This is a long shot but i thought it would be worth a go.I will be
in Liverpool next year (sept 99) as a student and as such i am going
to attempt to introduce the sport of ultimate to the Mersey
community. Will anyone with experience of Ultimate (even people who
have only chucked around before) be living around that area and if
so, would it be possible to give me a hand to teach some people to
play. Also if any ultimate players know students in Liverpool who are
interested in playing, please ask them to get in touch.


Thanks for reading and any help is appreciated.

Cheers

Chewy

Reply to this E mail until 11-6-99. E mail BusJChew@... after
mid september. Tel 0117 9573899 anytime inbetween!!


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Finally the Yorkie Bar Kids have played some games, but as a team of
beginners we are quite confused about the pick rule. What exactly is a
pick, and what happens when the player you are marking deliberately
cuts so that you are forced run between another player and their
marker?
Thanks very much

Tom
Yorkie Bar Kids


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Right,

I will say this now so we will hopefully get the objections (if there
are any) out of the way.

Regions will be:

Scotland
N of England
Midlands
SW and Wales
SE

Sheffield will remain in the midlands region.

I'll send a list of co-ordinators later but i'm sure you can all work
it out.

So get in touch with the other co-ordinators - discuss what you want
to do and we will try to have a tournament at the end of october.

Dave

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Just read Dave's suggestion about moving Sheffield into teh Northern
region and wonder if this is wise either from a geographical
perspective or from one of "strength".

With regard to the former Sheffield has always been on the border
between Midlands and North but it seems a convienient distance
from other Midlands teams - halfway between Leicester and Warwick,
forty minutes from Hull, and almost due West of Manchester.

Secondly, as far as I know Phat 'Eds are the only team remaining
completely (With the execption of Si Geeks) intact for next year.
Warwick are losing their entire first team bar two and Leicester are
certainly seeing some of their main players graduate. Without wanting
to appear self-imporatnt I think that moving Phat 'Eds North would
handicap the Midlands. Certainly for this inaugral representative
tournament.

Also, Phat 'Eds have always played their qualifying tournaments in
the Midlands regionals. If boundries are redrawn would this apply to
next season's indoor qualifiers; obviously this also applies to the
Scottish question.

We need to decide what these regions will be soon so things can get
underway w/ regards the rep. tournament. Who makes the final
decision????

Also>>> has a new student coordinator been appointed for next year?

Thanks for reading, Karl (Phat 'Eds/ Death or Glory)

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sorry to bother everyone, but the aberdeen team has just
suffered a drastic loss to the player rota with an exam
being moved, meaning we are very short of players for
tour 3 at the start of june. As we really want to be
there, we wondered if there are any players out there who
would like a game? As we don't expect to do that that
well, hopefully we won't be stepping on anybodies toes by
asking for pickups.

Any takers? Please get in touch

----------------------
neil Preston
Falling skies
u01ngp@...
(01224) 488944



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Hi All,

Haven't checked my e-mail fo a while but makes for interesting
reading.

So from what I can see the regions would be:

Scotland
N. Of England
Midlands
SW and Wales
SE

Obviously there are complaints about the distance and the fact that
the North would be weakened.

However they would be very very strong if they were not split. And
maybe it is worth thinking about (as distance wise) moving sheffield
into the North region?

The regionla co-ordinators are:

SW: me, Chris (mythago), Tara (OW!)

SE: Iain Roberst, Jo, NEED ONE MORE

Midlands: Jo (Jesters), Si Geeks, James Mcgrath (Bears)

North: Chewy, Chris Richardson,  NEED MORE

Scotland: Paul Eastman NEED MORE.

I'm sure once we have sorted out the regions then we will have the
finalised people doing the northeren regions however they are
organised.


So That Is what I propose as as the rare concerned. Scotland and the
North are split (there is still the question of Sheffield that needs
to be sorted.)

If people think that the region should be split with Sheffield ion
the north or just split then e-mail and let us know. But from the
general consensus Scotland and the North will be split.


am setting a deadline of next tuesday fo when the regional debate
will be finished. Something will be sent out then saying what will
happen and who the co-ordinators are - need people to let me know
from Scotland and the north - in fact any region.
Obvvioulsy not everyone can be satisfied but with strength of the
regions - when they are still reasonably large - should not be a
issue - winning isn't the most impostnat thing as far as this is
concerned - imporving student ultimate is.

Dave

Dave Barnard - Catch 22, No Frills & MTJAH
@ 01222 373095

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I think in reply to Scotts message.

The North and Scotland would be weaker if they  were spolit but then
I will balance the teams out a bit with more evenly size groups.

I mean in the southwest we only have OW and Mythago that have made it
to everything. The fact that nearly every team is loosing all there
players - not least mythago, is not an issue. The cycle happens every
three years or so and there still always seems to be more player
playing who were said to leave.

Also good old players teand to produce good new ones so the future of
those clubs loosing players is never in question..

I think as we are students the convienience of travel rather than
trying to make "our region the best" should be the thing that defines
the regions - what do we think.

Dave
Dave Barnard - Catch 22, No Frills & MTJAH
@ 01222 373095

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Hi everyone,

my Oakleys that everyone knows and loves broke in a
terminal fashion today. I have decided to get contact
lenses, does anyone have experience with them? Do they
fall out on layouts? Which kind are best? Should I get
funky ones with the Nike logo on?

Cheers,

Bryce

===
The Milkybar Kid of Far Flung, Glasgow.
(Also the captain)
_____________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com

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Another Southerners view;

I think Will's right, keeping the practices local will benefit the sport in
the long run.  The whole idea of this regional style of competition was to
cream off the best players in the clubs and bring them together for some
higher level ultimate.  For any teams that feel they are weaker as a result
of losing their core first team players then this is a prime chance to learn
from coaching different to what they are used to.  Players can go away to a
weekend training session with the rest of the best players in the region and
learn from what they do - then take this and develop their own teams from
what they learnt.  This can only be better for the quality of student
ultimate.

It seems that having the Scotish and Northern regons combined will not only
involve a lot of travelling for the people in that region, but create a
super-region that could potentially be very hard to beat.  From looking at
Daves comparison of the regions through the past tournaments it seems that a
two well practiced teams from any separate region could havve a very close
match of competitve ultimate.

For teams that are worried about losing their top players - Will's comment
about Ultimate being a team sport applies especially.  A team that practices
together and learns cutting styles and cuts will always dominate a team that
doesn't practice together very much - it doesn't matter how good any one or
two individuals are they can't play the role of seven people on the line.
Also any student team faces the same problem of losing players as they
graduate - you're not alone.

For the record I would be quite willing to help coach the SE region, however
I won't be a student and therefore I feel it's important that are at least
two or three students who are also involved in the regional side.  Mainly
because they are the consistant contacts with the student community - and
will know each other through the inter-university leagues.

Iain
Skunks
-----Original Message-----
From: Will Parker <wp296@...>
To: student-ultimate@egroups.com <student-ultimate@egroups.com>
Date: Tuesday, May 18, 1999 6:01 PM
Subject: [student-ultimate] Regional ultimate


>
>It may be out of place for a southerner to stick his view in but:
>
>The fact that a region is weaker should not really be the deciding feature
>on how to divide up. Surely it makes much more sense to be able to get to
>a practice more easily, that way, you could practice more often and become
>stronger anyway. Ultimate is a team sport - a well bonded team is likely
>to play much better than an unpracticed team with a couple of good
>players.
>
>Besides, the North (without Scotland) would still be on a par with the SE
>according to Dave's scoring system. If they were to join with Scotland
>that would leave the SE well below average - The SE is already suffering
>due to lack of coordinators which is a real shame. (Before you say it, I
>would help, but won't be a student next year).
>
>So, to wrap it up:
>
>1) Stick to localised regions - student ultimate changes so much year by
>year that it is almost ridiculous to try and divide things up to be even
>by strength.
>
>2) Come on SE region. Lets try a bit harder to get things moving in our
>region.
>
>
>Will
>Skunks
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
>
>


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It may be out of place for a southerner to stick his view in but:

The fact that a region is weaker should not really be the deciding feature
on how to divide up. Surely it makes much more sense to be able to get to
a practice more easily, that way, you could practice more often and become
stronger anyway. Ultimate is a team sport - a well bonded team is likely
to play much better than an unpracticed team with a couple of good
players.

Besides, the North (without Scotland) would still be on a par with the SE
according to Dave's scoring system. If they were to join with Scotland
that would leave the SE well below average - The SE is already suffering
due to lack of coordinators which is a real shame. (Before you say it, I
would help, but won't be a student next year).

So, to wrap it up:

1) Stick to localised regions - student ultimate changes so much year by
year that it is almost ridiculous to try and divide things up to be even
by strength.

2) Come on SE region. Lets try a bit harder to get things moving in our
region.


Will
Skunks


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Well I think that it's about time that I entered my viewpoint on this
matter. I was at the  meeting in Bakewell as  well, and thought that the
creation of this 'representative regional team'was a good one, as did
just about everyone else there. However, even though we did agree to keep
the region the North and Scotland, I also agree with those that the
travelling distances  between student teams is a problem.

But, if the two  were to split, I  believe that the North would  be
weakened. I know that Lancaster and Leeds next year will be  seriously
under-strength from the position that they are now, as the majority of
their 'A-team' players are moving on to the real world or other areas.
(correct me on this one if I'm wrong Jedi). Judging by recent results we
would easily be able to hold our own, but I think that next year will be
a different story.

So this leaves the problem of gigantic travelling distances! Well
travelling times from here(Lancaster) to Edinburgh are about 3.5 hours,
and it can't be that much different for Leeds, York, Bradford and Durham.
I don't know about travelling times in Scotland, but it seems to me that
it would still be reasonable if all training took place around Edinburgh
or Glasgow, or some other 'central' location.

The other problem is that Chewy has put himself forward as the coordinator
for thisregion, and he would potentially have the furthest travelling
time as anyone if it were to be held in a more central location!

But basically what I'm saying is that I don't believe that the North can
do all that well without Scotland next year, and perhaps  we can still
keep together by holding this in a central location like Edinburgh or
Glasgow.

What does everyone think?

	 Scott

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reservoir Fish
Ultimate at Lancaster

ultimate@...
http://www.lancs.ac.uk/socs/ultimate
---------------------------------------------------------------------------




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Sorry I haven't written sooner on this.  I was at the meeting and the
discussion was basically centred on the weakness that would be caused
to the North of England team, as it leaves only Leeds, Bradford,
Lancaster, York and Durham, while Scotland would only have Glasgow,
Edinburgh, St Andrews, Dundee and Aberdeen (although both are 5
teams, the Scots seem much more gung ho about the whole thing,
arguably with little reason, the English seemed more concerned - see
the PS for stats).

The reason for staying combined was to keep everyone in the same
regions they qualify from indoors to promote some sort of regional
bonding (something already very prominent in the North).

However, it appears the weight of feeling in Scotland is against the
view of being combined.

I take the points of Ed, Paul and Jim and now agree that the
logistics of getting players from Aberdeen and Leeds together for a
training session is very difficult.  (one way round it would be to
turn it into a tournament weekend - clubs 1st day, training and hat
second, but then we are making things harder for people).

But on the other hand - a representative match is about taking the
top players in the region together, obviously the bigger the region
the greater the prestige in getting picked.

The other problem is that of the womens competition.  I think we
might struggle to have full womens teams in both regions, so would
need to join for that.  Though this doesn't mean requiring to have
the open division combined as well.

Certainly the feeling of the meeting seemeed to be that it was a
decision for the North and Scotland to make on their own whether to
join or split.  I don't actually think standard wise it will make a
huge difference.

Dave.
Far flung.

PS - since people keep talking about the performance in previous
tournaments I did my own research.  Using a simple system taking the
results of indoor and outdoor student nationals, awarding one point
for last plus one for every place higher came to the following
results:

Indoors:

21 - Scotland
20 - North of England
35 - Midlands
20 - SE
40 - SW and Wales

Outdoors:

39 - Scotland
53 - North of England
63 - Midlands
53 - SE
46 - SW and Wales

Overall:

60 - Scotland
73 - North of England
98 - Midlands
73 - SE
86 - SW and Wales

The most noticeable thing when doing these stats was how evenly split
the top teams at outdoors were.  Top five places were one from each
region and the next 6 had one from each region again.There would be
little to worry about standardwise by splitting the teams, whereas
joining the regions leads to a large advantage for the Nth and
Scotland.


> From:          <JAMESMCD@...>
> Organization:  Edinburgh University
> To:            student-ultimate@egroups.com
> Date:          Tue, 18 May 1999 11:52:59 +0000
> Priority:      normal
> Subject:       [student-ultimate] Re: A separate Scotland?

> Referring to Ed Coates' comments on having Scotland as a separate
> region...
>
> Although I wasn't at Bakewell when this was discussed, it seems to make
> sense that Scotland should be treated as a region in its own right. My
> own points echo those made by Ed - especially the one about the
> unmanageably large geographical distances involved in the Northern
> region as it stands at present.
>
> Against the splitting of the region, the only complaint that I can see
> being made, would be that splitting the region would produce two heavily
> weakened teams - but I can't believe that this would occur - just take a
> look of recent results - Scottish and Northern teams always have a
> strong showing in the top 10.
>
> My final point is that others in Scotland, not just Ed and myself,
> believe that this separation would be very successful. For this reason I
> think it should be discussed, even if the end result is that for this
> year we remain as a North and Scotland team.
>
> Thanks for reading,
>
> Jim
>
> R-S-B
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> @Backup - The #1 Online Backup Service
> Automatic, Safe, Reliable Backup and Restores. FREE for
> 30 Days. INSTALL Now and have a chance to win a Palm Pilot V!
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>
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Hi All,

I'd just like to add the I also feel there is some merit to having a
seperate scotland team. Looking at the results from this years tournements
scotland are always there somewhere near the top, O.K so we may have been
a little lucky at student outdoors, but I feel that it would be good for
the sport in Scotland which often looks like it might start to fade a
little.

I feel that some discussion is needed on this topic particuallary from
people from the northern region.

Maybe we should stay combine for the first tournements and then see how it
goes? Maybe we should split now?

If we stay combined then I'm more then willing to help sortout the northen
and scotland region with the help of others.

Paul Eastman

President(Elect)
Ro-Sham-Bo

Gael Force



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Referring to Ed Coates' comments on having Scotland as a separate
region...

Although I wasn't at Bakewell when this was discussed, it seems to make
sense that Scotland should be treated as a region in its own right. My
own points echo those made by Ed - especially the one about the
unmanageably large geographical distances involved in the Northern
region as it stands at present.

Against the splitting of the region, the only complaint that I can see
being made, would be that splitting the region would produce two heavily
weakened teams - but I can't believe that this would occur - just take a
look of recent results - Scottish and Northern teams always have a
strong showing in the top 10.

My final point is that others in Scotland, not just Ed and myself,
believe that this separation would be very successful. For this reason I
think it should be discussed, even if the end result is that for this
year we remain as a North and Scotland team.

Thanks for reading,

Jim

R-S-B


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hello to any team captains needing to bolster up their
squads,

one ammateur disciple going cheap, looking to pick up for
any worthy or unworthy team for tour 3, @ edinburgh, 5/6th
june.

age 20, 5'10"ish

/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Felix Merry
F.Merry@...
(01274) 730180


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Hi folks,

This is really for the students out there, so non-students need
read no further.

There was a student pick up team at Tour II, Sheffield, and we
are hoping to enter a similar team for Tour III.   So all you
students who fancy a bit of ultimate in Scotland, 7th and 8th June,
but dont have a team to play with, register your interest by e-mailing
Ultimate@...,  and come and play for with us.

See you north of the boader,  Phat' Eds.

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Forwarded message:
From:          "Si Weeks" <PEBLEY/GGA95SEW>
To:            gga95sew
Date:          Wed, 12 May 1999 17:41:27 +0100
Subject:       FW: GUINNESS STUDENT OFFICER PROGRAMME: 1999/00

Hi everyone,

This a genuine opportunity to earn money, beer and work experience.

Despite the date given on this email they are still accepting
applicants, although you need to act very quickly. Give it a read,
'cos it sounds to me like a top thing to do. If I was around next
year i'd be doing it.

Si Weeks.

P.S. The guy the message is from Guy Bowles (UTI player) hence why it
reaches this list. It is open to any student, but as a result of
having an insider we get the first chance to take up the opportunity.

P.P.S. Do not reply to me as I know no more about than is given in the
mesasages below.

> Date sent:      Fri, 7 May 1999 13:08:53 +0100
> From:           "Bowles, Guy" <guy.bowles@...>
> Subject:        FW: GUINNESS STUDENT OFFICER PROGRAMME: 1999/00
> To:             "'Si Weeks'" <gga95sew@...> (IPM Return Requested)

> Hi Si,
> Not sure if you're the right contact here, but it would be great if you
> could forward the below onto a student version of Britdisc (if such a
> thing exists?). Certainly the below provides some great opportunity for
> students to get into a commercial environment (plus drink beer!), but may
> also provide some leads for kit sponsorship etc. for Ultimate teams? Who
> knows?
>
> Cheers,
> Guy.
> (UTI)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:   Bulletin, Park Royal
> Sent:   07 May 1999 12:13
> Subject:    GUINNESS STUDENT OFFICER PROGRAMME: 1999/00
>
> GUINNESS STUDENT OFFICER PROGRAMME: 1999/00
>
> WHAT IS A GUINNESS STUDENT OFFICER?
>
> GUINNESS Student Officers are responsible for "on the ground activity",
> in and around their respective Universities. Working alongside their Area
> Business Executive, their role includes identifying promotional and
> sponsorship opportunities, whilst maximising sales and awareness through
> bars activity and product trial. They are tasked with developing closer
> relations with student bodies including Bar Management and Executive
> Committee members; whilst evaluating the drinking patterns of their peers
> and creating their own promotional mechanics. In addition, they are a
> source of area information both on and off campus, for all parts of the
> business.
> They work for approximately 10 hours per week, starting in September /
> October with the new term and are paid ?400 per term with the opportunity
> to earn an extra ?100 if all their objectives are achieved.
>
> HISTORY
>
> The GUINNESS Student Officer Programme has been running for around four
> years, starting with four Student Officers in Loughborough, Oxford, UMIST
> and Edinburgh. These Universities were chosen by looking at student
> population, beer consumption and the availability of appropriate courses.
> The success of the programme became apparent and more Student Officers
> were appointed. The numbers increased from four to seventeen in 1998.
> This year Customer Marketing were given the go-ahead to recruit 50
> Student Officers.
>
> See attached list for details of Universities included.
>
>
> WHAT CAN YOU DO?
>
> Please review the attached list and consider if there is anyone (relative,
>  friend, friend of a friend, someone you can vouch for) who attends one
> of the Universities, preferably going into their second year, who would
> like to take on the role of GUINNESS Student Officer. If there is, and
> you would like to nominate them please send a contact number via e-mail
> to Recruitment Manager, Mark Bickerton - mark.bickerton@...
>
> The GUINNESS Student Officer Programme is a great opportunity for a
> student to gain valuable Marketing experience with a major blue chip
> company.
>
> An interest in Marketing and a passion for the GUINNESS brand are
> essential.
>
> The closing date for applications is 10th May 1999.
>
--------------------------
74 commonside
sheffield
s10 1gg
tel: 0114 266 2304
email: gga95sew@...

--------------------------
74 commonside
sheffield
s10 1gg
tel: 0114 266 2304
email: gga95sew@...

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Hello all you britdiscers and student types,

We have just got this e-mail from the local education officer, who is the
person that organises those visits to Universities for kids in the
region. She has found our club via our web page (which is linked to our
Athletic Union site) and has found it interesting enough to bring some
kids along to a training session. This sort of thing is ideal for that
whole topic of more publicity, and who better than the new generation of
ultimate players! Who knows, maybe some of these kids that are coming along
will remember our crazy sport and become a member of their local or
University club.

So all you student types out there, go and find out if this sort of thing
is happening at your University, and get stuck in!!

	 Scott


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Reservoir Fish
Ultimate at Lancaster

ultimate@...
http://www.lancs.ac.uk/socs/ultimate
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:17:14 +0100
From: Goodall, Elaine <e.goodall@...>
To: "'ultimate@...'" <ultimate@...>
Subject: Campus visit day (Monday 21st June)

Hello,

My name is Elaine Goodall and I am working for the Community Access Programme
based in the Department of Educational Research.  On the 21st of June we are
organising a campus visit day for small groups of secondary school pupils (aged
about 14) and their parents.  Each year we arrange for the pupils, in groups of
about ten at a time, to take part in various activities around the campus.  In
the past these activities have been organised by departments around the
university, but we are hoping to include some societies this year to show the
pupils that there is more to university life than departmental activities!

After reading your society's web page, I thought that it might be a society
that these pupils would be interested in.  If there is any chance that you
might be able to offer to introduce a small group of pupils to what your
society does, and perhaps to organise a short activity for them to do (the
sessions organised are expected to last about 45 minutes each), then please get
in touch with us as soon as you can.  The campus visit day is Monday the 21st
of June (week 10).

Please read the following attachment for further information (if you have
problems accessing the attachment, please let me know)

Thank you very much for taking the time to read this.

I hope that you will be able to offer us your support.

Yours sincerely,

Elaine Goodall
Community Access Programme Assistant




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I don't know why i'm doing this!!

I am willing to HELP organise the northern region next year, however
i'm going to be really busy as i'm going to try to set up a team in
Liverpool. W ith my masters degree i will not have time to do the
whole nothern organisation bit. If someone else in the north takes
control, i am more than willing to help them out.

Come on, there has to be some first or second years in the north who
have got the easy life, with no work. Any of you guys from
Ro-Sham-Bo? I think most of you are still students for the next
couple of years.

Get in touch

Chewy




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Hi folks!

I see from the current discussion and minutes of the meeting at
Bakewell that the plan is to use the qualification boundaries to
select regional sides.

For those of you who don't know me, I drew up the fixture lists for
the Scottish League last year, and in the absence of a willing
volunteer, I guess I'll be doing the same again this coming year.
The league has been successful in two respects: it has introduced
new players to competitive ultimate and it has built a working
relationship between the clubs.  It would be relatively easy (he
says!) to chose a Scottish side because most players have played
each other regularly over the past two seasons.

The primary reason I haven't jumped at the chance to be involved is
one of logistics.  The region seems to be split quite naturally into a
cluster of teams within an hour or so of Edinburgh and a cluster
more centred on Leeds.  It simply wouldn't be possibly to hold a one
day training session in Leeds and expect Scottish players from as
far away as Aberdeen to be able to make it, put in a valuable
contribution to the practice and then head back up the motorway.
(By car it's about 4hrs Glasgow to Leeds, in a minibus it's more like
5, and Aberdeen is even further away!!!)

There are currently five universities playing Ultimate in Scotland -
Aberdeen, Dundee, Edinburgh, Glasgow and St Andrews, and
there are possible additions to that list in Strathclyde and Herrit
Watt over the coming months.  The student player population
between Edinburgh and Glasgow comprises over 50, and although
I haven't had time to get hard data there are almost certainly over
100 students playing ultimate regularly in Scotland.  I think this is
sufficient to justify a Scottish team, particularly when combined with
the results of Sorcerers, Ro Sham Bo and Far Flung in student
competitions over the last couple of seasons.

I'd be interested to hear the views of people both in the region and
outside of it....

Yours
Ed





____________________________________________________
Ed Coates
Old Jock of Far Flung, Ultimate at Glasgow University
Secretary of Mud Culture, Glasgow Open Ultimate
Gael Force

5 Ruchill St
Glasgow
0141 946 3422

My ally is the force - and a powerful ally it is.
Life creates it, makes it grow.  Uhuh!
It's energy surrounds us and binds us.
Luminous beings are we not this crude matter.
You must feel the force around you!

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Hi All,

Thanks for the message Jo. I think you are write we should keep the
teams the same as the regionbs for qualifiers apart from Welsh teams
and your list is mopre than complete. (I'm sure not all those teams
are still around).

And Jo, well done for volunteering to help run the Midland team with
Si.

That gives us these people running the people running the teams in
each region:

South west and wales
Dave (No Fills)
Chris (Mythago - non playing coach)
Tara (OW!)

Midlands
Si (Phat Eds - non playing coach)
Jo (Jesters)
Need someone else - a bear that will be hear next year(?) or other
keen person

South East
Jo (Discdoctors - Not much time)
Need two others - severe lack of attendence at the student meeting
only skunks i think were there - Mohawks, skunks, need two
volunteers)

North and Scotland
No one - Need some people to organise this region - let me know asap.


I think that we should try and arrange one training session for
either June or Very Early October and then have the represenative
game at the time that used to be regionals (end of october)

So I will officially start the ball rolling by saying - I need to
hear from all the SW teams So we can organise a weekend. Please each
of the teams send as many players as you like as it will be a good
chance to practice with new people - meet new people - learn new
things - and start to build a team.

E-mail me ASAP with ideas about when to do it.

All other regions - lets get things going - it is up to you to get
teams together but i'll try and co-ordinate the effort.


Dave





Hi all

Just a quick query about the regional tourney.

If the regions stay as they are for the indoors with the exception of
the
welsh teams who join the South-West, then I guess the following is
the
list of teams in each region. If the regions are changing it needs to
be
decided what teams are in what regions.

Can someone in the know confirm whether this is correct or not.
Hopefully
this should get the ball rolling with regards to sorting team
training.

Not all the teams in the list are well established but I guess the
fact
that they are on the BUF list means that there must be at least one
person
at that uni who wants to play some Ultimate and as such is eligible
to
try out for the regional team.

South-East

Guildford
Alien Nation
Brunel Falcons
Chaos
Discpraxic Dragons
Essex University
Kings
K-Niggets
Morphine Logic
None of the Above
PDQ
Skunks
Soton Institute
Strange Blue
The Flying Squad
Toxic
Mohawks
Under Cover Lovers
Disc Doctors
Mad Kows

South-West & Wales

Bangor
Mwnci See
Fubar
Mythago
No Frills
Ow!
Picnic
Uriel
University of Wales Institute
UWE

North of England & Scotland

Disciples
Falling Skies
Far Flung
Flying Sorcerers
Jedi
Northern Lights
Fish
Ro-Sham-Bo
Shooting Stars
Source
Yorkie Bar Kids

Midlands

Bears
Grantham
Fingers 6
Hulltimate
Jesters
Phat 'Eds
Purple Haze

hope this is okay, sorry if i missed anyone.

Cheers

joe (jesters)


Dave Barnard - Catch 22, No Frills & MTJAH
@ 01222 373095

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Hi all

Just a quick query about the regional tourney.

If the regions stay as they are for the indoors with the exception of the
welsh teams who join the South-West, then I guess the following is the
list of teams in each region. If the regions are changing it needs to be
decided what teams are in what regions.

Can someone in the know confirm whether this is correct or not. Hopefully
this should get the ball rolling with regards to sorting team training.

Not all the teams in the list are well established but I guess the fact
that they are on the BUF list means that there must be at least one person
at that uni who wants to play some Ultimate and as such is eligible to
try out for the regional team.

South-East

Guildford
Alien Nation
Brunel Falcons
Chaos
Discpraxic Dragons
Essex University
Kings
K-Niggets
Morphine Logic
None of the Above
PDQ
Skunks
Soton Institute
Strange Blue
The Flying Squad
Toxic
Mohawks
Under Cover Lovers
Disc Doctors
Mad Kows

South-West & Wales

Bangor
Mwnci See
Fubar
Mythago
No Frills
Ow!
Picnic
Uriel
University of Wales Institute
UWE

North of England & Scotland

Disciples
Falling Skies
Far Flung
Flying Sorcerers
Jedi
Northern Lights
Fish
Ro-Sham-Bo
Shooting Stars
Source
Yorkie Bar Kids

Midlands

Bears
Grantham
Fingers 6
Hulltimate
Jesters
Phat 'Eds
Purple Haze

hope this is okay, sorry if i missed anyone.

Cheers

joe (jesters)

p.s. cracking weekend, cheers everyone.



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As regards to splitting up the regions I thought it was decided that
the north would not be split, but the name just changed to the north
of England and Scotland. This should keep the Scots happy.
Adam
ro-sham-bo

--------------------------
If in doubt consult Calvin :-)

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With regards to SE coaches for the regional team, James
Elliot's name was only suggested as a maybe.  I can't
easily get hold of him to find out and I believe he is
still trying to form a team at Southampton Institute so may
not have time.  I'll try to contact him and find out
otherwise I would say he is an unlikely.

P.S.  For the record the minutes say with the indoor bids
that the SE were not represented.  The SE were represented
by Skunks who were present, but unable to hold the indoors
that is why no bid for the tournament was made.

Thanks
marv (Skunks)


On Tue, 4 May 1999 16:24:13 +0100 "J.Fryer"
<PMA97JF@...> wrote:

> On Saturday night, in Bakewell there was a meeting to discuss the
> future of student Ultimate.  Each team was represented by one member
> of their club.  These are a rough outline of the minutes
> chaired by Dave Barnyard.
>
> 1) BUF changing to a players association.
>
> There were three possible proposals for discussion as to the payment
> students would make to join an association.
> Idea 1. Reduced Membership.
> £1 to BUF on joining club, eligible for all student tournaments.  Pay
> extra £9 to then play non student tournaments.
> Idea 2. Free Temporary Membership.
> Pay full £10 after a couple of months, eligible for all tournaments.
> Idea 3. Hybrid of first two.
> Taking Idea 1 but not having to pay for the first couple of months
> after joining club.
>
> It was decided that logistically the first method was easier, and as
> alot of students do not play in the tour it would be unfair to make
> them pay the full £10 either straight away or after a short period of
> time.  Therefore Idea 1 was accpeted.
>
> 2) Student Co-ordinator
>
> No decision was reached, but Dave suggested that it would need to be
> someone at an established club not on the committee.  He had found
> that he had no time for his role as co-ordinator whilst setting up
> his own new team.  This will be decided at the BUF agm.
>
> 3) Indoor Bids
>
> Dave Barnyard - SW
> Si Weeks - Midland
> Lancaster, Edinburgh, Leeds and Dundee will all have to make
> their bids to Dave for the North.
> SE were not present at the meeting.
>
> 4) Representative Tournament
>
> It is proposed to have a tournament in October hopefully made up of
> the best players from each of the regions.  There will be Open, and
> Womens teams.
> Scotland want to be a region of their own, and Wales will join the
> SW.  There will also be Midlands, North, and SE.
> A squad of around 17 would train together beforehand and could be
> coached by non students.
> It was thought that these people should be involved in the coaching
> SW - Dave and Chris (Mythago)
> SE - Jo (Disc Doctors)  and James Elliot
> Midland - Si W
> North and Scotland to be sorted out later.
>
> 5) Rule Changes
>
> Keep playing with the same rules for now.
>
> 6) Rostering
>
> After the confusion of the Indoors it has been decided that:
> If the 1st team qualify, 2nd team players can move up.
> If both teams qualify then there can be no moving of payers.
> If the 2nd team qualifies but the 1st dont then the 1st cant move to
> the 2nd team.
> There will be no rostering
>
> 7) Any other business
>
> a) Regional Leagues, Scotland and SE
> These up and running leagues have tried to concentrate more on
> bringing through the less experienced players in the 2nd year as
> there are alot of new teams.
> If travel is easy within regions, then try and sort out more mini
> tournaments within them.
> Nothing was deicded on setting up leagues in other regions or sorting
> out co-ordinators to do so, although through the representative match
> the regions should be able to sort out something.
>
> b) Women and Coed
>
> It was decided to concentrate on the womens game rather than coed.
> There needs to be more done to enrole women at the start of each year
> such as simply having women on the university ultimate stand
> promoting the game.
> Supporting the womens practices by making the women in your club more
> aware about when they take place and where.  Also by attending the
> womens tournaments.  Even if a team could not be found within one
> university, joining up with others such as the Phat 'eds / Mohawks
> joint team that has been playing at womens tournaments.
> Finally it was suggested to have a womens game at each student
> tournament probably organised by Tara.
>
> Thanks for making it to the end,
> Jon (Phat 'eds)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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>

----------------------
Neil Pennington
nap197@...


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On Saturday night, in Bakewell there was a meeting to discuss the
future of student Ultimate.  Each team was represented by one member
of their club.  These are a rough outline of the minutes
chaired by Dave Barnyard.

1) BUF changing to a players association.

There were three possible proposals for discussion as to the payment
students would make to join an association.
Idea 1. Reduced Membership.
£1 to BUF on joining club, eligible for all student tournaments.  Pay
extra £9 to then play non student tournaments.
Idea 2. Free Temporary Membership.
Pay full £10 after a couple of months, eligible for all tournaments.
Idea 3. Hybrid of first two.
Taking Idea 1 but not having to pay for the first couple of months
after joining club.

It was decided that logistically the first method was easier, and as
alot of students do not play in the tour it would be unfair to make
them pay the full £10 either straight away or after a short period of
time.  Therefore Idea 1 was accpeted.

2) Student Co-ordinator

No decision was reached, but Dave suggested that it would need to be
someone at an established club not on the committee.  He had found
that he had no time for his role as co-ordinator whilst setting up
his own new team.  This will be decided at the BUF agm.

3) Indoor Bids

Dave Barnyard - SW
Si Weeks - Midland
Lancaster, Edinburgh, Leeds and Dundee will all have to make
their bids to Dave for the North.
SE were not present at the meeting.

4) Representative Tournament

It is proposed to have a tournament in October hopefully made up of
the best players from each of the regions.  There will be Open, and
Womens teams.
Scotland want to be a region of their own, and Wales will join the
SW.  There will also be Midlands, North, and SE.
A squad of around 17 would train together beforehand and could be
coached by non students.
It was thought that these people should be involved in the coaching
SW - Dave and Chris (Mythago)
SE - Jo (Disc Doctors)  and James Elliot
Midland - Si W
North and Scotland to be sorted out later.

5) Rule Changes

Keep playing with the same rules for now.

6) Rostering

After the confusion of the Indoors it has been decided that:
If the 1st team qualify, 2nd team players can move up.
If both teams qualify then there can be no moving of payers.
If the 2nd team qualifies but the 1st dont then the 1st cant move to
the 2nd team.
There will be no rostering

7) Any other business

a) Regional Leagues, Scotland and SE
These up and running leagues have tried to concentrate more on
bringing through the less experienced players in the 2nd year as
there are alot of new teams.
If travel is easy within regions, then try and sort out more mini
tournaments within them.
Nothing was deicded on setting up leagues in other regions or sorting
out co-ordinators to do so, although through the representative match
the regions should be able to sort out something.

b) Women and Coed

It was decided to concentrate on the womens game rather than coed.
There needs to be more done to enrole women at the start of each year
such as simply having women on the university ultimate stand
promoting the game.
Supporting the womens practices by making the women in your club more
aware about when they take place and where.  Also by attending the
womens tournaments.  Even if a team could not be found within one
university, joining up with others such as the Phat 'eds / Mohawks
joint team that has been playing at womens tournaments.
Finally it was suggested to have a womens game at each student
tournament probably organised by Tara.

Thanks for making it to the end,
Jon (Phat 'eds)

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Hello people,

What I think:


> 1.  Are we going to play the new WFDF rules at Student outdoors, i.e.
> drop pulls.  I dont think Si would have any problems if we decide we
> want to play the new rules.

I think we should play some of the new rules but not them all. I
think it would be unrealistic to assume that si could supply 5 discs
for each pitch so that's out but as far as the dropped pull and 20
yard brick I think we shouyld play them.

> 2.  Are we going to have a meeting to discus student ultimate, like we
> did at the national indoors in Leeds?  As far as i remeber we
> made a decision that we would.  Do people want to eat before, during
> or after the meeting?  What do people think?

Definately need a meeting. I have spoken to Si about this and there
are lots of things needed to be discussed about next year so the same
cock ups don't happen again (Like getting a student co-ordinator who
is busy trying to set up his own new team!!) along with things like
the representative match that I would love to see happen at the
begining of next term. We need to sort out regional organisers for
this.

Si Weeks: if you have a complete contact list of team could you bring
it - i've lost mine suprise surprise.

Also want to sort out indoor regionals - initial bids recieved and
this time if you bid for one and everyone says  yes you can do it
that mean its your and book it straight away for the same time of
year - no fuck ups this time.

> 3.  Now would be a good time to get the student leagues organised
> for the next academic year.  I understand that the South East and
> Scotland have leagues running already, so I we need to concentrate on
> the Midlands, the North and the South West.  It would be
> helpfull if those people involved in the leagues already up and
> running could share their wisdom on getting a league up and running.
> I guess that Dave Barnyard, and possibly Si Weeks would have a list
> of student contacts, so there's a start we just need some volunteers.

BARNARD!!!

The leagues is an important thing but for some teams unrealistic - we
need to talk about possible other sollution and ideas about getting
together to play ultimate in you region - this includes the regional
representative match.


Any other ideas write to the list.

Dave Barnard.
Dave Barnard - Catch 22, No Frills & MTJAH
@ 01222 373095

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Hi all, it occured to me that their are a number of issues that need
sorting out fairly soon.

1.  Are we going to play the new WFDF rules at Student outdoors, i.e.
drop pulls.  I dont think Si would have any problems if we decide we
want to play the new rules.

2.  Are we going to have a meeting to discus student ultimate, like we
did at the national indoors in Leeds?  As far as i remeber we
made a decision that we would.  Do people want to eat before, during
or after the meeting?  What do people think?

3.  Now would be a good time to get the student leagues organised
for the next academic year.  I understand that the South East and
Scotland have leagues running already, so I we need to concentrate on
the Midlands, the North and the South West.  It would be
helpfull if those people involved in the leagues already up and
running could share their wisdom on getting a league up and running.
I guess that Dave Barnyard, and possibly Si Weeks would have a list
of student contacts, so there's a start we just need some volunteers.

Well done for getting to the end,   Pete Coy (Phat' eds)

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Well just as every player has their own individual style every university
has it's own style of managing their teams. For instance Oxford has had what
approximates to an AU for about a year now. The ultimate team is one of the
most consistent performers (somehow we always seem to love that 5th
spot.....) and yet despite everything we can't manage to get more than 55
quid's worth of support and two hours hall time a week. Where are we going
wrong? I don't know but here's a warning to everyone out their thinking of
starting a student: league be aware that some clubs won't be able to play
every time and that some clubs won't be able to play at all. All are
different but the demands are the same a BUF system where new clubs pay only
half subs is OK but if the BUF is to be fair to all the member teams then it
must "means test" it's fees and well that's not possible. What will probably
happen in the next 10/20 years is that student teams that aren't afforded
all the priveleges of better AU's will probably go to the wall and we'll be
left with a non expanding student base. How do we solve this? I don't know
but I'm sure some of you out there have an idea!!!

Sorry!

Phil Cooper
Ex-OW! Captain


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To share some information on how we managed to start a Uni team in
Glasgow - apologies for length.

Our Uni had the same system as that described by Paul in Manchester.
That is - there must be 15 members for 2 years before there was any
support given by the AU.  Full accounts, membership lists etc. were
also provided.

We got around this by the following method.

1. Our Uni has a system where an individual must join the AU - after
that they can join as many clubs as they like.  We set our club
membership fee at zero pounds and took the names and membership
numbers of 15 people (all swimmers as it happens) and they agreed to
join our club to give us the required number of members.

2.  We trained on public parks and invited members of the public to
play with us.  As we did not use Uni facilities and received no
support we saw no reason to insist on members to join the AU.

At this point we had a distinction between members and players.  As
we were not breaking any rules we could be quite open about it.

3.  We went to the Sports and Recreation Service in the University -
who run the facilities and explained the situation to them.  We said:
"If you give us some hall time, we will run a free session for anyone
in the Uni to come and play Ultimate"  We guarantee to get 15-20 people
each week and if we fall short we will give up our time.

The sports service were more than happy to see good use of hall time
and the promotion of a new sport.

4.  We had been to the student newspaper and got an article in that
promoted the sport and helped recruit players.  They were also
extremely excited about the chance of an anti-AU story (which of
course when interviewed we put across diplomatically).

5.  When we went back to the AU we explained what we had done and
claimed that this counted as our first year.  We had a constitution
etc. and they accepted that argument.  We also got into a long
discussion about the problems of having a sport for all attitude
while still having the 2 year rule.  They then came back with an idea
of "starter clubs" which meant that after one year we would be
entitled to 4 minibuses a year and one-third of one percent of the
total AU budget.  There would be no more than three starter clubs in
any one year and if they proved themselves then they would get full
affiliation.  That year 3 starter clubs were set up (Ultimate, Gaelic
Football and Gymnastics).

What is the take home message?  Play by the rules, be honest about
what you are doing, and win the arguments but don't be scared to bend
the rules.  We managed to show our AU that there was a demand for the
sport, we could run it, but that we would not be prepared to make our
players join the AU unless they supported us.  "Sport for all" always
gets AU peoples backs up - keep making them say they are interested
in sport for all.  Also keep other organisations onside - we had the
newspaper and the sports service supporting us before our AU did.
Finally always make them think they came up with something.  Our AU
president was delighted to come up with the idea of starter clubs and
take the credit for the recent influx of new sports (which they do
deserve credit for).

Every Uni is different but don't expect money straight off.  You will
have to pay for tournaments yourself.

What is the present situation with the BUF regarding new student
teams?  Perhaps there could be some sort of a starter club incentive
in the BUF for registering new Uni teams (waive subs, 50% off entry
fees to student indoor regionals?).  Just an idea.  Seems to me that
at the moment the effort of starting a Uni team will far outweigh the initial
benefits if a player already has a Uni team to play for.  Much as the
experience was fun and rewarding I'm not sure I would have done it if
I could have gone and played elsewhere.

Hope this is of some use to anyone presently struggling with
establishment,

Dave.
Far Flung - Glasgow Uni.

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