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Re: [RecRoom] Hmmmmm......

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  • Brian Jordan
    Badger: Speaking as someone who never served (and doubts he d have been of any particular use outside clerical) I can painfully understand the thinking behind
    Message 1 of 4 , Sep 1 8:55 PM
      Badger:
      Speaking as someone who never served (and doubts he'd have been of any
      particular use outside clerical) I can painfully understand the thinking
      behind this. It's what I call the cold equations. You do what you must
      because there are no other options.

      I am vaguely glad they didn't have to take that action. I just wish it
      had been because the hijackers had a sudden attack of common sense.

      Sliding towards sunrise,
      Brian Jordan
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "Hugh Miller" <h.s.miller@...>
      To: <jlink@...>
      Sent: Saturday, August 31, 2002 11:46 PM
      Subject: [RecRoom] Hmmmmm......


      > I don't know, this might disgust some of you, but I found it very
      > interesting and totally understandable.
      >
      >
      http://www.abcnews.go.com/sections/wnt/DailyNews/9/11_fighterjets020830.html
      > ?partner=earthlink
      >
      > I've tried to explain the military mindset before (Ron doesn't need it
      > explained) but I think this one says it all.
      >
      > Would I have? Sure. You give your life to your country when you sign up.
      > That's the whole idea. It's not like they hide it from you, what you are
      > doing...
      >
      > Badger, not a hawk, but it's awfully hard to explain to someone who has
      > never been in the Service...
      >
      > (and I am SO happy they got rid of conscription! A volunteer force is
      far,
      > far better. Our Constitution forbids involuntary slavery and I have
      always
      > thought of the draft as just that.)
      >
      >
      >
      > To Post a message, send it to: 6crecroom@...
      >
      > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: 6crecroom-unsubscribe@...
      >
      > While you're at it, read the stories in:
      >
      > http://www.egroups.com/list/sixthcolumn
      >
      > http://www.egroups.com/list/onimal
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
    • Hugh Miller
      ... From: Brian Jordan To: Sent: Sunday, September 01, 2002 11:55 PM Subject: Re: [RecRoom] Hmmmmm...... ...
      Message 2 of 4 , Sep 1 9:48 PM
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Brian Jordan" <bjordan@...>
        To: <6crecroom@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Sunday, September 01, 2002 11:55 PM
        Subject: Re: [RecRoom] Hmmmmm......


        > Badger:
        > Speaking as someone who never served (and doubts he'd have been of any
        > particular use outside clerical) I can painfully understand the thinking
        > behind this. It's what I call the cold equations. You do what you must
        > because there are no other options.

        Well, there are other options--you can refuse an unlawful order or protest
        and register a complaint against one while disobeying it, but I think you
        would have made a fine clerk in the Service and those who sit behind desks
        _also_ serve. That's a compliment, btw. =)

        COLD EQUATIONS, eh? Yes, still one of my favorite all time SF stories.
        Awful, but necessary to save many others. Still gives me chills.

        > I am vaguely glad they didn't have to take that action. I just wish
        it
        > had been because the hijackers had a sudden attack of common sense.

        Not likely--they were on a mission for Allah, in their programmed minds.

        Yes, I'm glad the fighter pilots didn't have to suicide too, but they would
        have done it if they had to, because they are _Military_, and the Oath says
        "protect and defend". Period. There is no other way to react. In the
        words of the poem, you "do and die". A pity, but there it is.... ^^;; Sho
        ga nai.

        How's the leg? Doing better, I hope!

        Badger
      • Brian Jordan
        ... any ... Under the circumstances, I have no expectation the pilots would have chosen either option. I have great respect for those who defend our country.
        Message 3 of 4 , Sep 2 4:09 AM
          Badger:

          > > Speaking as someone who never served (and doubts he'd have been of
          any
          > > particular use outside clerical) I can painfully understand the thinking
          > > behind this. It's what I call the cold equations. You do what you must
          > > because there are no other options.
          >
          > Well, there are other options--you can refuse an unlawful order or protest
          > and register a complaint against one while disobeying it

          Under the circumstances, I have no expectation the pilots would have
          chosen either option. I have great respect for those who defend our country.
          Our leaders, on the other hand....

          > but I think you would have made a fine clerk in the Service and those who
          sit behind desks
          > _also_ serve. That's a compliment, btw. =)

          And I take it as such. Thank you.

          >
          > COLD EQUATIONS, eh? Yes, still one of my favorite all time SF stories.
          > Awful, but necessary to save many others. Still gives me chills.
          >

          One more reason I will, eventually, replace my copy of the Greatest SF Short
          Stories of All Time (or whatever the exact title was) . Lot of good
          reading. Not all fun, but good.

          > > I am vaguely glad they didn't have to take that action. I just wish
          it
          > > had been because the hijackers had a sudden attack of common sense.
          >
          > Not likely--they were on a mission for Allah, in their programmed minds.
          >

          Programmed being the most important word. I expect Allah is as sad as any of
          us. Probably more.
          (Side note, a while back I saw a cartoon of some Arab terrorist figure
          arriving at the pearly gates and getting his seventy two virgins- all male.
          A certain ugly justice to the concept.)

          > Yes, I'm glad the fighter pilots didn't have to suicide too, but they
          would
          > have done it if they had to, because they are _Military_, and the Oath
          says
          > "protect and defend". Period. There is no other way to react. In the
          > words of the poem, you "do and die". A pity, but there it is.... ^^;;
          Sho ga nai.

          Again, no arguement.

          >
          > How's the leg? Doing better, I hope!
          >

          Leg's better, thanks. (Bizarre to note that, considering I seriously feared
          I might bleed to death, my greatest aggravation at the time was that I had
          to hobble down to the front door to let the EMS guys in. The stupid deadbolt
          had slipped just enough to hold the front door shut. (sigh) So there I was,
          tracking blood over the recently cleaned carpets. Damnably annoying.)

          I am told my problem is water retention in my left leg, a side effect of my
          varicose vein problem years back. Once the wounds finish healing, I can
          expect to wear a special compression hose on that leg for the rest of my
          life. I saw what happens if I don't when I was getting physical therapy
          last Thursday: An older woman there was having her leg seen to. My leg
          requires a few square inches to have the dead skin scaped clear to promote
          healing. She has an area all around her ankle about 7" in diameter to be
          cleared off each time. Based on her cries it hurts like hell having that
          much skin scraped clean.

          Bet on it: I'm going to wear that stocking religiously!

          Happy labor day all.

          Sliding towards sunrise,
          Brian Jordan
        • Phil
          Interesting article Badger-kun. I like to think our men in women in uniform could be able to do what has to be done when the time comes, and admire the hell
          Message 4 of 4 , Sep 5 2:34 AM
            Interesting article Badger-kun. I like to think our men in women in uniform
            could be able to do what has to be done when the time comes, and admire the
            hell out of those who do. It's easy for us to talk about how noble it is to
            lay down your life to protect your country, but a whole nother story when
            you're the one being asked to do it. I guess that's one of the reasons I was
            never cut out for military life. I'd have a very difficult time if put in
            that situation. In those pilots shoes I don't know if I could do it.

            But you can be darn sure I'd consider those pilots heroes and definately in
            the running for the Metal of Honor.


            ---PHIL
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