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[7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

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  • narolines
    HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part of the country you re modelling, and that there were certainly more tanks on stone,
    Message 1 of 12 , Jan 25, 2007
      HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part
      of the country you're modelling, and that there were certainly more
      tanks on stone, brick or concrete bases than any other. But wooden-
      based water tanks were not unknown; there were certainly some in
      Colonel Stephens's empire (the K & ESR had some, I think) and there
      were other light railway lines where the tank was supported on a sort
      of pylon made up from sleeper timbers laid at right angles to form a
      very gradually tapering pyramidal structure. I haven't had time to sift
      through my bookshelves, but I'm sure there were others (if nothing
      else, my own Warwickshire Light Railway, set in the English Midlands,
      has one!) I'll try to find time to look for some examples over the next
      few days. Another way to go would be to use a metal base - often from
      surplus rail or heavy angle-iron.

      Graham
    • Vincent Bradley
      Graham, I am loosely modeling the Ashover Light Railway with some Leighton Buzzard sand thrown in. I am really trying to see what sort plumbing was used to
      Message 2 of 12 , Jan 25, 2007
        Graham,
        I am loosely modeling the Ashover Light Railway with some Leighton Buzzard
        sand thrown in. I am really trying to see what sort plumbing was used to
        release water into the tank on the engine that the driver/fireman operated.
        I notice that the filling spouts seem to be a hose unlike here in America
        where they are almost universally formed metal. I have settled on a
        rectangular tank. Were tanks open at the top or enclosed? For support I am
        going to model on one of the ALR ones which was later enclosed.
        Vincent

        -----Original Message-----
        From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
        narolines
        Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:41 AM
        To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

        HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part
        of the country you're modelling, and that there were certainly more
        tanks on stone, brick or concrete bases than any other. But wooden-
        based water tanks were not unknown; there were certainly some in
        Colonel Stephens's empire (the K & ESR had some, I think) and there
        were other light railway lines where the tank was supported on a sort
        of pylon made up from sleeper timbers laid at right angles to form a
        very gradually tapering pyramidal structure. I haven't had time to sift
        through my bookshelves, but I'm sure there were others (if nothing
        else, my own Warwickshire Light Railway, set in the English Midlands,
        has one!) I'll try to find time to look for some examples over the next
        few days. Another way to go would be to use a metal base - often from
        surplus rail or heavy angle-iron.

        Graham



        This group is:
        1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
        scale or thereabouts
        2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
        membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
        3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
        committee
        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Frank Sharp
        Vincent, The hose, or bag as it was usually called, would be canvas if you were poor, and leather if affluent. A cloth shoe lace often does service for the
        Message 3 of 12 , Jan 25, 2007
          Vincent,



          The hose, or bag as it was usually called, would be canvas if you were poor,
          and leather if affluent. A cloth shoe lace often does service for the
          former, shrink on sleeving, if you can get the matt grey black version
          doesn't do too bad for leather. Several methods of controlling the water
          flow, simplest was a valve, usually a screw valve, on the outlet, the
          disadvantage of this being that the valve was exposed, liable to freeze and
          split. Main line water towers usually had a stove, a fire devil, under them,
          usually in the open. The other common way to control the flow was to have
          something rather like a domestic sink plug in the base of the tank, over the
          hose discharge. It would then be operated by a seesaw arm, with a chain down
          to the plug inside the tank, and a chain hanging outside. Pulling the
          outside chain lifted the plug. A weight, often a track chair, would be
          around to hang on the chain to save having to hold it. Many firemen got wet
          feet if the driver, who usually held the chain whilst the fireman held the
          bag in the filler, forgot or didn't come back in time.. The gain is that the
          plug is within the main tank and the hose empties completely, so frost isn't
          just as big a problem.



          On main lines the inlet pipe would have a valve on it rather like you toilet
          or water tank at home. They were usually paying for the water. Narrow gauge
          might have a similar system, but in several places water was from a spring
          or stream, and there was an overflow pipe into the nearest water course.
          Running water, especially that coming from underground rarely freezes, so if
          the inlet was at the bottom of the tank and obviously the overflow from the
          top, the water was continually being replenished, and that might reduce
          frost problems.



          On narrow gauge, make do and mend was often the order of the day. Pictures
          of locos on the Tal-y-llyn taking water which is being fed into the tank
          down an open length of guttering are well known.



          In the U.K. we are getting used to milder winters, but in the 1800's and to
          well part the first half of the 1900's it was not uncommon for quarries to
          close for several weeks in winter because of frost. The Welsh slate mills
          which were water wheel powered often had problems. They would also have
          problems in dry summers.



          Frank



          -----Original Message-----
          From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
          Vincent Bradley
          Sent: 25 January 2007 14:42
          To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: RE: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks



          Graham,
          I am loosely modeling the Ashover Light Railway with some Leighton Buzzard
          sand thrown in. I am really trying to see what sort plumbing was used to
          release water into the tank on the engine that the driver/fireman operated.
          I notice that the filling spouts seem to be a hose unlike here in America
          where they are almost universally formed metal. I have settled on a
          rectangular tank. Were tanks open at the top or enclosed? For support I am
          going to model on one of the ALR ones which was later enclosed.
          Vincent

          -----Original Message-----
          From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
          [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
          Of
          narolines
          Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:41 AM
          To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
          Subject: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

          HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part
          of the country you're modelling, and that there were certainly more
          tanks on stone, brick or concrete bases than any other. But wooden-
          based water tanks were not unknown; there were certainly some in
          Colonel Stephens's empire (the K & ESR had some, I think) and there
          were other light railway lines where the tank was supported on a sort
          of pylon made up from sleeper timbers laid at right angles to form a
          very gradually tapering pyramidal structure. I haven't had time to sift
          through my bookshelves, but I'm sure there were others (if nothing
          else, my own Warwickshire Light Railway, set in the English Midlands,
          has one!) I'll try to find time to look for some examples over the next
          few days. Another way to go would be to use a metal base - often from
          surplus rail or heavy angle-iron.

          Graham

          This group is:
          1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
          scale or thereabouts
          2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
          membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
          3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
          committee
          Yahoo! Groups Links





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • vannerley
          A quirky exception - in this as so much else - is the Sittingbourne & Kemsley/Bowater Light Rly. The paper mill to which the line belonged has its own high
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 26, 2007
            A quirky exception - in this as so much else - is the Sittingbourne &
            Kemsley/Bowater Light Rly.

            The paper mill to which the line belonged has its own high pressure
            water supply (from bore holes at Senora Field to the SW of the mill) so
            the locos were (and are) watered direct from stand pipes of the sort
            seen on the standard gauge: essentially a 4" pipe with a curved top and
            flexible hose.

            I wonder if the people who live in the houses that have now been built
            all over Senora Field realise what is under the homes ...

            2284
            David Vannerley
          • Vincent Bradley
            ... From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Frank Sharp Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 2:31 PM To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 26, 2007
              -----Original Message-----
              From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              Frank Sharp
              Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 2:31 PM
              To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

              Vincent,



              The hose, or bag as it was usually called, would be canvas if you were poor,
              and leather if affluent. A cloth shoe lace often does service for the
              former, shrink on sleeving, if you can get the matt grey black version
              doesn't do too bad for leather. Several methods of controlling the water
              flow, simplest was a valve, usually a screw valve, on the outlet, the
              disadvantage of this being that the valve was exposed, liable to freeze and
              split. Main line water towers usually had a stove, a fire devil, under them,
              usually in the open. The other common way to control the flow was to have
              something rather like a domestic sink plug in the base of the tank, over the
              hose discharge. It would then be operated by a seesaw arm, with a chain down
              to the plug inside the tank, and a chain hanging outside. Pulling the
              outside chain lifted the plug. A weight, often a track chair, would be
              around to hang on the chain to save having to hold it. Many firemen got wet
              feet if the driver, who usually held the chain whilst the fireman held the
              bag in the filler, forgot or didn't come back in time.. The gain is that the
              plug is within the main tank and the hose empties completely, so frost isn't
              just as big a problem.



              On main lines the inlet pipe would have a valve on it rather like you toilet
              or water tank at home. They were usually paying for the water. Narrow gauge
              might have a similar system, but in several places water was from a spring
              or stream, and there was an overflow pipe into the nearest water course.
              Running water, especially that coming from underground rarely freezes, so if
              the inlet was at the bottom of the tank and obviously the overflow from the
              top, the water was continually being replenished, and that might reduce
              frost problems.



              On narrow gauge, make do and mend was often the order of the day. Pictures
              of locos on the Tal-y-llyn taking water which is being fed into the tank
              down an open length of guttering are well known.



              In the U.K. we are getting used to milder winters, but in the 1800's and to
              well part the first half of the 1900's it was not uncommon for quarries to
              close for several weeks in winter because of frost. The Welsh slate mills
              which were water wheel powered often had problems. They would also have
              problems in dry summers.



              Frank



              -----Original Message-----
              From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              Vincent Bradley
              Sent: 25 January 2007 14:42
              To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks



              Graham,
              I am loosely modeling the Ashover Light Railway with some Leighton Buzzard
              sand thrown in. I am really trying to see what sort plumbing was used to
              release water into the tank on the engine that the driver/fireman operated.
              I notice that the filling spouts seem to be a hose unlike here in America
              where they are almost universally formed metal. I have settled on a
              rectangular tank. Were tanks open at the top or enclosed? For support I am
              going to model on one of the ALR ones which was later enclosed.
              Vincent

              -----Original Message-----
              From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
              [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
              Of
              narolines
              Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:41 AM
              To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
              Subject: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

              HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part
              of the country you're modelling, and that there were certainly more
              tanks on stone, brick or concrete bases than any other. But wooden-
              based water tanks were not unknown; there were certainly some in
              Colonel Stephens's empire (the K & ESR had some, I think) and there
              were other light railway lines where the tank was supported on a sort
              of pylon made up from sleeper timbers laid at right angles to form a
              very gradually tapering pyramidal structure. I haven't had time to sift
              through my bookshelves, but I'm sure there were others (if nothing
              else, my own Warwickshire Light Railway, set in the English Midlands,
              has one!) I'll try to find time to look for some examples over the next
              few days. Another way to go would be to use a metal base - often from
              surplus rail or heavy angle-iron.

              Graham

              This group is:
              1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
              scale or thereabouts
              2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
              membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
              3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
              committee
              Yahoo! Groups Links





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



              This group is:
              1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
              scale or thereabouts
              2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
              membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
              3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
              committee
              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • Vincent Bradley
              Frank, This is exactly what I was looking for. I am planning on using a plug valve in the bottom of the tank and shrink tubing for the spout. I will be using
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 26, 2007
                Frank,
                This is exactly what I was looking for. I am planning on using a plug valve
                in the bottom of the tank and shrink tubing for the spout. I will be using
                wood for the support structure.
                Thanks,
                Vincent

                -----Original Message-----
                From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                Frank Sharp
                Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 2:31 PM
                To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

                Vincent,



                The hose, or bag as it was usually called, would be canvas if you were poor,
                and leather if affluent. A cloth shoe lace often does service for the
                former, shrink on sleeving, if you can get the matt grey black version
                doesn't do too bad for leather. Several methods of controlling the water
                flow, simplest was a valve, usually a screw valve, on the outlet, the
                disadvantage of this being that the valve was exposed, liable to freeze and
                split. Main line water towers usually had a stove, a fire devil, under them,
                usually in the open. The other common way to control the flow was to have
                something rather like a domestic sink plug in the base of the tank, over the
                hose discharge. It would then be operated by a seesaw arm, with a chain down
                to the plug inside the tank, and a chain hanging outside. Pulling the
                outside chain lifted the plug. A weight, often a track chair, would be
                around to hang on the chain to save having to hold it. Many firemen got wet
                feet if the driver, who usually held the chain whilst the fireman held the
                bag in the filler, forgot or didn't come back in time.. The gain is that the
                plug is within the main tank and the hose empties completely, so frost isn't
                just as big a problem.



                On main lines the inlet pipe would have a valve on it rather like you toilet
                or water tank at home. They were usually paying for the water. Narrow gauge
                might have a similar system, but in several places water was from a spring
                or stream, and there was an overflow pipe into the nearest water course.
                Running water, especially that coming from underground rarely freezes, so if
                the inlet was at the bottom of the tank and obviously the overflow from the
                top, the water was continually being replenished, and that might reduce
                frost problems.



                On narrow gauge, make do and mend was often the order of the day. Pictures
                of locos on the Tal-y-llyn taking water which is being fed into the tank
                down an open length of guttering are well known.



                In the U.K. we are getting used to milder winters, but in the 1800's and to
                well part the first half of the 1900's it was not uncommon for quarries to
                close for several weeks in winter because of frost. The Welsh slate mills
                which were water wheel powered often had problems. They would also have
                problems in dry summers.



                Frank



                -----Original Message-----
                From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                Vincent Bradley
                Sent: 25 January 2007 14:42
                To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks



                Graham,
                I am loosely modeling the Ashover Light Railway with some Leighton Buzzard
                sand thrown in. I am really trying to see what sort plumbing was used to
                release water into the tank on the engine that the driver/fireman operated.
                I notice that the filling spouts seem to be a hose unlike here in America
                where they are almost universally formed metal. I have settled on a
                rectangular tank. Were tanks open at the top or enclosed? For support I am
                going to model on one of the ALR ones which was later enclosed.
                Vincent

                -----Original Message-----
                From: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
                [mailto:7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com] On Behalf
                Of
                narolines
                Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:41 AM
                To: 7mmnga@yahoogroups. <mailto:7mmnga%40yahoogroups.com> com
                Subject: [7mm NGA] Re: Water Tanks

                HI Vince - Frank is certainly right in that it does depend on what part
                of the country you're modelling, and that there were certainly more
                tanks on stone, brick or concrete bases than any other. But wooden-
                based water tanks were not unknown; there were certainly some in
                Colonel Stephens's empire (the K & ESR had some, I think) and there
                were other light railway lines where the tank was supported on a sort
                of pylon made up from sleeper timbers laid at right angles to form a
                very gradually tapering pyramidal structure. I haven't had time to sift
                through my bookshelves, but I'm sure there were others (if nothing
                else, my own Warwickshire Light Railway, set in the English Midlands,
                has one!) I'll try to find time to look for some examples over the next
                few days. Another way to go would be to use a metal base - often from
                surplus rail or heavy angle-iron.

                Graham

                This group is:
                1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
                scale or thereabouts
                2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
                membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
                3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
                committee
                Yahoo! Groups Links





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                This group is:
                1 - for people interested in modelling narrow gauge railways in 7mm:1ft
                scale or thereabouts
                2 - not restricted to members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association although
                membership of said organisation is thoroughly recommended
                3 - moderated by current serving members of the 7mm Narrow Gauge Association
                committee
                Yahoo! Groups Links
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