Well--if you're going to drag the Federales in--they have the third one in
the Smithsonian--if you're going to dream--why not build both? gj 8^))
----- Original Message -----
From: "choefer" <choefer@...>
To: <on3@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 3:26 PM
Subject: [on3] Re: PSC/MMI production drawings!!!!! 4-4-0


Several years ago I talked to Kyle at CSRM about restoring Sonoma to
operating condition. It's been a while so consider the dollars as
foggy/fuzzy ballpark values.

First of all, since it's one of the 3 remaining originals, it has greater
value in a non-operating condition. All those original parts can't get worn
out and wrecked from an "archival" perspective. So, that leaves fleshing
out the artifact with replacements for non-factory and worn out bits. It
would then stay non-operational to preserve the artifact.

What's needed off the top of my head: New boiler. Misc. odd plumbing,
connecter rods for valves, that water glass, some gauges, new bearings on
the drivers...thie list goes on. Right now, if you're not intimately
familiar with the loco or running a real one, she looks complete.

Plan "B" is to build a complete and operating copy. To do that:
1) Set up a non-profit for the project. Very simple.
2) Start soliciting donations, grants, sponsors, etc. That's a lot of work.
3) Line up the craftsmen and artisans to do the labor for free. Bodies are
easy to come by. Guys who know what they're doing are going to cost.
3) Eureka or Sonoma would have to be dismantled and copies of most of the
castings made. The masters need to be about 2% bigger than the original
parts for shrinkage of the cooling metal. Getting a casting house to do the
work is pretty simple. Then reassemble the original loco.
4) Scour the collector's market and other museums for original or very good
duplicate parts.
5) Fabricate all the stuff that can be fabricated without castings. That
includes all sheet metal, built up bar parts, wood components, etc.

Now, when I spoke with Kyle, getting Sonoma to run was going to cost up to
$250,000.

A duplicate was closer to $500,000. Since then, metals and casting costs
have really gone up. Call it closer to the $750-$800,000 range to do
everything.

The State of California won't fund something like this right now.
Absolutely for sure there's no money within the Park System. Possibly
there's some obscure fund in some other department but I wouldn't count on
that either. So, look at Federal, corporate, or private money donations.

Craig H



--- In on3@yahoogroups.com, Bill Daniels <billinsf@...> wrote:
>
> Depends... on how fast you want to do it and how much money you have to
> spend. Real (12" to the foot, that is) railroads could do Class V
> overhauls in a month or less... but they were equipped for that kind of
> work and had the funding, manpower and component availability (either by
> outsource or self manufacture) to do it. Today that's no longer the case.
> Components that once were available over-the-shelf nowadays have to be
> custom fabricated (fortunately that's doable) and there are few people
> with the skills to work on steam. As for money...
>
> How long it would take to restore the Sonoma to operational condition
> would also depend on the current condition of the locomotive. How good is
> the frame, how good is the boiler shell, how good are the components? And,
> most importantly, does the money and the will to rebuild her actually
> exist anymore considering the economy in California?
>
> Bill Daniels
>
> Tucson, AZ
>
> --- On Sun, 7/19/09, rickshoup <ricshoup@...> wrote:
>
> From: rickshoup <ricshoup@...>
> Subject: Re: [on3] Re: PSC/MMI production drawings!!!!! 4-4-0
> To: on3@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 12:52 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Boone,
>
> As a SWAG how much do you think it cost to restore the Sonoma?
>
> How many years?
>
> =========== ========= =========
>
> Regards: Rick Shoup.
>
> ricshoup@verizon. net
>
> Note my spelling of verizon has changed.
>
> ++++++++++++ +++++++++ ++++
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "Bill Daniels" <billinsf@yahoo. com>
>
> To: <on3@yahoogroups. com>
>
> Sent: Sunday, July 19, 2009 2:49 PM
>
> Subject: Re: [on3] Re: PSC/MMI production drawings!!!! ! 4-4-0
>
>
>
> Boone,
>
>
>
> Although I haven't seen the Eureka as of yet, I have seen the Sonoma
>
> at the California State Museum. It's a truly gorgeous little gem...
>
> I'd consider getting one except for the little fact that the economy
>
> has to start getting better before I can spare $500 for one. But it IS
>
> tempting...
>
>
>
> Bill Daniels
>
>
>
> Tucson, AZ
>
>
>
> --- On Sun, 7/19/09, Boone Morrison <boone@aloha. net> wrote:
>
>
>
> From: Boone Morrison <boone@aloha. net>
>
> Subject: Re: [on3] Re: PSC/MMI production drawings!!!! ! 4-4-0
>
> To: on3@yahoogroups. com
>
> Date: Sunday, July 19, 2009, 12:38 PM
>
>
>
> GJ:
>
> Eureka was built for the Eureka & Palasades in, I believe, 1878 or 79.
>
> Sonoma wasbuilt for the North Pacific Coast in 1877. They are in most
>
> all respects identical.Both were restored from the same data base,
>
> assembled and created by Calif StateRR Museum. Both are simply
>
> beautiful, though Sonoma is not operational.
>
> One other approach is to get that same engine "painted, unlettered"
>
> and name itfor your road and engine number. All the 8-18C done in
>
> Style One paint were thesame in that period.
>
> Enjoy!
>
> Aloha, Boone
>
>
>
> On Jul 18, 2009, at 1:42 PM, Glenn476 wrote:
>
> Yes--now I'm torn between the "Eureka" and the "Sonoma"--no- -I
>
> can't afford
>
> both as I have another loco coming then--
>
>
>
> What was the original owner of the "Eureka"? Was it built for the
>
> E&P?
>
> gj
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> From: "Royce Wilson" <wilsongk@bellsouth . net>
>
> To: <on3@yahoogroups. com>
>
> Sent: Saturday, July 18, 2009 9:07 AM
>
> Subject: [on3] Re: PSC/MMI production drawings!!!! ! 4-4-0
>
>
>
> > Boone, you are slowly drawing the Colorado modelers to California
>
> narrow
>
> > gauge.
>
> >
>
> > Royce Wilson
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > ------------ --------- --------- ------
>
> >
>
> > Remember, additional On3 photos and files can now be found at:
>
> >
>
> > http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/On3photos
>
> >
>
> > ThanksYahoo! Groups Links
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
>
> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
>
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>
> Version: 8.5.387 / Virus Database: 270.13.19/2245 - Release Date:
>
> 07/18/09
>
> 05:57:00
>




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