Of course  John ... From: brunians@... <brunians@...> Subject: Re: [stoics] Stoics and Suicide To: stoics@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, 31...
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Leo Iermano
leoiermano
Sep 1, 2008 11:09 am
Hi All This is the question posed: Stoicism permits suicide when life cannot be endured. Is this inconsistent with submission to destiny or with classifying...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 1, 2008 3:42 pm
... I completely agree. But let's be careful here--are we talking about whether the actions of the other person can be both rational and irrational at the...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 1, 2008 3:52 pm
... I don't think so. It doesn't conflict with submission to destiny if you have the view (previously articulated) that you're only supposed to commit suicide...
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jan.garrett
chrys1943
Sep 1, 2008 4:49 pm
Lucian, Dio, and Epictetus are three of the four sources for a composite Roman-era portrait of the ideal philosopher, as described in lecture V in the Teaching...
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jan.garrett
chrys1943
Sep 1, 2008 6:54 pm
Damasio's book is generally regarded as a major achievement in cognitive science. This is an early review but it continues to be cited as important, e.g., in a...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 12:08 am
... Gichism? I don't know. It's no theory that I've ever encountered. ... I am perfectly happy with the claim that we aim at indifferent, and that external...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 12:28 am
... You said it yourself--it's impossible for her action to be both rational and irrational. Ergo, if one person forms the opinion that the action was...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 12:30 am
... Really? You mean frontal lobe damage gives someone true beliefs about value? Remarkable. Regards, Grant...
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Amos
vivepablo
Sep 2, 2008 1:58 am
It's one thing to be a cool-headed passionless thinker and another thing to be a person incapable of passion. When one thinks about complex issues, a...
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jan.garrett
chrys1943
Sep 2, 2008 2:41 am
If we do not presuppose strict Stoicism (for the sake of discussion), then one might argue that cool-headed rationality of the sort you recommend, Amos, is not...
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Amos
vivepablo
Sep 2, 2008 1:26 pm
I understand the factor that you mention, Jan, that of reflecting on emotions. In addition, a person without emotions would be a robot or a computer....
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 1:35 pm
... The fact that this isn't what the Stoics mean when they call something a preferred indifferent. There's no point using Stoic technical terminology unless...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 1:51 pm
... Except that this would be silly. I may think the earth is a sphere, and Bubba may think the earth is flat, but that doesn't make the earth both a sphere...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 1:55 pm
... Again: the murderer aims at the death of his victim. This does not make the death of the victim a preferred indifferent. The sadistic rapist aims at his...
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jan.garrett
chrys1943
Sep 2, 2008 3:55 pm
You're right, Gich, and I too have made that point in the past when discussing the classical (mainstream/Chrysippean) Stoic position. The only way I can think...
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Kevin
kevin11_c
Sep 2, 2008 3:59 pm
Gich, for what it is worth I specifically remember Epictetus using the terms "preferred" and "dis-preferred" towards indifferents in my translation (Hard). It...
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Stoic Stoic
londonstoic
Sep 2, 2008 4:10 pm
It’s interesting to note the extent to which Stoicism still infuses American politics, by taking a brief look at the American presidential election. Nearly...
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Kevin
kevin11_c
Sep 2, 2008 4:21 pm
I sent to quickly: I guess it is your opinion that E never used those terms, and my opinion that he did. The fact remains to be seen.... Kevin ... From:...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 4:28 pm
... AFAIK, all Stoics who use the term "preferred indifferent" use it as I am using it. ... I don't see how you can take my sentence, which says the opposite...
21223
Amos
vivepablo
Sep 2, 2008 4:28 pm
Ok, the sage has no passions, but he does have to master impressions, which if not mastered, would give rise to passions. He does not have to master his...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 5:15 pm
... I have read many of them, Gich. I am afraid that _you_ are confused. ... This certainly is a common usage of the word "fact". It is not the one that I'm...
21229
Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 5:21 pm
... You said that a preferred indifferent is the outcome someone aims at. These are the outcomes these people are aiming at. Please explain why they aren't...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 5:22 pm
... I have no time for such research today, and in any case I am not the person on the list with the most extensive knowledge of the literature. I happily...
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jan.garrett
chrys1943
Sep 2, 2008 6:06 pm
Interesting commentary on the appearances in recent U.S. politics. ... From: Stoic Stoic To: stoics@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:10 AM ...
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Grant Sterling
fccmoose
Sep 2, 2008 6:50 pm
Last comment for today--way over the limit as it is. ... I am baffled. Sally asserts that things are one way, Samantha asserts that things are a different...
21233
Kevin
kevin11_c
Sep 2, 2008 11:25 pm
Gich, for the sake of argument I will cede that E never uses the specific term 'preferred'. However he did explicitly endorse the idea of a 'preferred...
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Keith Seddon
khs10uk
Sep 3, 2008 2:00 am
Grant: AFAIK, all Stoics who use the term "preferred indifferent" use it as I am using it. Gich: Can you provide a single specific reference that shows this to...
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Daniel
dtstrain
Sep 3, 2008 3:08 am
... as a preferred indifferent, and if she does so she might or might not be factually correct in her judgment." ... for Sally and a dispreferred indifferent...
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Leo Iermano
leoiermano
Sep 3, 2008 8:00 am
A Guide to the Good Life The Ancient Art of Stoic Joy William B Irvine Add to Cart ISBN13: 9780195374612ISBN10: 0195374614 hardback, 336 pages Oct 2008, Not...
