Since you mentioned about Japan.... I agree that even if Japanese people are not Christian and most don t want to believe in any religion or they remainMessage 1 of 11 , Jul 31, 2002View SourceSince you mentioned about Japan.... I agree that even if
Japanese people are not Christian and most don't want to
believe in any religion or they remain Atheist. (other
religions also exist in Japan) They are respectful, kind
and love their country and traditions. They are also
concerned about "What others may think about them " so
"reputation" is a very important facade. Political
Scandals by Public servants are always headlines here
and it is good that these are tackled as important concerns
that people have got to know and this is admirable here.
The efficiency of Public Service is also admirable here.
I can inumerate so many of it.............. but even with
all these admirable facts and as you mentioned that JAPAN
IS RICH ........... well, I can say Japan being a rich country
has also it's "worse moral problems" within its society.
With all its richness, Young people are lost and suicides
had increased this year...... both young and old.
"Loss of meaning in life??????????? "
It's not easy....... to judge societies by its richness
because try living for a while in rich countries and you
will also see its "degradation" I guess, we have to find
the "middle way". Balance and harmony of life.
Money cannot buy it all and in fact, remembering,
my sociology class..... Generally, Filipinos are people
who loves harmony. In the 1960's we are able to have a
balance life....... family, work, decent life, a shelter,
food and friends. In fact, Filipinos, are more knowledgeable
with organic and herbal medicines than in any rich country
(interview the old people in the villages) and only now here
in Japan they learn to appreciate "garlic" and learn about
its medical contribution to the body" And also here, people
are returning organic ways of planting and even producing
organic plants alternative to medicine and daily life use.
Consumers are also aware of choosing organic or non-chemical
planted vegetables. Recycling is also becoming an alternative
business here as Japan try its best also to be self-sustainable
economically. May pag-asa pa siguro..... sana bumalik tayo sa
ating magagandang kinagisnang mana na karunugan sa ating
mga lolo at lola!
... Yup, it s a fact among Japanese - suicide. I also read about some of their young lady (mostly students) who are working as prostitutes even though they areMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 1, 2002View Source"Akira and Luisa Kobayashi" <ak-lu540@t...> wrote:
> Japan being a rich country has also it'sYup, it's a fact among Japanese - suicide. I also read
> "worse moral problems" within its society.
> With all its richness, Young people are lost and suicides
> had increased this year...... both young and old.
> "Loss of meaning in life??????????? "
about some of their young lady (mostly students) who
are working as prostitutes even though they are not
really starving but they just want to have their own
extra money. This is also the case in other developed
countries. They want MORE than what others have and
they start corrupting. So, there's no real Utopia,
all system of governments have their own advantages and
disadvantages. We need to pick up the good ones....
> Recycling is also becoming an alternative business hereThis is what we always mention here in our club.
> as Japan try its best also to be self-sustainable
I wish that government officials can read our posts and
start building recycling factories as projects to create
jobs and at the same time it can help clean our environment.
> May pag-asa pa siguro.....May pagasa pa rin Kaibigan------ Magbago lang ang mga pananaw
ng mga Pilipino para sa ikabubuti ng Bayan at hindi para sa
sariling kapakanan o kapangyarihan lamang.
Because "we have seen ourselves made into servants of EGOISTs",
"we should" not ourselves "become egoists.... but should rather
see to it that egoists become impossible. We want to turn them
all into ragamuffins, we want no one to possess anything,
in order that 'ALL' should be possessors. So say the
social [liberals]. Who is this person whom you call `all'?
It is `SOCIETY'"----- (from Marx book)
See that none render evil for evil unto any man;
but ever follow that which is GOOD,
both among yourselves, and to ALL MEN-----
~1 Thessalonians 5:15
Aren t you imposing your own values to others? We should remember that we can t impose our own belief system, values and culture to others. I am particularlyMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 11, 2002View SourceAren't you imposing your own values to others? We should remember
that we can't impose our own belief system, values and culture to
others. I am particularly responding to your idea, " they start
for the people,
--- In Patriots_of_the_Philippines@y...,
> "Akira and Luisa Kobayashi" <ak-lu540@t...> wrote:
> > Japan being a rich country has also it's
> > "worse moral problems" within its society.
> > With all its richness, Young people are lost and suicides
> > had increased this year...... both young and old.
> > "Loss of meaning in life??????????? "
> marl0 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> Yup, it's a fact among Japanese - suicide. I also read
> about some of their young lady (mostly students) who
> are working as prostitutes even though they are not
> really starving but they just want to have their own
> extra money. This is also the case in other developed
> countries. They want MORE than what others have and
> they start corrupting. So, there's no real Utopia,
> all system of governments have their own advantages and
> disadvantages. We need to pick up the good ones....
> Because "we have seen ourselves made into servants of EGOISTs",
> "we should" not ourselves "become egoists.... but should rather
> see to it that egoists become impossible. We want to turn them
> all into ragamuffins, we want no one to possess anything,
> in order that 'ALL' should be possessors. So say the
> social [liberals]. Who is this person whom you call `all'?
> It is `SOCIETY'"----- (from Marx book)
> See that none render evil for evil unto any man;
> but ever follow that which is GOOD,
> both among yourselves, and to ALL MEN-----
> ~1 Thessalonians 5:15
Thanks for your posts :^). It s also my words..... What is appropriate in other counries may not be appropriate in the Philippines. I don t think one societyMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 12, 2002View SourceThanks for your posts :^).
It's also my words.....
What is appropriate in other counries may not be appropriate
in the Philippines. I don't think one society should be able
to impose it's VALUES on another.
But we have our own FREEWILL..... WE can CHOOSE what to accept,
reject or ignore :^).
It's acceptable that Marxism is not the true socialism, since
most of the ideologies and systems that we (Westeners, Africans
or Asians) are using today, came from the old Greek philosophies,
where Marx also based his theories. But I believe that these
different branches of SOCIALISMS (as you said) today are ALL
BASED on Marx theories. Well, I'm NOT an expert of Socialism(s),
I'm still studying it and it's interesting in a way.
I'm ALSO for the people,
> > marl0 <no_reply@y...> wrote:
> > So, there's no real Utopia,
> > all system of governments have their own advantages and
> > disadvantages. We need to pick up the good ones....
> > ==============================================================
> > Because "we have seen ourselves made into servants of EGOISTs",
> > "we should" not ourselves "become egoists.... but should rather
> > see to it that egoists become impossible. We want to turn them
> > all into ragamuffins, we want no one to possess anything,
> > in order that 'ALL' should be possessors. So say the
> > social [liberals]. Who is this person whom you call `all'?
> > It is `SOCIETY'"----- (from Marx book)
> > See that none render evil for evil unto any man;
> > but ever follow that which is GOOD,
> > both among yourselves, and to ALL MEN-----
> > ~1 Thessalonians 5:15
Ganundin ang mga komunista na hindi nila puedeng ipilit sa mga pilipino ang kanilang mga ideolohiya. Iba ang utak ni Karl Marx, at iba din ang utak ni Mao TseMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 12, 2002View SourceGanundin ang mga komunista na hindi nila puedeng ipilit sa mga
pilipino ang kanilang mga ideolohiya. Iba ang utak ni Karl Marx,
at iba din ang utak ni Mao Tse Tung sa utak ng mga pilipinong hindi
na nga maintindihan kung ano sila papasukan pa ng mga ideolohiyang
wala naman talagang nakakaintindi kundi iyong imbentor niyon. Tapos
iyong mga kabisote naman akala mo alam na alam na nila ang minemoriya
lang pala nila sa mga aklat na binabasa nila dahil pagdating sa gawa
ay wala rin sinabi. Iyong mga nabilog naman ay mamumundok at manunulisan
at binibiktima iyong mga mahihirap na naiipit na nga sa dalawang bato!
Dapat nang tayong mag-isip ng sariling atin, kahit na ideolohiyang
mas tama ang tugma sa pag-iisip nating mga Pilipino. Hindi iyong
bubuhayin pa ang patay na ideolohiya dahil walang kuwenta.
Mas gugustuhin ko pang gayahin ang disiplina ng mga hapon o basahin
si Rizal para lalo kong maintindihan kung bakit tayo ganito ngayon!
We need to pick-up the good ones... there s no problem at all in picking-up the good ones... there are so many of them around... it IS US, VOTERS who do notMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 12, 2002View SourceWe need to pick-up the good ones... there's no
problem at all in picking-up the good ones... there
are so many of them around... it IS US, VOTERS
who do not want the good ones because in election
time we put our hearts in our heads. We use our
emotion that we easily get-suckered into their
The new generation of voters should be able to
use their heads... to rule over their body... if they
don't, then, they would start bickering again, and
that would be our problem, our seemingly endless
Well, I m NOT an expert of Socialism(s), ... You are an expert. All of us are intellectuals, organic intellectuals (Gramsci) :-) a Marxist. Yes Marxism isMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 13, 2002View Source"Well, I'm NOT an expert of Socialism(s),
> I'm still studying it and it's interesting in a way."You are an expert. All of us are intellectuals, organic intellectuals
(Gramsci) :-) a Marxist.
Yes Marxism is interesting. Yes, you are right that even the so
called "democratic ideals" came from the Enlightenment (Modernity
thesis). It is also safe to say that the origin of dialectical method
is simply based on the evolutionary course of human logic. We have
the thesis where dialogoue begins. Say, you are for capitalism and I
am for socialism, I presented my ideology as socialism, then you
presented the anti-thesis, an opposite of my thesis.
From the comparison of these two theses come the synthesis of
knowledge, a new thesis of a higher level of quality, then again new
anti-thesis comes out so that we keep reaching for higher levels of
quality in our opinions.
We are here, creating "magic" "the magic of dialogue. For me, it is
not important if you are right or wrong, what is important is
whether we have a procedure that gives us benefit in our dialogue
This is one of the points of dialectical. Can you not relate yourself
as a Filipino in that particular Marxist idea?
Now, materialism is self explanatory. Simple. Everything that exists
is explained by REASON and the law of nature and logic. Look closely,
if this is foreign to you as a Filipino- Laws of nature and logic
are not static logic but continuously re-shaping logic in the
boudaries of nature and reality.
Well, so you can see from dialectical materialism, the nature of
reality, reality that for example, rejects religious dogmas and the
essence of the invented "god".
Do not get me wrong, common perception of those against Marx and
Socialism is that Socialists are godless creatures. NO. Socialisms
support True religion. In the Philippines, Magbabaya is god the
Supreme Being their theological principle is liberation theology of
nourishing not just the spirit but the body and their prayers is to
help the poor becuase God himself says, "If what ever you have done
to the least of your breathren, you have done it unto me" (True God
of the poor).
I can explain the relevant of Marxism to the Philippines and the
Filipinos. Just ask me :-)
Thanks for the warm(hot) welcome:-)
I think Marxist ideology is not an alien ideology as far as the Filipinos are concerned. I understand where you are coming from but let me explain:-) using oneMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 13, 2002View SourceI think Marxist ideology is not an alien ideology as far as the
Filipinos are concerned. I understand where you are coming from but
let me explain:-) using one of my writings:
The Centrality of False Consciousness and Cultural Power
False reality or "false consciousness" is one of the core
concepts of Marxist tradition. "Religion, especially fundamentalist
Christianity, remains the obvious example of "false consciousness,"
with the anxieties and unhappiness of the everyday world being
displaced to an illusory realm.
The rereading of Marx's ideas about "false consciousness" had an
immense impact on cultural studies, especially when Marx pointed out
in "The German Ideology "(Chapter 19) that we will only discover the
true cultural aspects from the moment of production and the
historical aspects, that produced the same.
Marx refers to cultural history as tied with economic determinism
and culture as a strong political force. The use of this concept
refers to the way in which people's systematically misunderstand
their social experience and this undermines their power to liberate
themselves from subordination and being able to design their own
I was thinking and relating Marxist argument to the famous Marxist
gibe, " Religion is the opiate of the people" as he says,"Religious
distress is the same time the expression of real distress and also
the protest against real distress. Religion is the sight of the
oppressed creatures, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is
the spirit of spiritless conditions. It is the opium of the people
(Marx, K., 1884)
In the Philippines, religion has acquired a total political dimension.
Religion has drugged the poor people into submission, no
matter how miserable, with the promise of a pie in the sky. Get
hungry now and eat in the right hand of the father in heaven.
This is a good example of mystification as a political weapon.
Religious classes that are the conduits of the economic dominant
class are just nourishing the spirit and not the body. The concept
of "false consciousness" is also found in the Preface and
Introduction to a Contribution to the Critique of Political Economy,
where Marx asserts that this "consciousness" must be explained by the
contradictions of material life
Marx argues that each significant moment of history is constructed
around a particular mode of production. Each mode of production
brings into being different ways to produce the necessities of life
but also produces different social institutions including cultural
Go figure using the Philippines' religious culture as the song I
heard, Santong Aso - Banal na Kabayo :-) hilarious isn't it?
for the people,
PS: next post I'll explain the relevant of Marxism in terms of the
Philippines economic system :-)
Rizal was totally against the revolution. Filipinos went through TOGETHER with Bonifacio even with Rizal s vehement opposition, the Filipinos won and wereMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 13, 2002View SourceRizal was totally against the revolution. Filipinos went through
TOGETHER with Bonifacio even with Rizal's vehement opposition, the
Filipinos won and were admired by other nationalities because they
were the first group of colonised people in Southeast Asia who staged
a national revolution against the colonisers. Why is Rizal the
national hero? Ask the Americans:-)
Well, apply Marxist "false consciousness" to that idea.
> "Ganundin ang mga komunista na hindi nila puedeng ipilit sa mgaPilipino ang kanilang mga ideolohiya"
> "Hindi iyong bubuhayin pa ang patay na ideolohiya dahil walangkuwenta"
Well,in terms if ideologies, it is disappointing to see some people
echoing this tired right wing error. The fact that one event precedes
another historically does not establish a cause and effect
relationship. When economic circumstances create social upheaval
(like in the Philippines) that ultimately results in dictatorship,
there is often a socialist movement that recognises the economic
cause of the upheaval, and which fails to prevent the dictatorship
from rising to power. To separate socialist ideas from that idea
naturally leads to absurdity of our reasoning.
for the people,
You can t say that Rizal was totally against the revolution, or he would not be writing those propaganda or campaign for reforms that he thought should beMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 15, 2002View SourceYou can't say that Rizal was totally against the revolution, or he
would not be writing those propaganda or campaign for reforms that
he thought should be implemented first like a compulsory education
before Filipinos should be granted independence.
I would feel the same way he did about an armed revolution that must
be the hot issue during his time especially with the sad reality
that 400 years of foreign rule had divided the Filipinos, and any
attempt at taking up arms against Spain would be futile. And he was
right! It would take another century in fact before the Philippines
could be totally independent, and it would take a mountain (Mt.
Pinatubo)to do that! But look at how the Filipinos have wasted such
blessing from above by installing a US puppet who is not revealing
what kind of agreement she is making with the Americans in exchange
for monetary, etc. support for her candidacy in 2004, and who is
talking of returning the US bases even against the will of the
people, who have now a better understanding of how the Americans
mess up their affairs. I can puke at how she calls everybody against
the US bases and military presence "communists" even when they are
Nevertheless, I would prefer Rizal to Karl Marx. Rizal had a better
understanding of his people, and was recommending reforms that would
really be beneficial to them and fit their mentality. It's adopting
foreign ideas that they cannot even make use of that is the main
problem why Filipinos have retrogressed instead of progressing as
they have the potential to do. I do not buy the crap that it was
because of his passive resistance that the Americans chose Rizal to
be the national hero. My professor at UP used to say that but I did
not want to believe them. It was a good incentive to read Rizal,
Filipinos should be allowed to adopt an ideology of their own. Even
Mao Tse Tung did not swallow whole the teachings of Karl Marx, who
was teaching a godless ideology that surely will not fit the
religious and almost fanatical Filipinos. I would not recommend an
ideology that would even hinder progress.
In 1988, I visited Red China and was surprised to find a 50-year
behind China under a Communist regime. It was a great contrast to
the China of today that has returned to capitalism!!
Anything that restrict and suppress freedom as Communism does is not
an ideal ideology!!
Dear Dawn. Your statement, Anything that restrict and suppress freedom as Communism does is not an ideal ideology!! seems to me a characteristicallyMessage 1 of 11 , Aug 15, 2002View SourceDear Dawn.
Your statement, "Anything that restrict and suppress freedom as
Communism does is not an ideal ideology!!" seems to me a
characteristically "unenlightened" response that reflect more social
conditioning than scholarship.
Please understand, I do not intend this to be dismissive or
insulting. Few Filipinos or even Americans and even academics in
Harvard or Oxford have had the opportunity to study socialist theory
in a manner that would permit them to understand it on its own terms
or glean any understanding or benefit from it.
Americans and of course Filipinos (because of Americanism) have been
told not to consider it, they have been told what to think of it, and
they are for the most part blissfully ignorant of the substantial
contributions of socialists to both America and the world.
I would use a metaphor judging your post: A Catholic cannot
understand Islam by reading the Bible and will not understand it well
by a superficial reading of the Q'uran. Similarly, if people are
ignorant of socialism and out of touch with the reality of most
recent histories as a result.
I honestly think as I have studied and now lecturing different
political ideologies in a white middle class dominated university
that there is a great deal of relevant insight in the writings of
Socialists and Marxists.
For example, have you considered reading the relevant of Marxist
teachings about the Philippines, as a model of a colonial state of
affairs? It is a perfect example of how the colonisers' culture was
hegemonically imposed upon the people? Yes, Dawn, this is a strong
Marxist idea and I will explain it further:
The more than three hundred years of Spanish colonial rule made the
Philippines an exact image of Spain. The country was named after the
imperialist King Philip and one of the biggest provinces was named
after Queen Isabela. The Philippines is a replica of Spain. The
Spaniards did not just name the indigenous Filipino places after
Spain, but each and every Filipino was baptised and given Spanish
names. The Spaniards unloaded their cultural baggage, which was
instilled by a forceful insistence on their Christian values,
knowledge, behavioural attitudes and ways of understanding for
looking at the world around them.
The Spanish colonisers deliberately used the standard rhetoric of
colonialism under various guises, Monogamy ("clean sex, which has
value"), industrial capital ("clean" money which has value),
Christianity (" being washed in the blood of the lamb"),class
control ("cleansing the great unwashed"), and the imperial
civilising mission ("washing and clothing the savage").
The progressive Christian imperialism has deeply rooted in the
Filipino people's consciousness. The Bible has been an instrument for
the promotion of imagined ideas until they faced the world of purely
imagined reality. Yes, this is a strong Marxist thesis. Please read
the preface to the "Political Economy", "Grundrisse" and the "Preface
of Das Kapital".
The Ideological ascendancy of the indigenous ruling class and the
colonisers was attained in the Philippines through a process of
transition using what Antonio Gramsci calls Hegemonic Apparatsuses.
Apart from the church the apparatuses used include the education
system and eventually the media. These are the instruments used in
the propagation, institutionalisation and dissemination of ruling
class ideas. The ruling class over time gains even more power with
the (now) consent of the people without having to resort to coercion.
Yes, this is a powerful Marxist theory. How can you say that Marxist
teaching is not relevant to the Philippines?
Regarding Rizal, I am not denying his contribution but do not be
shocked of what I'm going to say:-) Because I studied Marxism,
Socialism, Neo Marxism and all Interwar Marxism and practically all
Political, social, cultural ideologies, from Liberalism,
Conservatism, Nationalism, Anarchism, Environmentalism, Feminism,
Ecofeminism ,Postructuralism, Postmodernism to Socialism/Marxism/Neo
Marxism, I would say that Rizal's work is a Marxist idea.
For example, when the situation before the actual revolution in
the Philippines was particularly delicate and revolutionaries were
extra careful, working underground because many native women were
married to the colonisers and thus became the conduits of colonial
policy. Many revolutionaries were pinpointed/uncovered, reported to
the colonisers by the Filipino Spanish collaborators.
However, similar to the hegemonic propagation of the imagined God
and angels, "Noli Me Tangere, written by then emerging intellectual,
Dr. Jose Rizal, a book of fiction seeps quietly and continuously into
reality, creating the remarkable confidence of community in anonymity
which is the hall mark of modern nations. This is a very strong
Poststructuralist Marxist idea!
Yes, Rizal's novel was written in 18th century but it can be
analysed using a Marxist Poststructuralist approach. In applying
Althusser's "symptomatic reading." It means double reading of text,
produce another meaning.
In double reading of Dr Jose Rizal's Noli Me Tangere, the various
characters in the novel are illusions but burying them dead so that
other characters come alive as Dr. Rizal sought to unearth. For
example, the character of Dona Victorina, a native woman who is
married to a coloniser behaves like a true colonial. She is
interested in only "things" colonial, pretends not to understand her
own people and regards herself as a true Spaniard by changing her
name to Dona Victorina.
Dona Victorina represents a colonised person who has distorted their
consciousness with a "colonial mentality," meaning, subservient
attitudes towards aping Spanish ways .Using Marxist Poststrcturalist,
Dona Victorina in the novel represents the Philippine's native elite,
collaborating with the Spaniards.
This is about reading a text using symptomatic reading of double
reading by Alhusser, a neo-Marxist who applied in his own
Poststrcturalist theory the method of Marx in reading the political
economy of Adam Smith .
Symptomatic reading is also applicable to those producing the text
(writers, poets, playwrights, filmmakers, and others) by describing
society's problems. Cecille Reyes Guidote's Master Thesis for
Trinity University in Dallas Texas is the same when she implemented
her ideas to Philippines. PETA was born. Everybody knows about that.
For clarity, Guidote used Poststrcturalist Marxist, "symptomatic "
Well I can relate Marxist teachings in all aspects of Philippine
society. Marx's "trivial things" for example, The Filipino women's
responsiveness to the "white men as ideal husbands" has a lot to do
with ideology and this cultural colonialism has played a great role
in shaping Filipino women's actions. That is for another day:-)
Well, even del Pilar's idea was a Marxist idea:-) as he says, "The
basis for what developed into what is now accepted as a
typically Filipino way of life and manner of viewing the world
was laid during the early years of Spanish occupation. As the
principal architects of the colonial edifice, the priests fashioned a
a theocratic society with religion as the core of Spanish cultural
control " (del Pilar, M. H, 1898).
The relevant of Socialism to the Philippines in terms of economics
is my main forte but I'm waiting for the right opportunity:-)
to be continued:-)