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The Pericope Adulterae   Message List  
Reply Message #1276 of 7211 |
Re: [textualcriticism] The Pericope Adulterae

Hi TC,

Thank you Curtis, Ann, Tommy and Andrew.

Bruce Metzger
"No Greek Church Father prior to Euthymius Zigabenus (twelfth century) comments
on the passage, and Euthymius declares that the accurate copies of the Gospel do
not contain it."

I think it is important to point out that Metzger was repeating an assertion of
Hort.
And I will conjecture that Metzger was familiar with Hort's argumentation.

Dr. Leslie McFall in the UK has given us background information when he gave
us..
"PASSAGES RELATING TO THE PERICOPE ADULTERY IN HORT¹S UNPUBLISHED LETTERS."

(81/3.11.64) to BFW.
"Have you realised that the Pericope [de adultera] was apparently absolutely
unknown to every Greek
Father whose writings have been preserved, till Euthymius Zigabenus in the 11th
century?"

My sense is that a lot of textual assertions are passed down in this manner,
from Westcott or Hort, through Bruce Metzger who puts it in a more accessible
place, and then down to Daniel Wallace, Bart Ehrman, James White and many
others. And I wonder whether many such constructions are original to Bruce
Metzger, perhaps some of our textual experts have insight on this.

So the careful constructions may not be in fact checked for current accuracy,
even if they were accurate to the extent of knowledge at the original stating.
And another issue is ignored, whether the assertion contains careful 'parsing
language' designed to make a case rather than give a full and accurate picture.

And then on top of that the assertions can grow in the retelling, dropping the
subtle language of the original, and becoming simply incorrect in fact. I saw a
recent case on that with Bart Ehrman and the Johannine Comma, albeit second
hand, so it could use more checking.

The artificial delineation of "Greek Fathers", even including a time period when
many writers were fluent with both the Greek and Latin literature, would be an
example of a parsing language that is used time and again to give the impression
that a verse was unknown when it fact it may have been copiously referenced and
quoted.

To my way of thinking, this misuse of language, with an intention to obscure
information for textual political ends, is a fundamental scholastic integrity
concern.

Shalom,
Steven Avery
Queens, NY
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Messianic_Apologetic







Wed Nov 9, 2005 11:34 am

praxean
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Message #1276 of 7211 |
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Greetings, In Dr. Metzger's Textual Commentary (p. 220) he states concerning the PA "No Greek Church Father prior to Euthymius Zigabenus (twelfth century)...
Curtis Dubreuil
curtis7777 Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
7:03 am

Greetings, As Wieland's "paper" (nice word for an internet publication) shows, the story itself being known is something else than the story being part of ...
Jan Krans
jlhkrans Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
9:33 am

... From: "Curtis Dubreuil" <curtis7777@...> To: <textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 5:39 AM Subject:...
sarban
andrewcriddle Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
9:33 am

Hi TC, Thank you Curtis, Ann, Tommy and Andrew. Bruce Metzger "No Greek Church Father prior to Euthymius Zigabenus (twelfth century) comments on the passage,...
Schmuel
praxean Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
12:01 pm

... So which bit of this is incorrect? ... Peter M. Head, PhD Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament Tyndale House 36 Selwyn Gardens...
Peter Head
petermh2004 Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
2:04 pm

Dear list, I would also take a look at William L. Petersen, "OUDE EGW SE [KATA]KRINW: John 8:11, the Protevangelium Iacobi, and the History of the Pericope...
Tommy Wasserman
tommywasser Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
10:12 am

  ... Isn't the standard understanding of who the "Greek Fathers" were/are "those who were of Greek ancestry, whose first tongue was Greek, and who ...
Jeffrey B. Gibson
jgibson000 Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
3:29 pm

Hi TC, ... Jeffrey, ... To simplify the issue ... why is "Greek ancestry, whose first tongue was Greek, and who **wrote** in Greek" Even a particular relevant...
Schmuel
praxean Offline Send Email
Nov 9, 2005
4:47 pm

  ... It isn't -- since the issue isn't their -- or anyone's -- "textual authority" (even assuming that term is meaningful in this context), but by whom,...
Jeffrey B. Gibson
jgibson000 Offline Send Email
Nov 10, 2005
7:10 am

Going over WH's introduction, I see that they address the matter of whether codices S and B might be copies made from a common exemplar. The question is...
James Miller
jamtata Offline Send Email
Nov 11, 2005
7:10 am

James wrote: 1) two extant mss thought to have been copied from a common ... In my article at: ...
Tommy Wasserman
tommywasser Offline Send Email
Nov 11, 2005
9:37 am

Tommy Wasserman wrote: ... exemplar, or 2) of any extant ms thought to have been copied from another extant ms (i.e., its vorlage)? Relevant input will be ...
Daniel Buck
bucksburg Offline Send Email
Nov 11, 2005
4:40 pm

Thank you for pointing out this article, Tommy. I found it interesting and relevant to my interests in many ways. As I understand it after a fairly cursory...
James Miller
jamtata Offline Send Email
Nov 12, 2005
7:43 am

... It confirmed the existence of the Patmos family (three MSS, where 1385 is exemplar of 1169 and 1173, but not 1204. ... Yes,perhaps more complex. Note also...
Tommy Wasserman
tommywasser Offline Send Email
Nov 13, 2005
3:07 pm

I wrote a couple of related posts some months ago as I was doing some research. I've now concluded the major part of that research and want to revisit and...
James Miller
jamtata Offline Send Email
Apr 29, 2006
7:57 am

Dear James, Honestly I think you need to read more background. Please examine the volumes in Studies and Documents series, about Family 13, that I referred you...
Tommy Wasserman
tommywasser Offline Send Email
Apr 30, 2006
4:17 pm

... Thank you for that advice, Tommy. I'll respond later to your specific reading suggestions. But for now, just some points of clarification. I have a...
James Miller
jamtata Offline Send Email
May 6, 2006
6:31 pm

James, ... Probably not on the same page. I haven't had time to respond in detail. My advice was very general, i.e. some bibliographic references that I ...
Tommy Wasserman
tommywasser Offline Send Email
May 7, 2006
6:08 pm

Hi TC, ... Jeffrey ... Schmuel No, that is not why these artificial formulations are created. They are used as an apologetic for explaining why the minority...
Schmuel
praxean Offline Send Email
Nov 11, 2005
7:11 am

... From: Jeffrey B. Gibson To: textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [textualcriticism] The Pericope...
Jack Kilmon
jkilmon_2000 Offline Send Email
Nov 11, 2005
7:10 am
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