--- 333 <nagasiva@...
> in general as i began to thereafter encounter the
> Thelemic community, as it calls itself, i had to
> admit that his writing did *not* merit that extra
> attention, and that it was a detour from SOME in
> occultism (proper into a backwater of
> post-Christian, nuveau-gnostic de facto Satanism, in
the same way
> that some get embroiled in Blavatsky, or Bailey, or
> any other order-based subsuming culture). this is
> what i have heard from some other Satanists of my
> acquaintance also, intellectuals and writers.
Personally, I find Thelema to be an 'umbrella term'
under which I corral Christianity, Daoism, Tibetan
Bhuddism, Vedic thought, NLP, Scientology,General
Semantics, Bucky Fullerism, and a host of other
minutiae borrowed from other writers and systems all
of which support my will. I too find the Thelemic
'satanist-lackey' to be missing the mark by a fair
distance largely due to orthodox shackling to AC's
Through my own explorations, I have found that
performing Crowley's ritual system by rote can lead to
something akin to damnation, for some, this may be a
desirable state, in that, certain points of view and
arrangements of cosmology are available.
At the end of the day I would have to contend that
Crowley is worth a second look, perhaps his
innovations in classical systems are dismissable,
however, almost no other author in prior history had
written such a large body of work on the subject and
such an influential. Arguably, the popularity that
Wicca, Magick and the popular interest in the occult
that we enjoy today would not have occured without the
influence of his literary contributions. By example,
tomes like 777 and the Book of Thoth are works of
unaparalelled genius, which explore and instruct the
QBLH and the Tarot in a manner which few have matched
However, looking at Crowley the man, one cannot
dismiss the unsavory aspects of his character and
certain behaviors. You cant sugarcoat eating turds I
guess, but you can try. Yet, where does that leave us,
his heirs, to look for our own ethical conduct? The
answer, in my opinion,
is we cannot judge the 'message by the man':
A Scientology writer named Filbert coined a term
called an 'ascencion experience' in which a person can
vault themselves into a creative fugue state, a state
which allows them to write or create on level which
temporarily supersedes their own personal ethics and
abilities. He cited examples like Ben Franklin and
Thomas Jefferson and their writing among others. I
think this idea cxan be readily applied to the
phenomena of 'channeling' and can also account for a
person like Crowley transmitting a large body of
inspired writing which traveled beyond his own
personal standard of behavior and ethics. Nonetheless,
I couldnt advocate Crowley as a 'role model', his
status as a prophet has nothing to do with his
personal behavior, rather, it exists in spite of them.
> this also informs your assessment of "a minority
> within a minority". insofar as Thelema is a religion
> it is a minority. some religions overlap with magic
> and the larger category of occultism to a point,
> but they *never* subsume it, and often contend
> against facets of occultism which they deem
> to be immoral, incompetent, or nonextant
> ("a waste of time or energy").
Within Thelema, there seem to be minorities within
minorites themselves, as we by example who research EQ
we continue to be such a minority. Practicing Magick,
by definition, denotes a minority. Things like the
'Secret Cheifs' also by defintion, are a minority.
Being a magician lends one to a one type of minority
"Thus ye have star and star, system and system..."
seems to denote minorities...."let not one know well
the other." ALso seems to speak to the fact there need
be no oversight on said minorites, amen to that!
> as a religion, Thelema's overlap with occultism
> tends toward that of the Golden Dawn and its
> pecadillos, including ceremonialism and masonry.
> these (particularly the latter) could eliminate
> occultism completely without damaging their
> primary components (when anti-magic or anti-
> divination religions get in charge of them,
> occultism of these kinds has been eradicated
> within their orders or masonic lines, as with
> some Rosicrucians).
Indeed, OTO as an orthodoxy with real power could end
genuine and objective research into things like EQ and
TEQ. No evolution of systems taking place, no
improvement, just another 2400 years of "Glory to
thee..." ad nauseum.
> Thelema need not be a religion.
> it may be easily seen as an enveloped genre of
> textual expression manifesting heavily during
> the turn to the 20th century in New Thought
> communications and amongst those employing
> will-focussed or will-force-centered ideologies
> at least of magic, if not of all human endeavours.
Thelema is a religion to the extent that deities are
recognized and worshipped by some Thelemites. Thelema
is also a desitic philosophy inasmuch as Gods are
addressed as natural and praeternatural concepts are
seen in the ligt of archetypes, etc. In my opinion,
Thelema should be the lathe upon which man places all
religions in order to 'plane down' a personal way of
looking at things and behaving.
Crowleyan Thelema is also a religion in that some
Thelemites seem to interpret certain aspects of AL and
the other Holy Books as prophetic.
Believing in a 'prophetic advent' would also qualify
as a religion. Therefore proponents of EQ almost
without exception believe that ALW is encrypted into
AL by Aiwass without the Prophet's knowledge, thus
proving its non-human origin, this too would
constitute religous aspects.
Rabeasian Thelema would seem to revolt at these very
ideas, regarding Thelema as some proto-nihilistic
application of deconstructing social convention. We
can see some of this application in Crowleyan Thelema,
but which seem today to serve to enforce the extant
> Pascal Beverly Randolph and WW Atkinson deserve
> far more emphasis within such a broader view, and
> tools such as EQ and Babalonian Hoopla Masses may
> take their place as artifices in cults of
> Crowleyanity whilst true Thelemites stream in to
> offering "self-development", "nerve-force
> generation",and "prosperity thinking", leaving
> cultists to their poverty and queer unpredictable
Well again here I must concede, I have gotten a wealth
of results from Clearing Technology, as far as I'm
concerned, it is a system of Magick.
From its proper applications, I no longer experience
poverty as a result of it. 'Queer circumstance' as you
call it, is not a plaguing experience to me. However,
that idea that ceremonial magicians are a poor,
scrounging lot who live in small weird little flats is
a rank sterotype which applies to the genre as a
whole, not just Thelema or the OTO or its like orders.
In point of fact, I've known a handful of rich
Thelemites, some of us do have money and
accomplishment in life. However, I do not feel that
mundane riches are not a sign of attainment.
There are modern innovations which I dont think the
working magician should ignore, but that is another
lengthy post. :-)
> as such, occult expression on this which is
> being quite ignored by the zealots of the
> Beast is occulting the essential writ on
> volitional philosophy in a wider sense, and
> what may have a better grounding than could
> be expected from an addled laird's witty writ.
I disgree, I think Crowley's writings can and do serve
as a lens to wider philosophical inquiry, I've seen
too many personal examples of this.
>as long as QBLs are things that can be constructed,
>rather than, say, cosmic information of import to the
>central cosmic authority, or precise cosmograms by
>supreme natural designer, then the first graft from
>Kabbalah would be a stand-in, regardless of the cult.
Well, we continue to argue that EQ does in fact exist
within the text of AL without AC's knowledge. This
doesn't discount any other 'order and value' of the
English ALphabet, that Crowley himself knew. This
cipher is a solution to grid page (chap III, v 47) in
which the text states plain that Crowley ('no beast)
shall divine. These too qualify as parts of a
religion, yet we arent enforcing these things as an
orthodoxy. There seems to be a more scientific
approach to the idea of a 'religion' than is most
climes. Its a paradox.
>the OTO doesn't put them up to it, does it?
>I'm a member and we've never differed on the
>matter of your (or others') EQ, except that
>i don't want it to eclipse its logical and
When the ALW key was first suggested to Crowley by
Achad, he revolted at it, and so, here we all are ,
however, in spite of this, EQ has yielded a complete
system of initiation via its unveiling of timed
astrological sex magick. These kinds of workings,
informed by EQ, have been going on for about 35-40
years now, creating an alternative sect. ALW can be
considered an extension of the traditional base ten
QBLH in many ways, it too is a 'logical system' in so
much it is a tautology, as is Kaballah is a tautology,
magick is a tautology, Hell, even math is a tautology.
So, trying to render the virtues of one system being
more 'logical' than another is rather moot based upon
the grounds that each is self contained and
self-suppporting. As I've experienced it, working with
EQ facilitates greater understanding of the classical
Which brings up another point, its also true that
there were alternate systems of Hebrew gematria in use
(such as 1-22), the base ten/final value ('9 chamber')
QBLH that we are classically accustomed to was
popularized by the Victorian/Edwardian magicians. How
are we to dismiss the advent of a Greek and Arabic
QBLH as well, should proponents of these systems
militate against each other relentlessly as to who is
I'm an OTO member also. ;->
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