-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  Hi and a question hoping for an answer
Date:  Thu, 15 Jan 2004 01:07:45 +0000 (GMT)
From:  David Hampshire <mrdavidhampshire@...>
To:  webmaster@...



My name is David Hampshire and may I just first of all thank you for
opening and reading this e-mail,

I am currently studying Graphic Design at the University of Bristol, and
I'm writing for your help! If I may be so bold.

I am wondering if it would be possible to ask these questions and hope
for a return of answers if possible.

I have undertaken a project on the Famous explorer Captain James Cook,
as you may know he discovered countries such as,

Hawaii,

New-Zealand,

Australia,

Tahiti etc. On his journeys he collected many flowers and plants, I was
wondering if you may know of any plants that we have here in the UK that
may have been brought from any of these countries? This would be
tremendously helpful for me and my project, If you could please e-mail
me back with ANY help you can it would be great,

Thank you for reading this email.

With much thanks again

David Hampshire

(BA HONS)



Mr David Hampshire

M: 07734823877
T: 07904380121
@: mrdavidhampshire@...
@: d_hampshire@...


--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

The Ruling Families would be very happy if livestock
disappeared.   Have you noticed how governments
now handle disease outbreaks?  The general policy
is to liquidate a farmer's herd or flock so that the
farmer cannot prove any or all animals were not
diseased.

Pasture land in arid/brittle environments need ruminant
herds to maintain condition.

If this is a "vegan" chat group, I should probably sign
off;  I doubt anyone cares for my concern about
the small farmer or how the prairie was made.

Here's a basic guide to food from your garden I've just uploaded
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/food/foodchart.htm


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Hi Folks,

A permaculture course (full certificate in PC)
is being held in Newton Abbot, Devon and
Forever Trees nursery, Devon.

Ten week course (two saturdays per month) Starts 24th Jan.

Taught by. Steven Nutt of PFAF woodland Garden fame.

Costs negotiable.

If interested please ring Cristina Palfrey on 01803 873252
ASAP.
They are currently short on numbers so it would be
great if they could get another person.

		 ttfn

			 Rich
--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

This woodland gathering looks like it could be good.
Hopefully we will get a PFAF representative there.

		 Rich

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: permaculture woodland gathering
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2004 11:19:35 -0000
From: tomas <tomasremiarz@...>
To: Plants For A Future <webmaster@...>

Hi Richard

& a happy new year to you. i've just got back from germany & am now cracking
on with preparing the permaculture woodland gathering, which you've
hopefully already heard about. (see last issue of pemaculture works & pc
website.) we are
hoping that you will attend with a stall and display, and are also thinking
of a workshop on non-timber forest products, to which you might be able to
contribute. the gathering is from june 3rd-6th; friday will be a on-day
conference on sustainable woodland management, which will include the
workshop. saturday is a woodland fair open to the general public. thursday &
sunday are for networking, discusion & case studies.
do you think you can come along to this with your stall & display &
contribute to the workshop? also, if you can think of anybody else we
shoould invite, please let us know. and if you could publicise the event
wherever possible, all the better.

cheers
tomas


--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

Thank you, that was very helpful. With a little tweaking I can adapt it
to Arizona clime. Caat

Message: 1
    Date: Mon, 19 Jan 2004 21:19:11 -0000
    From: "Graham Burnett" <grahamburnett@...>
Subject: Food from your garden

Here's a basic guide to food from your garden I've just uploaded
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/food/foodchart.htm

Permaculture Design Certificate Courses

Three courses ideal for Vegans, Vegetarians and Raw fooders

In England and at Ecoforest, Spain
April, May, June and October 2004

Ecoforest is the world's first vegan, raw food, sustainable living
community and eco-education project.

Unique and extraordinary accredited 2 week Permaculture Design
Certificate courses.  Permaculture Diploma support also available

Permaculture Courses Calendar
Ideal for raw fooders, vegans, and any one interested in sustainable
living & natural health.

5th to 18th April, at Ecoforest, Spain - raw eco-community education
project with vegan Pc Diploma holders Steve Charter (author of Eat
More Raw!) & Devin Ashwood - certain to be another `fantastically
positive, life changing experience.'

10th to 23rd May at Stepping Stones Housing Co-op, Gloucestershire,
UK with Steve Charter (Dip.) & Emma Jackson (both vegan permaculture
teachers) – specialising in community, co-ops, home education as
well as natural health and vegan / vegetarian permaculture.

June 6th to 19th Steve will also be teaching with Nir Halfon at Plaw
Hatch Biodynamic Farm, Sussex, with more of an emphasis on the
integration of Permaculture design and Biodynamics techniques and
philosophy.

Autumn Permaculture Course at Ecoforest
2 Week accredited Permaculture Design Certificate course - lead
teachers Steve Charter (Dip.), with Wim Bommerez: 10-23 October.

For details on all these courses and more see www.permaculture-
steve.net and www.ecoforest.org

For enquiries, e-mail or write: Steve Charter, Ecoforest, Apdo 29,
Coin 29100, (Malaga), Spain and Tel (sometimes): 00 (34) 647 003 623
(Spain, mobile) or from May c/o 24 Vale Close, Lower Bourne,
Farnham, Surrey. GU10 3HR.

e-mail is best for me, please send to:  true_charter@...

The costs of Permaculture Design certificate courses are:

April (Spain):  £345/500E
May (UK):  £275/E400
June (UK):  £325/470E
Oct. (Spain):  £345/500E

Prices include most foods – there is a non-profit on site shop at
Ecoforest where fruit, nuts and other items may be bought at good
prices.

What's In A Permaculture Course?
You'll learn to use permaculture to create plentiful yields of food
and beauty with little effort whilst increasing wildlife and
building a sustainable planet for all. The course also covers
ecobuilding, sewage, compost, eco-community and economics, and much
more. You will be able to find a timetable for a typical course on
the permaculture-steve website listed below, although innovations,
adaptations to the venue, teachers or participants, and other fine-
tunings are often made to each new course … but it's a good guide.

Ecoforest is a not for profit organisation and a part of all the
course fees help us work to promote sustainable living, natural
health, permaculture and eco-communities.

We can also support people working for their 2 year Diploma in
Applied Permaculture Design.

More information available on the internet at:  www.ecoforest.org
and www.permaculture-steve.net

More Course Information
April and October courses: Ecoforest is sited in the beautiful Rio
Grande valley in southern Spain, with the river running along its
boundary. With over 500 visitors, including 50 permaculture course
graduates, Ecoforest has changed many lives since it was founded in
the summer of 2000. Full details and a course pack can be found via
www.ecoforest.org

May course: Stepping Stones is a Housing Co-operative at Highbury
Farm - a vegetarian / vegan site surrounded by woodland nature
reserves in Gloucestershire. Drinking water is from the farm's own
spring. The course will be ideal for vegans and raw fooders,
integrating many issues including natural health, sustainable and
community living and appropriate education, including home schooling.

June course: Plaw Biodynamic Hatch Farm is in the heart of
Britain's `Rudolph Steiner country' in Sussex. Drinking water is
supplied by the farm's own spring. In addition to the normal Design
Certificate syllabus the course will cover the integration of
biodynamic techniques with permaculture.

Food and Catering Arrangements:
Ecoforest: salad foods included in the course costs, additional
fruit, nuts, dried fruit, etc. can be bought from our small on-site
not for profit shop. Breakfast is `freestyle', lunch and dinner are
usually communal for most participants although this is entirely
optional.

Stepping Stones: help yourself breakfast and lunch, communal evening
meal made by teams each day.

Plaw Hatch Farm: help yourself breakfast, cater for yourself lunch
(farm shop open every day) communal evening meal made by teams each
day.

All the courses will be … experiences in community living, a lot of
fun and supporting ecological projects and communities.

Permaculture @ Ecoforest Courses - what people say:
"The course far exceeded my expectations and I learnt a whole lot
more than permaculture. A life changing. life enhancing experience…
I can't think of anything we've done on the course that isn't
applicable and relevant in my life."

"I love you and thank you very much. I couldn't expect - and didn't -
  such a powerful and mind shaking course."

"The spiritual side was a big surprise for me, but a welcome one at
this time in my life. It's a …  good combination of land / spiritual
aspects, and really great people!"

"It was a great experience. Skills I will always keep with me.
Thanks."

"Keep it up. Don't ever stop! I have been fortunate to have many
incredible learning experiences … but none of them come close to
these last two weeks. Thank you."

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Booking Slip for Permaculture Courses

Name(s):_____________________________________

Address:_____________________________________

____________________________________________

Telephone:______________________

Email:__________________________

Course Venue: ________________________________

Course Dates: ___________ Number of persons: _____



I enclose a 20% non-returnable deposit per booking,

____ Euros cash / _____ cheque made payable to Steve

Charter, and understand that the balance is payable at

the start of course in Euros.



Send to: Steve Charter at EcoForest, Apdo 29,

Coin 29100, (Malaga), Spain or May-Sept: 24 Vale Close,

Lower Bourne, Farnham, Surrey. GU10 3HR. UK.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

More About Ecoforest
The Mission of the Ecoforest project and Charitable Trust -
Ecoforest Education for Sustainability (an Associated Project of the
Peramculture Association UK, Charity No. 290897) - is to teach and
enable people to live sustainably. We aim to help create paradise
garden communities across the globe where residents, visitors and
volunteers can sustain themselves in ways that sustain and enhance
the environment for generations to come. Ecoforest was in part
inspired by PFAF.

There are many health, spiritual and life skills benefits from
living here for those that become members or supporters. Ethical
investors can help us develop this uniquely positive project. Many
people can help the vision take root and grow.

We have a regular camping visitor option that includes salad foods
and our own seasonal fruit – including our own delicious organic
oranges (Jan-June) - each day, for just 20 Euros per day. Bring your
own tent and sleeping bag.

Ecoforest wants and need …
… more resident and visiting members, ethical investors and
supporters. Come and visit for a while to get a feel for what it's
like to live here. We particularly need people who are skilled, self-
motivated, responsible and effective, and who can support themselves
financially, perhaps running appropriate courses here.

Skilled People: We need responsible people to live here or work with
us (e.g. for 3 or 6 months or longer) taking on key tasks: garden
management and development; building, structural work and
landscaping; admin. and visitor support; fund-raising (can be done
from anywhere!).

Supporters and Donors:
We have ethical investment options for donations and for supporters
of Ecoforest, our work and vision - benefits include free annual
visitor time here. Please contact info@... for more
information.

For more info see www.ecoforest.org

Thanks
Steve Charter

I came across an excellent site with a lot
of good thoughtful articles about permaculture,
woodland gardening and farming.
http://www.self-willed-land.org.uk/

Of particular interest was the article about
self-willed land  - the rewilding of open spaces in the UK
about the need to allow wilderness to develop again
in this country.

Rich
--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

Friday 30th April to Sunday 2nd May 2004

Following the success of last years events we are running
another Permaculture Introductory weekend, details below;

http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/course/index.htm

PERMACULTURE; A weekend for beginners

Creating sustainable human communities by following nature's
patterns;
"Permaculture is a way of life. It shows us how to make the most of
our resources by minimising waste and maximising potential. But
living ecologically and sustainably doesn't mean giving everything
up, it means relearning the value of nature, to understand new ways
of being wealthy. Permaculture methods can be applied now, whether
you are gardening, doing the shopping, looking after kids, going to
work or building your own home. Permaculture is not about getting
away from it all- it's about taking control of our lives, our
individual needs and our common future."

THIS WEEKEND INTRODUCTION TO PERMACULTURE WILL INCLUDE; SUSTAINABLE DESIGN
PRINCIPLES, PERMACULTURE ETHICS, ORGANIC GARDENING, COMMUNITY ECONOMICS,
L.E.T.S. SYSTEMS, FOREST GARDENING, WILD FOOD WALK, OPTIONAL YOGA SESSIONS,
'HANDS ON' PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE & MORE.

Friday 30th April to Sunday 2nd May 2004

At
DIAL HOUSE CENTRE FOR
DYNAMIC CULTURAL CHANGE
NORTH WEALD (near Epping)
ESSEX

COST; @ £75.00 (flexibility/concessions available)
(NB. There will be space to camp at the venue. Indoor accommodation
will also be available in the main house at an additional cost of £5.00 per
person per night)

For further details or to book places, contact Graham Burnett, email
landandliberty@... or phone 01702 303259, or send an SAE
to Land & Liberty, 35 Rayleigh Avenue, Westcliff On Sea, Essex, SS0
7DS (NB. These are NOT contacts for Dial House)

A review of our Spring 2003 course from 'Growing Green International';
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/course/ziggy/

Some pictures from our last introductory course
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/coursepics/page.html

For more information about Dial House see;
http://www.southern.com/southern/band/CRASS/dialhouse.html

The Dial House compost toilet building workshop, July 2002
http://pages.unisonfree.net/gburnett/compostloo/essay/compostbog.htm

Please forward this post to anyone you think might be interested!


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Friday 30th April to Sunday 2nd May 2004

Following the success of last years events we are running
another Permaculture Introductory weekend, details below;

http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/course/index.htm

PERMACULTURE; A weekend for beginners

Creating sustainable human communities by following nature's
patterns;
"Permaculture is a way of life. It shows us how to make the most of
our resources by minimising waste and maximising potential. But
living ecologically and sustainably doesn't mean giving everything
up, it means relearning the value of nature, to understand new ways
of being wealthy. Permaculture methods can be applied now, whether
you are gardening, doing the shopping, looking after kids, going to
work or building your own home. Permaculture is not about getting
away from it all- it's about taking control of our lives, our
individual needs and our common future."

THIS WEEKEND INTRODUCTION TO PERMACULTURE WILL INCLUDE; SUSTAINABLE DESIGN
PRINCIPLES, PERMACULTURE ETHICS, ORGANIC GARDENING, COMMUNITY ECONOMICS,
L.E.T.S. SYSTEMS, FOREST GARDENING, WILD FOOD WALK, OPTIONAL YOGA SESSIONS,
'HANDS ON' PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE & MORE.

Friday 30th April to Sunday 2nd May 2004

At
DIAL HOUSE CENTRE FOR
DYNAMIC CULTURAL CHANGE
NORTH WEALD (near Epping)
ESSEX

COST; @ £75.00 (flexibility/concessions available)
(NB. There will be space to camp at the venue. Indoor accommodation
will also be available in the main house at an additional cost of £5.00 per
person per night)

For further details or to book places, contact Graham Burnett, email
landandliberty@... or phone 01702 303259, or send an SAE
to Land & Liberty, 35 Rayleigh Avenue, Westcliff On Sea, Essex, SS0
7DS (NB. These are NOT contacts for Dial House)

A review of our Spring 2003 course from 'Growing Green International';
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/course/ziggy/

Some pictures from our last introductory course
http://www.gb0063551.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/coursepics/page.html

For more information about Dial House see;
http://www.southern.com/southern/band/CRASS/dialhouse.html

The Dial House compost toilet building workshop, July 2002
http://pages.unisonfree.net/gburnett/compostloo/essay/compostbog.htm

Please forward this post to anyone you think might be interested!


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Hello,

 

I'm looking all over to find a source of perennial kale for the permaculture gardens here in Urbana Illinois. We rarely drop below -10F (-23 C) and we love ... kale!

 

Rob Scott

Urbana Permaculture Project

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Yahoo! Groups Links

• To visit your group on the web, go to:
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf/
   
• To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  pfaf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
   
• Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

Hi Lena,
Thanks for clarifying. I'm really looking for Brassica
oleracea var. ramosa -- yes, in particular the
cultivars 'Thousand Head' and 'Perennial Daubenton' --
any help on this treasure hunt is welcomed.

Rob Scott
Urbana Permaculture Project
Urbana, IL, USA

--- Lena Israelsson <lena.israelsson@...> wrote:
> Hi Rob,
> Do you mean See kale (Crambe maritima) or
> Thousand-head Kale (Brassica
> oleracea var. ramosa)?
> lena israelsson

__________________________________
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Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/

These companies use to sell Thousand-head kale: Abundant life Seed
foundation, Sutton Seeds, Seeds Blüm, Future foods. You find them
easily on internet. I don´t know where to find Perennial Daubentin,
but I would love to know.
lena

Can someone please remove me. Thanks
tony.martin11@...

Tony wrote:
> Can someone please remove me. Thanks
> tony.martin11@...
>
OK, I've now removed you. I've heard that
Yahoo can be a bit slow at the moment, which might
explain the delay.

	 Rich
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
>  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>  pfaf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
>  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
> .

--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

Anyone got an idea about this?

Kelly Kavanaugh (kellykavan@...) added the comment:

Other Plant Names: Nothofagus procera

I have heard that in India that rauli is used as bindi(the red dot on
married woman's foreheads). Is rauli red?  Is this the rauli that is
used in India for this purpose?

--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

Hey, everybody, This is Thomas in beautiful Longview Gardens,
Raleigh, NC. I just read a great article in Harper's Magazine titled
The Oil We Eat. This article deals with the energy costs of
producing, transporting, and processing foods in our current
agricultural system. The article also goes into the history of
agriculture just enough to draw some ugly conclusions about modern
civilization and social structure. Anyways, this article and some
other materials I've been reading recently (see works by Daniel Quinn
www.ishmael.org) have led me to conclude that I must produce my own
food in a truly sustainable way. We have a third of an acre around
our house that yields pecans and mulberries, but not much else. I'd
like to turn it into a food-producing haven for wildlife and my
friends and family. I'm trying to educate myself in permaculture and
have some knowledge of "sustainable" building techniques. If you know
of any resources-books, online information networks, or
permaculture "schools"-please let me know about them. I've already
checked out Gaia's Garden, our local library system's only book on
the subject and I plan to audit a permaculture class at NC State
University. Any help for a novice would be appreciated. We can fix
this.
-Thomas

-------- Original Message --------
Subject:  down on the farm
Date:  Tue, 10 Feb 2004 19:40:46 -0000
From:  peter white <p.a.white@...>

Hi

Following on from the response to the previous 'Farming Today' programme
('what would happen to the countryside if everyone went vegan?') radio 4
have now recorded a full 'On Your Farm' programme at Iain Tolhursts
stockfree organic market garden  in Berkshire.

This will be going out on Sunday 15 February at 6.30am, you will be able
to listen to it during the following week from 'listen again' on
http://www.bbc.co.uk

I hope to have a written synopsis of it available also, if you would
like a copy of this please email me direct.

This is a very encouraging development, Iain's place is an outstanding
   model of what can be done to grow food without using animal based
inputs. There will be a link to the VOT website www.veganorganic.net
<http://www.veganorganic.net> on the Farming Today webpages, so this
will generate considerable interest! We have prepared some special
material to add to our website.

During the recording Iain mentioned the wider issues of animal-free
farming, the valuable social content  of his work, plus the work of VOT
and the forthcoming Stockfree Organic Standards, how much of this will
be included depends on the final editing; a half-hour on mainstream
radio is a tremendous breakthrough.

Best wishes
Peter White and all at Vegan-Organic Trust (VOT)

--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

like to know seed sources in usa... also post some permaculture links
for southern usa.

You would be better off obtaining tubers since seed is likely to give
variable results.

I'm not sure how up to date this info is, but William Blackmon of the
Department of Horticulture at Louisiana State University was carrying out
research into this species in the 1980's and 90's. He developed several
higher-yielding cultivars. I'd recommend contacting him, or the Department
of Agriculture if he is no longer there, to see if these cultivars are
available.

Hope that is of help

Ken Fern

----- Original Message -----
From: "nudsurf" <nudsurf@...>
To: <pfaf@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 7:27 PM
Subject: [pfaf] Apios


> like to know seed sources in usa... also post some permaculture links
> for southern usa.
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>

"Take chances, make mistakes, get messy" ~ Miss Frizzle, 'The Magic
School Bus'


I would be interested on things relating to the southwest. Desert area.
Thanks Caat

Cat, and others, have asked for data on Permaculture
projects in South and Southwest USA. The Permaculture
Activist webpage has a page listing USA Permaculture
projects at:

http://www.permacultureactivist.net/pcresources/NorthAmerica.htm#USA

Also, Keith Johnson is currently updating this
resource, so make sure that your project is listed
here.

Rob Scott
Urbana Permaculture Project
Urbana, IL
www.prairienet.org/upp


__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

Dale (dalep6@...) added the comment:

I'm on Siesta Key off the coast of Sarasota, Florida and it's hot, humid
even at night so that's why Here is my situation.  I am in Sarasota,
Florida zone 9b...hot and humid and the killer is hot nights for 6
months out of the year.  Coldest it gets is 30 rarely and 35-40 a few
times a winter.  I have a path made out of 3" thick and 24' square
concrete blocks with 3" holes.  They were made to be filled with gravel
or grass in parking lots to minimize the amount of asphalt used.  I had
planned on planting groundcover in the holes.  I tried Laurentia and it
did fine for a while.  But then died out.  This path is under a very
large oak with a well trimmed canopy on the NW side of my house.  It
gets bright filtered light for part of the day.  Do you know of anything
that would be happy in this situation?  I think the Laurentia couldn't
spread and that's what did it in.  Sure hope you have some ideas.

I also want a groundcover to grow under many Alocasia/Colocasias where
they will definitely be in shade from these "elephant ears."

Thanks so much for "listening."  I really want to find something for the
path!
Dale Six
Sarasota, Floridaso many plants fail here.

--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

I got mine from Will Bonsall of the Seed Savers network...  As I
remember he had a number of different cultivars.

mIEKAL


On Thursday, February 12, 2004, at 09:58 AM, KenFern wrote:

> You would be better off obtaining tubers since seed is likely to give
> variable results.
>
> I'm not sure how up to date this info is, but William Blackmon of the
> Department of Horticulture at Louisiana State University was carrying
> out
> research into this species in the 1980's and 90's. He developed several
> higher-yielding cultivars. I'd recommend contacting him, or the
> Department
> of Agriculture if he is no longer there, to see if these cultivars are
> available.
>
> Hope that is of help
>
> Ken Fern

Mike Jackson (mike-de-hest@...) added the comment:

Living in NW England my garden is overun by a pale blue allium bought
some 20 years ago.  It grows 20 to 25cm tall and flowers more like a
bluebell than an onion. A particular feature is a large amount of
folliage in the late autumn - no doubt gathering energy for its spring
rampage.  At the edge of woodland and competing with grass it is well
behaved.  It is the sunny soil beds and crevices under flags that it
loves to invade. Any suggestions as to the precise variety, please?  N W
England - cultivated open ground


--
Plants for a Future: 7000 useful plants
Web:   http://www.pfaf.org/ same as http://www.comp.leeds.ac.uk/pfaf/
Post:  1 Lerryn View, Lerryn, Lostwithiel, Cornwall, PL22 0QJ
Tel:  01208 872 963 / 0845 458 4719
Email: webmaster@...
PFAF electronic mailing list http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pfaf

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [PermacultureUK] - Permauculture Intro Online
Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 20:37:37 +0000
From: permaculture.uk@... ("GeorgeSobol")
Reply-To: george sobol <terrafirma@...>
To: webmaster@...

'Introduction to Permaculture - Tools for Sustainability'

Greetings.  We are writing to you let you know about a new version of
the Introduction to Permaculture course that we will be offering
later this month.  This is very short notice but we have just been
given the go-ahead for an exciting development in permaculture
training which combines traditional 'face to face' contact with
online discussion and study using the internet.

So, if you have basic computer skills, we'd like to invite you to
take part in this new version of the 'Introduction to Permaculture -
Tools for Sustainability' course, which the Permaculture Euducation
Project are running in conjunction with the WEA (Workers' Educational
Association) South West.  Owning a computer is not essential as the
course can be accessed through UKonline Centres, libraries, etc.
RSVP to gsobol@... or ring 0845 458 0194.

How will the course be run?  The course is 30 hours long and will be
run over a month.  There will be two 'face to face' meetings - a day
at the beginning of the course and a day at the end - with
approximately eighteen hours of online study and discussion over the
month in between.  The two meetings will be held at the LEEP site
(Langford Environmental Education Project) near Exeter where you can
see permaculture design in practice - both buildings and land use -
and where we can do the practical parts of the course.

When is the course starting?  VERY SOON!  Registrations: NOW!
Day 1 - Saturday 28 February 2004
Day 2 - Saturday 28 March 2004

What does it cost?  £60.00 per person or £5.00 if you receive means
tested benefits.  The Learner Support Fund is available to cover fees
and other costs for people on low incomes, and the
Learning Support Fund is there to enable learners with disabilities
to participate.

There are only 12 places available on the course so if you are
interested please e-mail gsobol@... or ring 0845 458 0194
(local rate) as soon as possible.  If it is successful we hope to
extend e-learning to the full Permaculture Design Course in the near
future.  If this is not for you, please pass the information on to a
friend.

With best wishes

George Sobol & Patsy Garrard
	   14 February 2004






Further Information

What does the Introduction to Permaculture course cover?

... The ethics and attitudes of permaculture
... The guiding principles of permaculture design
... Observation skills
... Simple mapping
... Inspiring case studies
... A design exercise, working with nature not against it

You will gain:
... a greater understanding of the ethics, attitudes and principles
used in permaculture design for sustainable living and community
development;
... some practical experience of applying your new skills and understanding;
... an idea of how to apply these in your own life;
... an idea of where to go for further information.

You will receive information, advice and support prior to the start
of the course by email, and by telephone if necessary, and you will
be asked to register online.  You will then receive directions to the
LEEP site for the first Saturday and advice on what to bring.

For the online part of the course you will work from home, but not in
isolation.  You will be working in small groups or 'learning sets'
which will give contact and opportunities for discussion, with
support online and by phone from the course tutor.  The interactive
element means that it will be possible to share much more detailed
information than is possible within the time constraints of a day's
meeting.

Who is it for?  Anybody!  The online dimension of the course makes it
more accessible, especially to people such as carers, single parents
and those with mobility difficulties, by reducing travel costs and
allowing for more flexiblity of learning time. The course is open to
anyone over the age of 16 and is suitable for a wide range of people.
Everybody's contribution is valued and your combined experience is
enormously important.
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S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(S(
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PERMACULTURE EDUCATION PROJECT
The Permaculture Education Project is part of the Projects Network of the
Permaculture Association (Britain) Charity Reg. No. 290897
http://www.permaculture.org.uk
Snail Mail: 1 Eureka Terrace, Bovey Tracey,  Devon TQ13 9HG
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PERMACULTURE  =  PERMANENT AGRICULTURE  =  PERMANENT CULTURE
Practical strategies for land, buildings and people