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Everglades Challenge part 4   Message List  
Reply Message #31398 of 31916 |
Re: [proa_file] Re: Everglades Challenge part 4

On Sun, Feb 26, 2012 at 1:39 PM, jhargrovewright2@...
<jhargrovewright2@...> wrote:
> Dave,My, "feel" is 6" + with the wrapping rather close (2-3") together.

That agrees with Skip's feel. According to calculators here:
http://www.mathopenref.com/arcradius.html that's about a 200" radius.
If you could get it to 9", that'd be 132". Probably enough (either
one) for esthetics--could make a nice cross beam with reflex ("S")
curve, or a wicked curved boom or gaff.

> The 1/8" is a potential problem.  I have never tried less than 3/16".  Also
the
> glue would need to be epoxy because others tend to form a bond as soon
> as it is tight and that might cause a problem.

You're right; epoxy's best. OTOH, I've had pretty good luck delaying
the grab of simple wood glues by wetting the wood--in this case maybe
soaking it for a bit. ;-)

> The bending will require all of the sides stave to slide against the others.
> The bending is going to tend to flatten out the material....just like any
> tubing...at some point

If I were going for a max bend, think I'd include a few short plugs
inside the spar--just to avoid this. Kinda like packing metal tubing
full of sand before bending to avoid flattening. I bet with a 4'
section you could get away with just 3 plugs--one perhaps 12" long to
leave 6" sticking out for the join, another one 6" in from the
opposite end, and the third in the middle.

Still be miles simpler with a 4-sided spar; no bending, no jigs. To
get that same radius (200") in a 4' piece only means a bend 1 3/8"
high--so could cut it out on a bandsaw. (I know, intuition says halve
the length and halve the height--4"--but the calculator says it ain't
so!) Then again, with that bandsaw (or saber saw--or heck, I've cut
curves like this with a skill saw), you can go hog wild--specify any
radius you like for esthetic's sake. It's only money (requires wider
and wider pieces of wood for the staves--and leaves more scrap)

There's another issue with sectioned spars--hoop strength near their
ends. This is an old kite spar problem--deserving an old kite spar
solution. Wrap the ends of the spar sections with a couple of layers
of uni-directional glass or kevlar, set in either epoxy or
polyester--even "whipping" the ends with kevlar (or glass) twine, then
epoxying will work (with kite sticks we just used a couple of layers
of 3M strapping tape--or whipped the end with ordinary polyester
sewing thread, followed with clear fingernail polish)

Dave Culp



Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:08 pm

kiteship
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Message #31398 of 31916 |
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More outrigger hijinks at: http://tristramshandy21st.blogspot.com/#!/2012/02/everglades-challenge-part-iv-invisible.html Much written about little, as ever....
wtarzia Offline Send Email Feb 25, 2012
6:52 am

Great stuff as always, Wade. Each time I see them, I fall in love all over again with your inflatable amas. Is there *any* way to get you to consider building...
Dave Culp
kiteship Offline Send Email
Feb 25, 2012
8:58 pm

... I have been putting that fantasy on the back burner for some trip to the West Coast of Ireland, for since visiting Great Blasket Island I've wanted a boat...
wtarzia Offline Send Email Feb 25, 2012
9:10 pm

... Sure, but I had in mind one of the too-cool home-made/hand-built wooden mast sections we were talking about here a couple of months ago. The 8-sided job...
Dave Culp
kiteship Offline Send Email
Feb 25, 2012
10:20 pm

<CLIP> ... <CLIP> Not specifically but I did play around with the trial assembled oars when building 12'-16' pieces and you'd be surprised at how much radius...
proaskip Offline Send Email Feb 26, 2012
4:12 pm

Thanks, Skip! Haven't met anyone (yet) who's tried tapering using this method. On a scale of 1-5, please (1 being it falls together if I simply let go and 5...
Dave Culp
kiteship Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
6:09 pm

1.12765 mas o menos Staves are clamped together birdmouth down then tapered with powerplane then belt sander. It's a little fiddly to get the taper you want...
proaskip Offline Send Email Feb 26, 2012
9:29 pm

One trick I read about for birdsmouth is to make two opposing staves wider than the rest, to get a kind of oblong shape. In extreme it could be a wide flat...
David
madefortrade Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
10:08 pm
wtarzia Offline Send Email Feb 26, 2012
9:24 pm

Am I missing part of this thread? Making 8 sided spars straight is the problem. Making them a controlled tight curve would also be problematic. ... From: Dave...
jhargrovewright2@...
jhargrovewri... Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
6:46 pm

Please tell us more: At a guess, what radius do you think you could bend one to--say after gluing, assembling and wrapping--but before the glue dries--how...
Dave Culp
kiteship Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
7:08 pm

Just tried it dry, would be easy to go a little more lubricated with epoxy. 1/4"x 9/16" x 8' birdmouth staves (I've got a few from when I was going to make my...
proaskip Offline Send Email Feb 26, 2012
9:21 pm

Dave,My, "feel" is 6" + with the wrapping rather close (2-3") together. The 1/8" is a potential problem. I have never tried less than 3/16". Also the glue...
jhargrovewright2@...
jhargrovewri... Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
9:41 pm

On Sun, Feb 26, 2012 at 1:39 PM, jhargrovewright2@... ... That agrees with Skip's feel. According to calculators here: ...
Dave Culp
kiteship Offline Send Email
Feb 26, 2012
10:09 pm

This is the inflatable ama I thought good for a shunring proa: 14 feet long, 9.5 inches diameter, a little over 350 pounds buoyancy: ...
wtarzia Offline Send Email Feb 27, 2012
7:31 pm
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