My favorite hero of the golden age is the Red
Raven. I know I didn't have him as a member of my 'tream
team' of Timely heroes, but that is because the
character, in the way I perceived his personality, is even
less likely to join together with a group of humans
than Namor was. <br><br>From his appearance in the
X-men to his "death" in Sub-Mariner, the Raven never
came across to me as a joiner. I know he was a member
of the Liberty Legion, but in my opinion those were
some of his WORST appearances ... I mean, the guy
hardly spoke a word!

Hi glad to be here!<br><br>I am a big fan of the
All Winners squad and the Invaders and I am glad to
join this club.<br><br>I am currently working on a
research project at the Library of Congress and I am
including this club on a list of now five here at Yahoo. I
am making an Open invitation to the members of this
club for requests for information that I might be able
to provide during my research. This will help me
focus my research and all questions about Timely Comics
are most welcome.<br><br>Thanks!<br><br><br>Rex:)

Just want to take a moment to welcome the new
folks to this little virtual campfire. I am very
impressed by the folks who have signed on here. I hope to
learn tons about my chosen hobby, by just listening
(and throwing in my couple of pennies
occasionally).<br><br>Welcome<br>Dean

Just a short note saying that I'm glad someone has formed a group like this and
that I'm looking forward to some good conversation.<br><br>jess<br><a
href=http://www.geocities.com/ratmmjess/gaguide.html
target=new>http://www.geocities.com/ratmmjess/gaguide.html</a>

Age is an advantage at this club. What Timely
characters do you remember other than the Human Torch,
Captain America, and Sub-Mariner? It's one thing to know
about obscure Timely characters from research and
second-hand sources, but it's quite another to have actually
had a chance to read the stories when the books were
new. Who were your favorite Timely characters and did
you see any issues of the 70s Invaders
series?<br><br>Curious,<br>Jon

I know it says Denver Dan but it's Jon Glade. Glad to see you over here. I think
this club has a lot of potential and I know you'll have some insightful things
to add.<br><br>Take care,<br>Jon

Thinking about the characters involved on this
page has made me really miss the best comic I had read
in a long time-Marvel Universe. Roger Stern was on
his way to creating fabulous stories, but it was
abandoned far too soon. The initial Invaders trilogy was a
GREAT story! I was enthralled throughout. The artwork
by Steve Epting was incredible and I really look
forward to his brief return to the Avengers.<br>The
four-part Monster Hunter story really proved to be a trip
down memory lane for me. I really like it when any
Marvel writer works in something about those giant
monsters. This did that and placed it all in the holy
continuity too. <br>If you have not (I don't think that is
likely but just in case) gotten or read this series get
it immediately!<br>If you are still not convinced
then one phrase-<br><br>"GIANT DRAGON SUBMARINE".<br>
<br>Inquiring minds have got to know.<br><br>Dean

Hammeranvil,<br><br>I overlooked the word
"imagined" in your opening and thought you were recounting
the plot from some mini-series I had missed. Not
until I got to the end did I realise that you were
giving your own plot, which was sort of a relief because
I though I was really out of touch with what had
happened with Marvel in the last few years. Ah, for the
days when you could read all the DC and Marvel titles
for $10 a month and still have change left over for a
nickle coke.<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a><br><a
href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/goldenagers
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/goldenagers</a>

<<Back about 1993 or so there was an
Invaders mini-series that featured characters from other
companies (the Human Meteor, the Spider-Queen, Dr. Nemisis,
Voltron, etc.) recycled as villains, who later
reformed&gt;&gt;<br><br>I imagined the Nazi-sympathizing Spider Queen as
still being involved with the Hitler Hellions even at
the end of the war. She would be part of a grand
comic story ....<br><br>I imagined that Captain
America, after being frozen for decades, was a little
confused about what transpired during his last enounter
with Bucky. <br><br>I say Zemo's android knocks out
Bucky, but Bucky doesn't regain consciousness. Steve
Roger's, thinking that his sidekick has been killed, is
distraught but still fights on. He then, all by himself,
tries to stop the exposive-ridden plane that Baron Zemo
sent off. It explodes and Cap ends up frozen in the
ocean.<br><br>Meanwhile Zemo brainwashes the unconscious Bucky and
eventually raises him as a son. Thus Baron Zemo II whom
hates Cap with as much venom this side of the Red Skull
is actually Cap's old sidekick Bucky! <br><br>It
takes Spider Woman, who had been a Nazi-tolerating
villainous at the time, to tell Cap the truth decades later.
And her appearance here would return her to
mainstream Marvel continuity.<br><br>Anyway, this was just a
quick run-down of an idea I had ....

No. I have seen no use of the character before her appearance here.  I remember
that little mini-series quite well.  It was a very entertaining return and made
me miss the team even more.<br><br>Dean

Dean,<br><br>the V Battalion is interesting,
especially the new version of the Destroyer. Back about 1993
or so there was an Invaders mini-series that
featured characters from other companies (the Human
Meteor, the Spider-Queen, Dr. Nemisis, Voltron, etc.)
recycled as villains, who later reformed. A new version of
the Silver Scorpion was introduced as well. As far as
I know, these new/old Roy Thomas characters have
been ignored so far. Anyone know of any
exceptions?<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a>

No Kidding! I've been there when you let a little
misunderstanding get going and then there is no graceful way to
correct it.<br><br>I jumped over and joined The Space
Outpost. The beauty of these clubs is that they inspire me
to dig out old comics and read them again. Now I'll
be fishing for space comic reprints.<br><br>"Kaji
Dha" was the phrase the 2nd Blue Beetle used to effect
the change from Dan Garret. It was the Egyptian
version of "Shazam" I reckon. That might be a fun
exercise-collect all the magic phrases used in comics for specific
purposes.<br>It seems a lot of characters have little lines that
do one thing or another.<br><br>Dean

I think I misunderstood the intent of your
original idea. Oh yeah, I agree that an updated Invaders
could be interesting. If one were free to select both
from original and ret-con characters you could make up
quite a team. Frankly I am much interested in the
Battalion V and the recent revelation that they seem to
have WWII roots. This could be the Invaders translated
to the modern world in a most intriguing way. I have
already tripped over a site on this group. I will attempt
a link.<br><br>We may get more info on this kind of
thing when the Lost Generations reaches its ultimate
ending(beginning?I not sure how to refer to the ultimate issue.)and
a continguous line is reestablished to the modern
Marvel universe.<br><br>Dean

<<Come to think of it, the Patriot briefly
had a female sidekick, Lady Patriot, who is long
overdue for some recognition.&gt;&gt;<br><br>I see Lady
Patriot becoming the one and ONLY Patriot of the
golden-age era after Jeff Mace (Patriot I) abandons the name
when he took up the mantle of Captain America
following the diappearance of Steve Rogers (Cap I) and the
death of The Spirit of 76' (Cap II).

Marvel had the imagination to update some of
Timely's more obscure characters. I'm sure there are some
talented boys and girls out there who could give many
others a new lease on life. I would keep the Invaders
original line-up, but I would ADD to it in ways that I
think would bring about the best interactions between
interesting characters. <br><br>my team would
be:<br><br>Captain America - because Cap's the man<br> <br>Makkari
of the Eternals - hey, every team needs a speedster.
I don't care which guise he's under as long as he's
on the team.<br><br>Blond Phantom - simply because
she was blond and NOT stupid, and her character would
stand out against the sexist stereotypes that prevailed
at the times ... and she would use ingenuity rather
that relying on a super-power. Maybe she could even
stand out as a guiding force on the team the way
Liberty Belle did for the All-Star Squadron. I know, I
know, she isn't REALLY golden-age, but at the time I
came up with my great master list, I didn't know that.
<br><br>The Ancient One - because he has tremendous mystical
abilities ... plus I've always wondered what that old man
was doing during World War Two<br><br>Miss America -
because I would also like a female character WITH
super-powers on the team ... but I would like Miss America to
possess all of the powers she possessed in her 1940's
appearances including super-strength.<br>my team would
be:<br><br>The Black Marvel - the one from the TV show AND the
one from the old Timely comics. I would like to see
the original Marvel officially pass the mantle to the
new guy. Or, as several folks have already suggested,
have the black character as a totally different hero.
Whatever the case I would like to see a black character on
the team so that the issue of minority inclusion
could be presented in a way that Roy Thomas only
touched upon when he placed Amazing Man in the All-Stars.
Two things I NEVER bought while reading the All-Star
Squadron was the idea that a clearly black person would be
allowed equal, fully-accepted status with the other
heroes ... or the idea that Liberty Belle would be
recognized as the team's leader. I believe that Amazing Man
would have to conceal his race the way the Black Marvel
did on the Spidey cartoon in order to be "fully"
accepted by the team. And even if<br>Liberty Belle was the
leader of the team in fact, the media would make certain
that Johnny Quick or Commander Steele was perceived as
leader of the team in the eyes of the American public.
<br><br>Sub-Mariner - Because a team needs that character with
super-srrength, but i would like to see his Atlantean heritage
and his disdain for humanity presented
more.<br><br>Human Torch - because he possesses sheer power

Sorry Dean, I took it the phrase literally as
your name. Stupid of me I guess, but I'm glad you
cleared it up before it got out of hand.<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a>

No offense, but I kind of took Kaji Dha as
something that Son of Vulcan said and thought it was kind
of neat. No apology is needed. Actually the Green
Lama wants to know if he can use it. He thinks it is
really neat also.<br>Take care buddy,<br>Don

My name is not "Kaji Dha". I started using that
phrase lifted from the 60's Blue Beetle as a closing
when I was just on the Charlton Bullseye roster. I
never meant to confuse anyone on this point. I was
trying to be cute, and as usually happens that backfired
pretty good. <br><br>For the record my name is "Dean"
and I will begin signing my posts as such. Again I
apologize for misleading anyone. It's a little thing but I
don't like being rude. Sorry.<br><br>Dean

I have to agree with Kaji; Marvel doesn't seem to
put much value on its Timely past so I think the odds
of ever seeing a new version of the All Winners
Squad or new stories featuring the original members of
the Squad are remote. I can't say I've ever thought
of an alternative lineup for the All Winners Squad,
but alternative lineups for the Liberty Legion have
crossed my mind. Basically, I was hoping Roy Thomas would
include or guest star the golden age Vision, the Black
Marvel, the Silver Scorpion, the Fin and/or the first
Marvel Boy in stories featuring the Liberty Legion. I
also hoped the Liberty Legion would get its own book,
but knew the odds were against that happening. Since
the Invader bit the dust, I've become aware of some
other Timely heroes who I would like to see somewhere
eventually: Moon Man, Captain Terror, the American Avenger,
Blue Blaze, the original Black Widow and the first
version of the Witness. Come to think of it, the Patriot
briefly had a female sidekick, Lady Patriot, who is long
overdue for some recognition. <br><br>Given the editorial
power to launch a new version of the Liberty Legion, I
would set the book in the WW II era and use the
following cast:<br><br>Patriot (leader), Red Raven, the
Vision, Silver Scorpion, Blue Blaze, Jack Frost, Black
Marvel and Thin Man, with guest appearances by Black
Widow, the Fin, Rockman, the Challenger, Captain Terror,
Blazing Skull, Moon Man, Lady Patriot,the Witness and
Marvel Boy. I'd have the Whizzer and Miss America become
permanent members of the Invaders since they eventually
became members of the All Winners Squad. I realise this
is all idle speculation but it's fun.<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a><br><a
href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/goldenagers
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/goldenagers</a>

I don't know how you eliminate the Big 3. Namor
is incredibly hard to manage in a group but he is a
headliner. I personally love the Whizzer. His origin and
name are so goofy that you have to just throw your
common sense to wind (like hanging onto it was much
use). Miss America struck me as a token, but who is out
there. Maybe Namora, but wasn't she introduced later
than the war. I loved the Destroyer, and I am glad a
version has resurfaced in the modern Marvel universe (see
Thunderbolts).<br>I don't see many options and being able to keep the
book even remotely marketable. But maybe my knowledge
and imagination aren't up to the task.
<br><br>SonofVulcan

I don't know about everyone else, but I for one
was never happy with the line-ups in the Invaders,
All Winners Squad or Liberty Legion. This being the
case, I would like to pose a question: If you could
have formed the All Winners Squad, which Timely heroes
would you stock your team with?

I've added two new relevant links to Timely
characters.<br><br>Jess Nevins' "A Guide to Marvel's Golden Age
Characters" is a damned good website which has well research
information of Timely characters, some of which only appeared
once or
twice.<br><br><a href=http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/7160/gaguide.html
target=new>http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Olympus/7160/gaguide.html</a><br><br>\
The other link is pretty slim, mostly because it
deals with the heroines of Timely comics (and one from
the atomic age Atlas era) and there simpely weren't
all that many of
them.<br><br><a
href=http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Underworld/3063/GoldenAgeIndex.html
target=new>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Underworld/3063/GoldenAgeIndex.html</\
a><br><br>I think I can scare up another link or two, if you
give me a day or so. Meanwhile, look through the
Nevins' site because there is a wealth of obscure and
underused characters in it.<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a>

Welcome to the dance. <br><br>SonofVulcan

Glad to be here.

The Invaders show up in Marvel:The Lost
Generation #7. That's a real surprise given the current time
frame occupied by the storyline. I will say no more
except that the comic also features a fine two-sides
charging at one another cover. I just love that cover
design.<br><br>SonofVulcan

Good Golden Age Links established. Check it out.

Though the Atlas-Seaboard Club grew out of a
discussion on the Charlton Bullseye site it was also
triggered by Mikel Midnight's comment that no site existed
for the second Atlas company. I thought that might
make it a place people would be looking for.<br>This
club too grew out of Mikel Midnight's similar comment
that while the net had a few Invaders sites it had
nothing on the Golden-Age inspirations for Roy the Boy's
little WWII project.<br><br>I just love the name "The
All-Winners Squad".<br><br>I was introduced to the team by
reading the second half of the second adventure reprinted
so many decades ago in Marvel Superheroes. I didn't
get the first half for at least another decade and
the the first adventure eluded me for at least
another couple of years. The recent reprint of the first
adventure from All Winners #19 has me aching to see the
second story also reprinted in a single comic. Bless Tom
Brevoort's heart. He has been responsible for more great
stuff than any editor I can remember since Roy the Boy
held down the office so long ago.<br><br>Yes. Let's
get into those other (often forgotten) Golden Age
heroes. For me many of them are just colorful images on a
reprint of a great Timely cover in the Overstreet Guide
or some such. A perfect example is "The Thunderer";
what's his deal anyway?<br><br>Thanks for showing up for
the dance,<br>SonofVulcan

Sonofvulcan,<br><br>Jon Glade here so don't be
baffled by the signature on the yahoo I.D. I ran out of
room on my yahoo card and used another card I have for
non-comics interests. Don't be confused that I'm signing my
posts "Jon" although I'm here under another name. With
that out of the way, let me say that I think you have
a great idea with this club, because it paves the
way to discuss all of the Timely heroes, golden age
or those created by Roy Thomas for the Invaders
title. I know of no clubs devoted to or including the
Timely heroes (other than "the big three" (Captain
America, original Human Torch and Prince Namor) except for
Golden Agers and atomicgoldandsilver, where mention of
Timely heroes crop up on occassion.<br><br>I will be
back and post some links soon.<br><br>Take
care,<br>Jon
Glade<br><a href=http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver
target=new>http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/atomicgoldandsilver</a>

I have created this club because I see a need (a
small one admittedly) for a place where fans of one of
the most unsuccessful groups in Golden Age comics.
I'm aware of two (count them)two adventures that this
group had. But it is the potential in this assemblage
(as seen by Roy Thomas in his Invaders) that speaks
loudly to me as a fan.<br><br>In fact I want this to be
a place not only for the All-Winners Squad but for
the Invaders as well.<br><br>So sign up and
paticipate. Will this be successful. Like the original team,
maybe or maybe not. But only if enough of us make it
so.<br><br>Sincerely,<br><br>SonofVulcan

Welcome to the Yahoo! Message Board for The All Winners Squad