Congratulation Heidi! You made my day! You are better than Vasmer! He mentioned Lith.Message 1 of 1 , Apr 17, 2008View Source
Congratulation Heidi! You made my day! You are better than Vasmer!He mentioned Lith. gaudiuÌ, gausti Ð·Ð²ÑÑÐ°ÑÑ ( buzz, drone) thinking it was akin to the Russian word 'Ð³Ð¾Ð²Ð¾Ñ'; John Atkinson cited it uncritically in one of his messages to my "Cybalist" topic.
MHG. 'gewern' sound the same as modern English 'govern'
gewahr (aware, cognisant), Gebärde (gesture)
Greek ÎºÏ Î²ÎµÏÎ½Ï (govern, be in power)
OCS Ð³Ð¾Ð²Ð¾ÑÑ/govor - speech, speaking, talk; Pol. gwar, Czech hovor.
Let us go a little bit farther: English GUARD <=> WARD; OE weardian
Serbian UGOVORITI (agree upon) <=> UTVRDITI (to get AGREED)
Serbian GOVORITI (talk) <=> UGOVORITI (agree upon) <=> U-TVRDITI (allege, assert, uphold)
Serbian UT-VRDA, VARDA, TVRDAVA, UTVRDENJE (castle, stronhold, citadel);
TVRDNJA, TVRDENJE (assertion)
Lithuanian TVIRTOVE (citadel; Serb. tvrdava) => Lithuanian TVIRTINTI (assert; Serb. tvrditi)
Serbian TVRD (hard) <=> Lithuanian TVIRTAS (hard)
Serbian UDVARATI (woo, court); 'udvarati' is in fact the same as UGOVARATI (in this case: arrange marriage)
Serbian VRDATI (quibble) <=> IZ-GOVOR
Kuo tamsta vardu? What is your name?
Lithuanian VARDAS (name).
Serbian CUVAR (keeper) <=> English KEEPER
English WARDEN <=> VRATAR (porter, keeper); from Serbian DVER (door),
DOVRATAK, VRATA (door), Greek ÎÎ¥Î¡Î` (gate), German TÜR, Sanskrit DVARAM (door), Skt. APA-VRITAM (wide open), Serb. OTVOR (opening), Latvian DURVIS (door; this Latvian word could be the cognate of Slavic DRVO (tree); the doors are generally made of wood), Latv. ATVERT (open), Latv. TURET (keep), Latv. AIT-KOPIS (shepherd) Lithuanian DURYS (door), ATVERTI (open); Hebrew KEBES (lamb, sheep, young ram); Serbian KOBASA, KOBASICA (shepherd's food)
Serb. OT-VARATI (open) => Serb. OD-GO-VARATI (answer, respond)
Serbian TABOR (camp), CADOR, ATOR (tent) - all coming from DVOR (house) and STVORITI (make, create); we can see here that the Serbian number CETIRI, CETVORO (four, Greek ÏÎÏÏÎµÏÎ±, ÏÎÏÎ±ÏÏÎ¿Ï, Latin QUATTUOR, Turkish dört, German vier from Serb. DVOR, English TOWER, Lat. turris, English town DOVER?; cf. above Serb. TVRDAVA castle, fortress) apeared from the noun DVOR (house) or CADOR (tent) taking in account the four sides of the house or tent.
Serbian KUBURA (trouble), KUBURENJE (coping with troubles), BORENJE (fighting, combat)
Serbian GO-VORENJE (speech, talk); UD-VARANJE (wooing, condescending talk); hence Serbian VARANJE (cheating), IZNE-VERITI from IZ-GNE- VERITI (betry).
The main problem is to see is the Serbian word 'govor' originating from the compound word PRE-GO-VOR (PRO-GO-VORITI, PRO-Z-BORITI start to utter, speak) or PRE-GO-VARATI (discuss, negotiate). Another, almost forgotten Serbian word is specially interesting - it is PRO-TA- BORITI (to chat; Serbian "dola je da koju protabori" (she came for a lettle chat). This word connects DVOR (house) and GOVOR (speech); hence TVRDAVA, UTVRDENJE (fortress) and TVRDNJA, TVRDENJE (assertion)
Of course, my intention here is not to bring some apriori conclusions. The above words are only a material for an eventual (more serious) reaserche in the future.
Heidi wrote: ON ...two...it takes at least two for there to exist an assertion... one to assert and one to hear it. A "a tveirtove" could be a two towered citadel. It takes at least to make fast or hard an agreement.
OIsl. tviræði (ambiguity); in fact tvi (two) reiða (attendance, service); this sounds close to Serbian dvored (two-arrayed or two- raw);
(attendance, service) is the same word as Serbian (work, service)
OIsl. tveir (tvr, tvau) and
OIsl. vörðr (warder; Serb. vratar)
OIsl. orð word; Serb. oriti (speak, resound), Lat. orator (speaker)
OIsl. prédika (preach; Serb. pridika)
"koma á rðu við..." (to enter into talk with); German reden (talk) - Serb. go-voriti (speak) => Serb. oriti (speak), Ger. Wort => OIsl. orð (word); if we compare all these words and if we know that the both part of the Serbian word 'prego-varati' (negotiate) came from 'obra´cati' (invoke) i.e. 'pricati' (talk) or 'pridikovati' (preach) we shall see that their basis was BR-GON (opposite driving)... in case of the Serb. 'pre-go-vara-nje' (negotiation) we have the same basis reduplicated (br-gon-br-gon).
Although this process seems complicated it is very simple in its essence. Tomorrow I will try to explain the way in which Slavic and Germanic words are indivisible related. OE weorð; Serb. vredan (worthy)
ON verðr - we see that Old Norse "worth" is R suffixed in the same way as above 'tveir' (tvai); what is the meaning of that R?
The problem is that we do not know from which "root" the Slavic 'govor' sprang . Pokorny would say it was the root *gou- (*goue-, *gu-, *gow-), but it is wrong because it coresponds to Old Indian 'gavate' (to sound), Serb. 'zvuk' (sound), 'zovnuti' (call) and 'zvanje' (profession, title); of course, it demands more profound explanation, which will connect Latin 'aqua' and Serbian 'kovanje' (coin, hammering), 'jeka' (echo!) and 'od-je- kivanje' (reecho)...
The basis here was GON-BEL-GON ;-) or in the world of "erudits" it would be close to *berg- because Slavic 'govor' was a compound word 'go-vor', in reality reduced from 'preko-vor' (Serb. prica story, 'pricati' speak, talk, preach!; Serb. pridika (preach!; German predigen!; Serb. prego-vori negotiations, literally "speach fight"; here we can see that 'voriti' in Slavic 'go-voriti' is equal to English 'war', i.e. Serb. boriti fight).
I know that the majority of the participants on this list is not able to understand what I am talking about; especially those who are deeply swamped in "scientific" contemplation and who are not unable to see that the diachronic development of words can be resolved only if we start our researches first with semantic than logic and if we include phonetic changes in the end. I would say we began from the wrong end and it was the reason why linguistic science made a little progress from its first steps, 2 centuries ago.
In Serbian 'kubura' is old fashioned pistol, handgun and it never meant 'holster'. I was surprised when I found the meaning 'holster' in Serbian - English online dictionaries.
On the bottom of the page you can see the picture of that old-fashioned gun (Ethnographic Museum in Belgrade).
Kubura also has the meaning 'trouble', 'struggle' In fact, I wanted to see is there any possible relation among these German and Serbian words.
English war and word! Are these two words mutually related and are they related with German Wehr (protection, defense)?
Serbian 'z-borit-i' - 'go-worit! (talk, speak); boriti (fight), pregovarati (negotiate), progovoriti (start to talk); preko (over), prica (story), progo-voriti = proca-vrljati = po-pricati (talk, speak, converse);
Gewähr and Serb. govor (speech, talk)?