Dear Troy, Another way around the problem you are trying to resolve is to question, for yourself, the possibility of a pre-Nero date for the Revelation. I have...
Oh, you take the low road and I'll take the high road only I'm not going to Scotland just yet. :-) While you date it early, I date it even later than the...
Revlisters, Regarding arguments for a pre-Domitianic date, see most recently: George H. van Kooten. 2007. "The Year of the Four Emperors and the Revelation of...
Professor Marshall's recommendation of van Kooten's JSNT article "The Year of the Four Emperors and the Revelation of John" is most welcome. The consensus...
Charles Larkin
charles.larkin@...
Dec 3, 2007 5:19 pm
904
Another obstacle for anyone maintaining the consensus dating of Rev is the Hebraic and Jewish background of its allusions, imagery, and language. It seems to...
Steve Thompson
steve.thompson@...
Dec 3, 2007 7:32 pm
905
Troy I think the work of Richard Baukham needs to be included in this discussion. His 'The Climax of Prophecy' has several chapters that address the use of...
... discussion. His 'The Climax of Prophecy' has several chapters that address the use of potential Nero myths that may underlie Rev 13 and 17; and he...
I am dissapointed that Kenneth Genrty has not had something to say on this. Regards Jason Coates ... From: revelation-list@yahoogroups.com ...
Moriah Plastics (Coat...
jasonnola@...
Dec 6, 2007 11:59 am
909
Yes, Bauckham does discuss the idea of Nero as beast quite extensively. But he relates it in particular to the myth of Nero redivivus as an eschatological...
I don't think the term "myth" adequately describes the depth of the belief that Nero had returned. Here is a very relevant quote from Tacitus, in his The...
I haven't had a chance to read Bauckham yet on this, but does he also deal with the variant reading 616 ? Could someone summarize his position? And is there...
In order for 666 to be construed as referring to Nero it must be transliterated into Hebrew and read as "Nern Kaisar." This is likely the reason that the...
With Hebrew gematria, the letter "nun" is worth 50 points, so "Nero Kaisar" = 616. As the second beast rising up out of the sea, however, the pressing...
Paul Anderson
panderso@...
Dec 6, 2007 9:33 pm
914
Bauckham discusses it, and on usual text critical criteria shows 666 to be the more likely original. 666 is triangular, whereas 616 is not. ... Ian ...
Thanks, Paul. Like many or most readers of this list, I'm familiar with gematria and the value of Hebrew nun, and how "Nero(n) Kaisar" could be either 666 or...
Domitian's culpability in persecuting Christians (and in some cases others as well) has been called into question in recent scholarship. It seems that his...
Nope, I don't buy it. The angelification of Domitian goes against all Roman histories as well as Christian ones--it is wistfully revisionistic from a...
Paul Anderson
panderso@...
Dec 6, 2007 10:47 pm
920
On Titus sudden death Domitian became emperor. Unlike his father and brother, he was either unable or unwilling to disguise his autocracy: in particular, he...
Thanks, George, this is helpful. The caution I want to raise is that while Domitian might not have levied a "sudden reign of terror" (and in that sense was in...
Paul Anderson
panderso@...
Dec 7, 2007 12:10 am
922
Relatedly, I think it was Robert Grant who brought up that the Trajan/Pliny correspondence demonstrates a new approach to the problem of accusations,...
... on this. ... I believe Dr. Gentry is knee deep in writing his commentary. Does anyone have an update as to where he is with this venture? Troy Yoppini...
In a message dated 12/6/2007 10:11:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... I have been watching the interesting discussions. I wish I had time to jump in but I have...
KennethGentry@...
Dec 7, 2007 3:24 am
925
Dear List Members: Gettting back to the question of what the early Christians thought about all this, the answer must be, sadly, that we have no way of...
Charles Larkin
charles.larkin@...
Dec 7, 2007 4:24 am
926
I have written elsewhere that there is a fundamental problem with this whole approach to dating. Most commentators look at the different emperors, reflect on...
In a message dated 12/6/2007 11:24:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... This is certainly true, however we should note the following in this regard: (1) 666 must...
KennethGentry@...
Dec 7, 2007 12:27 pm
928
You are right that the current emperor is not necessarily the "nastiest." In 17:10-11, the one who "now is," is merely one in a list of seven, no worse and no...
Ramsey Michaels
profram@...
Dec 7, 2007 1:12 pm
929
Like Ian Paul, I think the evidence at hand points towards a Domitianic date for the Book of Revelation. This would be in harmony with the testimony of...
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