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Re: [20thMass] Re: Andersonville

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  • Kevin Frye
    You are correct Jimmy. The Civil War POW holding policy, no matter what the reasons were , and there were many, were a sad fate for the typical in the field
    Message 1 of 11 , Oct 20, 2007
      You are correct Jimmy.  The Civil War POW holding policy, no matter what the reasons were , and there were many, were a sad fate for the typical in the field soldier.  As usual, in all wars, it is the individual who pays the price in decisions made.  There are so many other prisons worth noting that were also failed experiments which was the case of Civil War POW sites.  Other horrible places in the North as you mentioned, Elmira, Point Lookout, Fort Delaware, Douglas in Chicago, Rock Island Illinois all come to mind as well as Confederate stockades such as Andersonville, Cahaba Alabama, Salisbury, Libby, Belle Island, Danville, Florence, Blackshire, Millen , Macon and Thomasville Georgia all come to mind.  Andersonville stands out because of the highest numbers held, dead and survivors, but the history of these other Hell Holes should not be forgotten.  The History Channel did a segment last year on Douglas and I was in hopes that they would continue shows about these I have mentioned that are not well known but maybe with forums like this, they will not be completely forgotten.
       
      Kevin

       
    • Kevin Frye
      Code No: 44220 Grave No: 0 Last Name: Baker First Name: William Rank: Musician Company: A Regiment: 20 State: MA Branch Of Service : Infantry Date of Death:
      Message 2 of 11 , Oct 20, 2007
        Code No: 44220
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Baker
        First Name: William
        Rank: Musician
        Company: A
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Exchanged March 8, 1865; mustered out July 16, 1865.
        Reference: p 496 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 496
        Place Captured: p 496 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 496
        Date Captured: 6/3/1864
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date: 7/16/1862
        Age at Muster: 19
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
        Code No: 10642
        Grave No: 642
        Last Name: Barge
        First Name: Henry
        Rank: Private
        Company: E
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death: 4/20/1864
        Cause of Death: FEVER TYPHUS
        Remarks* HENRY BARZ [1][2]
        Reference: p 18 [3]; p 531 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 531
        Place Captured:
        Date Captured:
        Alternate Names: Barz
        Status: Died at  Andersonville
        Muster date:  4/8/1863
        Age at Muster: 28
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
        Code No: 19078
        Grave No: 9078
        Last Name: Bauer
        First Name: Michael
        Rank: Private
        Company: B
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death: 9/17/1864
        Cause of Death:  scorbutus
        Remarks* MICHAEL BAUR, COMPANY A [1][2]; M. BANNER, COMPANY B [3]
        Reference: p 18 [3]; p 504 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 504
        Place Captured: Cold Harbor, Virginia
        Date Captured: 6/3/1864
        Alternate Names: Baur   Banner
        Status:  Died at  Andersonville
        Muster date:  8/7/1863
        Age at Muster: 24
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 44242
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Baxter
        First Name: John W.
        Rank: Private
        Company: K
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Exchanged at Vicksburg, Mississippi, April 19, 1865. Released April 22, 1865 and mustered out June 16, 1865
        Reference: p 577 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 577
        Place Captured: North Anna River, Virginia
        Date Captured: 5/21/1864
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date:  8/18/1863
        Age at Muster: 21
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 44226
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Bohme
        First Name: Franz
        Rank: Private
        Company: C
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Exchanged November 26, 1864; discharged for disability, April 29, 1865.
        Reference: p 513 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 513
        Place Captured: Wilderness, Virginia
        Date Captured: 5/6/1864
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date:  4/14/1864
        Age at Muster: 26
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
        Code No:  44224
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Bornemann
        First Name: Henry C. A.
        Rank: Private
        Company: B
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Sent to Camp Lawton, Millen, Georgia November 11, 1865. Released April 22, 1865; mustered out May 29, 1865.
        Reference: p 505 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 505
        Place Captured: Wilderness, Virginia
        Date Captured: 5/6/1864
        Alternate Names: Burnaman
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date:  4/2/1864
        Age at Muster: 31
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 50878
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Carney
        First Name: William
        Rank: Private
        Company: K
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death: 9/18/1864
        Cause of Death: .
        Remarks* Reported to have died at Andersonville, September 18, 1864.
        Reference: p 578 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 578
        Place Captured:
        Date Captured:
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Reported to have died at Andersonville
        Muster date:  8/5/1863
        Age at Muster: 21
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 64066
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Chapman
        First Name: Joseph
        Rank: Private
        Company: E
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Sent to Andersonville, June 8, 1864. Died in prison at Florence, Souh Carolina, date unknown
        Reference: MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 533
        Place Captured: Cold Harbor, Virginia
        Date Captured: 6/3/1864
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date: 8/8/1861
        Age at Muster: 31
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 44235
        Grave No: 0
        Last Name: Constant
        First Name: Francis
        Rank: Private
        Company: F
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death:
        Cause of Death:
        Remarks* Joined Confederate Army while a prisoner. Recaptured, date not noted. Sent to Nashville, Tennessee and released July 6, 1865 on taking oath of allegiance. Mustered out July 24, 1865.
        Reference: p 541 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 541
        Place Captured: Wilderness, Virginia
        Date Captured: 5/6/1864
        Alternate Names:
        Status: Survived Andersonville
        Muster date:  4/1/1864
        Age at Muster: 23
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
         
         
        Code No: 15409
        Grave No: 5409
        Last Name: Cott
        First Name: John
        Rank: Private
        Company: K
        Regiment: 20
        State: MA
        Branch Of Service : Infantry
        Date of Death: 8/12/1864
        Cause of Death: Anasarca
        Remarks* J. COLT [3]
        Reference: p 19 [3]; p 579 [33], MASS ADG RPT VOL II: 579
        Place Captured: Wilderness, Virginia
        Date Captured: 5/6/1864
        Alternate Names: Colt
        Status: Died at Andersonville
        Muster date:  8/5/1863
        Age at Muster: 22
        More Information Available : NO
         
         
        3 = List of Union Soldiers Buried at Andersonville; Dorence Atwater, 1865.
         
        33 = Massachusetts Soldiers, Sailors, and Marines in the Civil War, Volume II; State of Massachusetts, 1931.
         
         
         
      • George
        Hi Kevin, and thank you for your informative, detailed response (and No, I don t believe that you unduly rambled!). I had no idea that there were so many
        Message 3 of 11 , Oct 20, 2007
          Hi Kevin, and thank you for your informative, detailed response
          (and No, I don't believe that you unduly rambled!). I had no idea
          that there were so many Winders; I presume that the Winder that I
          was inquiring about to you with uncertainty was the General Winder
          who died in February, 1865, but I guess that it could have been any
          one of
          them.

          I have to say that your defense of Wirz at least in my case, falls
          on deaf ears in the respect of his pleading for assistance from
          Richmond and receiving none as it but reinforces the conviction in
          my mind (as I originally posted) that officials in addition of Wirz
          should have been held accountable for what happened at
          Andersonville. If you feel that there was an injustice done to Wirz
          for being the only one to "hold the bag" for Andersonville-yes I
          agree with you! He should have had
          company!

          You made reference to Lincoln; one note that you may-or may not-
          know is that during the War, his oft-repeated and advertised offers
          of pardons and amnesty for Confederates did specifically exclude
          those Confederates such as Wirz and Winder-ie. those involved in the
          administration of Union POW's. Had Lincoln lived, we will never
          know what he may have done, and Wirz may very well have had his
          company on the gallows. Frankly, I am surprized that Andrew Johnson
          allowed even Wirz to be hung, as no one else-including Jefferson
          Davis-
          was.

          Thank you again for your response and detailed information! Are you
          also involved with the touching and well-done Andersonville
          website? If so, it is excellent, and I will visit it often. Thanks
          again.
          George.


          --- In 20thMass@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin Frye" <Frye@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi George,
          > First I want to mention that its been a very busy week for me
          and I will post whats available on those from the 20th in the neat
          future. Ill be posting in groups of 10 as I find time to transcribe
          instead of the 60 some at once.
          >
          > Wirz was incontrol of the interior of ths stockade walls. There
          were several Winders involved in the prison system connected with
          Andersonville. General J. H. WInder was the Commander of
          Confederate Military Prisons in charge of the prisons East of the
          Mississippi. His son, ( Post commander ) was W. Sidney Winder was
          in charge of the basic day to day operation outside the prison pen
          walls and there was a third by the name of Richard B. Winder who was
          Quartermaster and oversaw the commissary at Camp Sumter (
          Andersonville ). Richard was the Nephew of J. H. Winder. When Wirz
          needed anything, he had to go to W. Sidney, who went to Richard B,
          who had to deal long distance with those powers that be in Richmond
          including J. H. for supplies. As we all well know dealing with any
          Government the more steps you have to go through to get anything,
          the odds increase of nothing happening.
          >
          > I have not read anything of anyone else here being placed on trial
          as Wirz was. The answer to your question of General J. H. WInder
          being tried was that he died February 6 1865 , just months before
          the war ended leaving Wirz holding the bag. Wirz`s trial, in my
          belief was a farse and history as well as transcripts show this.
          First, a few details that might be new to those who are reading
          this.
          >
          > Wirz left Switzerland several years before the war began to find
          new life in America. His wife had died and he left at least one
          child ( I believe there were two ) in the hands of his parents. He
          came to America established a new life , got married, and soon had
          two children shortly before the war began. After being shot through
          the arm at the battle of Seven Pines, he spent some time at Libby
          prison in a post and soon was sent here to Andersonville soon after
          this stockade opened. He arrived here March 27 1864 , 32 days after
          the first prisoners arrived. The stockade was only three sided
          until just after he arrived, but prisoners were being transfered
          here from Belle Island and other sites at numbers of 400 a day for
          the first several months. As these prisoners came in so fast, and
          supplies so slow , it only accelerated the problems that soon became
          out of control. I believe that many designs of this stockade that
          might have helped in the problems were postponed and ignored as the
          hope and plans of resuming exchanges were always a day away and the
          feeling was that these modifications were not needed.
          >
          > The following is going to sound wishy washy but I have very mixed
          views on Wirz.
          > In defence of Wirz ( Yall hang with me now ) I will say that I
          have seen documents in his own handwriting begging for more food and
          supplies as well as less prisoners. He always got the reverse. Wirz
          was on trial in an attempt to get him to implicate Jeff Davis and up
          until the day he was hanged, he would not do so. There are several
          examples of Wirz having moments of compassion. After arriving
          here, one of his first acts after seeing the many young boys of ages
          of 12 to 15 was to having them removed from the general population
          and paroling them outside the stockade for use as errand boys, and
          to do chores for the guards. Being so far from anything and deep in
          Confederate lines, he knew the chance of them escaping was slim. He
          felt that boys of such a young age should not have to suffer in the
          events of what happened inside the prison walls. He also helped the
          prisoner self organized Police force ( The Regulators ) overpower ,
          hold trial, and punish those " Raiders" who caused so much mysery,
          robbery, and murder among the prison population including the
          execution of the 6 ringleaders. In the summer when conditions were
          the worst, Wirz allowd a party of 6 prisoners to be paroled to carry
          a large written petition to Washington demanding the resumption of
          exchanges. The problem here is that these men had outlasted their
          enlistment and they turned this document over to a federal officer
          when dicharged before they simply went home. These are just a few
          examples that come to mind showing his intent was not for the
          extermination of Federal prisoners. During his trial, there were
          later proven witnesses who were never here at Andersonville.
          Since this document that the paroled prisoners never made it to
          Washington, it was not allowed to be submitted in his defence
          although several of these men gave sworn testimony in person at the
          trail of Wirz allowing their freedom. The judge said simply , No
          document,, it never happened.
          >
          > Now for the flip side.
          > Wirz was not a kind man for certain. One of the descendants of
          Wirz`s Children he left in Switzerland is an officer in the Swiss
          Military. Swiss Col. Heinrich Wirz has done a great
          deal of research on his infamous ancestor for many years and has met
          with Andersonville Park personell several times. His research shows
          that his infamous ancestor left Switzerland just a few steps ahead
          of the law and was far from the model citizen. Although much of his
          life was on the wrong side of the law and honesty, his final fate
          was fueled by the need for someone to pay.
          >
          > My view,, and its just an opinion,, is that the end for Wirz was
          the result of one of the best things that happened here at
          Andersonville. A fellow prisoner here by the name of Dorence
          Atwater was placed in charge of keeping the dead rolls. I can go
          into a long story but thanks to his work only 460 of the 12920 who
          died here lie in unmarked graves. He also made a secret copy which
          he smuggled out upon his release late in 1864 which he had printed
          in many large newspapers when the war ended. It was this incredible
          record keeping that fueled the need for someone to pay for what
          happened here. I look at it this way. There were 58000 who died in
          Vietnam. Thats a huge number but its a cold number. For those of
          you who have traveled to Washington to see the WALL you know that
          these 58000 names become more personal as you connect with people.
          These were men and women who had Mothers, Fathers, Children. Having
          this experiance brings passion and anger at the loss and removes the
          coldness from that huge number.
          >
          > I believe that Atwaters list caused the same result. When your
          loved one went off to war and never came back , there would have
          been grief yes, but to think he died in battle defending his beliefs
          was one thing, but to find he died here at Andersonville for
          certain, and to hear the many stories told and printed by the more
          than 33000 survivors who survived , would have fueled the need for
          payback. WInder was not there,, Wirz was and being the main link to
          all stories he paid the price. Were there things he might have done
          to help the conditions here and he did not? I believe there were a
          couple things that were in his hands which I could go into later,
          but with Lincolns vision for healing the wounds . the payment with
          Wirz life I think , was the simplest way to get past Andersonville
          and the hatred those family members of the ex-prisoners had against
          the people of the south might have been simplified if it could be
          directed at one person.
          >
          > I Hope I havent rambled on to much ( grin )
          >
          > Kevin
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ----- Original Message -----
          > From: George
          > To: 20thMass@yahoogroups.com
          > Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 2:22 AM
          > Subject: [20thMass] Re: Andersonville
          >
          >
          > Hi Kevin, I have a question which I don't know will be within
          your
          > scope of knowledge, but I always have been curious to know the
          > answer so I will ask, anyway. I know of course that Wirz, the
          > Andersonville warden was tried and hanged after the War. It is
          my
          > understanding that Wirz's boss was a Confederate General I
          believe
          > out of Richmond named General Winder. This General Winder had a
          > reputation for cruelty towards Union prisoners as well, and as
          > Wirz's boss, shared a lot of the blame for conditions at
          > Andersonville.
          >
          > My question: Was Winder ever tried by Union authorities after
          the
          > War as Wirz was? If so, what was the disposition of his trial?
          And
          > if he was not tried, why not? I never understood Wirz's
          execution
          > by itself for what happened at Andersonville, while not holding
          > accountable the Confederate authorities that he answered to, who
          at
          > the minimum were at least equally responsible. Thanks.
          > George.
          >
          >
          > --- In 20thMass@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin Frye"
          > <Frye@> wrote:
          > >
          > > Hi Gang,
          > > Sorry for the previous posting as I thought it was going
          > private to Coly. Guess I better introduce myself. My name is
          Kevin
          > Frye and I am a local part time historian and volunteer for the
          > National Park Service at Andersonville National Historic Site. I
          > have been here as a volunteer for more than 10 years and can
          answer
          > any question,, well nearly any question you might think of about
          > Andersonville. If I cant answer it, I will research and find the
          > answer if its available. I have a copy of the park database here
          at
          > my home which not only has details on those from the 20th who
          were
          > and still are here but also has more than 41000 records of those
          > held as POW at Andersonville. My offer for FREE research for the
          > asking is simply an email away. If you prefer me to answer in a
          > private email, or publicly to this forum for all to share, just
          let
          > me know.
          > >
          > > Kevin Frye
          > > Andersonville Historian / NPS Volunteer
          > > www.angelfire.com/ga2/Andersonvilleprison/
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you,
          > > Jesus Christ and the American G I.
          > >
          > > One died for your soul, the other for your freedom
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > -------------------------------------------------------------------
          -----------
          >
          >
          > No virus found in this incoming message.
          > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
          > Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.15.1/1079 - Release Date:
          10/19/2007 5:10 AM
          >
        • Kevin Frye
          ... From: George To: 20thMass@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 3:18 PM Subject: [20thMass] Re: Andersonville Hi Kevin, and thank you for your
          Message 4 of 11 , Oct 20, 2007
             
            ----- Original Message -----
            From: George
            Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 3:18 PM
            Subject: [20thMass] Re: Andersonville

            Hi Kevin, and thank you for your informative, detailed response
            (and No, I don't believe that you unduly rambled!). I had no idea
            that there were so many Winders; I presume that the Winder that I
            was inquiring about to you with uncertainty was the General Winder
            who died in February, 1865, but I guess that it could have been any
            one of
            them.

            I have to say that your defense of Wirz at least in my case, falls
            on deaf ears in the respect of his pleading for assistance from
            Richmond and receiving none as it but reinforces the conviction in
            my mind (as I originally posted) that officials in addition of Wirz
            should have been held accountable for what happened at
            Andersonville. If you feel that there was an injustice done to Wirz
            for being the only one to "hold the bag" for Andersonville- yes I
            agree with you! He should have had
            company!

            You made reference to Lincoln; one note that you may-or may not-
            know is that during the War, his oft-repeated and advertised offers
            of pardons and amnesty for Confederates did specifically exclude
            those Confederates such as Wirz and Winder-ie. those involved in the
            administration of Union POW's. Had Lincoln lived, we will never
            know what he may have done, and Wirz may very well have had his
            company on the gallows. Frankly, I am surprized that Andrew Johnson
            allowed even Wirz to be hung, as no one else-including Jefferson
            Davis-
            was.



            --- In 20thMass@yahoogroup s.com, "Kevin Frye" <Frye@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi George,
            > First I want to mention that its been a very busy week for me
            and I will post whats available on those from the 20th in the neat
            future. Ill be posting in groups of 10 as I find time to transcribe
            instead of the 60 some at once.
            >
            > Wirz was incontrol of the interior of ths stockade walls. There
            were several Winders involved in the prison system connected with
            Andersonville. General J. H. WInder was the Commander of
            Confederate Military Prisons in charge of the prisons East of the
            Mississippi. His son, ( Post commander ) was W. Sidney Winder was
            in charge of the basic day to day operation outside the prison pen
            walls and there was a third by the name of Richard B. Winder who was
            Quartermaster and oversaw the commissary at Camp Sumter (
            Andersonville ). Richard was the Nephew of J. H. Winder. When Wirz
            needed anything, he had to go to W. Sidney, who went to Richard B,
            who had to deal long distance with those powers that be in Richmond
            including J. H. for supplies. As we all well know dealing with any
            Government the more steps you have to go through to get anything,
            the odds increase of nothing happening.
            >
            > I have not read anything of anyone else here being placed on trial
            as Wirz was. The answer to your question of General J. H. WInder
            being tried was that he died February 6 1865 , just months before
            the war ended leaving Wirz holding the bag. Wirz`s trial, in my
            belief was a farse and history as well as transcripts show this.
            First, a few details that might be new to those who are reading
            this.
            >
            > Wirz left Switzerland several years before the war began to find
            new life in America. His wife had died and he left at least one
            child ( I believe there were two ) in the hands of his parents. He
            came to America established a new life , got married, and soon had
            two children shortly before the war began. After being shot through
            the arm at the battle of Seven Pines, he spent some time at Libby
            prison in a post and soon was sent here to Andersonville soon after
            this stockade opened. He arrived here March 27 1864 , 32 days after
            the first prisoners arrived. The stockade was only three sided
            until just after he arrived, but prisoners were being transfered
            here from Belle Island and other sites at numbers of 400 a day for
            the first several months. As these prisoners came in so fast, and
            supplies so slow , it only accelerated the problems that soon became
            out of control. I believe that many designs of this stockade that
            might have helped in the problems were postponed and ignored as the
            hope and plans of resuming exchanges were always a day away and the
            feeling was that these modifications were not needed.
            >
            > The following is going to sound wishy washy but I have very mixed
            views on Wirz.
            > In defence of Wirz ( Yall hang with me now ) I will say that I
            have seen documents in his own handwriting begging for more food and
            supplies as well as less prisoners. He always got the reverse. Wirz
            was on trial in an attempt to get him to implicate Jeff Davis and up
            until the day he was hanged, he would not do so. There are several
            examples of Wirz having moments of compassion. After arriving
            here, one of his first acts after seeing the many young boys of ages
            of 12 to 15 was to having them removed from the general population
            and paroling them outside the stockade for use as errand boys, and
            to do chores for the guards. Being so far from anything and deep in
            Confederate lines, he knew the chance of them escaping was slim. He
            felt that boys of such a young age should not have to suffer in the
            events of what happened inside the prison walls. He also helped the
            prisoner self organized Police force ( The Regulators ) overpower ,
            hold trial, and punish those " Raiders" who caused so much mysery,
            robbery, and murder among the prison population including the
            execution of the 6 ringleaders. In the summer when conditions were
            the worst, Wirz allowd a party of 6 prisoners to be paroled to carry
            a large written petition to Washington demanding the resumption of
            exchanges. The problem here is that these men had outlasted their
            enlistment and they turned this document over to a federal officer
            when dicharged before they simply went home. These are just a few
            examples that come to mind showing his intent was not for the
            extermination of Federal prisoners. During his trial, there were
            later proven witnesses who were never here at Andersonville.
            Since this document that the paroled prisoners never made it to
            Washington, it was not allowed to be submitted in his defence
            although several of these men gave sworn testimony in person at the
            trail of Wirz allowing their freedom. The judge said simply , No
            document,, it never happened.
            >
            > Now for the flip side.
            > Wirz was not a kind man for certain. One of the descendants of
            Wirz`s Children he left in Switzerland is an officer in the Swiss
            Military. Swiss Col. Heinrich Wirz has done a great
            deal of research on his infamous ancestor for many years and has met
            with Andersonville Park personell several times. His research shows
            that his infamous ancestor left Switzerland just a few steps ahead
            of the law and was far from the model citizen. Although much of his
            life was on the wrong side of the law and honesty, his final fate
            was fueled by the need for someone to pay.
            >
            > My view,, and its just an opinion,, is that the end for Wirz was
            the result of one of the best things that happened here at
            Andersonville. A fellow prisoner here by the name of Dorence
            Atwater was placed in charge of keeping the dead rolls. I can go
            into a long story but thanks to his work only 460 of the 12920 who
            died here lie in unmarked graves. He also made a secret copy which
            he smuggled out upon his release late in 1864 which he had printed
            in many large newspapers when the war ended. It was this incredible
            record keeping that fueled the need for someone to pay for what
            happened here. I look at it this way. There were 58000 who died in
            Vietnam. Thats a huge number but its a cold number. For those of
            you who have traveled to Washington to see the WALL you know that
            these 58000 names become more personal as you connect with people.
            These were men and women who had Mothers, Fathers, Children. Having
            this experiance brings passion and anger at the loss and removes the
            coldness from that huge number.
            >
            > I believe that Atwaters list caused the same result. When your
            loved one went off to war and never came back , there would have
            been grief yes, but to think he died in battle defending his beliefs
            was one thing, but to find he died here at Andersonville for
            certain, and to hear the many stories told and printed by the more
            than 33000 survivors who survived , would have fueled the need for
            payback. WInder was not there,, Wirz was and being the main link to
            all stories he paid the price. Were there things he might have done
            to help the conditions here and he did not? I believe there were a
            couple things that were in his hands which I could go into later,
            but with Lincolns vision for healing the wounds . the payment with
            Wirz life I think , was the simplest way to get past Andersonville
            and the hatred those family members of the ex-prisoners had against
            the people of the south might have been simplified if it could be
            directed at one person.
            >
            > I Hope I havent rambled on to much ( grin )
            >
            > Kevin
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: George
            > To: 20thMass@yahoogroup s.com
            > Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 2:22 AM
            > Subject: [20thMass] Re: Andersonville
            >
            >
            > Hi Kevin, I have a question which I don't know will be within
            your
            > scope of knowledge, but I always have been curious to know the
            > answer so I will ask, anyway. I know of course that Wirz, the
            > Andersonville warden was tried and hanged after the War. It is
            my
            > understanding that Wirz's boss was a Confederate General I
            believe
            > out of Richmond named General Winder. This General Winder had a
            > reputation for cruelty towards Union prisoners as well, and as
            > Wirz's boss, shared a lot of the blame for conditions at
            > Andersonville.
            >
            > My question: Was Winder ever tried by Union authorities after
            the
            > War as Wirz was? If so, what was the disposition of his trial?
            And
            > if he was not tried, why not? I never understood Wirz's
            execution
            > by itself for what happened at Andersonville, while not holding
            > accountable the Confederate authorities that he answered to, who
            at
            > the minimum were at least equally responsible. Thanks.
            > George.
            >
            >
            > --- In 20thMass@yahoogroup s.com, "Kevin Frye"
            > <Frye@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi Gang,
            > > Sorry for the previous posting as I thought it was going
            > private to Coly. Guess I better introduce myself. My name is
            Kevin
            > Frye and I am a local part time historian and volunteer for the
            > National Park Service at Andersonville National Historic Site. I
            > have been here as a volunteer for more than 10 years and can
            answer
            > any question,, well nearly any question you might think of about
            > Andersonville. If I cant answer it, I will research and find the
            > answer if its available. I have a copy of the park database here
            at
            > my home which not only has details on those from the 20th who
            were
            > and still are here but also has more than 41000 records of those
            > held as POW at Andersonville. My offer for FREE research for the
            > asking is simply an email away. If you prefer me to answer in a
            > private email, or publicly to this forum for all to share, just
            let
            > me know.
            > >
            > > Kevin Frye
            > > Andersonville Historian / NPS Volunteer
            > > www.angelfire. com/ga2/Anderson villeprison/
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you,
            > > Jesus Christ and the American G I.
            > >
            > > One died for your soul, the other for your freedom
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
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            >
            >
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            10/19/2007 5:10 AM
            >


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          • Kevin Frye
            If your speaking of www.angelfire.com/ga2/Andersonvilleprison/ then yes I am involved. It is 100 % my website. Kevin Thank you again for your response and
            Message 5 of 11 , Oct 20, 2007
              If your speaking of www.angelfire.com/ga2/Andersonvilleprison/  then yes I am involved.   It is 100 % my website.
               
              Kevin
               
               
               
              Thank you again for your response and detailed information! Are you
              also involved with the touching and well-done Andersonville
              website? If so, it is excellent, and I will visit it often. Thanks
              again.
              George.

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