoking a joint or looking at naked women
is "evil." A corollary to Burke's admirable sentiment here is:
Authoritarianism can also prevail when self-righteous men insist on
standing on my dick.
> Now about the context of your post this may not apply, but you made your
statement pretty broad so I'm pointing pointed this out.
I'm pretty sure the context was implied. In one case, a ddial which
was private property: "democracy" on bulletin boards is at the
pleasure of the SysOp, or more precisely, the one who plays the build
and mixes his labor with the application, and in the other case, a
pornographic pleasure shack, neither of which infringe anyone else's
rights. Not to use political terminology or whatever, but I've
noticed over the course of my life that "shall not be infringed" is a
statement people take to mean exactly opposite of what it actually
does mean. Or free speech, "except/but." I regard the "except/but"
crowd as a far greater threat than the occasional guy who uses his
freedom to be an asshole.
> I want to conclude with people many times interfere FAR too much, and
freedom is great and should be respected by all (including the person who is
free to do what they want). If everyone was free, lived decent, and didn't
try to hurt /take advantage of others then the world would be a better
place and nobody would need to mind anyone but their own business - I just
don't feel that's realistic very often.
I have felt pushed around by laws, rules, and regulations governing
what I can and can't do far often than I've felt pushed around by
people who were doing "evil." That's just a statement of my own
existence in the United States. That could change, of course. But
from my point of view, most people do live free and decently. At
least, far more than than don't. And the minority who don't certainly
do not provide ample justification for more laws, more regulation, or
in a word, more violations of our civil liberties. I am still far
more wary about laws, authority, government, and so on, than I am
about occasional crimes of immoral individuals.
I am 37 years old right now. One time, a few years ago, some
aassholes broke into my truck in Tucson, and attempted to steal it.
We caught them in the middle of it and they ran.
Setting aside schoolyard scrapes, that's the only crime I've ever been
a victim of a crime that I can recall. That's not a bad record,
especially when you consider that stealing trucks is already a crime
(and even this started with them sticking their nose into my business:
> I probably deviated already too far off topic from 80sBBSes,
It's okay. The point of this list is less about staying on topic all
the time and more for a crowd of people who were "there" to hang out
and have discussions.
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