Scott and others looking at this,

I'm out at CDRVLY this weekend, looking at the logs more carefully. I
still see problems in APRS-IS with garbage at the end of the OT2
status packets.

The thing I notice, though, is that the garbage is there when the
status packet arrives to be igated!

The setup here is that there's a WRT54 running arps4r acting as
the digi/igate; it uses the T2 as a TNC. The T2 generates the
status packet directly; it gets digi'd by OKHRST, and comes back
to be igate'd (there's a small problem in that pass, too, since
the igate seems to be stripping part of the digipath).

When the packet arrives here, it already has a string of nulls
at the end, and the igate is passing that along faithfully.

So ... that says to me that either the T2 is sending them, or,
perhaps, OKHRST doesn't quite like the packet. OKHRST is an X-Digi/TNC-X,
which adds another compontent to the puzzle :-)

73 de chris K6DBG

On Sep 1, 2007, at 11:16 AM, Chris Kantarjiev wrote:

>  OKHRST is an X-Digi/TNC-X, which adds another compontent to the
> puzzle :-)

The X-digi has a few problems.  The one I saw the most when running
it was it completely trashed the path of the packet it was repeating
every so often.

-Jason
kg4wsv

--- Chris Kantarjiev <cak@...> wrote:

> Scott and others looking at this,
>
> I'm out at CDRVLY this weekend, looking at the logs
> more carefully. I
> still see problems in APRS-IS with garbage at the
> end of the OT2
> status packets.
>
> The thing I notice, though, is that the garbage is
> there when the
> status packet arrives to be igated!

I'd say go ahead use a UI-View temporarily to monitor
the packets and do igating. See if there is a
difference.

On my setup, I don't see any trailing garbage on the
status packets recorded at findu, but the difference
is I use a laptop running UI-View (or AGWUIdigi) to do
the gating.

Then you can tell whether it is actually a T2 problem
or the other digi repeating your status packets.

73 de Paulus - N5SNN / YD0NXX




________________________________________________________________________________\
____
Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the
tools to get online.
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting

Will a T2 understand messages that are addressed to it, but come in over
the KISS interface?

No, not at this point - it doesn't do any parsing of the KISS frames.
Might not be too hard to do, but I'd have to make sure it didn't
interfere with the digi function and everything.

Scott

Chris Kantarjiev wrote:
>
>
> Will a T2 understand messages that are addressed to it, but come in over
> the KISS interface?
>
>

Would be very useful for me to access/control a remote T2 that is
connected to the only igate near it :-) The message goes out to RF
from the IGATE, via the T2, but is never digi'd so the T2 can hear it.

Perhaps when you work on getting the status packets, etc, to go down
the KISS channel, this could get done, too...

73,
chris

--- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, Scott Miller <scott@...> wrote:
>
> No, not at this point - it doesn't do any parsing of the KISS frames.
> Might not be too hard to do, but I'd have to make sure it didn't
> interfere with the digi function and everything.
>
> Scott
>
> Chris Kantarjiev wrote:
> >
> >
> > Will a T2 understand messages that are addressed to it, but come
in over
> > the KISS interface?
> >
> >
>

> I'd say go ahead use a UI-View temporarily to monitor
> the packets and do igating. See if there is a
> difference.

Not really an option for me, since the T2 is connected to a WRT. But I
know other people are running into this problem, too, perhaps they can
debug further with UI-View.

> The X-digi has a few problems.  The one I saw the most when running
> it was it completely trashed the path of the packet it was repeating
> every so often.

Fair enough, but ... many many other packets get through this X-digi
w/o being mangled.

--- Chris Kantarjiev <cak@...> wrote:

>
> The setup here is that there's a WRT54 running
> arps4r acting as
> the digi/igate; it uses the T2 as a TNC. The T2
> generates the
> status packet directly; it gets digi'd by OKHRST,
> and comes back
> to be igate'd

Ok, I was bored this afternoon so I thought I want to
duplicate your problem on my T2 that is acting as a
digi, TKUSIR.

My T2 (actually a T2-135) is permanently installed as
a digi, and also doing as a WX station. So I hook this
board up to a ubuntu laptop running aprsd to do
perform as an igate .

The status packets from the T2 is digipeated by a
Kenwood D700 then comes back to the T2 and gets
igate'd.

I see no trailing garbage on TKUSIR's status packets,
unlike on yours.

Yours:
CDRVLY>APOT2A,TCPIP*,qAC,T2SPAIN:!3724.30N111937.46W#
13.7V
77F���������ʏ\
33;���������ʏ\
33;

Mine:
TKUSIR>APOT2A,YD0NXX-7*,qAR,TKUSIR:!0615.00S/10646.00E#
00.9V 14C



Hope that helps,

73 de Paulus - N5SNN / YD0NXX




      
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
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We are having cable issues hooking the ot2m board to the vx-2r.

The ot2m indicates it is trying to transmit but the radio never enters
a transmit state.

The recieve side works fine.  Do you have cable info on how to hook up
this particular combination?

Ideas?

hello,

We are attempting to hook a vx-2r to a ot2m prototype e.

We receive data through the radio but cannot get the ptt to work and
send info out.

The ot2m appears to be attempting to transmit, but the radio does not
key down.

We are looking for ideas on what to hook up to make this work.

Thanks.

mark bookout

We resolved this issue by building the HT4C cable shown on Byonics
site, then adding a 1K resistor between the Mic Audio In (Pin 1) and
PTT Out (Pin 3) and ignoring the PTT lead on the radio altogether.

Thanks!

Bryan A. Thompson




--- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Bryan A. Thompson"
<yahooforward@...> wrote:
>
> We are having cable issues hooking the ot2m board to the vx-2r.
>
> The ot2m indicates it is trying to transmit but the radio never enters
> a transmit state.
>
> The recieve side works fine.  Do you have cable info on how to hook up
> this particular combination?
>
> Ideas?
>

This is a wonderful APRS event to attend:

     <http://nwaprs.info/sg.htm>

--
Curt, WE7U: <www.eskimo.com/~archer/>     XASTIR: <www.xastir.org>
   "Lotto:  A tax on people who are bad at math." -- unknown
"Windows:  Microsoft's tax on computer illiterates." -- WE7U
The world DOES revolve around me:  I picked the coordinate system!

That's a good point.  Maybe I can just provide the 3.5mm plugs with
appropriate resistors pre-installed inside.

Scott

ljs_hiho wrote:
>
>
> The Alinco DR-135 sure does crackle when in Digital mode
>
> Is it not a good idea to maintain radio design parameters when damping
> out the speaker.
>
> Rather than an open circuit by using an unconnected plug in the
> speaker output, use a resistor/s with a value as close as possible to
> the original radio speaker ohms of say 4R or 8R
>
> If using an external speaker you can install a small switch to
> alternate between the actual speaker or the resistor load!
> John VK3LJS
>

Recieved my unit. updated the configuration with my call-sign and
garmin gps. I see the RX and ACT leds flash red every cycle. and the
radio transmits out.  However I don't see my info on findu.

should I be doing something else?

Thanks
Chris

Listen to your transmission on another radio if you can.  Make sure
there's audio there, make sure it's not overdeviating.  Can you hear the
nearest digipeater OK?  How far away is the nearest IGate?

Scott

k9sarfrog wrote:
>
>
> Recieved my unit. updated the configuration with my call-sign and
> garmin gps. I see the RX and ACT leds flash red every cycle. and the
> radio transmits out. However I don't see my info on findu.
>
> should I be doing something else?
>
> Thanks
> Chris
>
>

Chris (callsign???) wrote...

> Received my unit. updated the configuration with my call-sign and
> Garmin GPS. I see the RX and ACT LEDs flash red every cycle. and the
> radio transmits out. However I don't see my info on findu.
> should I be doing something else?

You could start by telling us your callsign, your approximate location (are
you within range of an IGate or a digi that can be heard by an IGate?), and
what path you are using. What do your transmitted tones sound like? What
TXDelay are you using?You could also see if you could decode your
transmitted tones. Do you have another TNC to try that with? If not, do
you have a friend "across town" that could confirm that your tones can be
decoded OK? Does the GPS have a lock?  Lots of questions, but you give us
much to go on.

73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
--
"I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"

I wrote...

>  Lots of questions, but you give us much to go on.

That should of course have been "but you don't give us much to go on" hi!

73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
--
"I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"

Callsign: K9RMA
Location: Bothell WA 98011

I do hear other stations. GPS is locked.  I'll listen to my TX on
another radio tonight.  I do not have another TNC.

The only tool that I know that tells me the nearest APRS stations is
findu.  is there a easy way to know which is a digipeater/IGate?

http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/map-near.cgi?zip=98011

Thanks
Chris

--- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com, "Keith VE7GDH" <ve7gdh@...> wrote:
>
> Chris (callsign???) wrote...
>
> > Received my unit. updated the configuration with my call-sign and
> > Garmin GPS. I see the RX and ACT LEDs flash red every cycle. and
the
> > radio transmits out. However I don't see my info on findu.
> > should I be doing something else?
>
> You could start by telling us your callsign, your approximate
location (are
> you within range of an IGate or a digi that can be heard by an
IGate?), and
> what path you are using. What do your transmitted tones sound
like? What
> TXDelay are you using?You could also see if you could decode your
> transmitted tones. Do you have another TNC to try that with? If
not, do
> you have a friend "across town" that could confirm that your tones
can be
> decoded OK? Does the GPS have a lock?  Lots of questions, but you
give us
> much to go on.
>
> 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
> --
> "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
>

Look on the web for

  agwpe

This package uses your soundcard for the TNC.

I have successfully decoded packets by having my portable sitting
next to the laptop using the laptop built in mic.

Great troubleshooting tool.

WB9VXY

k9sarfrog wrote:

> Callsign: K9RMA
> Location: Bothell WA 98011
>
> I do hear other stations. GPS is locked. I'll listen to my TX on
> another radio tonight. I do not have another TNC.
>
> The only tool that I know that tells me the nearest APRS stations is
> findu. is there a easy way to know which is a digipeater/IGate?
>
> http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/map-near.cgi?zip=98011
> <http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/map-near.cgi?zip=98011>
>
> Thanks
> Chris
>
> --- In tracker2@yahoogroups.com <mailto:tracker2%40yahoogroups.com>,
> "Keith VE7GDH" <ve7gdh@...> wrote:
> >
> > Chris (callsign???) wrote...
> >
> > > Received my unit. updated the configuration with my call-sign and
> > > Garmin GPS. I see the RX and ACT LEDs flash red every cycle. and
> the
> > > radio transmits out. However I don't see my info on findu.
> > > should I be doing something else?
> >
> > You could start by telling us your callsign, your approximate
> location (are
> > you within range of an IGate or a digi that can be heard by an
> IGate?), and
> > what path you are using. What do your transmitted tones sound
> like? What
> > TXDelay are you using?You could also see if you could decode your
> > transmitted tones. Do you have another TNC to try that with? If
> not, do
> > you have a friend "across town" that could confirm that your tones
> can be
> > decoded OK? Does the GPS have a lock? Lots of questions, but you
> give us
> > much to go on.
> >
> > 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
> > --
> > "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
> >
>
>

Chris K9RMA wrote...

> Callsign: K9RMA
> Location: Bothell WA 98011
> I do hear other stations. GPS is locked.
> I'll listen to my TX on another radio tonight.  I do not have another TNC.
>
> The only tool that I know that tells me the nearest APRS stations is
> findu.  is there a easy way to know which is a digipeater/IGate?
> http://www.findu.com/cgi-bin/map-near.cgi?zip=98011

I tried http://map.findu.com/K9RMA* (note the asterisk) and it doesn't like
your callsign with any SSID has made it to an IGate. Now that we know your
location (near Bothell WA) we know that there is a LOT of APRS activity
around you. KD7NM-5 is less than 2 km to your east. When I say "a lot" I
don't mean a lot within a few blocks of you, but the Seattle area just to
your south is a very high-density area for APRS use. You shouldn't have any
trouble finding someone close to you with a TNC to help pinpoint the
problem.

As Tom WB9VXY suggested, you could try a "software based TNC" and try
decoding your own tones if you have another radio to listen with.

If you have listened to other packet signals, it could help determine if
your transmitted tones sound "normal" or not. Typical problems are not
enough deviation, or (more often) too much deviation. Another one would be
having the TXDelay too short. Having it too long is wasteful of bandwidth,
but too short and the beginning of your transmission will be cut off.

Are you using an SSID after your callsign?

What path are you using? With no path or an improper path, you would still
show up at findu.com if you were heard direct by an IGate. With a proper
path... eg. WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 or just WIDE2-2 you should get two hops via
nearby digis.

I know you said you could hear other stations, but how much power are you
running, and into what antenna? Is the SWR OK? Even with a terrible match
you would probably still hear other stations.

Looking at www.findu.com/cgi-bin/find.cgi?KD7NM-5 (apparently your closest
neighbour) and then going to nearby activity, there is a digi (RDMND) just 6
miles to his SE, but it hasn't been heard for a couple of days, so scratch
that one off the list. Looking at a nearby mobile station, it was gated by
KD7NM which is only about 12.4 km or 7.7 miles to your NW... not too far if
you are putting 5W into a quarter wave with a good ground plane or whatever.
You could run down the list of stations "nearby activity" and look at RF
stations around you.... e.g. you could look at mobile stations and look at
their paths and which IGate last gated them.

The ball's in your court now to do some logical troubleshooting and to
answer a few more of the questions.

73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
--
"I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"

On 9/6/07, k9sarfrog <both@...> wrote:
> Callsign: K9RMA
> Location: Bothell WA 98011

> The only tool that I know that tells me the nearest APRS stations is
> findu.  is there a easy way to know which is a digipeater/IGate?

http://aprs.he.fi will give you a great map of local activity, as well
as some data mining that is not available on findu.com

http://www.db0anf.de/app/aprs will give you a good map of your area,
as well as some data mining that is not available in findu.com or
aprs.he.fi.

Put all of these in your arsenal of tools for viewing data on the
internet stream.

You can discover which stations around you are digipeating or i-gating
on both sites above. Click on the info page on aprs.he.fi to get
information about the station, inlcuding stations near you, stations
that have heard you directly on RF, and stations that have acted upon
your packets on the last 48 hours.

On www.db0anf.de, the used digipeater page will show you everyone that
has acted upon your packets in it's history buffer. If you are acting
as a digipeater or i-gate, you can see all the users that you have
acted upon. You can also have the site show a map of where all those
users are located.

James
VE6SRV

Hi all.  I am the communications lead on a student-run high altitude
balloon project, and we are considering a new TNC.  I was sent here by
Gary Dion, N4TXI, and have been looking through the documentation and
files on the Tracker 2.

Myself and two other students have 1.5 weeks to come up with complete
design documentation for our communications subsystem, so I don't have
as much time as I would like to peruse the documents and messages at
my leisure.  So I would like to entreat any of you who could to help
orient me as far as the specifications, features, problems, work
involved, etc. that go along with attempting to use a Tracker2 in our
balloon.  The features that we need are:

-Restricted Digipeat Capability
-GPS Telemetry Data in NMEA format

I'd like to see all SMT components if possible (weight
considerations), but this isn't necessary.

Any help I could get would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks and 73 ~ Jeremy Day  KI4PRZ

On Sep 6, 2007, at 1:26 PM, jeremydayauburn wrote:

> -Restricted Digipeat Capability

what sort of restrictions?

> -GPS Telemetry Data in NMEA format

why NMEA format?  That is the most inefficient position packet type
in terms of bandwidth.  Bandwidth also equates to power consumption
(transmitter is running longer).

I don't know if the T2 will spit out NMEA by itself, but since it's a
full TNC you could certainly use it (maybe with a microcontroller?)
to get NMEA on the air.

> I'd like to see all SMT components if possible (weight
> considerations), but this isn't necessary.

My understanding is that the production model T2 is SMT, but I have
the PTH version and there won't be that much difference.

-Jason
kg4wsv

> -Restricted Digipeat Capability
> -GPS Telemetry Data in NMEA format
>
> I'd like to see all SMT components if possible (weight
> considerations), but this isn't necessary.

Digipeater capability is no problem.  The T2 doesn't output GPS
telemetry over the air in NMEA format - it's too inefficient and makes
you choose between course/speed and altitude in a given packet.

It supports the standard APRS position format, plus Base91 compressed
format.  It'll still give you course/speed and altitude, plus HDOP and
number of satellites in use if you need that.

Also, if you're running in Garmin binary mode, you can get rate-of-climb
in feet per minute.  If someone can send me some sample data with the
proprietary $PGRMV sentence with some vertical velocity (like from a
plane) for testing I'll see if I can implement that for NMEA mode as
well.  It'll still only work on Garmins, though.

The OT2m rev 1.0 (formerly Prototype E) is SMT with the exception of the
connectors and such.  The T2-135 is significantly lighter, but doesn't
have power control for a cutdown device and would need a 5 volt power
supply and close attention to radio interfacing since it's only intended
to be used with the Alinco DR-135T.

I do have some really small (unpopulated) Tracker2 boards on hand still,
but they suffered from oscillator problems, and I'm not even sure if
I've got all of the documentation and parts for those still.

The T2-135 is available now, and the OT2m (the one in the metal case)
should be here in another two weeks or so if all goes well.  The factory
just contacted me this morning for clarification on some parts, and
somehow there was a shortage of voltage regulators, but nothing that
should slow down production.

Scott

On 9/6/07, jeremydayauburn <dayjerd@...> wrote:

> Myself and two other students have 1.5 weeks to come up with complete
> design documentation for our communications subsystem

By complete communications subsystem, does that include things outside
of the APRS tracker?

> The features that we need are:
>
> -Restricted Digipeat Capability
> -GPS Telemetry Data in NMEA format
>
> I'd like to see all SMT components if possible (weight
> considerations), but this isn't necessary.

The OT2 will do what you ask, but as others have indicated NMEA is
out. I am assuming that you simply want lat/long/cse/spd/alt data. The
OT2 will do this.

One thing that you want to be aware of is that you do NOT want to
digipeat on 144.390 simplex. Listen on a seperate frequency, and
downlink onto 144.390. Once your balloon gets a couple thousand feet
in the air, it will never hear a quiet time on 144.390, and will
appear to be locked up. Balloon borne trackers need to ignore the
energy on the channel, and transmit blind. Digipeaters need to listen
for uplink audio, and at altitude, it can be extremely noisy.

We sent up a digital camera last month, and are still dealing with the
aftermath. Our project got featured on digg.com and gizmodo.org. At
least 6 major papers have featured the story, as well as CBC radio,
Global Television, and CTV.

Have a peek at the website for some background information. The BEAR
site has detailed information about the payload construction, as well
as telemetry data, etc. The SABLE site has photos and other
information from that set of launches.

We are planning on setting an altitude record in October with BEAR-III.

http://bear.sbszoo.com

Scott, any chances of an OT2 in a tiny SMT version for balloon flights
like the OT+ SMT?

It would be great to have digipeating capability as well as the
ability to change flight parameters in flight by sending messages to
the payload.

We are stuffing the payload inside the balloon to reduce total mass,
and the OT2 won't fit in the nozzle!

James
VE6SRV

> One thing that you want to be aware of is that you do NOT want to
> digipeat on 144.390 simplex. Listen on a seperate frequency, and
> downlink onto 144.390. Once your balloon gets a couple thousand feet
> in the air, it will never hear a quiet time on 144.390, and will
> appear to be locked up. Balloon borne trackers need to ignore the

I did run a digipeater on 144.39.  I think I had QUIET set to 0, though,
so it'll ignore the fact that the channel is busy.  SWDCD should be ON.
   I was using a non-standard alias, of course - don't want to digipeat
all of southern California and Nevada's WIDEn-N traffic!

> Scott, any chances of an OT2 in a tiny SMT version for balloon flights
> like the OT+ SMT?

I was thinking of an OT1+ with integrated Copernicus GPS engine and 500
mW transmitter.  (Wasn't I talking to you about that the other day,
James?)  If and when I get a compact transceiver an all-in-one T2 would
be a possibility.  In fact, I'm doing that with the more expensive
commercial 6-watt RF boards.

The big problem with a tiny T2 board is that the demand's not really
high enough to warrant automated production, and the part count is
enough to make it a pain to produce in-house.

Scott

I guess I should clear up a few things:

   I meant that the GPS input would be NMEA protocol. Output from
the TNC to the radio is (I assume) AX.25 standard.

  Also, by restricted digipeat capability, I mean having the digipeater
listen only for packets from our chase vehicles, which would (I hope)
be the only packets on whatever frequency we chose. This frequency
should be different from the national APRS frequency.

   Thanks to everyone for their input.

   Jeremy Day
Communications Lead
Auburn High Altitude Balloon Team
space.auburn.edu

Ok.  NMEA input is fine, of course.  As I mentioned, Garmin binary mode
will give you vertical speed, but you'll also get estimated position
error rather than HDOP, and time will be off a bit due to the lack of
leap second handling in the current firmware.

You can restrict digipeating by using a non-standard alias.  I think I
used AIR for mine.  You just need to set the path appropriately on the
stations using it.

And to clarify further on the NMEA thing, all APRS output is going to be
AX.25 (well, unless you're running PSK31 anyway) - but APRS lets you use
NMEA or one of three or four other position formats within that AX.25
packet.

Scott

Jeremy Day wrote:
>
>
> I guess I should clear up a few things:
>
> I meant that the GPS input would be NMEA protocol. Output from
> the TNC to the radio is (I assume) AX.25 standard.
>
> Also, by restricted digipeat capability, I mean having the digipeater
> listen only for packets from our chase vehicles, which would (I hope)
> be the only packets on whatever frequency we chose. This frequency
> should be different from the national APRS frequency.
>
> Thanks to everyone for their input.
>
> Jeremy Day
> Communications Lead
> Auburn High Altitude Balloon Team
> space.auburn.edu
>