93! ... I m sorry if I phrased my reply so badly as to imply that Crowley deserved credit for any of Leo s work - that was not my intention at all. I onlyMessage 1 of 88 , Apr 22, 2009View Source93!
tom chaudoin wrote:
>I'm sorry if I phrased my reply so badly as to imply that Crowley
> 93 Boys,
> RIKB wrote
> >It's worth pointing out that his system isn't really "his" system. The
> >attribution of trigrams to letters is Crowley's - in fact, it is the
> >only system that uses letter attributions made by the Prophet who
> >received Liber AL - and the idea of interpreting the trigrams as base 3
> >numbers also was not Leo's.
> It is also worth pointing out that in Crowley's own footnotes
> regarding TEQ cipher
> he states that he thought it wasn't 'worth much', to paraphrase. It is
> Leo who has extrapolated
> greatly what the Prophet himself seems to have overlooked. Leo has
> done an amazing job
> collating years of data, this should be chalked up to him, not
> backdated to Crowley like he
> was King Wen or something.
deserved credit for any of Leo's work - that was not my intention at
all. I only wanted to point out that the Trigrammaton system was not
invented out of whole cloth like mine or Tim's or NAEQ/ALW or any of the
many other systems out there. The attributions of letters to trigrams
*are* Crowley's, and there's only one really straightforward and
sensible way to read the trigrams as numbers. Of course, Crowley said
"no qabalah of merit [had] arisen" from his attributions because he
never made the connection between the trigrams and numbers, but it's not
an innovation of Leo's. Joachim Bouvet realized in the late 1600s that
the Fu Xi arrangement of I-Ching hexagrams was the equivalent of
Leibniz's binary notation. Any student of I-Ching and the Western
history of mathematics would find it perfectly logical to make the
connection between Trigrammaton and base 3, and Leo was not the first to
do so (when you think about it, it's kind of shocking that Crowley
himself didn't make the connection). Leo was the first Thelemite to put
the two pieces together - and it's a good thing, because I can't imagine
another person more suited by intellectual temperament and education to
realize the full implications of what he'd found. When you say that Leo
extrapolated, yes, that's the whole point. No one else has even
extrapolated. To reference another noted extrapolator, there's a pointed
difference between standing on the shoulders of giants and thinking you
Aside from all that, I don't think Leo would take offense at being
called the Duke of Zhou. I'd take Duke of Zhou. ;-)
Anyway, in the context of what you were saying about aggrandizement, I
felt it was important to point those things out, because I've never
found Leo to be self-aggrandizing.
>Very true, but the point I want to emphasize is that many other people
> >that certainly *is* pure genius...but the most I've heard
> >him crow about is the power, elegance, and beauty of the system itself,
> >which no sensible person could really disagree with.
> No disagreement here, however, again it is Leo who discovered this
> power, beauty and excellence,
> not Crowley.
could have easily discovered the same thing (although, as I say, I think
Leo is uniquely suited to realize its full implications) - just like,
for example, Poincaré very nearly formulated special relativity first,
or like Leibniz independently discovered Calculus. This doesn't detract
from Leo's brilliance any more than it detracts from Einstein's or
Newton's. If Tim Moss had been killed in a bizarre gardening accident at
the age of 12, no one else would ever come up with the Sin Key because
the Sin Key is based on a number of completely ad-hoc requirements that
are important to (or turned out to be convenient for) Tim Moss. TEQ is
much more firmly based on Thelemic history, scripture, and tradition; it
has greater resonance in the context of what I guess I'm forced to call
"orthodox" Thelema (I'd prefer to just say "Thelema," but for some
reason there seems to be some confusion about what that means). Of
course, anyone is free to reject the importance of that, but it seems
kind of silly that people who purport to be Thelemites would find it
Thelema93, herupakraath, Joel & All, Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. ... N = Death. M = The Hanged Man A = The Fool ... Hope this relates.Message 88 of 88 , Jun 12, 2009View SourceThelema93, herupakraath, Joel & All,
Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.
>> There has never been a satisfactory answerJoel wrote:
>> provided for the nature of the Three Grades of
>> Thelema named in verse I:40 of the Book of the
> The word AMN is used in the Book of theN = Death.
> Law and could be argued to relate to the
> Three Grades.
M = The Hanged Man
A = The Fool
>Hope this relates. I've been thinking about those
> The Fool, Death and the Hermit are mentioned
> by name in the Book of the Law. The Fool easily
> corresponds to the Man of Earth, Death offers a
> more difficult association to the Lovers and the
> Hermit speaks for itself. If you count the Nun
> as it's final value, the total value for the word
> AMN = 741. AMN is said to conceal the elements
> via the number 741. The values for Aleph for
> Air =1, Mem for Water =40, Shin for Fire = 300
> and Tau for Earth = 400. AMShTh = 741 = AMN.
>Hope this relates,
Hermits. Crowley's Tarot deck depiction's nothing
like AL's. Crowley's Hermit's seething, disgusted,
hateful, crazed vengeful, sinister spell caster - feh!
I can really relate to the guy, it's easy to see, been
a LONG time since he saw beds of purple. This
is a LARGE discrepancy.
I've gotten the idea, The Hermit, The Lover, and the
man of the Earth is a Magical Formula. Happened
to drop by oldsaintnick11's place the other day, grabbed
some "Levels of Dark Matter". According to Mr. Super
Tarot, "change in three fundamental ways is known
as the three gunas - one energy appearing in three
forms: Sattva, Rajas, and Tamas", & ten Karmas,
Whomsoever'd like to help me out here, please feel
welcome. I'm amidst new seas. Abash as thou wilt.
Hermes HGA Poimandres, "The Divine Pymander",
describes one energy appearing in 3 Forms: Life,
Light & Word."
"The Word of God that appeared as a pillar of flame
out of the darkness is the Son of God, born of the
mystery of the Mind. The name of that Word is
Reason. Reason is the offspring of Thought, and
Reason shall divide the Light from the darkness
and establish Truth in the midst of the waters."
"Nature beholding the descent, wrapped Herself
about the man whom She Loved, and the two were
"Understand, O Hermes, and meditate deeply upon
the mystery. That which in you sees and hears is
not of the Earth, but is the Word of God incarnate.
The union of the Word and the Mind produces that
mystery. The Supreme Mind Loved the man. The
Word was Reason, and by the Reason of the Word
invisible things were made manifest. Man is the
Sphere of Generation and the 2nd Mind."
"Man fell in love with his own shadow and desired
to descend into it. Coincident with desires, the
Intelligent Thing united Itself with the unreasoning
image or shape."
The Hermit - Reason - (The Word) - Sattva - Maintain
The Lover - Fire - (Son of Striving) - Rajas - Create
The man of the Earth - (Form) - Tamas - Destroy
Poimandres said: "man has the Power of Seven
Governors plus Life, Light & Word, 8 rings of Fire,
7 Harmonies - Musical Notes (Harmonics), 7 Planets,
7 Wheels (Orbits), Circles, 7 Species, 7 Races."
Each of the Governors gave each man a share of
Its own Nature."
"The 1st Ring sits on the Moon; The Ability to
Increase or Division. 2nd Mercury; Craftiness.
Deceit. 3rd Venus; Lust & Passion. 4th Sun;
Ambitions. 5th Mars; Boldness. 6th Jupiter;
Riches. 7th Saturn; Falsehoods. 8th; Ring
of Fixed Stars."
"Orbits control the World by Mystical Powers
called Destiny - man is controlled by Fate &
1. Do - Shanti - Peace
2. Ra - Pushti - Wealth
3. Mi - Vashikaran - Control
4. Fa - Istambaran - Paralyzing
5. So - Jazambhan - Change Behavior
6. La - Mohan - Attraction Hypnotism
7. Ti - Akarsha - Action - Attraction - Faraway
8. Uchcalatan - Fear - Cause Doubt
9. Vidweshan - Division
10. Maran - Death - Cause Death
"Let the man endued with a Mind mark, consider,
and learn of himself, and with the Power of the Mind,
divide himself from his not-self and become a Sense
of Reality. For the beginning and the ending are in
the same place and state".
Hermes asked "The Intelligent Thing" if all men
did not have Minds, and the Great Dragon replied:
'Take heed what you say, for I am the Mind."
Hermes wrote 10 Books of Heratic Laws, Goals and
Training. 36 Books Philosophy + 6 Medical = 42.
I'd like to structure our Books like Hermisses.
"The punishment of desire is the agony of un-fulfillment".
Love is the Law, Love under Will.