Honestly, you lost me halfways through your message, so i figured a smart alec
answer was better than nothing;)

KAJ




________________________________
From: Andrew Brown <scottish.andy76@...>
To: star-trek-one@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2009 3:44:08 PM
Subject: Re: [ST1-LCN] Re: Starship sensors

See what happens when I try to stimulate a serious debate whose answwers
would actually help me out in something. *throws his hands in the air in a
"why do I even bother" gesture*

Scotty, beam me up. There's no intelligent life here.

Andy

2009/7/9 AJ <n1684t@...>

>
>
> I think you nailed it Brent.....Must be YATI
>
> KAJ;)
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Andrew Brown <scottish.andy76@...<scottish.andy76%40gmail.com>
> >
> To: star-trek-one@yahoogroups.com <star-trek-one%40yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Thursday, July 9, 2009 3:15:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [ST1-LCN] Re: Starship sensors
>
> *NOT* helpful at all, man. I *know* this. *I* told *you* this! Which part
> of
> "I'm trying to reconcile the inconsistencies" was unclear? :P
>
> Andy
>
> 2009/7/9 Brent <king.brent@... <king.brent%40yahoo.com>>
>
> >
> >
> > I say it's YATI
> >
> > -Brent ;)
> >
> >
> > --- In star-trek-one@yahoogroups.com
<star-trek-one%40yahoogroups.com><star-trek-one%
> 40yahoogroups.com>,
>
> > Andrew Brown <scottish.andy76@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > A quick question for you all: How can any ship sneak up on or evade
> > > another's detection while using warp drive?
> > >
> > > My previous understanding -- which I am now suspecting/realising was
> > > probably absorbed from my tech manuals and the novels -- is partially
> > based
> > > on Einstein's Theory of General Relativity in that subspace/FTL sensors
> > can
> > > detect an object at long range (into light-years of distance) based on
> > the
> > > effect that object's mass has on spacetime; the larger the mass, the
> more
> > > gravitational effect on spacetime, thus the longer the range it can be
> > > detected at by FTL gravity-based sensors. Thus, stars and planets can
> be
> > > detected from light years away but stations and ships you have to get
> > much
> > > closer to.
> > >
> > > The long-range sensors on Kirk's Enterprise could scan for ships to 1
> > parsec
> > > (3.26 ly) with immediate results in 'TOS: The Enterprise Incident', but
> > > didn't detect the Klingon ship that attacked it at the start of 'TOS
> > Errand
> > > of Mercy'. The E-D could scan for ships out to 10 ly in 'TNG: The
> > Wounded',
> > > but in 'TNG: Relics' the E-D didn't detect the massive gravity well of
> a
> > > friggin' Dyson Sphere until it yanked them out of warp!
> > > I'm finding it hard to reconcile these for a story I'm writing, and I
> > want
> > > to be internally consistent instead of making crap up as I go along.
> > > Specifically, I'm looking at where a ship can be detected and under
> what
> > > conditions.
> > > So, based on what we see in the eps, do starship sensors scan into the
> > > subspace realm, or just use FTL means to scan normal space? Are the
> > sensors
> > > mass/gravity-based, or use some other means to detect the varying types
> > of
> > > object?
> > >
> > > If a ship at warp speed is generating both energy, light, heat, it's
> own
> > > gravity, and most importantly, an intense gravity field and/or
> distortion
> > of
> > > normal spacetime from it's warp drive being active, as well as using a
> > > navigational deflector to sweep microscopic space particles and debris
> > from
> > > its path, how can any ship sneak up on another using warp drive?
> > Conversely,
> > > if a ship cannot be detected at warp speed, how can long range sensors
> > > detect a ship at all?
> > >
> > > I've read the Memory Alpha pages on these topics and it seems like
> > subspace
> > > itself cannot be scanned by Fred technology. So, here are my theories.
> > Which
> > > one (or combination) seems most reasonable?
> > >
> > > 1) Nothing beyond the subspace barrier is detectable. This means a ship
> > is
> > > undetectable until it drops out of warp beside you. This however flouts
> > > established facts where bases and ships can detect incoming ships and
> > > calculate an ETA for them, giving our heroes a dramatic deadline to
> beat,
> > as
> > > well as current warp drive theory that the ship doesn't enter subspace
> > but
> > > instead pulls a subspace bubble into normal space.
> > >
> > > 2) A ship or base needs to actively scan for these things instead of
> them
> > > being detectable by passive means. This allows people to sneak up in
> warp
> > > drive, but if this were the case, standard procedure would be evolved
> > > through experience to perform frequent active scans so you cannot be
> > taken
> > > by surprise.
> > >
> > > 3) A ship at warp drive is detected by its other emissions and/or the
> > effect
> > > is passage has on objects in normal space, not on the drive itself.
> Point
> > of
> > > fact is that a ship's inertial mass is decreased inside a subspace
> > > bubble/warp field/static warp shell, so maybe that's how they avoid the
> > mass
> > > issue. Also, this would help with cloaked ships at warp, as how can you
> > > neutralise/hide the gravitational effects?
> > >
> > > 4) Anything else you want to suggest within this topic. "Get a life",
> > "You
> > > have too much time on your hands", "Who the flock cares you
> > > minutiae-obsessed freak!" and such like are not welcome or acceptable
> > > responses.
> > >
> > > Andy
> > > --
> > > http://www.starbase23.net
> > >
> > > "A nation trying to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing
> in
> > a
> > > bucket and trying to pull himself up by the handles." - Sir Winston
> > > Churchill
> > >
> > > The Doctor: "Must be a spatio-temporal hyperlink."
> > > Mickey: "Wot's that?"
> > > The Doctor: "No idea. Just made it up. Didn't want to say `Magic
> Door'."
> > > - Doctor Who: The Woman in the Fireplace (S02E04)
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> http://www.starbase23.net
>
> "A nation trying to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a
> bucket and trying to pull himself up by the handles." - Sir Winston
> Churchill
>
> The Doctor: “Must be a spatio-temporal hyperlink.”
> Mickey: “Wot’s that?”
> The Doctor: “No idea. Just made it up. Didn’t want to say ‘Magic
Door’.”
> - Doctor Who: The Woman in the Fireplace (S02E04)
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
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--
http://www.starbase23.net

"A nation trying to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a
bucket and trying to pull himself up by the handles." - Sir Winston
Churchill

The Doctor: “Must be a spatio-temporal hyperlink.”
Mickey: “Wot’s that?”
The Doctor: “No idea. Just made it up. Didn’t want to say ‘Magic
Door’.”
- Doctor Who: The Woman in the Fireplace (S02E04)


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