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Re: [40Whacks] June Is Busting Out All Over

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  • Muriel Arnold
    Hi June: You say there is no dispute as to the time Mrs. Chace was hanging clothes. I never knew there was one. Everything I ve read said it was around 10:30
    Message 1 of 6 , Sep 26, 2004
      Hi June:
      You say there is no dispute as to the time Mrs. Chace was hanging clothes.
      I never knew there was one.  Everything I've read said it was around 10:30 when she saw McGowan stealing pears.
      He admitted it was he whom Mrs. Chace had seen.  He returned to the Crowe yard where he was sent on an errand by Mr. Crowe.  Mr. Crowe agreed with this.
      Bridget testified that she re-entered the house at 10:30.  You asked why hadn't Bridget seen him or he Bridget?
      My explanation for that was when Bridget entered the house at 10:20, it was not to get a dipper to rinse off the windows (which she never washed), it was to go to her room and change dress.  She sneaked out of the house by the side door, went and re-entered the house by the front door.
      McGowan didn't see her, as he could see the back of the house and not the side door.  With Bridget, who would have been more than willing to name him as a possible suspect, failed to spot McGowan for the same reason he failed to spot her.
      Now for Dr. Handy's wild-eyed man:
      I no longer have all my newspaper clippings, but I know Dr. Handly had been taken to Boston to look at the guy the Boston police had arrested.  They had not claimed it was Graham.  In fact, Dr. Handy's trip to Boston occurred BEFORE the police located Graham.  I have no idea who it was the Boston police arrested.
      Then you said 10:30 <...that puts the pear-pilferer in the yard at the time Andrew came home.>
      Sorry, but at 10:30, Andrew Borden had just left Jonathan Clegg's store on North Main Street.  He hadn't made it to Clegg's new store as yet.  He left that store at 10:40 and Andrew got home around 10:52.  The reason most people claim he arrived home at 10:45 is because that is the time Bridget claimed he got home.
      Guess I better get off the computer.  It is storming real good outside and the TV is warning us to watch out for tonadoes.  Guess the wind is blowing about 40 mph.  Wish hurricane Jeanne would leave soon.  That makes 4 hurricanes to hit us in about six weeks.
      ----- Original Message -----
      Sent: Saturday, September 25, 2004 10:27 AM
      Subject: Re: [40Whacks] June Is Busting Out All Over

      Muriel wrote:
      >You would be right about the pear pilferer being in a position to view
      >the Borden back yard at the time Lizzie said she went to the barn,
      >except:    Patrick McGowan was the pear pilferer.  He claimed he
      >stole the pears at 10:30, not about 11:00 as stated by Mrs. Mary
      >Chace.  He was backed up by John Crowe, who'd sent him, a
      >mason's helper, on an errand.  It was nearly eleven when Lizzie
      >went to the barn.
      There's a problem with this, tho...if the pear-pilferer was only Patrick McGowan, it doesn't explain who Mrs. Chace saw around 11:00 am -- there's no dispute as to the time she was hanging clothes.
      Also, if the man she saw was one of the masons, why did he AVOID going to where the masons were working when he left the Borden yard?  Why didn't anyone see this man working with the masons before or after?
      If it was McGowan at 10:30, why didn't he see Bridget or Bridget see him?  If, as you claim, Bridget was the guilty party, you would think that she'd jump at the chance of casting suspicion on someone other than herself, and a trespasser stealing pears would be the perfect patsy....if she wasn't responsible for the murders, you would think that she'd still want to offer up a possible suspect to the authorities other than her mistress...
      I suspect we are dealing with more than one pear-pilferer that morning...
      Based on the accounts of non-involved bystanders, it seems the Borden yard and premises were unusally active that morning, with "mysterious strangers" abounding...
      >"The New York Herald had it that the man whom the boy saw
      >(climbing over the Borden's back fence), was found today...
      But the Herald never really investigated, only took one person's word for what he claimed really happened; but when you look closely at all the accounts, there are some definite discrepancies in them which tend to suggest that there was more than one man pilfering pears that morning...
      >June, you found it interesting that the police had not provided
      >Dr. Handy with the opportunity to see Michael Graham in person,
      >just cloncluding on their own that Graham's description was close
      >enough.  Interesting is right, seeing they took Dr. Handy to Boston
      >to view the guy the police there had arrested as possibly being his
      >wild-eyed man.
      When was this?  According to the accounts I read, by the time the papers were concluding that the police had determined that Graham was the man whom Dr. Handy had seen, Dr. Handy was claiming that they'd never brought him in to ID Graham in person...
      I never read that Graham was arrested in Boston, only that he was arrested by the FRPD for being drunk and disorderly.  Who was it you claim was arrested in Boston that you claim Dr. Handy was brought to see?  Why did Dr. Handy insist that he'd never been brought to see Michael Graham?
      >Thursday morning:  Who rang the bell, who answered the door.
      >e)  Where was Bridget when this event occurred?
      As I pointed out above, if as you claim there was only one pear-pilferer, and he was pilfering pears at 10:30, then why didn't your supposedly guilty Bridget jump at the chance to cast suspicion in THAT direction?
      Could it be because Mrs. Chace actually got the time right, that the man she saw (who upon seeing her watching him acted a lot more furtively than a simple trespasser pilfering a pear would act) was in the Borden yard closer to 11 than 10:30?
      Also, if as you contend the time WAS closer to 10:30, that puts the pear-pilferer in the yard right at the time Andrew came home -- Andrew, who supposedly first went to the back (side) door and found it locked and so then went to the front door and rang to be let in -- why didn't HE notice someone trespassing in his yard and stealing his pears?
      >Out in the back yard throwing up?  No one found any vomit
      >in the back yard.
      Then it would seem that no one found Andrew's vomit, either; my guess is that Bridget, when getting water to wash the windows, probably tossed a few buckets on the mess to wash it away and get rid of the smell and the flies it would naturally attract...
      June  ;-)


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