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Re: Broke another blade

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  • Neil Fallon
    I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They told me that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round that it would no longer
    Message 1 of 28 , Feb 2, 2006
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      I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They told me
      that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round
      that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new wheel from
      Grizzly as well as a new shaft.

      I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that holds the
      gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I got the
      gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
      bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with no pin.
      Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot for a set
      screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the other
      wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
      straight. I'll post a progress report later.

      Neil

      --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Glenn and Bill,
      >
      > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of it. There
      > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look completely round
      > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel measures the
      > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft balancing shop
      > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel to them
      > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of balance. They
      > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
      >
      > Neil
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
      > >
      > > Neil,
      > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just excentric a
      > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem as long as you
      > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to back .. it
      > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be trying
      > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just went out and
      > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give or take
      > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout. I have
      > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the blade stand
      > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.
      > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal position when
      > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode? Trying to cut
      > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
      > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow allowing
      > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
      > > HTH
      > > Glenn
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > From: Neil Fallon
      > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
      > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
      > >
      > >
      > > Hi Glenn,
      > >
      > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off. The wheel still
      > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and checked the
      > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw without the
      > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the spindle. It
      > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I put the wheel
      > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to check the
      wheel
      > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was just cast
      > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that was of a little
      > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
      > >
      > >
      > > Neil
      > >
      > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > Neil,
      > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what makes it
      tic by
      > > the time you have it working well :)
      > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
      > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the blade. If it is
      > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can break blades.
      > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a history of
      problems with
      > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft.
      > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The back edge is only
      > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back side and really
      > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the tracking goes
      > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the blade.
      > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the teeth of the
      > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be removed on
      one side
      > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to chamfer the front
      > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the blade all the
      > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine running using a
      > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but I took
      care and
      > > had no incidents.
      > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6 compilation for
      > FAQs...
      > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
      > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have had my saw
      > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have replaced are a couple
      > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you, when I first
      > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement pieces
      "just in
      > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and shipping I
      > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I decided to
      just let
      > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
      > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
      followed by
      > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the "fiddly" part
      kills the
      > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of having the
      > > saw LOL.
      > > >
      > > > Glenn
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: Neil Fallon
      > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
      > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
      > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything seemed to be
      > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing teeth. I put
      another
      > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on the bottom
      > pulley. I
      > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the shoulder
      > of the
      > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I really had
      > to turn
      > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While checking to see
      > if the
      > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that the bottom
      > pulley
      > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never noticed this before.
      The
      > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running but cuts
      > fine.
      > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it warped some
      > how. Is
      > > > there anything I can check that would cause that pulley to
      wobble?
      > > >
      > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise like a piston
      > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone somewhere
      that is
      > > > related to both of these things?
      > > >
      > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of days.
      > The saw
      > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They can't win more than
      > 2 games
      > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days in a row.
      > > >
      > > > Neil
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting Hobby Hobby and craft supply
      > > > Craft hobby Hobbies and crafts
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
      > > >
      > > > a.. Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
      > > >
      > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > > > 4x6bandsaw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > > >
      > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
      Terms of
      > > Service.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
      > >
      > > a.. Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
      > >
      > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > > 4x6bandsaw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      > >
      > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      > Service.
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
      > >
      >
    • Neil Fallon
      ... Got the blade back on and it still isn t tracking correctly. Still jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it s just tinker time until I get it to stay
      Message 2 of 28 , Feb 2, 2006
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        --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
        >
        > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They told me
        > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round
        > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new wheel from
        > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
        >
        > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that holds the
        > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I got the
        > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
        > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with no pin.
        > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot for a set
        > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the other
        > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
        Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly. Still
        jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker time until
        I get it to stay on.

        Neil

        > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
        >
        > Neil
        >
        > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
        > >
        > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
        > >
        > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of it. There
        > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look completely round
        > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel measures the
        > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft balancing shop
        > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel to them
        > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of balance. They
        > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
        > >
        > > Neil

        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
        > > >
        > > > Neil,
        > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just excentric a
        > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem as long as you
        > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to back .. it
        > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be trying
        > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just went out and
        > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give or take
        > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout. I have
        > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the blade stand
        > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.
        > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal position when
        > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode? Trying to cut
        > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
        > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow allowing
        > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
        > > > HTH
        > > > Glenn
        > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > From: Neil Fallon
        > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
        > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
        > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Hi Glenn,
        > > >
        > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off. The wheel
        still
        > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and checked the
        > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw without the
        > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the spindle. It
        > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I put the
        wheel
        > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to check the
        > wheel
        > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
        just cast
        > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that was of a
        little
        > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Neil
        > > >
        > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > Neil,
        > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what makes it
        > tic by
        > > > the time you have it working well :)
        > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
        > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the blade. If
        it is
        > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can break
        blades.
        > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a history of
        > problems with
        > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft.
        > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The back edge is only
        > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back side and
        really
        > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the tracking goes
        > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the blade.
        > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the teeth of the
        > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be removed on
        > one side
        > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to chamfer the
        front
        > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the blade
        all the
        > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine running
        using a
        > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but I took
        > care and
        > > > had no incidents.
        > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6 compilation for
        > > FAQs...
        > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
        > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have had my saw
        > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have replaced are a
        couple
        > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you, when I
        first
        > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement pieces
        > "just in
        > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
        shipping I
        > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I decided to
        > just let
        > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
        > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
        > followed by
        > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the "fiddly" part
        > kills the
        > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
        having the
        > > > saw LOL.
        > > > >
        > > > > Glenn
        > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > From: Neil Fallon
        > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
        > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
        > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything seemed
        to be
        > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing teeth. I put
        > another
        > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on the bottom
        > > pulley. I
        > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the shoulder
        > > of the
        > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I really had
        > > to turn
        > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While checking to see
        > > if the
        > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that the bottom
        > > pulley
        > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never noticed this before.
        > The
        > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running but cuts
        > > fine.
        > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it warped some
        > > how. Is
        > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that pulley to
        > wobble?
        > > > >
        > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise like a
        piston
        > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone somewhere
        > that is
        > > > > related to both of these things?
        > > > >
        > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of days.
        > > The saw
        > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They can't win more than
        > > 2 games
        > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days in a row.
        > > > >
        > > > > Neil
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting Hobby Hobby and craft supply
        > > > > Craft hobby Hobbies and crafts
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
        > > > >
        > > > > a.. Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
        > > > >
        > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > > > 4x6bandsaw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > > > >
        > > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
        > Terms of
        > > > Service.
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > > > YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
        > > >
        > > > a.. Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
        > > >
        > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > > 4x6bandsaw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        > > >
        > > > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
        > > Service.
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        >
        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > > >
        > >
        >
      • Mike Klotz
        I ve been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the gear box and put washers between it
        Message 3 of 28 , Feb 2, 2006
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          I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the gear box and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a quick check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.  So I shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade onto the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do tomorrow.
           
          I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat spots.  I found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  Like I said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out. 
           
          Mike
           
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
          Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

          --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
          >
          > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They told me
          > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round
          > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new wheel from
          > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
          >
          > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that holds the
          > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I got the
          > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
          > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with no pin.
          > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot for a set
          > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the other
          > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
          Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.  Still
          jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker time until
          I get it to stay on.

          Neil

          > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
          >
          > Neil
          >
          > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
          > >
          > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of it.  There
          > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look completely round
          > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel measures the
          > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft balancing shop
          > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel to them
          > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of balance.  They
          > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
          > >
          > > Neil

          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Neil,
          > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just excentric a
          > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem as long as you
          > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to back .. it
          > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be trying
          > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just went out and
          > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give or take
          > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout.  I have
          > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the blade stand
          > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth. 
          > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal position when
          > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?  Trying to cut
          > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade. 
          > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow allowing
          > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
          > > > HTH
          > > > Glenn
          > > >   ----- Original Message -----
          > > >   From: Neil Fallon
          > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
          > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
          > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >   Hi Glenn,
          > > >
          > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.  The wheel
          still
          > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and checked the
          > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw without the
          > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the spindle.  It
          > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I put the
          wheel
          > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to check the
          > wheel
          > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
          just cast
          > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that was of a
          little
          > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >   Neil
          > > >
          > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
          > > >   >
          > > >   > Neil,
          > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what makes it
          > tic by
          > > >   the time you have it working well :)
          > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
          > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the blade.  If
          it is
          > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can break
          blades.
          > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a history of
          > problems with
          > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft. 
          > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The back edge is only
          > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back side and
          really
          > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the tracking goes
          > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the blade.
          > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the teeth of the
          > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be removed on
          > one side
          > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to chamfer the
          front
          > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the blade
          all the
          > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine running
          using a
          > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but I took
          > care and
          > > >   had no incidents. 
          > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6 compilation for
          > > FAQs...
          > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
          > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have had my saw
          > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have replaced are a
          couple
          > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you, when I
          first
          > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement pieces
          > "just in
          > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
          shipping I
          > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I decided to
          > just let
          > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then. 
          > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
          > followed by
          > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the "fiddly" part
          > kills the
          > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
          having the
          > > >   saw LOL.
          > > >   >
          > > >   > Glenn
          > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
          > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
          > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
          > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
          > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything seemed
          to be
          > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing teeth.  I put
          > another
          > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on the bottom
          > > pulley.  I
          > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the shoulder
          > > of the
          > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I really had
          > > to turn
          > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While checking to see
          > > if the
          > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that the bottom
          > > pulley
          > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never noticed this before.
          >  The
          > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running but cuts
          > > fine.
          > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it warped some
          > > how.  Is
          > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that pulley to
          > wobble?
          > > >   >
          > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise like a
          piston
          > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone somewhere
          > that is
          > > >   >   related to both of these things?
          > > >   >
          > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of days.
          > > The saw
          > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They can't win more than
          > > 2 games
          > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days in a row.
          > > >   >
          > > >   >   Neil
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >   SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting  Hobby  Hobby and craft supply 
          > > >   >         Craft hobby  Hobbies and crafts 
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > >   >
          > > > 
          > >
          >
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          > >
          >
          ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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          > > >     a..  Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
          > > >      
          > > >     b..  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
          > > >      4x6bandsaw-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
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          > > Service.
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          > > >
          > >
          >
          ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          > > >
          > >
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        • Neil Fallon
          Hi Mike, I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I don t have any room behind
          Message 4 of 28 , Feb 2, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            Hi Mike,

            I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
            running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I don't have
            any room behind it to put a shim in.

            Neil

            --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
            >
            > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
            tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the gear box
            and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
            the wheel.....no change. Then.....I noticed that the blade was
            jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
            too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel. So a quick
            check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
            were at an angle. They were driving the blade off the wheel. So I
            shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade onto
            the bottom wheel quite nicely. I may be too lazy to go pull the
            washers out from under the gear box :) Still more work to do tomorrow.
            >
            > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
            $4.25ea. Several of the originals had some really bad flat spots. I
            found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running. Like I
            said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
            >
            > Mike
            >
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: Neil Fallon
            > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
            > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
            > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
            >
            >
            > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
            > >
            > > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They told me
            > > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round
            > > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new wheel from
            > > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
            > >
            > > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that holds the
            > > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I got the
            > > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
            > > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with no pin.
            > > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot for a set
            > > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the
            other
            > > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
            > Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly. Still
            > jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker time until
            > I get it to stay on.
            >
            > Neil
            >
            > > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
            > >
            > > Neil
            > >
            > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
            > > >
            > > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of it. There
            > > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look completely round
            > > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
            measures the
            > > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft
            balancing shop
            > > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel to them
            > > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of balance. They
            > > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
            > > >
            > > > Neil
            >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
            > > > >
            > > > > Neil,
            > > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just excentric a
            > > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem as long
            as you
            > > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to
            back .. it
            > > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be
            trying
            > > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just went
            out and
            > > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give
            or take
            > > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout.
            I have
            > > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the
            blade stand
            > > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.
            > > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
            position when
            > > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode? Trying
            to cut
            > > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
            > > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow
            allowing
            > > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
            > > > > HTH
            > > > > Glenn
            > > > > ----- Original Message -----
            > > > > From: Neil Fallon
            > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
            > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
            > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > Hi Glenn,
            > > > >
            > > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off. The wheel
            > still
            > > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and
            checked the
            > > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw
            without the
            > > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
            spindle. It
            > > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I put the
            > wheel
            > > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to
            check the
            > > wheel
            > > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
            > just cast
            > > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that was of a
            > little
            > > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
            > > > >
            > > > >
            > > > > Neil
            > > > >
            > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
            <sleykin@c...> wrote:
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Neil,
            > > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what makes it
            > > tic by
            > > > > the time you have it working well :)
            > > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
            > > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the blade. If
            > it is
            > > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can break
            > blades.
            > > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a history of
            > > problems with
            > > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft.
            > > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The back edge
            is only
            > > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back side and
            > really
            > > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the
            tracking goes
            > > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the blade.
            > > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
            teeth of the
            > > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be removed on
            > > one side
            > > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to chamfer the
            > front
            > > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the blade
            > all the
            > > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine running
            > using a
            > > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but I took
            > > care and
            > > > > had no incidents.
            > > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
            compilation for
            > > > FAQs...
            > > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
            > > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
            had my saw
            > > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have replaced are a
            > couple
            > > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you, when I
            > first
            > > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement pieces
            > > "just in
            > > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
            > shipping I
            > > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I decided to
            > > just let
            > > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
            > > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
            > > followed by
            > > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the "fiddly" part
            > > kills the
            > > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
            > having the
            > > > > saw LOL.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Glenn
            > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
            > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
            > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
            > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
            > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything seemed
            > to be
            > > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing teeth. I put
            > > another
            > > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on the bottom
            > > > pulley. I
            > > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
            shoulder
            > > > of the
            > > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I
            really had
            > > > to turn
            > > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While checking
            to see
            > > > if the
            > > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
            the bottom
            > > > pulley
            > > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never noticed this
            before.
            > > The
            > > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running
            but cuts
            > > > fine.
            > > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it
            warped some
            > > > how. Is
            > > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that pulley to
            > > wobble?
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise like a
            > piston
            > > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone somewhere
            > > that is
            > > > > > related to both of these things?
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of
            days.
            > > > The saw
            > > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They can't win
            more than
            > > > 2 games
            > > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
            in a row.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > Neil
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting Hobby Hobby and craft
            supply
            > > > > > Craft hobby Hobbies and crafts
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > > >
            > > > >
            > > >
            > >
            >
            ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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            > > > > >
            > > > > > a.. Visit your group "4x6bandsaw" on the web.
            > > > > >
            > > > > > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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            > > > > >
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            > > > Service.
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            > Craft hobby Hobbies and crafts
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          • Mike Klotz
            Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight edge. If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can t think of any reason the blade would
            Message 5 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
            • 0 Attachment
              Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any reason the blade would try to come off. 
               
              I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out, then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand, you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
               
              I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy, but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations like this :(
               
              Mike
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
              Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

              Hi Mike,

              I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
              running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I don't have
              any room behind it to put a shim in.

              Neil

              --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
              >
              > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
              tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the gear box
              and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
              the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
              jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
              too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a quick
              check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
              were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.  So I
              shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade onto
              the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
              washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do tomorrow.
              >
              > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
              $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat spots.  I
              found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  Like I
              said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out. 
              >
              > Mike
              >
              >
              >   ----- Original Message -----
              >   From: Neil Fallon
              >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
              >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
              >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
              >
              >
              >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
              >   >
              >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They told me
              >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it round
              >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new wheel from
              >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
              >   >
              >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that holds the
              >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I got the
              >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
              >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with no pin.
              >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot for a set
              >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the
              other
              >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
              >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.  Still
              >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker time until
              >   I get it to stay on.
              >
              >   Neil
              >
              >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
              >   >
              >   > Neil
              >   >
              >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> wrote:
              >   > >
              >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
              >   > >
              >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of it.  There
              >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look completely round
              >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
              measures the
              >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
              balancing shop
              >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel to them
              >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of balance.  They
              >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
              >   > >
              >   > > Neil
              >
              >   > >
              >   > >
              >   > >
              >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N" <sleykin@c...> wrote:
              >   > > >
              >   > > > Neil,
              >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just excentric a
              >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem as long
              as you
              >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to
              back .. it
              >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be
              trying
              >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just went
              out and
              >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give
              or take
              >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout.
              I have
              >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the
              blade stand
              >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth. 
              >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
              position when
              >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?  Trying
              to cut
              >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade. 
              >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow
              allowing
              >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
              >   > > > HTH
              >   > > > Glenn
              >   > > >   ----- Original Message -----
              >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon
              >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
              >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
              >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
              >   > > >
              >   > > >
              >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
              >   > > >
              >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.  The wheel
              >   still
              >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and
              checked the
              >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw
              without the
              >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
              spindle.  It
              >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I put the
              >   wheel
              >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to
              check the
              >   > wheel
              >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
              >   just cast
              >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that was of a
              >   little
              >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
              >   > > >
              >   > > >
              >   > > >   Neil
              >   > > >
              >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
              <sleykin@c...> wrote:
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   > Neil,
              >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what makes it
              >   > tic by
              >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
              >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
              >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the blade.  If
              >   it is
              >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can break
              >   blades.
              >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a history of
              >   > problems with
              >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft. 
              >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The back edge
              is only
              >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back side and
              >   really
              >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
              tracking goes
              >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the blade.
              >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
              teeth of the
              >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be removed on
              >   > one side
              >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to chamfer the
              >   front
              >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the blade
              >   all the
              >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine running
              >   using a
              >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but I took
              >   > care and
              >   > > >   had no incidents. 
              >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
              compilation for
              >   > > FAQs...
              >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
              >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
              had my saw
              >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have replaced are a
              >   couple
              >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you, when I
              >   first
              >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement pieces
              >   > "just in
              >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
              >   shipping I
              >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I decided to
              >   > just let
              >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then. 
              >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
              >   > followed by
              >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the "fiddly" part
              >   > kills the
              >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
              >   having the
              >   > > >   saw LOL.
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   > Glenn
              >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
              >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
              >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
              >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
              >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything seemed
              >   to be
              >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing teeth.  I put
              >   > another
              >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on the bottom
              >   > > pulley.  I
              >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
              shoulder
              >   > > of the
              >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I
              really had
              >   > > to turn
              >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While checking
              to see
              >   > > if the
              >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
              the bottom
              >   > > pulley
              >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never noticed this
              before.
              >   >  The
              >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running
              but cuts
              >   > > fine.
              >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
              warped some
              >   > > how.  Is
              >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that pulley to
              >   > wobble?
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise like a
              >   piston
              >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone somewhere
              >   > that is
              >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of
              days.
              >   > > The saw
              >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They can't win
              more than
              >   > > 2 games
              >   > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
              in a row.
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >   Neil
              >   > > >   >
              >   > > >   >
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            • Neil Fallon
              Hi Mike, I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested. The blade still popped off. I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand and once
              Message 6 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
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                Hi Mike,

                I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested. The blade
                still popped off. I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                and once again it popped off.

                I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                plate draw block. The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                have some side to side slop. I'm not sure if this could be causing
                the problem. No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                on there is still side to side movement.

                Neil

                --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
                >
                > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                edge. If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                reason the blade would try to come off.
                >
                > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                the drive pulley by hand. If I turned it in the correct
                direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                is. If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                blade in and there was no "jumping". Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                >
                > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                like this :(
                >
                > Mike
                > ----- Original Message -----
                > From: Neil Fallon
                > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                >
                >
                > Hi Mike,
                >
                > I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                > running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I don't have
                > any room behind it to put a shim in.
                >
                > Neil
                >
                > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                > >
                > > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                > tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the gear box
                > and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
                > the wheel.....no change. Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                > jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
                > too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel. So a quick
                > check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                > were at an angle. They were driving the blade off the wheel. So I
                > shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade onto
                > the bottom wheel quite nicely. I may be too lazy to go pull the
                > washers out from under the gear box :) Still more work to do
                tomorrow.
                > >
                > > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
                > $4.25ea. Several of the originals had some really bad flat spots. I
                > found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running. Like I
                > said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
                > >
                > > Mike
                > >
                > >
                > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > From: Neil Fallon
                > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                > >
                > >
                > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                wrote:
                > > >
                > > > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They
                told me
                > > > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                round
                > > > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new
                wheel from
                > > > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                > > >
                > > > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                holds the
                > > > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I
                got the
                > > > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
                > > > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                no pin.
                > > > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                for a set
                > > > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the
                > other
                > > > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
                > > Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                Still
                > > jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker
                time until
                > > I get it to stay on.
                > >
                > > Neil
                > >
                > > > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
                > > >
                > > > Neil
                > > >
                > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                <fallon416@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                > > > >
                > > > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                it. There
                > > > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                completely round
                > > > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                > measures the
                > > > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft
                > balancing shop
                > > > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel to them
                > > > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                balance. They
                > > > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                > > > >
                > > > > Neil
                > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Neil,
                > > > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just
                excentric a
                > > > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem as long
                > as you
                > > > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to
                > back .. it
                > > > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be
                > trying
                > > > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just went
                > out and
                > > > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give
                > or take
                > > > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout.
                > I have
                > > > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the
                > blade stand
                > > > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.
                > > > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                > position when
                > > > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode? Trying
                > to cut
                > > > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
                > > > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow
                > allowing
                > > > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                > > > > > HTH
                > > > > > Glenn
                > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Hi Glenn,
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                The wheel
                > > still
                > > > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and
                > checked the
                > > > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw
                > without the
                > > > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                > spindle. It
                > > > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I
                put the
                > > wheel
                > > > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to
                > check the
                > > > wheel
                > > > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
                > > just cast
                > > > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                was of a
                > > little
                > > > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Neil
                > > > > >
                > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Neil,
                > > > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                makes it
                > > > tic by
                > > > > > the time you have it working well :)
                > > > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
                > > > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                blade. If
                > > it is
                > > > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                break
                > > blades.
                > > > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a history of
                > > > problems with
                > > > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft.
                > > > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The back edge
                > is only
                > > > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                side and
                > > really
                > > > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the
                > tracking goes
                > > > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                blade.
                > > > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                > teeth of the
                > > > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                removed on
                > > > one side
                > > > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to
                chamfer the
                > > front
                > > > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                blade
                > > all the
                > > > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine
                running
                > > using a
                > > > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                I took
                > > > care and
                > > > > > had no incidents.
                > > > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                > compilation for
                > > > > FAQs...
                > > > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                > > > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
                > had my saw
                > > > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                replaced are a
                > > couple
                > > > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you,
                when I
                > > first
                > > > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                pieces
                > > > "just in
                > > > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
                > > shipping I
                > > > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                decided to
                > > > just let
                > > > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
                > > > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
                > > > followed by
                > > > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                "fiddly" part
                > > > kills the
                > > > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
                > > having the
                > > > > > saw LOL.
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Glenn
                > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything
                seemed
                > > to be
                > > > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing
                teeth. I put
                > > > another
                > > > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                the bottom
                > > > > pulley. I
                > > > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
                > shoulder
                > > > > of the
                > > > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I
                > really had
                > > > > to turn
                > > > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While checking
                > to see
                > > > > if the
                > > > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
                > the bottom
                > > > > pulley
                > > > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never noticed this
                > before.
                > > > The
                > > > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running
                > but cuts
                > > > > fine.
                > > > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it
                > warped some
                > > > > how. Is
                > > > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that
                pulley to
                > > > wobble?
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                like a
                > > piston
                > > > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone
                somewhere
                > > > that is
                > > > > > > related to both of these things?
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of
                > days.
                > > > > The saw
                > > > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They can't win
                > more than
                > > > > 2 games
                > > > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
                > in a row.
                > > > > > >
                > > > > > > Neil
                > > > > > >
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              • Neil Fallon
                Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block. Still jumping off of the bottom wheel. If I relax the set screw a little for the tracking it jumps off
                Message 7 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
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                  Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block.

                  Still jumping off of the bottom wheel. If I relax the set screw a
                  little for the tracking it jumps off of the top wheel.

                  Tried another new blade just to rule out the blade and it's still
                  jumping off.

                  Put a flat piece of metal on edge across the wheels and a torpedo
                  level on top of it and the wheels are level on both sides.

                  Does anyone know if there is a starting point that the set screw
                  should be at for the trsacking? I started all of the way out and gave
                  it one complete rotation when adjusting it each time that I tried.

                  Neil



                  --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Mike,
                  >
                  > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested. The blade
                  > still popped off. I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                  > and once again it popped off.
                  >
                  > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                  > plate draw block. The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                  > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                  > have some side to side slop. I'm not sure if this could be causing
                  > the problem. No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                  > on there is still side to side movement.
                  >
                  > Neil
                  >
                  > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                  > edge. If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                  > reason the blade would try to come off.
                  > >
                  > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                  > the drive pulley by hand. If I turned it in the correct
                  > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                  > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                  > is. If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                  > blade in and there was no "jumping". Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                  > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                  > >
                  > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                  > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                  > like this :(
                  > >
                  > > Mike
                  > > ----- Original Message -----
                  > > From: Neil Fallon
                  > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                  > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Hi Mike,
                  > >
                  > > I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                  > > running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I don't
                  have
                  > > any room behind it to put a shim in.
                  > >
                  > > Neil
                  > >
                  > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                  > > tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the gear box
                  > > and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
                  > > the wheel.....no change. Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                  > > jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
                  > > too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel. So a quick
                  > > check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                  > > were at an angle. They were driving the blade off the wheel. So I
                  > > shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade
                  onto
                  > > the bottom wheel quite nicely. I may be too lazy to go pull the
                  > > washers out from under the gear box :) Still more work to do
                  > tomorrow.
                  > > >
                  > > > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
                  > > $4.25ea. Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                  spots. I
                  > > found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running. Like I
                  > > said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
                  > > >
                  > > > Mike
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > ----- Original Message -----
                  > > > From: Neil Fallon
                  > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                  > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                  > wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They
                  > told me
                  > > > > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                  > round
                  > > > > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new
                  > wheel from
                  > > > > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                  > holds the
                  > > > > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I
                  > got the
                  > > > > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                  with the
                  > > > > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                  > no pin.
                  > > > > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                  > for a set
                  > > > > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was
                  on the
                  > > other
                  > > > > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything
                  looks
                  > > > Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                  > Still
                  > > > jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker
                  > time until
                  > > > I get it to stay on.
                  > > >
                  > > > Neil
                  > > >
                  > > > > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Neil
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                  > <fallon416@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                  > it. There
                  > > > > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                  > completely round
                  > > > > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                  > > measures the
                  > > > > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft
                  > > balancing shop
                  > > > > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel
                  to them
                  > > > > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                  > balance. They
                  > > > > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Neil
                  > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                  > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Neil,
                  > > > > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just
                  > excentric a
                  > > > > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem as long
                  > > as you
                  > > > > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to
                  > > back .. it
                  > > > > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                  could be
                  > > trying
                  > > > > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just
                  went
                  > > out and
                  > > > > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020"
                  give
                  > > or take
                  > > > > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                  runout.
                  > > I have
                  > > > > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the
                  > > blade stand
                  > > > > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.
                  > > > > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                  > > position when
                  > > > > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                  Trying
                  > > to cut
                  > > > > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
                  > > > > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                  shallow
                  > > allowing
                  > > > > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                  > > > > > > HTH
                  > > > > > > Glenn
                  > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                  > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                  > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                  > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Hi Glenn,
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                  > The wheel
                  > > > still
                  > > > > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and
                  > > checked the
                  > > > > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw
                  > > without the
                  > > > > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                  > > spindle. It
                  > > > > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I
                  > put the
                  > > > wheel
                  > > > > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to
                  > > check the
                  > > > > wheel
                  > > > > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                  that was
                  > > > just cast
                  > > > > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                  > was of a
                  > > > little
                  > > > > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Neil
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                  > > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Neil,
                  > > > > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                  > makes it
                  > > > > tic by
                  > > > > > > the time you have it working well :)
                  > > > > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
                  > > > > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                  > blade. If
                  > > > it is
                  > > > > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                  > break
                  > > > blades.
                  > > > > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a history of
                  > > > > problems with
                  > > > > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                  shaft.
                  > > > > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The
                  back edge
                  > > is only
                  > > > > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                  > side and
                  > > > really
                  > > > > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the
                  > > tracking goes
                  > > > > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                  > blade.
                  > > > > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                  > > teeth of the
                  > > > > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                  > removed on
                  > > > > one side
                  > > > > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to
                  > chamfer the
                  > > > front
                  > > > > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                  > blade
                  > > > all the
                  > > > > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine
                  > running
                  > > > using a
                  > > > > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                  > I took
                  > > > > care and
                  > > > > > > had no incidents.
                  > > > > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                  > > compilation for
                  > > > > > FAQs...
                  > > > > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                  > > > > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
                  > > had my saw
                  > > > > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                  > replaced are a
                  > > > couple
                  > > > > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you,
                  > when I
                  > > > first
                  > > > > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                  > pieces
                  > > > > "just in
                  > > > > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                  parts and
                  > > > shipping I
                  > > > > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                  > decided to
                  > > > > just let
                  > > > > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
                  > > > > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                  period,
                  > > > > followed by
                  > > > > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                  > "fiddly" part
                  > > > > kills the
                  > > > > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                  "fun" of
                  > > > having the
                  > > > > > > saw LOL.
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Glenn
                  > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                  > > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                  > > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                  > > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything
                  > seemed
                  > > > to be
                  > > > > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing
                  > teeth. I put
                  > > > > another
                  > > > > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                  > the bottom
                  > > > > > pulley. I
                  > > > > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
                  > > shoulder
                  > > > > > of the
                  > > > > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I
                  > > really had
                  > > > > > to turn
                  > > > > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While
                  checking
                  > > to see
                  > > > > > if the
                  > > > > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
                  > > the bottom
                  > > > > > pulley
                  > > > > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never noticed this
                  > > before.
                  > > > > The
                  > > > > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                  running
                  > > but cuts
                  > > > > > fine.
                  > > > > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it
                  > > warped some
                  > > > > > how. Is
                  > > > > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that
                  > pulley to
                  > > > > wobble?
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                  > like a
                  > > > piston
                  > > > > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone
                  > somewhere
                  > > > > that is
                  > > > > > > > related to both of these things?
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                  couple of
                  > > days.
                  > > > > > The saw
                  > > > > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They can't win
                  > > more than
                  > > > > > 2 games
                  > > > > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
                  > > in a row.
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > > Neil
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > >
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                  craft
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                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
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                  > > > SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting Hobby Hobby and craft supply
                  > > > Craft hobby Hobbies and crafts
                  > > >
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                • Mike Klotz
                  Mine has that same play in the slot that it slides in. Are you loosening the center bolt, the one that goes into the center of the shaft?? If you don t
                  Message 8 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Mine has that same play in the slot that it slides in.  Are you loosening the center bolt, the one that goes into the center of the shaft??  If you don't loosen it at least some, the tracking bolt will not have any affect on it.  When I track the upper wheel, I have to loosen the center bolt slightly, then turn the tracking bolt to make it track in.  If I want it to go out, I loosen the tracking bolt a small amount, then tighten the center bolt.  Tensioning the blade will tighten things up enough that there will not be any wobble from the looseness of the slot.  I'd start with the checking the center bolt/tracking bolt, then start with tensioning it just enough to keep the blade on, track it again, then tension some more, if the blade starts to move off again, then stop tensioning and adj the tracking to the back again...then tension some more.  If you're tightening the tension as hard as you can (like they've been saying to do here) before you try to track it, chances are the tracking bolt is just not in far enough. 
                     
                    Mike
                    ----- Original Message -----
                    Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 9:52 AM
                    Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

                    Hi Mike,

                    I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested.  The blade
                    still popped off.  I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                    and once again it popped off.

                    I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                    plate draw block.  The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                    piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                    have some side to side slop.  I'm not sure if this could be causing
                    the problem.  No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                    on there is still side to side movement.

                    Neil

                    --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                    edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                    reason the blade would try to come off. 
                    >
                    > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                    the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct
                    direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                    then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                    is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                    blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                    you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                    >
                    > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                    but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                    like this :(
                    >
                    > Mike
                    >   ----- Original Message -----
                    >   From: Neil Fallon
                    >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                    >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                    >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                    >
                    >
                    >   Hi Mike,
                    >
                    >   I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                    >   running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I don't have
                    >   any room behind it to put a shim in.
                    >
                    >   Neil
                    >
                    >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                    >   >
                    >   > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                    >   tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the gear box
                    >   and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
                    >   the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                    >   jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
                    >   too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a quick
                    >   check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                    >   were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.  So I
                    >   shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade onto
                    >   the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
                    >   washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do
                    tomorrow.
                    >   >
                    >   > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
                    >   $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat spots.  I
                    >   found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  Like I
                    >   said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out. 
                    >   >
                    >   > Mike
                    >   >
                    >   >
                    >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                    >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                    >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                    >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                    >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                    >   >
                    >   >
                    >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                    wrote:
                    >   >   >
                    >   >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They
                    told me
                    >   >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                    round
                    >   >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new
                    wheel from
                    >   >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                    >   >   >
                    >   >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                    holds the
                    >   >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I
                    got the
                    >   >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft with the
                    >   >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                    no pin.
                    >   >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                    for a set
                    >   >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was on the
                    >   other
                    >   >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything looks
                    >   >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                    Still
                    >   >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker
                    time until
                    >   >   I get it to stay on.
                    >   >
                    >   >   Neil
                    >   >
                    >   >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
                    >   >   >
                    >   >   > Neil
                    >   >   >
                    >   >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                    <fallon416@> wrote:
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                    it.  There
                    >   >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                    completely round
                    >   >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                    >   measures the
                    >   >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
                    >   balancing shop
                    >   >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel to them
                    >   >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                    balance.  They
                    >   >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > > Neil
                    >   >
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > >
                    >   >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                    <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > > Neil,
                    >   >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just
                    excentric a
                    >   >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem as long
                    >   as you
                    >   >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to
                    >   back .. it
                    >   >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade could be
                    >   trying
                    >   >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just went
                    >   out and
                    >   >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020" give
                    >   or take
                    >   >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric runout.
                    >   I have
                    >   >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the
                    >   blade stand
                    >   >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth. 
                    >   >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                    >   position when
                    >   >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?  Trying
                    >   to cut
                    >   >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade. 
                    >   >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too shallow
                    >   allowing
                    >   >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                    >   >   > > > HTH
                    >   >   > > > Glenn
                    >   >   > > >   ----- Original Message -----
                    >   >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon
                    >   >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                    >   >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                    >   >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                    The wheel
                    >   >   still
                    >   >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and
                    >   checked the
                    >   >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw
                    >   without the
                    >   >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                    >   spindle.  It
                    >   >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I
                    put the
                    >   >   wheel
                    >   >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to
                    >   check the
                    >   >   > wheel
                    >   >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel that was
                    >   >   just cast
                    >   >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                    was of a
                    >   >   little
                    >   >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >   Neil
                    >   >   > > >
                    >   >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                    >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   > Neil,
                    >   >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                    makes it
                    >   >   > tic by
                    >   >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
                    >   >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
                    >   >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                    blade.  If
                    >   >   it is
                    >   >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                    break
                    >   >   blades.
                    >   >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a history of
                    >   >   > problems with
                    >   >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the shaft. 
                    >   >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The back edge
                    >   is only
                    >   >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                    side and
                    >   >   really
                    >   >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
                    >   tracking goes
                    >   >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                    blade.
                    >   >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                    >   teeth of the
                    >   >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                    removed on
                    >   >   > one side
                    >   >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to
                    chamfer the
                    >   >   front
                    >   >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                    blade
                    >   >   all the
                    >   >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine
                    running
                    >   >   using a
                    >   >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                    I took
                    >   >   > care and
                    >   >   > > >   had no incidents. 
                    >   >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                    >   compilation for
                    >   >   > > FAQs...
                    >   >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                    >   >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
                    >   had my saw
                    >   >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                    replaced are a
                    >   >   couple
                    >   >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you,
                    when I
                    >   >   first
                    >   >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                    pieces
                    >   >   > "just in
                    >   >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare parts and
                    >   >   shipping I
                    >   >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                    decided to
                    >   >   > just let
                    >   >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then. 
                    >   >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in period,
                    >   >   > followed by
                    >   >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                    "fiddly" part
                    >   >   > kills the
                    >   >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the "fun" of
                    >   >   having the
                    >   >   > > >   saw LOL.
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   > Glenn
                    >   >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                    >   >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                    >   >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                    >   >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                    >   >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything
                    seemed
                    >   >   to be
                    >   >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing
                    teeth.  I put
                    >   >   > another
                    >   >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                    the bottom
                    >   >   > > pulley.  I
                    >   >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
                    >   shoulder
                    >   >   > > of the
                    >   >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I
                    >   really had
                    >   >   > > to turn
                    >   >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While checking
                    >   to see
                    >   >   > > if the
                    >   >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
                    >   the bottom
                    >   >   > > pulley
                    >   >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never noticed this
                    >   before.
                    >   >   >  The
                    >   >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when running
                    >   but cuts
                    >   >   > > fine.
                    >   >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
                    >   warped some
                    >   >   > > how.  Is
                    >   >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that
                    pulley to
                    >   >   > wobble?
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                    like a
                    >   >   piston
                    >   >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone
                    somewhere
                    >   >   > that is
                    >   >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a couple of
                    >   days.
                    >   >   > > The saw
                    >   >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They can't win
                    >   more than
                    >   >   > > 2 games
                    >   >   > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
                    >   in a row.
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >   Neil
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >
                    >   >   > > >   >
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                    >   > 

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                  • Mike Klotz
                    My HF saw has a bolt for the tracking. Are the wheels on the same plane?? A straight edge long enough to span both of them should tell you pretty
                    Message 9 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                    • 0 Attachment
                      My HF saw has a bolt for the tracking.  Are the wheels on the same plane??  A straight edge long enough to span both of them should tell you pretty quickly....it will also show if they are parallel.  If the bottom wheel is in too far, it would probably let the blade walk right off. 
                      Mike
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:28 AM
                      Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

                      Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block.

                      Still jumping off of the bottom wheel.  If I relax the set screw a
                      little for the tracking it jumps off of the top wheel.

                      Tried another new blade just to rule out the blade and it's still
                      jumping off.

                      Put a flat piece of metal on edge across the wheels and a torpedo
                      level on top of it and the wheels are level on both sides.

                      Does anyone know if there is a starting point that the set screw
                      should be at for the trsacking?  I started all of the way out and gave
                      it one complete rotation when adjusting it each time that I tried.

                      Neil



                      --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi Mike,
                      >
                      > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested.  The blade
                      > still popped off.  I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                      > and once again it popped off.
                      >
                      > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                      > plate draw block.  The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                      > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                      > have some side to side slop.  I'm not sure if this could be causing
                      > the problem.  No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                      > on there is still side to side movement.
                      >
                      > Neil
                      >
                      > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                      > edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                      > reason the blade would try to come off. 
                      > >
                      > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                      > the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct
                      > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                      > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                      > is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                      > blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                      > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                      > >
                      > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                      > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                      > like this :(
                      > >
                      > > Mike
                      > >   ----- Original Message -----
                      > >   From: Neil Fallon
                      > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                      > >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                      > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >   Hi Mike,
                      > >
                      > >   I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                      > >   running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I don't
                      have
                      > >   any room behind it to put a shim in.
                      > >
                      > >   Neil
                      > >
                      > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                      > >   >
                      > >   > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                      > >   tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the gear box
                      > >   and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
                      > >   the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                      > >   jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
                      > >   too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a quick
                      > >   check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                      > >   were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.  So I
                      > >   shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade
                      onto
                      > >   the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
                      > >   washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do
                      > tomorrow.
                      > >   >
                      > >   > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
                      > >   $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                      spots.  I
                      > >   found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  Like I
                      > >   said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out. 
                      > >   >
                      > >   > Mike
                      > >   >
                      > >   >
                      > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                      > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                      > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                      > >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                      > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                      > >   >
                      > >   >
                      > >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                      > wrote:
                      > >   >   >
                      > >   >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They
                      > told me
                      > >   >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                      > round
                      > >   >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new
                      > wheel from
                      > >   >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                      > >   >   >
                      > >   >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                      > holds the
                      > >   >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I
                      > got the
                      > >   >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                      with the
                      > >   >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                      > no pin.
                      > >   >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                      > for a set
                      > >   >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was
                      on the
                      > >   other
                      > >   >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything
                      looks
                      > >   >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                      > Still
                      > >   >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker
                      > time until
                      > >   >   I get it to stay on.
                      > >   >
                      > >   >   Neil
                      > >   >
                      > >   >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
                      > >   >   >
                      > >   >   > Neil
                      > >   >   >
                      > >   >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                      > <fallon416@> wrote:
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                      > it.  There
                      > >   >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                      > completely round
                      > >   >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                      > >   measures the
                      > >   >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
                      > >   balancing shop
                      > >   >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel
                      to them
                      > >   >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                      > balance.  They
                      > >   >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > > Neil
                      > >   >
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > >
                      > >   >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                      > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > > Neil,
                      > >   >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just
                      > excentric a
                      > >   >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem as long
                      > >   as you
                      > >   >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to
                      > >   back .. it
                      > >   >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                      could be
                      > >   trying
                      > >   >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just
                      went
                      > >   out and
                      > >   >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020"
                      give
                      > >   or take
                      > >   >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                      runout.
                      > >   I have
                      > >   >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the
                      > >   blade stand
                      > >   >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth. 
                      > >   >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                      > >   position when
                      > >   >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                      Trying
                      > >   to cut
                      > >   >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade. 
                      > >   >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                      shallow
                      > >   allowing
                      > >   >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                      > >   >   > > > HTH
                      > >   >   > > > Glenn
                      > >   >   > > >   ----- Original Message -----
                      > >   >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon
                      > >   >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                      > >   >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                      > >   >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                      > The wheel
                      > >   >   still
                      > >   >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and
                      > >   checked the
                      > >   >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw
                      > >   without the
                      > >   >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                      > >   spindle.  It
                      > >   >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I
                      > put the
                      > >   >   wheel
                      > >   >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to
                      > >   check the
                      > >   >   > wheel
                      > >   >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                      that was
                      > >   >   just cast
                      > >   >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                      > was of a
                      > >   >   little
                      > >   >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >   Neil
                      > >   >   > > >
                      > >   >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                      > >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   > Neil,
                      > >   >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                      > makes it
                      > >   >   > tic by
                      > >   >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
                      > >   >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
                      > >   >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                      > blade.  If
                      > >   >   it is
                      > >   >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                      > break
                      > >   >   blades.
                      > >   >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a history of
                      > >   >   > problems with
                      > >   >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                      shaft. 
                      > >   >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The
                      back edge
                      > >   is only
                      > >   >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                      > side and
                      > >   >   really
                      > >   >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
                      > >   tracking goes
                      > >   >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                      > blade.
                      > >   >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                      > >   teeth of the
                      > >   >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                      > removed on
                      > >   >   > one side
                      > >   >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to
                      > chamfer the
                      > >   >   front
                      > >   >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                      > blade
                      > >   >   all the
                      > >   >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine
                      > running
                      > >   >   using a
                      > >   >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                      > I took
                      > >   >   > care and
                      > >   >   > > >   had no incidents. 
                      > >   >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                      > >   compilation for
                      > >   >   > > FAQs...
                      > >   >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                      > >   >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
                      > >   had my saw
                      > >   >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                      > replaced are a
                      > >   >   couple
                      > >   >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you,
                      > when I
                      > >   >   first
                      > >   >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                      > pieces
                      > >   >   > "just in
                      > >   >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                      parts and
                      > >   >   shipping I
                      > >   >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                      > decided to
                      > >   >   > just let
                      > >   >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then. 
                      > >   >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                      period,
                      > >   >   > followed by
                      > >   >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                      > "fiddly" part
                      > >   >   > kills the
                      > >   >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                      "fun" of
                      > >   >   having the
                      > >   >   > > >   saw LOL.
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   > Glenn
                      > >   >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                      > >   >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                      > >   >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                      > >   >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                      > >   >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything
                      > seemed
                      > >   >   to be
                      > >   >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing
                      > teeth.  I put
                      > >   >   > another
                      > >   >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                      > the bottom
                      > >   >   > > pulley.  I
                      > >   >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
                      > >   shoulder
                      > >   >   > > of the
                      > >   >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I
                      > >   really had
                      > >   >   > > to turn
                      > >   >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While
                      checking
                      > >   to see
                      > >   >   > > if the
                      > >   >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
                      > >   the bottom
                      > >   >   > > pulley
                      > >   >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never noticed this
                      > >   before.
                      > >   >   >  The
                      > >   >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                      running
                      > >   but cuts
                      > >   >   > > fine.
                      > >   >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
                      > >   warped some
                      > >   >   > > how.  Is
                      > >   >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that
                      > pulley to
                      > >   >   > wobble?
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                      > like a
                      > >   >   piston
                      > >   >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone
                      > somewhere
                      > >   >   > that is
                      > >   >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                      couple of
                      > >   days.
                      > >   >   > > The saw
                      > >   >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They can't win
                      > >   more than
                      > >   >   > > 2 games
                      > >   >   > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
                      > >   in a row.
                      > >   >   > > >   >
                      > >   >   > > >   >   Neil
                      > >   >   > > >   >
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                    • Art Clark
                      Mine is pretty sensitive to changes in the clearance on the guide rollers. If it s a little too loose it wants to wander out. I read somewhere to use cigarette
                      Message 10 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Mine is pretty sensitive to changes in the clearance on the guide rollers. If it's a little too loose it wants to wander out. I read somewhere to use cigarette paper to set the clearance.
                        Art

                        On Feb 3, 2006, at 12:01 PM, Mike Klotz wrote:

                        My HF saw has a bolt for the tracking.  Are the wheels on the same plane??  A straight edge long enough to span both of them should tell you pretty quickly....it will also show if they are parallel.  If the bottom wheel is in too far, it would probably let the blade walk right off. 
                        Mike
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:28 AM
                        Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

                        Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block.

                        Still jumping off of the bottom wheel.  If I relax the set screw a
                        little for the tracking it jumps off of the top wheel.

                        Tried another new blade just to rule out the blade and it's still
                        jumping off.

                        Put a flat piece of metal on edge across the wheels and a torpedo
                        level on top of it and the wheels are level on both sides.

                        Does anyone know if there is a starting point that the set screw
                        should be at for the trsacking?  I started all of the way out and gave
                        it one complete rotation when adjusting it each time that I tried.

                        Neil



                        --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi Mike,
                        > 
                        > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested.  The blade
                        > still popped off.  I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                        > and once again it popped off.
                        > 
                        > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                        > plate draw block.  The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                        > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                        > have some side to side slop.  I'm not sure if this could be causing
                        > the problem.  No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                        > on there is still side to side movement.
                        > 
                        > Neil
                        > 
                        > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                        > edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                        > reason the blade would try to come off.  
                        > > 
                        > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                        > the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct
                        > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                        > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                        > is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                        > blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                        > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                        > > 
                        > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                        > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                        > like this :(
                        > > 
                        > > Mike
                        > >   ----- Original Message ----- 
                        > >   From: Neil Fallon 
                        > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com 
                        > >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                        > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                        > > 
                        > > 
                        > >   Hi Mike,
                        > > 
                        > >   I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                        > >   running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I don't
                        have
                        > >   any room behind it to put a shim in.
                        > > 
                        > >   Neil
                        > > 
                        > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                        > >   >
                        > >   > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                        > >   tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the gear box
                        > >   and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would tilt
                        > >   the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                        > >   jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a slight bit
                        > >   too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a quick
                        > >   check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                        > >   were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.  So I
                        > >   shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade
                        onto
                        > >   the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
                        > >   washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do
                        > tomorrow.
                        > >   > 
                        > >   > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid bearings for
                        > >   $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                        spots.  I
                        > >   found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  Like I
                        > >   said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.  
                        > >   > 
                        > >   > Mike
                        > >   > 
                        > >   > 
                        > >   >   ----- Original Message ----- 
                        > >   >   From: Neil Fallon 
                        > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com 
                        > >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                        > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                        > >   > 
                        > >   > 
                        > >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                        > wrote:
                        > >   >   >
                        > >   >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They
                        > told me
                        > >   >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                        > round
                        > >   >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new
                        > wheel from
                        > >   >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                        > >   >   > 
                        > >   >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                        > holds the
                        > >   >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I
                        > got the
                        > >   >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                        with the
                        > >   >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                        > no pin. 
                        > >   >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                        > for a set
                        > >   >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was
                        on the
                        > >   other
                        > >   >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything
                        looks
                        > >   >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly. 
                        > Still
                        > >   >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker
                        > time until
                        > >   >   I get it to stay on.
                        > >   > 
                        > >   >   Neil
                        > >   > 
                        > >   >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
                        > >   >   > 
                        > >   >   > Neil
                        > >   >   > 
                        > >   >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                        > <fallon416@> wrote:
                        > >   >   > >
                        > >   >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                        > >   >   > > 
                        > >   >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                        > it.  There
                        > >   >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                        > completely round
                        > >   >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                        > >   measures the
                        > >   >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
                        > >   balancing shop
                        > >   >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel
                        to them
                        > >   >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                        > balance.  They
                        > >   >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                        > >   >   > > 
                        > >   >   > > Neil
                        > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > 
                        > >   >   > > 
                        > >   >   > > 
                        > >   >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                        > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                        > >   >   > > >
                        > >   >   > > > Neil,
                        > >   >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just
                        > excentric a
                        > >   >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem as long
                        > >   as you
                        > >   >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to
                        > >   back .. it
                        > >   >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                        could be
                        > >   trying
                        > >   >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just
                        went
                        > >   out and
                        > >   >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020"
                        give
                        > >   or take
                        > >   >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                        runout. 
                        > >   I have
                        > >   >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the
                        > >   blade stand
                        > >   >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the teeth.  
                        > >   >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                        > >   position when
                        > >   >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode? 
                        Trying
                        > >   to cut
                        > >   >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.  
                        > >   >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                        shallow
                        > >   allowing
                        > >   >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                        > >   >   > > > HTH
                        > >   >   > > > Glenn
                        > >   >   > > >   ----- Original Message ----- 
                        > >   >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon 
                        > >   >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com 
                        > >   >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                        > >   >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off. 
                        > The wheel
                        > >   >   still
                        > >   >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and
                        > >   checked the
                        > >   >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw
                        > >   without the
                        > >   >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                        > >   spindle.  It
                        > >   >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I
                        > put the
                        > >   >   wheel
                        > >   >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to
                        > >   check the
                        > >   >   > wheel
                        > >   >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                        that was
                        > >   >   just cast
                        > >   >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                        > was of a
                        > >   >   little
                        > >   >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > >   Neil
                        > >   >   > > > 
                        > >   >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                        > >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                        > >   >   > > >   >
                        > >   >   > > >   > Neil,
                        > >   >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                        > makes it
                        > >   >   > tic by
                        > >   >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
                        > >   >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
                        > >   >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                        > blade.  If
                        > >   >   it is
                        > >   >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                        > break
                        > >   >   blades.
                        > >   >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a history of
                        > >   >   > problems with
                        > >   >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                        shaft.  
                        > >   >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The
                        back edge
                        > >   is only
                        > >   >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                        > side and
                        > >   >   really
                        > >   >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
                        > >   tracking goes
                        > >   >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                        > blade.
                        > >   >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                        > >   teeth of the
                        > >   >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                        > removed on
                        > >   >   > one side
                        > >   >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to
                        > chamfer the
                        > >   >   front
                        > >   >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                        > blade
                        > >   >   all the
                        > >   >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine
                        > running
                        > >   >   using a
                        > >   >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                        > I took
                        > >   >   > care and
                        > >   >   > > >   had no incidents.  
                        > >   >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                        > >   compilation for
                        > >   >   > > FAQs...
                        > >   >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                        > >   >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I have
                        > >   had my saw
                        > >   >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                        > replaced are a
                        > >   >   couple
                        > >   >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you,
                        > when I
                        > >   >   first
                        > >   >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                        > pieces
                        > >   >   > "just in
                        > >   >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                        parts and
                        > >   >   shipping I
                        > >   >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                        > decided to
                        > >   >   > just let
                        > >   >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then.  
                        > >   >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                        period,
                        > >   >   > followed by
                        > >   >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                        > "fiddly" part
                        > >   >   > kills the
                        > >   >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                        "fun" of
                        > >   >   having the
                        > >   >   > > >   saw LOL.
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   > Glenn
                        > >   >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message ----- 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                        > >   >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything
                        > seemed
                        > >   >   to be
                        > >   >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing
                        > teeth.  I put
                        > >   >   > another
                        > >   >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                        > the bottom
                        > >   >   > > pulley.  I
                        > >   >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close to the
                        > >   shoulder
                        > >   >   > > of the
                        > >   >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I
                        > >   really had
                        > >   >   > > to turn
                        > >   >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While
                        checking
                        > >   to see
                        > >   >   > > if the
                        > >   >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed that
                        > >   the bottom
                        > >   >   > > pulley
                        > >   >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never noticed this
                        > >   before.
                        > >   >   >  The
                        > >   >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                        running
                        > >   but cuts
                        > >   >   > > fine. 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
                        > >   warped some
                        > >   >   > > how.  Is
                        > >   >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that
                        > pulley to
                        > >   >   > wobble?
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                        > like a
                        > >   >   piston
                        > >   >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone
                        > somewhere
                        > >   >   > that is
                        > >   >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                        couple of
                        > >   days. 
                        > >   >   > > The saw
                        > >   >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They can't win
                        > >   more than
                        > >   >   > > 2 games
                        > >   >   > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 2 days
                        > >   in a row.
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
                        > >   >   > > >   >   Neil
                        > >   >   > > >   > 
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                        > >   >  
                        > >  
                        >
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                      • Neil Fallon
                        Hi Mike, I was loosening the center bolt and then adjusting the set screw. Then tightening the blade tensioner. I ll have to try it without really crancking
                        Message 11 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Hi Mike,

                          I was loosening the center bolt and then adjusting the set screw.
                          Then tightening the blade tensioner. I'll have to try it without
                          really crancking down on the tensioner.

                          I had the 2 wheels on the same plane but when I adjust the set screw
                          in, the top wheel tilts up a little.

                          Neil

                          --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Mine has that same play in the slot that it slides in. Are you
                          loosening the center bolt, the one that goes into the center of the
                          shaft?? If you don't loosen it at least some, the tracking bolt will
                          not have any affect on it. When I track the upper wheel, I have to
                          loosen the center bolt slightly, then turn the tracking bolt to make
                          it track in. If I want it to go out, I loosen the tracking bolt a
                          small amount, then tighten the center bolt. Tensioning the blade will
                          tighten things up enough that there will not be any wobble from the
                          looseness of the slot. I'd start with the checking the center
                          bolt/tracking bolt, then start with tensioning it just enough to keep
                          the blade on, track it again, then tension some more, if the blade
                          starts to move off again, then stop tensioning and adj the tracking to
                          the back again...then tension some more. If you're tightening the
                          tension as hard as you can (like they've been saying to do here)
                          before you try to track it, chances are the tracking bolt is just not
                          in far enough.
                          >
                          > Mike
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: Neil Fallon
                          > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                          > Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 9:52 AM
                          > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi Mike,
                          >
                          > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested. The blade
                          > still popped off. I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                          > and once again it popped off.
                          >
                          > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                          > plate draw block. The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                          > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                          > have some side to side slop. I'm not sure if this could be causing
                          > the problem. No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                          > on there is still side to side movement.
                          >
                          > Neil
                          >
                          > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                          > edge. If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                          > reason the blade would try to come off.
                          > >
                          > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                          > the drive pulley by hand. If I turned it in the correct
                          > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                          > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                          > is. If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                          > blade in and there was no "jumping". Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                          > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                          > >
                          > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                          > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                          > like this :(
                          > >
                          > > Mike
                          > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > From: Neil Fallon
                          > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                          > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                          > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Hi Mike,
                          > >
                          > > I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                          > > running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I
                          don't have
                          > > any room behind it to put a shim in.
                          > >
                          > > Neil
                          > >
                          > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                          > > tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the
                          gear box
                          > > and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would
                          tilt
                          > > the wheel.....no change. Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                          > > jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a
                          slight bit
                          > > too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel. So a
                          quick
                          > > check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                          > > were at an angle. They were driving the blade off the wheel.
                          So I
                          > > shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the
                          blade onto
                          > > the bottom wheel quite nicely. I may be too lazy to go pull the
                          > > washers out from under the gear box :) Still more work to do
                          > tomorrow.
                          > > >
                          > > > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid
                          bearings for
                          > > $4.25ea. Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                          spots. I
                          > > found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.
                          Like I
                          > > said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
                          > > >
                          > > > Mike
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > > From: Neil Fallon
                          > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                          > > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                          > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                          > wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They
                          > told me
                          > > > > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                          > round
                          > > > > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new
                          > wheel from
                          > > > > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                          > holds the
                          > > > > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out. Well I
                          > got the
                          > > > > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                          with the
                          > > > > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                          > no pin.
                          > > > > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                          > for a set
                          > > > > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what
                          was on the
                          > > other
                          > > > > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and
                          everything looks
                          > > > Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                          > Still
                          > > > jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker
                          > time until
                          > > > I get it to stay on.
                          > > >
                          > > > Neil
                          > > >
                          > > > > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
                          > > > >
                          > > > > Neil
                          > > > >
                          > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                          > <fallon416@> wrote:
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                          > it. There
                          > > > > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                          > completely round
                          > > > > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                          > > measures the
                          > > > > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft
                          > > balancing shop
                          > > > > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel
                          to them
                          > > > > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                          > balance. They
                          > > > > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > Neil
                          > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                          > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Neil,
                          > > > > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just
                          > excentric a
                          > > > > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem
                          as long
                          > > as you
                          > > > > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is front to
                          > > back .. it
                          > > > > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                          could be
                          > > trying
                          > > > > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I
                          just went
                          > > out and
                          > > > > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has
                          .020" give
                          > > or take
                          > > > > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                          runout.
                          > > I have
                          > > > > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth on the
                          > > blade stand
                          > > > > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the
                          teeth.
                          > > > > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                          > > position when
                          > > > > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                          Trying
                          > > to cut
                          > > > > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
                          > > > > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                          shallow
                          > > allowing
                          > > > > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                          > > > > > > HTH
                          > > > > > > Glenn
                          > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                          > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                          > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                          > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Hi Glenn,
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                          > The wheel
                          > > > still
                          > > > > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off and
                          > > checked the
                          > > > > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the saw
                          > > without the
                          > > > > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                          > > spindle. It
                          > > > > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend. I
                          > put the
                          > > > wheel
                          > > > > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure how to
                          > > check the
                          > > > > wheel
                          > > > > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                          that was
                          > > > just cast
                          > > > > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                          > was of a
                          > > > little
                          > > > > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Neil
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                          > > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Neil,
                          > > > > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                          > makes it
                          > > > > tic by
                          > > > > > > the time you have it working well :)
                          > > > > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
                          > > > > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                          > blade. If
                          > > > it is
                          > > > > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                          > break
                          > > > blades.
                          > > > > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a
                          history of
                          > > > > problems with
                          > > > > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                          shaft.
                          > > > > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The
                          back edge
                          > > is only
                          > > > > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                          > side and
                          > > > really
                          > > > > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the
                          > > tracking goes
                          > > > > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                          > blade.
                          > > > > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                          > > teeth of the
                          > > > > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                          > removed on
                          > > > > one side
                          > > > > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to
                          > chamfer the
                          > > > front
                          > > > > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                          > blade
                          > > > all the
                          > > > > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine
                          > running
                          > > > using a
                          > > > > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                          > I took
                          > > > > care and
                          > > > > > > had no incidents.
                          > > > > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                          > > compilation for
                          > > > > > FAQs...
                          > > > > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                          > > > > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I
                          have
                          > > had my saw
                          > > > > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                          > replaced are a
                          > > > couple
                          > > > > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like you,
                          > when I
                          > > > first
                          > > > > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                          > pieces
                          > > > > "just in
                          > > > > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                          parts and
                          > > > shipping I
                          > > > > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                          > decided to
                          > > > > just let
                          > > > > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
                          > > > > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                          period,
                          > > > > followed by
                          > > > > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                          > "fiddly" part
                          > > > > kills the
                          > > > > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                          "fun" of
                          > > > having the
                          > > > > > > saw LOL.
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Glenn
                          > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                          > > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                          > > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                          > > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                          > > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight. Everything
                          > seemed
                          > > > to be
                          > > > > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing
                          > teeth. I put
                          > > > > another
                          > > > > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                          > the bottom
                          > > > > > pulley. I
                          > > > > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close
                          to the
                          > > shoulder
                          > > > > > of the
                          > > > > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems that I
                          > > really had
                          > > > > > to turn
                          > > > > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While
                          checking
                          > > to see
                          > > > > > if the
                          > > > > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I noticed
                          that
                          > > the bottom
                          > > > > > pulley
                          > > > > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never
                          noticed this
                          > > before.
                          > > > > The
                          > > > > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                          running
                          > > but cuts
                          > > > > > fine.
                          > > > > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it
                          > > warped some
                          > > > > > how. Is
                          > > > > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that
                          > pulley to
                          > > > > wobble?
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                          > like a
                          > > > piston
                          > > > > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone
                          > somewhere
                          > > > > that is
                          > > > > > > > related to both of these things?
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                          couple of
                          > > days.
                          > > > > > The saw
                          > > > > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They
                          can't win
                          > > more than
                          > > > > > 2 games
                          > > > > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than
                          2 days
                          > > in a row.
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Neil
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > SPONSORED LINKS Metal cutting Hobby Hobby
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                        • Neil Fallon
                          Hi Art, Are you talking the side to side on the guide rollers? The Delta manual that is in the file section says to actually remove the guides while doing the
                          Message 12 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Hi Art,

                            Are you talking the side to side on the guide rollers? The Delta
                            manual that is in the file section says to actually remove the guides
                            while doing the intial tracking setup.

                            Neil

                            --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, Art Clark <clarkaw@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Mine is pretty sensitive to changes in the clearance on the guide
                            > rollers. If it's a little too loose it wants to wander out. I read
                            > somewhere to use cigarette paper to set the clearance.
                            > Art
                            >
                            > On Feb 3, 2006, at 12:01 PM, Mike Klotz wrote:
                            >
                            > > My HF saw has a bolt for the tracking. Are the wheels on the same
                            > > plane?? A straight edge long enough to span both of them should
                            > > tell you pretty quickly....it will also show if they are parallel.
                            > > If the bottom wheel is in too far, it would probably let the blade
                            > > walk right off.
                            > > Mike
                            > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > From: Neil Fallon
                            > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                            > > Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:28 AM
                            > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                            > >
                            > > Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block.
                            > >
                            > > Still jumping off of the bottom wheel. If I relax the set screw a
                            > > little for the tracking it jumps off of the top wheel.
                            > >
                            > > Tried another new blade just to rule out the blade and it's still
                            > > jumping off.
                            > >
                            > > Put a flat piece of metal on edge across the wheels and a torpedo
                            > > level on top of it and the wheels are level on both sides.
                            > >
                            > > Does anyone know if there is a starting point that the set screw
                            > > should be at for the trsacking? I started all of the way out and gave
                            > > it one complete rotation when adjusting it each time that I tried.
                            > >
                            > > Neil
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                            > > wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Hi Mike,
                            > > >
                            > > > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested. The
                            > > blade
                            > > > still popped off. I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                            > > > and once again it popped off.
                            > > >
                            > > > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                            > > > plate draw block. The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                            > > > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and
                            > > appears to
                            > > > have some side to side slop. I'm not sure if this could be causing
                            > > > the problem. No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the
                            > > plate
                            > > > on there is still side to side movement.
                            > > >
                            > > > Neil
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long
                            > > straight
                            > > > edge. If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                            > > > reason the blade would try to come off.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                            > > > the drive pulley by hand. If I turned it in the correct
                            > > > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                            > > > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings,
                            > > that
                            > > > is. If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                            > > > blade in and there was no "jumping". Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                            > > > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                            > > > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                            > > > like this :(
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Mike
                            > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                            > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                            > > > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                            > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Hi Mike,
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                            > > > > running it. The blade still jumped. With the new wheel I don't
                            > > have
                            > > > > any room behind it to put a shim in.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Neil
                            > > > >
                            > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@>
                            > > wrote:
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble
                            > > with
                            > > > > tracking the blade on the bottom wheel. I even removed the
                            > > gear box
                            > > > > and put washers between it and the main frame so that it
                            > > would tilt
                            > > > > the wheel.....no change. Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                            > > > > jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a
                            > > slight bit
                            > > > > too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel. So
                            > > a quick
                            > > > > check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the
                            > > bearings
                            > > > > were at an angle. They were driving the blade off the
                            > > wheel. So I
                            > > > > shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade
                            > > onto
                            > > > > the bottom wheel quite nicely. I may be too lazy to go pull the
                            > > > > washers out from under the gear box :) Still more work to do
                            > > > tomorrow.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid
                            > > bearings for
                            > > > > $4.25ea. Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                            > > spots. I
                            > > > > found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.
                            > > Like I
                            > > > > said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Mike
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                            > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                            > > > > > Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                            > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                            > > <fallon416@>
                            > > > wrote:
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place. They
                            > > > told me
                            > > > > > > that the center hole was out of round and if they
                            > > drilled it
                            > > > round
                            > > > > > > that it would no longer fit the shaft. I ordered a new
                            > > > wheel from
                            > > > > > > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                            > > > holds the
                            > > > > > > gear onto the shaft. I couldn't knock the pin out.
                            > > Well I
                            > > > got the
                            > > > > > > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                            > > with the
                            > > > > > > bearing. The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key
                            > > with
                            > > > no pin.
                            > > > > > > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                            > > > for a set
                            > > > > > > screw. The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was
                            > > on the
                            > > > > other
                            > > > > > > wheel. I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything
                            > > looks
                            > > > > > Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                            > > > Still
                            > > > > > jumping off of the bottom wheel. I guess it's just tinker
                            > > > time until
                            > > > > > I get it to stay on.
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > Neil
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > > straight. I'll post a progress report later.
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > Neil
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                            > > > <fallon416@> wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                            > > > it. There
                            > > > > > > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                            > > > completely round
                            > > > > > > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                            > > > > measures the
                            > > > > > > > exact same all the way around. There is a drive shaft
                            > > > > balancing shop
                            > > > > > > > a couple of blocks from my house. I'll take the wheel
                            > > to them
                            > > > > > > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                            > > > balance. They
                            > > > > > > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Neil
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                            > > > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > Neil,
                            > > > > > > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s? If it is just
                            > > > excentric a
                            > > > > > > > small amount (.01" or less) it should be no problem
                            > > as long
                            > > > > as you
                            > > > > > > > tension the blade with the saw running. If it is
                            > > front to
                            > > > > back .. it
                            > > > > > > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                            > > could be
                            > > > > trying
                            > > > > > > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel. I just
                            > > went
                            > > > > out and
                            > > > > > > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020"
                            > > give
                            > > > > or take
                            > > > > > > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                            > > runout.
                            > > > > I have
                            > > > > > > > never broken a blade in my recollection. The teeth
                            > > on the
                            > > > > blade stand
                            > > > > > > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the
                            > > teeth.
                            > > > > > > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                            > > > > position when
                            > > > > > > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                            > > Trying
                            > > > > to cut
                            > > > > > > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
                            > > > > > > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                            > > shallow
                            > > > > allowing
                            > > > > > > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                            > > > > > > > > HTH
                            > > > > > > > > Glenn
                            > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                            > > > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                            > > > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                            > > > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > Hi Glenn,
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                            > > > The wheel
                            > > > > > still
                            > > > > > > > > wobbled with the blade off. I took the wheel off
                            > > and
                            > > > > checked the
                            > > > > > > > > spindle to see if maybe it was bent. Running the
                            > > saw
                            > > > > without the
                            > > > > > > > > wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                            > > > > spindle. It
                            > > > > > > > > appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a
                            > > bend. I
                            > > > put the
                            > > > > > wheel
                            > > > > > > > > back on and the wobble returned. I'm not sure
                            > > how to
                            > > > > check the
                            > > > > > > wheel
                            > > > > > > > > itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                            > > that was
                            > > > > > just cast
                            > > > > > > > > wrong. I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                            > > > was of a
                            > > > > > little
                            > > > > > > > > better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > Neil
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                            > > > > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Neil,
                            > > > > > > > > > At least with the saw you bought you will know
                            > > what
                            > > > makes it
                            > > > > > > tic by
                            > > > > > > > > the time you have it working well :)
                            > > > > > > > > > Start checking things with the blade off.
                            > > > > > > > > > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                            > > > blade. If
                            > > > > > it is
                            > > > > > > > > loose the blade tracking will change randomly and
                            > > can
                            > > > break
                            > > > > > blades.
                            > > > > > > > > > Next check the blade idler wheel. It has a
                            > > history of
                            > > > > > > problems with
                            > > > > > > > > the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                            > > shaft.
                            > > > > > > > > > Then look carefully at your blade wheels. The
                            > > back edge
                            > > > > is only
                            > > > > > > > > intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                            > > > side and
                            > > > > > really
                            > > > > > > > > shouldn't have the blade running against it. If the
                            > > > > tracking goes
                            > > > > > > > > wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap
                            > > the
                            > > > blade.
                            > > > > > > > > > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge
                            > > the
                            > > > > teeth of the
                            > > > > > > > > blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                            > > > removed on
                            > > > > > > one side
                            > > > > > > > > causing the blade to cut taper. I used a file to
                            > > > chamfer the
                            > > > > > front
                            > > > > > > > > edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with
                            > > the
                            > > > blade
                            > > > > > all the
                            > > > > > > > > way back. I did this with the blade on and machine
                            > > > running
                            > > > > > using a
                            > > > > > > > > hand file. Probably not a real safe way to do it
                            > > but
                            > > > I took
                            > > > > > > care and
                            > > > > > > > > had no incidents.
                            > > > > > > > > > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                            > > > > compilation for
                            > > > > > > > FAQs...
                            > > > > > > > > > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                            > > > > > > > > > As to all the parts you are planning to buy ..
                            > > I have
                            > > > > had my saw
                            > > > > > > > > over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                            > > > replaced are a
                            > > > > > couple
                            > > > > > > > > of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap. Like
                            > > you,
                            > > > when I
                            > > > > > first
                            > > > > > > > > got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of
                            > > replacement
                            > > > pieces
                            > > > > > > "just in
                            > > > > > > > > case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                            > > parts and
                            > > > > > shipping I
                            > > > > > > > > wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                            > > > decided to
                            > > > > > > just let
                            > > > > > > > > it run till it broke and replace things then.
                            > > > > > > > > > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                            > > period,
                            > > > > > > followed by
                            > > > > > > > > years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                            > > > "fiddly" part
                            > > > > > > kills the
                            > > > > > > > > joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                            > > "fun" of
                            > > > > > having the
                            > > > > > > > > saw LOL.
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Glenn
                            > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
                            > > > > > > > > > From: Neil Fallon
                            > > > > > > > > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                            > > > > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                            > > > > > > > > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > I broke one of the new blades tonight.
                            > > Everything
                            > > > seemed
                            > > > > > to be
                            > > > > > > > > > working fine and then just snap. No missing
                            > > > teeth. I put
                            > > > > > > another
                            > > > > > > > > > blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                            > > > the bottom
                            > > > > > > > pulley. I
                            > > > > > > > > > adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close
                            > > to the
                            > > > > shoulder
                            > > > > > > > of the
                            > > > > > > > > > pulley as the manual says to do. It seems
                            > > that I
                            > > > > really had
                            > > > > > > > to turn
                            > > > > > > > > > in the hex screw further than normal. While
                            > > checking
                            > > > > to see
                            > > > > > > > if the
                            > > > > > > > > > blade was staying against the pulley I
                            > > noticed that
                            > > > > the bottom
                            > > > > > > > pulley
                            > > > > > > > > > seems to wobble a little. I have never
                            > > noticed this
                            > > > > before.
                            > > > > > > The
                            > > > > > > > > > blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                            > > running
                            > > > > but cuts
                            > > > > > > > fine.
                            > > > > > > > > > The bottom pulley is cast iron. I doubt that it
                            > > > > warped some
                            > > > > > > > how. Is
                            > > > > > > > > > there anything I can check that would cause that
                            > > > pulley to
                            > > > > > > wobble?
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a
                            > > noise
                            > > > like a
                            > > > > > piston
                            > > > > > > > > > slapping in an engine. Could a bearing be gone
                            > > > somewhere
                            > > > > > > that is
                            > > > > > > > > > related to both of these things?
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                            > > couple of
                            > > > > days.
                            > > > > > > > The saw
                            > > > > > > > > > seems to be like the Boston Bruins. They
                            > > can't win
                            > > > > more than
                            > > > > > > > 2 games
                            > > > > > > > > > in a row and the saw can't work for more than
                            > > 2 days
                            > > > > in a row.
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Neil
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                          • Mike Klotz
                            I just got done putting mine back together. I was able to take the washer out from between the gearbox and main frame and it still tracked okay. The cast
                            Message 13 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                            • 0 Attachment
                              I just got done putting mine back together.  I was able to take the washer out from between the gearbox and main frame and it still tracked okay.  The cast aluminum piece that holds the lower guide bearings is a poor casting.  It's not square.  That's why the bearings were at an angle.  I took it apart and took a flat file to it to get the bearings where I wanted them.  Didn't was to try to bend or heat it....cast aluminum...pretty easy to break. 
                               
                              I tried a cut with the tension reduced some....boy did it cut wrong on the vertical axis.  When the piece released at the end of the cut and the blade stopped, there was at least a 1/16" gap between the parent metal and the blade.  Upped the tension and put in a thicker piece....I'm running a 8-10 bimetal so maybe there just wasn't enought metal engaging the teeth?  Second cut on the thicker metal cut right on. 
                               
                              Sorry......I'm out of ideas for you.....good luck!!!  I'm curious about what you find. 
                              Mike
                               
                               
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 2:46 PM
                              Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade

                              Hi Mike,

                              I was loosening the center bolt and then adjusting the set screw.
                              Then tightening the blade tensioner.  I'll have to try it without
                              really crancking down on the tensioner.

                              I had the 2 wheels on the same plane but when I adjust the set screw
                              in, the top wheel tilts up a little.

                              Neil

                              --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Mine has that same play in the slot that it slides in.  Are you
                              loosening the center bolt, the one that goes into the center of the
                              shaft??  If you don't loosen it at least some, the tracking bolt will
                              not have any affect on it.  When I track the upper wheel, I have to
                              loosen the center bolt slightly, then turn the tracking bolt to make
                              it track in.  If I want it to go out, I loosen the tracking bolt a
                              small amount, then tighten the center bolt.  Tensioning the blade will
                              tighten things up enough that there will not be any wobble from the
                              looseness of the slot.  I'd start with the checking the center
                              bolt/tracking bolt, then start with tensioning it just enough to keep
                              the blade on, track it again, then tension some more, if the blade
                              starts to move off again, then stop tensioning and adj the tracking to
                              the back again...then tension some more.  If you're tightening the
                              tension as hard as you can (like they've been saying to do here)
                              before you try to track it, chances are the tracking bolt is just not
                              in far enough. 
                              >
                              > Mike
                              >   ----- Original Message -----
                              >   From: Neil Fallon
                              >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                              >   Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 9:52 AM
                              >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                              >
                              >
                              >   Hi Mike,
                              >
                              >   I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested.  The blade
                              >   still popped off.  I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                              >   and once again it popped off.
                              >
                              >   I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                              >   plate draw block.  The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                              >   piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and appears to
                              >   have some side to side slop.  I'm not sure if this could be causing
                              >   the problem.  No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the plate
                              >   on there is still side to side movement.
                              >
                              >   Neil
                              >
                              >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                              >   >
                              >   > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long straight
                              >   edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                              >   reason the blade would try to come off. 
                              >   >
                              >   > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                              >   the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct
                              >   direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                              >   then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, that
                              >   is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                              >   blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                              >   you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                              >   >
                              >   > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                              >   but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                              >   like this :(
                              >   >
                              >   > Mike
                              >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                              >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                              >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                              >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                              >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                              >   >
                              >   >
                              >   >   Hi Mike,
                              >   >
                              >   >   I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                              >   >   running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I
                              don't have
                              >   >   any room behind it to put a shim in.
                              >   >
                              >   >   Neil
                              >   >
                              >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble with
                              >   >   tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the
                              gear box
                              >   >   and put washers between it and the main frame so that it would
                              tilt
                              >   >   the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                              >   >   jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a
                              slight bit
                              >   >   too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So a
                              quick
                              >   >   check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the bearings
                              >   >   were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the wheel.
                              So I
                              >   >   shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the
                              blade onto
                              >   >   the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
                              >   >   washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do
                              >   tomorrow.
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid
                              bearings for
                              >   >   $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                              spots.  I
                              >   >   found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.
                              Like I
                              >   >   said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out. 
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   > Mike
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                              >   >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                              >   >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                              >   >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                              >   >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@>
                              >   wrote:
                              >   >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They
                              >   told me
                              >   >   >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they drilled it
                              >   round
                              >   >   >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new
                              >   wheel from
                              >   >   >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                              >   >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                              >   holds the
                              >   >   >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  Well I
                              >   got the
                              >   >   >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                              with the
                              >   >   >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key with
                              >   no pin.
                              >   >   >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                              >   for a set
                              >   >   >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what
                              was on the
                              >   >   other
                              >   >   >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and
                              everything looks
                              >   >   >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                              >   Still
                              >   >   >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker
                              >   time until
                              >   >   >   I get it to stay on.
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >   Neil
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
                              >   >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > Neil
                              >   >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                              >   <fallon416@> wrote:
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                              >   it.  There
                              >   >   >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                              >   completely round
                              >   >   >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                              >   >   measures the
                              >   >   >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
                              >   >   balancing shop
                              >   >   >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel
                              to them
                              >   >   >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                              >   balance.  They
                              >   >   >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > > Neil
                              >   >   >
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > >
                              >   >   >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                              >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > > Neil,
                              >   >   >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just
                              >   excentric a
                              >   >   >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem
                              as long
                              >   >   as you
                              >   >   >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is front to
                              >   >   back .. it
                              >   >   >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                              could be
                              >   >   trying
                              >   >   >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I
                              just went
                              >   >   out and
                              >   >   >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has
                              .020" give
                              >   >   or take
                              >   >   >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                              runout.
                              >   >   I have
                              >   >   >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth on the
                              >   >   blade stand
                              >   >   >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the
                              teeth. 
                              >   >   >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                              >   >   position when
                              >   >   >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                              Trying
                              >   >   to cut
                              >   >   >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade. 
                              >   >   >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                              shallow
                              >   >   allowing
                              >   >   >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                              >   >   >   > > > HTH
                              >   >   >   > > > Glenn
                              >   >   >   > > >   ----- Original Message -----
                              >   >   >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon
                              >   >   >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                              >   >   >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                              >   >   >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                              >   The wheel
                              >   >   >   still
                              >   >   >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off and
                              >   >   checked the
                              >   >   >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the saw
                              >   >   without the
                              >   >   >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                              >   >   spindle.  It
                              >   >   >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a bend.  I
                              >   put the
                              >   >   >   wheel
                              >   >   >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure how to
                              >   >   check the
                              >   >   >   > wheel
                              >   >   >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                              that was
                              >   >   >   just cast
                              >   >   >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                              >   was of a
                              >   >   >   little
                              >   >   >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >   Neil
                              >   >   >   > > >
                              >   >   >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                              >   >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Neil,
                              >   >   >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know what
                              >   makes it
                              >   >   >   > tic by
                              >   >   >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
                              >   >   >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                              >   blade.  If
                              >   >   >   it is
                              >   >   >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and can
                              >   break
                              >   >   >   blades.
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a
                              history of
                              >   >   >   > problems with
                              >   >   >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                              shaft. 
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The
                              back edge
                              >   >   is only
                              >   >   >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                              >   side and
                              >   >   >   really
                              >   >   >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
                              >   >   tracking goes
                              >   >   >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap the
                              >   blade.
                              >   >   >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge the
                              >   >   teeth of the
                              >   >   >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                              >   removed on
                              >   >   >   > one side
                              >   >   >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to
                              >   chamfer the
                              >   >   >   front
                              >   >   >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with the
                              >   blade
                              >   >   >   all the
                              >   >   >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine
                              >   running
                              >   >   >   using a
                              >   >   >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it but
                              >   I took
                              >   >   >   > care and
                              >   >   >   > > >   had no incidents. 
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                              >   >   compilation for
                              >   >   >   > > FAQs...
                              >   >   >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                              >   >   >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. I
                              have
                              >   >   had my saw
                              >   >   >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                              >   replaced are a
                              >   >   >   couple
                              >   >   >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like you,
                              >   when I
                              >   >   >   first
                              >   >   >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of replacement
                              >   pieces
                              >   >   >   > "just in
                              >   >   >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                              parts and
                              >   >   >   shipping I
                              >   >   >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                              >   decided to
                              >   >   >   > just let
                              >   >   >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then. 
                              >   >   >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                              period,
                              >   >   >   > followed by
                              >   >   >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                              >   "fiddly" part
                              >   >   >   > kills the
                              >   >   >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                              "fun" of
                              >   >   >   having the
                              >   >   >   > > >   saw LOL.
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   > Glenn
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  Everything
                              >   seemed
                              >   >   >   to be
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing
                              >   teeth.  I put
                              >   >   >   > another
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                              >   the bottom
                              >   >   >   > > pulley.  I
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close
                              to the
                              >   >   shoulder
                              >   >   >   > > of the
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems that I
                              >   >   really had
                              >   >   >   > > to turn
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While
                              checking
                              >   >   to see
                              >   >   >   > > if the
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I noticed
                              that
                              >   >   the bottom
                              >   >   >   > > pulley
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never
                              noticed this
                              >   >   before.
                              >   >   >   >  The
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                              running
                              >   >   but cuts
                              >   >   >   > > fine.
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
                              >   >   warped some
                              >   >   >   > > how.  Is
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that
                              >   pulley to
                              >   >   >   > wobble?
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a noise
                              >   like a
                              >   >   >   piston
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone
                              >   somewhere
                              >   >   >   > that is
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
                              >   >   >   > > >   >
                              >   >   >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                              couple of
                              >   >   days.
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                              >   >   >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They
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                            • Art Clark
                              This is after getting the initial tracking set up. Art
                              Message 14 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                              • 0 Attachment
                                This is after getting the initial tracking set up.
                                Art

                                On Feb 3, 2006, at 2:48 PM, Neil Fallon wrote:

                                Hi Art,

                                Are you talking the side to side on the guide rollers?  The Delta
                                manual that is in the file section says to actually remove the guides
                                while doing the intial tracking setup.

                                Neil

                                --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, Art Clark <clarkaw@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Mine is pretty sensitive to changes in the clearance on the guide 
                                > rollers. If it's a little too loose it wants to wander out. I read 
                                > somewhere to use cigarette paper to set the clearance.
                                > Art
                                >
                                > On Feb 3, 2006, at 12:01 PM, Mike Klotz wrote:
                                >
                                > > My HF saw has a bolt for the tracking.  Are the wheels on the same 
                                > > plane??  A straight edge long enough to span both of them should 
                                > > tell you pretty quickly....it will also show if they are parallel.  
                                > > If the bottom wheel is in too far, it would probably let the blade 
                                > > walk right off.
                                > > Mike
                                > > ----- Original Message -----
                                > > From: Neil Fallon
                                > > To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                > > Sent: Friday, February 03, 2006 11:28 AM
                                > > Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                                > >
                                > > Removed and re-installed the sliding plate draw block.
                                > >
                                > > Still jumping off of the bottom wheel.  If I relax the set screw a
                                > > little for the tracking it jumps off of the top wheel.
                                > >
                                > > Tried another new blade just to rule out the blade and it's still
                                > > jumping off.
                                > >
                                > > Put a flat piece of metal on edge across the wheels and a torpedo
                                > > level on top of it and the wheels are level on both sides.
                                > >
                                > > Does anyone know if there is a starting point that the set screw
                                > > should be at for the trsacking?  I started all of the way out and gave
                                > > it one complete rotation when adjusting it each time that I tried.
                                > >
                                > > Neil
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@> 
                                > > wrote:
                                > > >
                                > > > Hi Mike,
                                > > >
                                > > > I took the belt off and turned it by hand as you suggested.  The 
                                > > blade
                                > > > still popped off.  I removed the blade guides and turned it by hand
                                > > > and once again it popped off.
                                > > >
                                > > > I removed the blade wheel to see what was happening with the sliding
                                > > > plate draw block.  The sliding plate draw block is that flat black
                                > > > piece that has the set screw for adjusting the tracking and 
                                > > appears to
                                > > > have some side to side slop.  I'm not sure if this could be causing
                                > > > the problem.  No matter how tight the 4 bolts are that hold the 
                                > > plate
                                > > > on there is still side to side movement.
                                > > >
                                > > > Neil
                                > > >
                                > > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> wrote:
                                > > > >
                                > > > > Someone mentioned checking the wheel alignment with a long 
                                > > straight
                                > > > edge.  If the two wheels are tracking parallel, I can't think of any
                                > > > reason the blade would try to come off.
                                > > > >
                                > > > > I found the misalignment of the guide bearings while I was turing
                                > > > the drive pulley by hand.  If I turned it in the correct
                                > > > direction(motor belt disconnected), the blade would try to move out,
                                > > > then it popped back where it should be.....at the guide bearings, 
                                > > that
                                > > > is.  If I turned the pulley backwards, I noticed that it pulled the
                                > > > blade in and there was no "jumping".   Maybe if you turn it by hand,
                                > > > you can better isolate where your grief is coming from.
                                > > > >
                                > > > > I like these yahoo forums because the email is so quick and easy,
                                > > > but not being able to add pics to it is kind of a pain in situations
                                > > > like this :(
                                > > > >
                                > > > > Mike
                                > > > >   ----- Original Message -----
                                > > > >   From: Neil Fallon
                                > > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                > > > >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 8:38 PM
                                > > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                                > > > >
                                > > > >
                                > > > >   Hi Mike,
                                > > > >
                                > > > >   I tried taking the entire rear and front guide sections out and
                                > > > >   running it.  The blade still jumped.  With the new wheel I don't
                                > > have
                                > > > >   any room behind it to put a shim in.
                                > > > >
                                > > > >   Neil
                                > > > >
                                > > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@> 
                                > > wrote:
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   > I've been working on my 4x6 today and I was having trouble 
                                > > with
                                > > > >   tracking the blade on the bottom wheel.  I even removed the 
                                > > gear box
                                > > > >   and put washers between it and the main frame so that it 
                                > > would tilt
                                > > > >   the wheel.....no change.  Then.....I noticed that the blade was
                                > > > >   jumping a bit and if I adjusted the guide bearings even a 
                                > > slight bit
                                > > > >   too tight, the blade would really move out on the wheel.  So 
                                > > a quick
                                > > > >   check with the ruler against the bearings showed that the 
                                > > bearings
                                > > > >   were at an angle.  They were driving the blade off the 
                                > > wheel.  So I
                                > > > >   shimmed the top of the bearing adjusters and it pulled the blade
                                > > onto
                                > > > >   the bottom wheel quite nicely.  I may be too lazy to go pull the
                                > > > >   washers out from under the gear box :)  Still more work to do
                                > > > tomorrow.
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   > I called a local bearing supplier and found the guid 
                                > > bearings for
                                > > > >   $4.25ea.  Several of the originals had some really bad flat
                                > > spots.  I
                                > > > >   found that I had to tweak their adjustment with it running.  
                                > > Like I
                                > > > >   said....a hair too tight and it pushes the blade out.
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   > Mike
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                                > > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                                > > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                > > > >   >   Sent: Thursday, February 02, 2006 6:31 PM
                                > > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon" 
                                > > <fallon416@>
                                > > > wrote:
                                > > > >   >   >
                                > > > >   >   > I took the wheel to the drive shaft balancing place.  They
                                > > > told me
                                > > > >   >   > that the center hole was out of round and if they 
                                > > drilled it
                                > > > round
                                > > > >   >   > that it would no longer fit the shaft.  I ordered a new
                                > > > wheel from
                                > > > >   >   > Grizzly as well as a new shaft.
                                > > > >   >   >
                                > > > >   >   > I spent the last hour dilling both sides of the pin that
                                > > > holds the
                                > > > >   >   > gear onto the shaft.  I couldn't knock the pin out.  
                                > > Well I
                                > > > got the
                                > > > >   >   > gear off of the shaft and installed it on the new shaft
                                > > with the
                                > > > >   >   > bearing.  The Grizzly shaft only uses the woodruff key 
                                > > with
                                > > > no pin.
                                > > > >   >   > Before I can install the wheel I have to run to Home Depot
                                > > > for a set
                                > > > >   >   > screw.  The one that Grizzly uses is larger than what was
                                > > on the
                                > > > >   other
                                > > > >   >   > wheel.  I test fit the new wheel and ran it and everything
                                > > looks
                                > > > >   >   Got the blade back on and it still isn't tracking correctly.
                                > > > Still
                                > > > >   >   jumping off of the bottom wheel.  I guess it's just tinker
                                > > > time until
                                > > > >   >   I get it to stay on.
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   Neil
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > straight.  I'll post a progress report later.
                                > > > >   >   >
                                > > > >   >   > Neil
                                > > > >   >   >
                                > > > >   >   > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Neil Fallon"
                                > > > <fallon416@> wrote:
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > > Hi Glenn and Bill,
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > > The wobble is front to back and there is quite a bit of
                                > > > it.  There
                                > > > >   >   > > seems to be a spot on the wheel that doesn't look
                                > > > completely round
                                > > > >   >   > > when looking at the wheel from the front but the wheel
                                > > > >   measures the
                                > > > >   >   > > exact same all the way around.  There is a drive shaft
                                > > > >   balancing shop
                                > > > >   >   > > a couple of blocks from my house.  I'll take the wheel
                                > > to them
                                > > > >   >   > > tomorrow to see if they can tell me if it's out of
                                > > > balance.  They
                                > > > >   >   > > should be set up to spin it and see what it's doing.
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > > Neil
                                > > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > >
                                > > > >   >   > > --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                                > > > <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > > Neil,
                                > > > >   >   > > > How much wobble and in what plane/s?  If it is just
                                > > > excentric a
                                > > > >   >   > > small amount (.01" or less)  it should be no problem 
                                > > as long
                                > > > >   as you
                                > > > >   >   > > tension the blade with the saw running.  If it is 
                                > > front to
                                > > > >   back .. it
                                > > > >   >   > > could well be the cause of your problem as the blade
                                > > could be
                                > > > >   trying
                                > > > >   >   > > to run up on the ridge at the back of the wheel.  I just
                                > > went
                                > > > >   out and
                                > > > >   >   > > put an indicator on my saw and the drive wheel has .020"
                                > > give
                                > > > >   or take
                                > > > >   >   > > a bit of front to back wobble and .010" of excentric
                                > > runout.
                                > > > >   I have
                                > > > >   >   > > never broken a blade in my recollection.  The teeth 
                                > > on the
                                > > > >   blade stand
                                > > > >   >   > > proud of the wheel by about double the depth of the 
                                > > teeth.
                                > > > >   >   > > > I am assuming you were using the saw in the horizontal
                                > > > >   position when
                                > > > >   >   > > it broke and not using the table in the verticle mode?
                                > > Trying
                                > > > >   to cut
                                > > > >   >   > > a curved shape would be an easy way to break a blade.
                                > > > >   >   > > > I am still leaning to the blade guides being st too
                                > > shallow
                                > > > >   allowing
                                > > > >   >   > > the blade to ride back too far on the wheel.
                                > > > >   >   > > > HTH
                                > > > >   >   > > > Glenn
                                > > > >   >   > > >   ----- Original Message -----
                                > > > >   >   > > >   From: Neil Fallon
                                > > > >   >   > > >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                > > > >   >   > > >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 1:55 PM
                                > > > >   >   > > >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   Hi Glenn,
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   Did as you suggested and ran it with the blade off.
                                > > > The wheel
                                > > > >   >   still
                                > > > >   >   > > >   wobbled with the blade off.  I took the wheel off 
                                > > and
                                > > > >   checked the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   spindle to see if maybe it was bent.  Running the 
                                > > saw
                                > > > >   without the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   wheel on I could see nothing really wrong with the
                                > > > >   spindle.  It
                                > > > >   >   > > >   appeared to be spinning without a wobble or a 
                                > > bend.  I
                                > > > put the
                                > > > >   >   wheel
                                > > > >   >   > > >   back on and the wobble returned.  I'm not sure 
                                > > how to
                                > > > >   check the
                                > > > >   >   > wheel
                                > > > >   >   > > >   itself to see if the wobble is actually the wheel
                                > > that was
                                > > > >   >   just cast
                                > > > >   >   > > >   wrong.  I replaced the set screw with a new one that
                                > > > was of a
                                > > > >   >   little
                                > > > >   >   > > >   better quality when reinstalling the wheel.
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   Neil
                                > > > >   >   > > >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Glenn N"
                                > > > >   <sleykin@c...> wrote:
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Neil,
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > At least with the saw you bought you will know 
                                > > what
                                > > > makes it
                                > > > >   >   > tic by
                                > > > >   >   > > >   the time you have it working well :)
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Start checking things with the blade off.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > First is the set screw on the drive wheel for the
                                > > > blade.  If
                                > > > >   >   it is
                                > > > >   >   > > >   loose the blade tracking will change randomly and 
                                > > can
                                > > > break
                                > > > >   >   blades.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Next check the blade idler wheel.  It has a 
                                > > history of
                                > > > >   >   > problems with
                                > > > >   >   > > >   the bearing and the fastner that holds it to the
                                > > shaft.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Then look carefully at your blade wheels.  The
                                > > back edge
                                > > > >   is only
                                > > > >   >   > > >   intended to keep the blade from running off the back
                                > > > side and
                                > > > >   >   really
                                > > > >   >   > > >   shouldn't have the blade running against it.  If the
                                > > > >   tracking goes
                                > > > >   >   > > >   wonky the blade will run up on the ridge and snap 
                                > > the
                                > > > blade.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > On my saw, when the blade was against the ridge 
                                > > the
                                > > > >   teeth of the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   blade were fully on the wheel and the set would be
                                > > > removed on
                                > > > >   >   > one side
                                > > > >   >   > > >   causing the blade to cut taper.  I used a file to
                                > > > chamfer the
                                > > > >   >   front
                                > > > >   >   > > >   edge so the teeth did not hit the wheel even with 
                                > > the
                                > > > blade
                                > > > >   >   all the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   way back.  I did this with the blade on and machine
                                > > > running
                                > > > >   >   using a
                                > > > >   >   > > >   hand file.  Probably not a real safe way to do it 
                                > > but
                                > > > I took
                                > > > >   >   > care and
                                > > > >   >   > > >   had no incidents.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Just in case you haven't seen Grant Erwin's 4X6
                                > > > >   compilation for
                                > > > >   >   > > FAQs...
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > http://www.tinyisland.com/4x6bsFAQ.html
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > As to all the parts you are planning to buy .. 
                                > > I have
                                > > > >   had my saw
                                > > > >   >   > > >   over 10 years and so far the only parts I have
                                > > > replaced are a
                                > > > >   >   couple
                                > > > >   >   > > >   of wonky setscrews and the motor start cap.  Like 
                                > > you,
                                > > > when I
                                > > > >   >   first
                                > > > >   >   > > >   got my saw I was tempted to buy a bunch of 
                                > > replacement
                                > > > pieces
                                > > > >   >   > "just in
                                > > > >   >   > > >   case" .. by the time I totaled up all the spare
                                > > parts and
                                > > > >   >   shipping I
                                > > > >   >   > > >   wanted ... A new saw would have been cheaper so I
                                > > > decided to
                                > > > >   >   > just let
                                > > > >   >   > > >   it run till it broke and replace things then.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > These saws seem to have a very "fiddly" break-in
                                > > period,
                                > > > >   >   > followed by
                                > > > >   >   > > >   years of reliable service... Unfortunatley the
                                > > > "fiddly" part
                                > > > >   >   > kills the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   joy for many .. for me it was a good part of the
                                > > "fun" of
                                > > > >   >   having the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   saw LOL.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   > Glenn
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   ----- Original Message -----
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   From: Neil Fallon
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:05 AM
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Broke another blade
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   I broke one of the new blades tonight.  
                                > > Everything
                                > > > seemed
                                > > > >   >   to be
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   working fine and then just snap.  No missing
                                > > > teeth.  I put
                                > > > >   >   > another
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   blade on and had problems getting it to stay on
                                > > > the bottom
                                > > > >   >   > > pulley.  I
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   adjusted the tracking to keep the blade close 
                                > > to the
                                > > > >   shoulder
                                > > > >   >   > > of the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   pulley as the manual says to do.  It seems 
                                > > that I
                                > > > >   really had
                                > > > >   >   > > to turn
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   in the hex screw further than normal.  While
                                > > checking
                                > > > >   to see
                                > > > >   >   > > if the
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   blade was staying against the pulley I 
                                > > noticed that
                                > > > >   the bottom
                                > > > >   >   > > pulley
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   seems to wobble a little.  I have never 
                                > > noticed this
                                > > > >   before.
                                > > > >   >   >  The
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   blade also seems to have a slight wobble when
                                > > running
                                > > > >   but cuts
                                > > > >   >   > > fine.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   The bottom pulley is cast iron.  I doubt that it
                                > > > >   warped some
                                > > > >   >   > > how.  Is
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   there anything I can check that would cause that
                                > > > pulley to
                                > > > >   >   > wobble?
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   Also, if I tighten my drive belt up I get a 
                                > > noise
                                > > > like a
                                > > > >   >   piston
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   slapping in an engine.  Could a bearing be gone
                                > > > somewhere
                                > > > >   >   > that is
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   related to both of these things?
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   Someday I'll get this to run for more than a
                                > > couple of
                                > > > >   days.
                                > > > >   >   > > The saw
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   seems to be like the Boston Bruins.  They 
                                > > can't win
                                > > > >   more than
                                > > > >   >   > > 2 games
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   in a row and the saw can't work for more than 
                                > > 2 days
                                > > > >   in a row.
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >
                                > > > >   >   > > >   >   Neil
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                              • Neil Fallon
                                Hi Mike, I m going to give up on this. I ve done every adjustment that can be done. One of the very first posts in this forum was on the same subject but I
                                Message 15 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
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                                  Hi Mike,

                                  I'm going to give up on this. I've done every adjustment that can be
                                  done. One of the very first posts in this forum was on the same
                                  subject but I didn't see a solution. I emailed the author. Maybe
                                  he'll email back and tell me what the solution was. In the mean time
                                  its back to the chop saw and the dust. At least I can can get things
                                  done with it. I have spent the last few weeks just working on this
                                  machine. If I purchase another it will be a craftsman. I will be
                                  able to take out repair insurance if I purchase through Sears. My
                                  compressor motor went last year and they came down and replaced it
                                  right away without any additional cost.

                                  Neil

                                  --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Klotz" <mklotz1@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > I just got done putting mine back together. I was able to take the
                                  washer out from between the gearbox and main frame and it still
                                  tracked okay. The cast aluminum piece that holds the lower guide
                                  bearings is a poor casting. It's not square. That's why the bearings
                                  were at an angle. I took it apart and took a flat file to it to get
                                  the bearings where I wanted them. Didn't was to try to bend or heat
                                  it....cast aluminum...pretty easy to break.
                                  >
                                  > I tried a cut with the tension reduced some....boy did it cut wrong
                                  on the vertical axis. When the piece released at the end of the cut
                                  and the blade stopped, there was at least a 1/16" gap between the
                                  parent metal and the blade. Upped the tension and put in a thicker
                                  piece....I'm running a 8-10 bimetal so maybe there just wasn't enought
                                  metal engaging the teeth? Second cut on the thicker metal cut right on.
                                  >
                                  > Sorry......I'm out of ideas for you.....good luck!!! I'm curious
                                  about what you find.
                                  > Mike
                                  >
                                • Dave J
                                  I have not followed this thread but one thought that has occurred to me is that I don t like the idea of chips building up on the wheels and being squeezed by
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    I have not followed this thread but one thought that has
                                    occurred to me is that I don't like the idea of chips building
                                    up on the wheels and being squeezed by the blade. I haven't
                                    broken any blades but I plan to make a blade scraper to
                                    eliminate this.


                                    --- "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...> wrote:
                                    > Hi Mike,
                                    >
                                    > I'm going to give up on this. I've done every adjustment
                                    > that can be done. One of the very first posts in this forum
                                    > was on the same subject but I didn't see a solution. I
                                    > emailed the author. Maybe he'll email back and tell me what
                                    > the solution was. In the mean time its back to the chop saw
                                    > and the dust. At least I can can get things done with it.
                                    > I have spent the last few weeks just working on this machine.
                                    > If I purchase another it will be a craftsman. I will be
                                    > able to take out repair insurance if I purchase through Sears.
                                    > My compressor motor went last year and they came down and
                                    > replaced it right away without any additional cost.
                                    >
                                    > Neil
                                    >
                                  • Neil Fallon
                                    Hi Dave, The wheels are really clean and the blade that I m using is brand new. I looked up the Delta repair facilities in the back of the manual in file
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
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                                      Hi Dave,

                                      The wheels are really clean and the blade that I'm using is brand new.

                                      I looked up the Delta repair facilities in the back of the manual in
                                      file section. There is one about 5 miles from house. I'm going to
                                      take a ride down there today and see if they have any ideas or if they
                                      can fix it.

                                      I did find one problem that is probably contributing to this. The
                                      draw block attaches to the pulley with a square block in between the
                                      plate and the pulley. When the set screw is turned in the block
                                      raises a little. The indentation in the back is not deep enough to
                                      stop the screw from wandering off of the block as it is tightened.
                                      The block shaft itself is held on with a bolt and washer just above
                                      the set screw. When the set screw is turned in and the block raises a
                                      little the bolt that holds the block in place is binding at that point
                                      and the washer beneath the bolt is crushing inward. The bolt does not
                                      sit in the groove but above it on top of the washer. This allows for
                                      slight side to side movement. There should be something in the slot
                                      that stops the side to side play when the bolt is loosened. I guess
                                      you could level the pulley post and then just raise it slightly off
                                      the bubble prior to putting the wheel back on.

                                      I also found that there is an additional bushing under the top wheel
                                      that doesn't seem to wear like the lower one. Both bushings are the
                                      same size.

                                      Neil


                                      --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Dave J" <galt_57@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I have not followed this thread but one thought that has
                                      > occurred to me is that I don't like the idea of chips building
                                      > up on the wheels and being squeezed by the blade. I haven't
                                      > broken any blades but I plan to make a blade scraper to
                                      > eliminate this.
                                    • Neil Fallon
                                      I found and fixed the problem. The problem was the set screw and the way that it was jumping off of the wheel side to side. I took the block out and filed it
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Feb 3, 2006
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                                        I found and fixed the problem. The problem was the set screw and the
                                        way that it was jumping off of the wheel side to side. I took the
                                        block out and filed it down where the scores were from the set screw
                                        pushing sideways. I then put the block on the drill press and drilled
                                        about 1/8 inch in where the screw contacts the block with a 1/4 inch
                                        bit. I replaced the set screw with a cap screw socket which is like a
                                        thumb screw that you use a hex key on. Before I put the wheel back on
                                        the top I put a level on the shaft and made it just about 3/4 of a
                                        bubble off in the up position. I put the blade on and gave it a try.
                                        The blade started moving away from the top. One half of a turn with
                                        the hex key and the blade started tracking right. I then adjusted the
                                        blade guides so that the roller is just touching the blade. Got
                                        everything back together and did a test cut. Everything still looks
                                        fine as far as the blade sitting on the wheels and not coming off.
                                        I'll have to keep an eye on it.

                                        I guess sometimes stubbornness is a good trait.

                                        Neil
                                      • Steven Vine
                                        Great thread Neil. I ve been following this since it started. Even went and looked closely at my machine a few times. Phew, I thought you was gonna give up and
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Feb 4, 2006
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                                          Great thread Neil. I've been following this since it started. Even went and
                                          looked closely at my machine a few times. Phew, I thought you was gonna give
                                          up and never find the solution at one point. That would have been awful.
                                          Has that ticking/clunky noise stopped now you have solved things ?? Mine has
                                          recently started to make a slight clunk on each revolution.

                                          Regards

                                          Steven Vine

                                          >From: "Neil Fallon" <fallon416@...>
                                          >Reply-To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                          >To: 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com
                                          >Subject: [4x6bandsaw] Re: Broke another blade
                                          >Date: Sat, 04 Feb 2006 07:22:01 -0000
                                          >
                                          >I found and fixed the problem. The problem was the set screw and the
                                          >way that it was jumping off of the wheel side to side. I took the
                                          >block out and filed it down where the scores were from the set screw
                                          >pushing sideways. I then put the block on the drill press and drilled
                                          >about 1/8 inch in where the screw contacts the block with a 1/4 inch
                                          >bit. I replaced the set screw with a cap screw socket which is like a
                                          >thumb screw that you use a hex key on. Before I put the wheel back on
                                          >the top I put a level on the shaft and made it just about 3/4 of a
                                          >bubble off in the up position. I put the blade on and gave it a try.
                                          > The blade started moving away from the top. One half of a turn with
                                          >the hex key and the blade started tracking right. I then adjusted the
                                          >blade guides so that the roller is just touching the blade. Got
                                          >everything back together and did a test cut. Everything still looks
                                          >fine as far as the blade sitting on the wheels and not coming off.
                                          >I'll have to keep an eye on it.
                                          >
                                          >I guess sometimes stubbornness is a good trait.
                                          >
                                          >Neil
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
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                                        • Neil Fallon
                                          Hi Steve, The saw is very quiet. I ran it at 2:00 AM without waking anyone up. I did have some cluncking that I had thought was coming from the pulley motor
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Feb 4, 2006
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                                            Hi Steve,

                                            The saw is very quiet. I ran it at 2:00 AM without waking anyone up.
                                            I did have some cluncking that I had thought was coming from the
                                            pulley motor area. It turned out to be the bolt that goes across the
                                            saw holding the motor plate on. It was backed off on the bottom side
                                            (the side closest to the ground). As soon as it was tightened the
                                            clucking stopped. If you're getting the loud cluncking sound then try
                                            loosening the tension on your motor pulley and pulling the motor
                                            toward the front of the saw a little while it's running. I found that
                                            when the pressure came off the belt a little the cluncking sound
                                            stopped. That's when I found the loose bolt.

                                            Neil

                                            --- In 4x6bandsaw@yahoogroups.com, "Steven Vine" <microstoc@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Great thread Neil. I've been following this since it started. Even
                                            went and
                                            > looked closely at my machine a few times. Phew, I thought you was
                                            gonna give
                                            > up and never find the solution at one point. That would have been awful.
                                            > Has that ticking/clunky noise stopped now you have solved things ??
                                            Mine has
                                            > recently started to make a slight clunk on each revolution.
                                            >
                                            > Regards
                                            >
                                            > Steven Vine
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