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#81786 From: holloway@...
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:04 am
Subject: BAG gathering,Vacaville,CA,9/15/01
holloway@...
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Galoots far and wide (but mostly in the western parts of the USA):
	 The Bay Area Galoots will gather at my place just to the north of
Vacaville, CA. on Saturday, Sept. 15.  The current plan is to begin
converging about 10 AM, for show and tell, putzing, chatting, and doing
whatever comes natural.  I will have three WW benches available in the
shop, various tools scattered about, and a fairly well equipped smithy with
a forge that we might fire up. Ken Greenberg has offered to do a demo on
how to create Don McConnell-worthy molding (or reasonable facsimile ;-)
with a set of simple Hollows and Rounds.  I'm looking forward to that. Any
other demos are welcome.  If the schedule isn't too full and/or the spirit
moves, I will demo the Shaker Box molds and materials I gathered together
while participating in Ralph Brendler's online tutorial of same.  We will
break for lunch in early PM then keep on until we're tooled out.
	 This is to the entire OT list to catch anyone who might be in the
general region but not signed up on the BAG sub-list, with apologies to
BAGs who get a similar notice.  If you think you might be able to make it,
but are not on the BAG listserv, ping me for more detailed information,
including navigation to the site.
		 Tom Holloway


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#81785 From: holloway@...
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 3:36 am
Subject: Re: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
holloway@...
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Nick asked
>Question?  Short of burying the whole plane in a manure pile for a year, is
>there a technique to "rush" the patina on that shiny new side
>plate?..."

	 To which Todd provided all sorts of arcane and exotic methods of
artificially adding "age" to metal.

	 Another possibility not yet mentioned this time around is the
"patina" solutions available in stained glass supply shops in small and
inexpensive quantities, for changing the look of the solder veins in
stained glass work.  It comes in various shades and tones, which can be
mixed for intermediate colors and looks.  Wipe off quickly for lighter
effect, leave on a while for darker.  I believe these are mild acid
solutions that don't seem dangerous or difficult to use, with sensible
precautions (like, don't splash it in your eye!).  Wipe on with Q-tip or
similar, wipe off with rag or towel.
	 HTH,
		 Tom Holloway


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#81784 From: Steve Knight <stevek@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 5:18 am
Subject: Re: Rust Growing Season
stevek@...
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I need something better then wax on my steel sided infill's the finger prints
rust so bad. the wax does not seem to last any time at all. any idea's? it can't
be greasy as you have to hold the tool.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com
For prices and ordering instructions.
To subscribe to my good deals/beta testing/seconds email list send a email to
gooddeal-request@...
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#81783 From: "BUCKNER, BRIAN" <BBUCKNER@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:52 am
Subject: Re: Rust Growing Season
BBUCKNER@...
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Rodgers Charles wrote:

   >   How do you other galoots that live in rust prone areas (anywhere
   > outside of Lalafornia and the Sahara Desert) deal with this issue?


I've had good luck (so far) with "Bullfrog" VCI that I found at Highland
Hardware in Atlanta. The VCI emits some sort of gas that prevents rust quite
well. The only thing is that you must have the tools in a confined space for
it to work. I use mine in a toolbox but drawers and other enclosed spaces
will work fine.

It's pretty reasonable - about $7 for 12 emitters (they are small pieces of
foam with an adhesive back). They last for about a year. It has no affect on
the finish on wood or other non-metal surfaces.

Best,

Brian (in very humid North Florida).

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#81782 From: "BUCKNER, BRIAN" <BBUCKNER@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:12 am
Subject: RE: Unusual small router ID?
BBUCKNER@...
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I have a small closed throat router that I made from a bronze casting (St.
James Bay Tool Co.). It was copied from one that a patternmaker made and he
even cast his name "ANDY" into it. It's also about four inches long. It was
fashioned to resemble the #71.

You can see it at http://128.186.187.251/

I also have one similar but with an open throat. But it's still in its rough
form.

The size is very handy.

Best,

Brian.

   ------------------------------
   From: "William K. Taggart" <ILikeRust@...>
   To: <sexton1@...>, <oldtools@...>
   Subject: RE: Unusual small router ID?
   Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2001 18:32:45 -0400
   Message-ID: <001901c10991$910953a0$6cee43c0@...>
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   > >Paul W wrote:
   > >Anyone able to put a name to this little honey?
   > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1160092360
   >
   > Sure looks user-made to me.  Patternmakers seem to have had
   > time to mix
   > their own projects into casting runs quite easily.
   >
   > A few I've seen are really nice - better than the equivalent
   > commercially
   > available tool, both in appearance and design.
   >
   > Anybody out there collect homebrew stuff?

   I have one or two user-made items, including a baby router which looks
   manufactured, it's so nicely made. As I recall, Todd Hughes likes to
acquire
   interesting examples of user-made or modified/repaired old tools.

   - Bill

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#81781 From: "Bill - Craftsman Studio" <bill@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:04 am
Subject: Re: WTB damaged chisels
bill@...
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Wayne wrote
> Hi All,
>
>  I'm making another plea to the group for damaged chisels (socket beat
beyond repair). I'm looking for long straight sided (not bevel edged)
chisels over 1/2"...wider the better. I will be reshaping to make plane
irons. So please rescue the pitiful hunks of steel from the bottom of the
junk pail and let me give them a new repectable life as a hand tool again.

... Sadly I don't have any candidates but if I did I would happily donate
them.  Your planes are beautiful and more than worthy of an unloved chisel.

Should you decide to share with the group your technique for shaping the
hook or wrapped end, I would be most interested.

Cheers!

Bill




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#81780 From: "Todd and Betty Hughes" <dedhorse@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 3:49 am
Subject: Re: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
dedhorse@...
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Nick asked..."
Question?  Short of burying the whole plane in a manure pile for a year, is
there a technique to &#8220;rush&#8221; the patina on that shiny new side
plate?..." 

Wayne answeared
"I got one of those sideplates myself and I used cold bluing like they use on
gun barrels to turn it dark gray...."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Much of what I make now days has to be aged up when done, sometimes only to look a little worn, sometimes it has to be 200 plus years old.I would never put linseed oil on something I wanted to age up as it will prevent it from rusting, and many old-timers used it just for this, protecting tools from rust. I sometimes use gun bluing as sort of a base coat but most times I think gun browning is better.Bluing is better though if you just want to touch a small area up say that you had to file or grind. If you heat the side plate up first you will get much better results even with so called cold bluing.Common  house hold bleach will produce passable results and is very popular with some people,[not me] that ages things up, though if you are not careful it will give you a uniform look that looks like something aged in bleach.I like to use  gun browning,[not bluing] put on the hot metal so that it sizzles off, then I use a mixture of Hydrochloric acid and Muriatic acid,[believe that is what it is I mixed a big bottle of it up 9 years ago and still working on it] and paint it on the hot metal also.  For a job that calls for some scattered pitting I take some black powder sprinkle it on and light it.The piece should then be put somewhere warm and moist. This time of the year the best thing is to lay it on a damp paper towel in the grass with a piece of black plastic over it. Will heat up and provide plenty of humidity and rust up real fast. Just the browning will work ok probably for what you are doing on a 140 side plate. After done cooking for a few days you will want to take it out and clean it back some.This is the trick , and where the "artistry" comes into play ,cleaning it just right, to much and your work is destroyed, not enough and doesn't look right. Before you started rusting it you should had rounded the edges over some with sandpaper on a stick or a very fine wire wheel.The main mistake people make doing stuff like this is making it to uniform.Look at old rusty tools and you will see what you want with some arrears worn smooth and bright and others rusted. After done wash down with some baking soda in water to neutralize the acid.   
  I once took a course on fakes and forgeries taught by the head curator of a very prestigious museum and never heard so much bunk in my life," you can tell this is original because of the type of drill bit used,[a spoon bit, not an twist auger],this is authentic because it is made out of wrought iron and they don't make it anymore, [ I had just moved 2 truckloads of it the week before!] anyway at the last night you could bring in something you had to be checked so I brought in a piece I made the week before and it passed with flying colors....sort of thought about asking for my money back!....Todd  

#81779 From: Pam Niedermayer <pam_pine@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 3:47 am
Subject: Re: Cuckoo Clock - The Final Chapter
pam_pine@...
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Cool, very nice looking clock. Has the cucooing driven you crazy yet? :)

Pam

Ralph Brendler wrote:
>...
> After a few long nights of work, It's all finished.   I just finished
> hanging it on the wall.  It ticks, it tocks, it whizzes, it bongs, it goes
> "cuckoo"-- the whole nine yards.  The little bird even bobs up and down as
> he cuckoos... ;-)
> ...


--
Pamela G. Niedermayer
Pinehill Softworks Inc.
600 W. 28th St., Suite 103
Austin, TX 78705
512-236-1677
http://www.pinehill.com

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#81778 From: "L. Schmidt" <millhollow@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:32 am
Subject: Popular Mechanics Copyright issue
millhollow@...
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Hi All:
Several weeks ago I came across a number of boxlots of 1950s & 1960s Popular Mechanics magazines.
At a $1 a box it was hard to resist.
In their 50th anniversary issue they have a wonderful section on hand tools of yesteryear and some modern objects that will grow hair on your palms and/or cause blindness. I suppose you all know the evil I warn you about......p*w#r t**ls!
I would like to post a few of these pages on the internet for fellow gallots to look at and enjoy.
However, being that the magazine was published in 1952 has the copyright expired?
Is there a lawyer in the house?
Thanks again
Lou
Ps. Of course I mean the articles on hand tools and I intend to link them to an e-mail posting so as to prevent bandwidth waste.

#81777 From: jimbono@... (Jim Thompson)
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 3:24 am
Subject: RE: WTB damaged chisels
jimbono@...
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Hey, c'mon Bob! I see saws every weekend that are never going to find a
home.  They are new or late model saws that nobody will ever use or
resharpen. Obviously cheap crap that has no use.  I don't care if people
paint those all day long.

Chisels, well, that's kind of a toss up. Some are too shitty to worry
about restoring.  I saw a really big 1 1/2"  socket chisel recently that
had the socket beaten totally off the chisel.  The body of the chisel
had bad dings all over and it was slightly bent. I looked at it for a
minute, and decided it was just too much work to restore.  There is a
point at which I have to say no.  I have 35 bench chisels now that I
have brought back from the dead, but there are some that need to be
buried.
Or made into something else.

Jim Thompson

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#81776 From: Minch <ruby@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 2:53 am
Subject: I've Been to the Mountain
ruby@...
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GG


One of my auction buddies is an older gentleman who always manages to have a
#1 (tiny smoother jeff) or other interesting thing in his pocket.

Well today he sees me and grins and says "wanna see what I got in the
truck??"

A quick spin to the parking lot, he reaches into the cab and pulls out
a.....

Carter cupid's bow miter plane!

Boy oh boy is thing one wonderful piece of stuff.

It has a 2 piece steel sole - split at the mouth - with a little breadboard
joint to keep the pieces registered.  The cast brass body is beautifully
finished.  The rosewood infill is dense and close grained and quite lovely.
The lever cap is captive, like the blade holder on a #12 scraper.  And those
dovetails! Steel against brass in the cupid's bow pattern.  And is it heavy.

One neat feature is that the angled slot that has been filed out of the sole
for blade bedding is an exact fit to the width of the blade so you can't get
it in wrong.  This really seems to help in setting the blade as it is not
flopping side to side.

This specimen is unused, so I didn't have a chance at getting to use it.
But with the blade set to take 1/2 a hair, the mouth was the thickness of a
dollar bill.  I have heard about this but never really seen it before.

There is a big screw at the back of the body that my friend didn't know the
reason for.  Anybody?

I got to play with it for as long as I wanted.  I would love to try a plane
like this for its intended purpose.

Ed Minch


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#81775 From: Steve Knight <stevek@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 2:45 am
Subject: Re: Cuckoo Clock - The Final Chapter
stevek@...
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great job. I always wanted to make a clock. You did it better then I ever could.

--
Knight-Toolworks & Custom Planes
Custom made wooden planes at reasonable prices
See http://www.knight-toolworks.com
For prices and ordering instructions.
To subscribe to my good deals/beta testing/seconds email list send a email to
gooddeal-request@...
Subject: subscribe

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#81774 From: Moses and Meg <myoder@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 5:28 am
Subject: Re: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
myoder@...
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At 07:35 PM 07/10/2001 -0400, NickNaylo@... wrote:
>  Moses Yoder&#8217;s technique,left hand  thumb and middle finger
> holding, index finger applying pressure, worked perfectly.  A grinding
> epiphany!!!
>
>A little Scary Sharp and it&#8217;s the sharpest thing in the tool chest.

          I'm glad that others are having good experiences with the hand
cranked grinder. I really don't want any credit for the method that I wrote
about, as it was taken right out of the book "Making and Mastering Wooden
Planes" by David Finck.  He was a Krenov student, and I suspect the method
comes from Krenov. But I do enjoy the way it works. Just to make sure
credit is given where due.

          Moses Yoder
          White Pigeon, MI

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#81773 From: "Ralph Brendler" <ralph@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:50 am
Subject: Cuckoo Clock - The Final Chapter
ralph@...
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Those unfortunate galoots who have been following my travails in cuckoo
clockmaking can find the last installment on my web page at:

    http://www.brendlers.net/oldtools/cuckoo/

After a few long nights of work, It's all finished.   I just finished
hanging it on the wall.  It ticks, it tocks, it whizzes, it bongs, it goes
"cuckoo"-- the whole nine yards.  The little bird even bobs up and down as
he cuckoos... ;-)

I'm actually a little sad to be finished with it-- I had a LOT of fun making
this.  I've never made anything that required so many different skills.  I
now have a much greater appreciation for the skill and ingenuity of the Old
World craftsmen who made these.

It was definitely a challenge, but easily doable by someone with a modicum
of carving and casework skills.  I heartily recommend the exercise! My only
word of advice to aspiring cuckoo clockmakers-- buy the heavier weights...
;-)

ralph

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#81772 From: Scott Post <sepost@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:41 am
Subject: Re: The invasion of Indiana (oh the horror!)
sepost@...
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> Tad wrote:
>
>   If I remember right, it seems like we got quite a lot done that first day.
> Definately drilled and chopped the wedge mortice and escapement, etc.
> Needless to say we were sweating this operation because Tod had brought
> out the legendary "Posted" plane shortly before. (sorry Scott, I'm just
> reporting events as they occurred ;)
>

This has just been my week for taking abuse.  My family and coworkers
are already making fun of me for Harpering[1] my finger and now this.
How come Tod didn't save the cope iron Ralph filed too narrow?  Huh?

--
Scott Post  sepost@... http://members.home.net/sepost

[1] Harper, verb: To inflict a workshop injury upon oneself, often requiring
a trip to the Emergency Room.  example: to whack one's index finger with
a huge mallet while driving home a large tenon on one's new bench, thus
splintering off a piece of bone and leading to having the fingernail
drilled and splint applied.

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#81771 From: "Bob Rackers" <rackersr@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:38 am
Subject: RE: WTB damaged chisels
rackersr@...
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Wayne -
 
I'm willing to spend the time, when I have it.
Matter of fact, I have no reservation picking up those very chisels to repair them.
If so many good ones are to be had, then just grab a few of the less minty ones you have and use them?
Go to a garage sale of your choice this weekend and pick up a replacement for it.
Not to worry, they're a dime-a-dozen.
 
I can't say for certain, but I suspect the people that paint saws probably think some or all of the following thoughts.
 
I have no reason to feel guilty about painting saws because:
1. The few folks that are talented enough to get this saw back into good working order aren't going to want to spend the time.
(They generally have more productive things to do.)
2. Besides, how much would this saw be worth anyway if brought back to good working order when there are so many good saws to be had?
3. No one really uses handsaws much anymore, if at all, so if I don't paint these things, then a good 99% of them are going to simply rust away or get thrown out as junk.
4. I will not paint any saw, just the castaways.
5. Considering the fact that people can get a lot more work done with a circular saw, all handsaws are castaways.
6. I can paint any saw I want and not feel bad.
6. I'm taking an otherwise useless tool and turning it into something useful - a work of art.
 
Of course, that's just their opinion.
 
Bob
 
-----Original Message-----
From: WANDERSO@... [mailto:WANDERSO@...]
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 7:53 PM
To: rackersr@...
Cc: oldtools@...
Subject: Re: WTB damaged chisels

In a message dated 7/10/01 5:14:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
rackersr@... writes:


I'd say none are beyond repair, if one knows how to repair them.
Better to make something else into plane blades than repairable chisels.
A lot of folks seem to paint saws they consider beyond repair.

Bob



Your comment is noted, but consider this:
The few folks that are talented enough to remanufacture a socket chisel
aren't going to want to spend the time, they generally have more productive
things to do. How much is a repaired chisel worth anyway when there are so
many good ones to be had? No, 99% of these chisels are going to rust away or
get thrown out as junk. I'm not asking for good tools...just some castaways.
And unlike what I'm doing...painting a saw is taking a good tool (sometimes)
and turning it into something useless (IMHO).
Wayne

#81770 From: "John L. Odom" <jlodom@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:05 am
Subject: Re:sledge
jlodom@...
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GGs--

I rehandled a small one hand 6 lb. sledge today, one that' been in the
family as long as I can remember. As i was cleaning it up for the job, I
noticed the maker's stamp.  "Gar Wood  6".  I remember a lot of heavy
equipment with the Gar Wood name and also the speedboats, but this is the
first handtool I recall with that name.

John Odom, in Ooltewah, TN

_________________________________________________________________
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#81769 From: Adam <cherubini@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:09 am
Subject: woodworking with children
cherubini@...
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Gary asked about a bench for 2 year olds:

In my experience, the special kiddy bench thing doesn't work.

I'm an engineer and stuff like this isn't always as obvious to me as it is
to other people:  Gigi (just turned 4) isn't all that interested in the
"lamp mallet" (carvers mallet) jointer plane, and curlies in my shop.  She
just wants to spend time with her Dad.

She's always under foot and in the way.  She's happiest standing on a
kitchen step stool next to me at the tail vise of my bench (where I work
most often).  Gigi turns the "big steerer" at inopportune moments, crushing
my most fragile work pieces in the tail vice's powerful jaw.

I have things for Gigi to play with:  A clapped out razee jack plane with no
iron, lots of scrap blocks, and a clean chip brush.  She especially likes to
help milk paint.  You really can't screw up milk paint in my experience, so
a 3 year old is a welcome helper!

I change the way I work when Gigi comes to visit..  Although Gigi doesn't
mess with stuff she's not allowed to touch, like shiny drawknives, wood
planes, or hatchets, I try to move dangerous things, or chemicals out of her
path.  Also, I try to slow down and enjoy her presence.  I guess that's the
most important thing.

I'd skip the bench and make those people a nice safe stool or seat or
something so they can be right next to their Dad and see everything that's
happening.

But that's just my opinion.

Regards,

Adam Cherubini

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#81768 From: Ghio Bill <bghio@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 12:51 am
Subject: Do mitre jacks come in pairs? (Long)
bghio@...
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Several years ago I spotted a mitre jack sitting on a table at the local
antiques swap. Dealer told me it was a "clamp." Since a Galoot can't have
too many clamps, I bought it. This one was pretty much identical to the one
pictured in Salaman and every one I have seen since has been of this
configuration. If you are not sure what I am talking about, see
http://people.we.mediaone.net/wghio/1top.jpg

Last weekend I spotted a strange object on a dealer's table. Trapezoidal in
shape, it had a long handscrew operating a moving jaw just like my mitre
jack, but the angles were wrong. A mitre jack is supposed to give you a
45-deg. face to plane against (and per Salaman, a 90-deg. face on the
backside for squaring up). At first glance, this one looked to be about 30
degrees. I asked the dealer what it was used for and he explained that it
was a vice that would be installed at one corner of a wood worker's bench
(i.e., a tail vice). Sold me!

I bought this darn thing and still didn't know what end was up, I just knew
I had to have it. SWMBO was impressed enough with the joinery and gizmosity
that she just kept her elbow in my ribs and winking up a storm till I said
I'd take it. (Of course she changed her tune when she found out I already
owned a mitre jack – clearly she is a user, not a collector.)

As I inspected it, I saw marks on each end indicating it had been held
between bench dogs. Oriented with these marks down, it was apparent that the
45-deg. angle was between the inner surface, between the jaws, and the top
surface. http://people.we.mediaone.net/wghio/2top.jpg
If you compare the two pictures, you will see the advantage of this
arrangement: You plane from the top, rather than at an angle on the
45-degree face. This gives you more choices on your angle of attack and you
don't run into the bench top with a large plane. This angled position also
makes it easier to handle a long board: Compare
http://people.we.mediaone.net/wghio/2side.jpg to the first photo.

The first one mounts in a vice that is closed on a block on its underside.
This block is secured with side braces that make it practical to mount the
device only in the face vice as shown in the first photo. It faces backwards
if mounted in the end vice. The second one can mount in any position that
can get between two bench dogs, making it much more versatile. See
http://people.we.mediaone.net/wghio/1bottom.jpg for a bottom view of the
first jack and http://people.we.mediaone.net/wghio/2bottom.jpg shows the
bottom view of the second jack.

The maximum opening between the jaws of the first one is 6 1/4 inches, the
second opens to 9 inches. Overall length of both is 20 inches. Height of the
second is 5 1/2 inches, the first being about an inch taller. While the
joinery in the second is more complex, with four double tenons and two
dovetails compared to only lap or face joints in the first, there are only 9
pieces to the second compared to 14 pieces in the first. For strength, I'll
go with #2.

So the question is, for those who are still with me, have you ever seen a
mitre jack of this configuration? Is it associated with any particular
trade?

Bill
Mitre Jack Collector


Bill Ghio
Civil Service Department
City of Torrance, CA

310/ 618-2915
http://www.torrnet.com

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#81767 From: "Todd and Betty Hughes" <dedhorse@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 12:46 am
Subject: Re: An original Frame Saw Blade
dedhorse@...
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BugBear replied to my not being able to measure a saw blade...."
> Todd - are you trying to tell us you don't have a whole shelf of
> Starrett
> micrometers in original boxes, all bought for under buck?
>
> I can just hear it: "This G clamp has a really slow thread, and
> is a little small - how about 50c !?!?
>
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     I guess I have a couple of  micrometers floating around somewhere,[ by
the way I always refer to them as "Funny Nut Crackers" when I buy them have
found out that nut crackers go for less then C clamps!] but I have never
really figured out how to use them, something I don't think I need to know
how to do and with a slow head like me I can't afford to waste brain power
on stuff  I don't really need to know.I figure if I had just not taken those
math classes in school and filled my head up with useless stuff I would be
able today to be able to memorize the entire type study for the Stanley 9
1/2 series block plane.
    Is hard to date this saw since it is hand made I would be pretty
confident to putting it before the Civil War mainly because of the hand
forged hardware but this is just a guess.Remember the one I made a couple
years back had hand forged hard ware also.I do think it was harder for saw
makers to make thinner saws  back in the older days, . Looking at most of my
really old saws they seem to be somewhat thicker then say a Disston from
1900. I don't know if this was because they had trouble making steel this
thin or more likely was hard to make steel that was good enough,[and make it
cheap enough] that they could make it this thin and still have a good
saw....just guessing though...Todd

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#81766 From: Nichael Cramer <nichael@...>
Date: Wed Jul 11, 2001 12:10 am
Subject: Re: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
nichael@...
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>Question?  Short of burying the whole plane in a manure pile for a year,
is there a technique to &#8220;rush&#8221; the patina on that shiny new
side plate?

In one of his books, St Roy suggests the following gallootish
scheme for patina-izing shockingly bright, brand-new hardware:

Heat the hardware in a small of fire of shavings.  Then, coat
the thing in linseed oil and let it dry.

NEEDLESS TO SAY:  Be careful, linseed oil is very inflammable.

N

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#81765 From: WANDERSO@...
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 7:59 pm
Subject: Re: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
WANDERSO@...
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Question?  Short of burying the whole plane in a manure pile for a year, is
there a technique to &#8220;rush&#8221; the patina on that shiny new side
plate? 

Nick,
I got one of those sideplates myself and I used cold bluing like they use on
gun barrels to turn it dark gray. I inspected my buddy's original sideplate
and found the inside (the unworn side) had originally been blued anyhow. Most
hardware stores have bluing if you don't have a gun shop nearby.
Wayne

#81764 From: WANDERSO@...
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 7:53 pm
Subject: Re: WTB damaged chisels
WANDERSO@...
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In a message dated 7/10/01 5:14:10 PM Central Daylight Time,
rackersr@... writes:


I'd say none are beyond repair, if one knows how to repair them.
Better to make something else into plane blades than repairable chisels.
A lot of folks seem to paint saws they consider beyond repair.

Bob



Your comment is noted, but consider this:
The few folks that are talented enough to remanufacture a socket chisel
aren't going to want to spend the time, they generally have more productive
things to do. How much is a repaired chisel worth anyway when there are so
many good ones to be had? No, 99% of these chisels are going to rust away or
get thrown out as junk. I'm not asking for good tools...just some castaways.
And unlike what I'm doing...painting a saw is taking a good tool (sometimes)
and turning it into something useless (IMHO).
Wayne

#81763 From: NickNaylo@...
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 7:35 pm
Subject: Stanley 140 side plate and a good grind.....
NickNaylo@...
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In the mail when I got home yesterday was, surprise, surprise, the side plate to
my 140 (stanley skewed block/rabbet (rebate) plane Jeff).

I had ordered it from the Museum of Woodworking tools weeks ago, (posting
Galoots clued me in that reproductions were for sale) and seeing it was
backordered, assumed it would be months before I saw the thing.

It arrived just in time for &#8220;Shopnite&#8221;, the weekly evening wherein I
get to ditch my marital and parental duties and work solely for personal
enjoyment.

Anyway, the side plate fits very well, a little short here and a little high
there but I&#8217;m happy to have it.   Had to sharpen the iron though. Pulled
out the hand grinder (left hand thread nut courtesy of John Chestnut, thank
you), clamped it to the bench and, the old tool gods must have been smiling on
my shop, the grinding of the badly back bevelled skew blade went without a
hitch.   A nice hollow grind all the way across the blade, just like in all
those sharpening articles and books.  Moses Yoder&#8217;s technique,left hand 
thumb and middle finger holding, index finger applying pressure, worked
perfectly.  A grinding epiphany!!!

A little Scary Sharp and it&#8217;s the sharpest thing in the tool chest.

Question?  Short of burying the whole plane in a manure pile for a year, is
there a technique to &#8220;rush&#8221; the patina on that shiny new side plate?

I would never try to pass the thing off as original, the plane is far too
trashed for resale, almost no japanning, very little nickle on the cap, dinged
and dented adjusters, mangled screw heads, but it does warm my little bottom
feeder heart (got it for $9.00)

Thanks for reading this.

MS(NN)


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#81762 From: "William K. Taggart" <ILikeRust@...>
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:42 pm
Subject: RE: New Rogers jigsaw gloat
ILikeRust@...
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> Got lucky today and a guy called me about some tools.  I went
> out to look and he had a New Rogers jigsaw.  I got it for a price that
> seemed to me somewhere between fair and gloatable
>
> (1) Off the small pulley is a 6 inch shaft that looks like it
> was threaded to take an arbor.  What was that for?

On the ones I've seen, and catalog pages I've seen, the shaft could take a
couple different items:

  - a drill chuck for horizontal boring
  - an emery wheel or similar for grinding, polishing, etc.

> (3) Did these have a foot to hold down the work?

I've never seen one with a "hold down" - would seem to me to defeat the
purpose of a jigsaw - you want to be able to move the work around - you've
just got to also apply downward pressure.

> (4) It looks like there is an arrangement for a leather pump
> to blow chips  away from the work.  Most of the leather has long since
worn
> out.  Anyone tried to repair one of these?

Let us know how you make out on that one...  ;-)

> (5) What should I do about the rust and finish?  One thought
> I have had is to try to refinish the bottom parts of the legs and blend
the
> new finish  into the old.  Another is to leave it alone or just lightly
> clean it.  And another is to do the whole thing.  I lean more toward the
> first two, but the rust at the bottom of the legs is pretty bad and it
might
> be good at least to get rid of it and do something to prevent it from
returning.
> Generally I'm not big on refinishing tools, and I know that most
> collector's frown on it for many tools.  I seem to have noticed that
> collectors of stationary foot-power tools seem to be more
> like car and gas station collectors in their practices, which seems to
mean
> they refinish stuff more often than not.  Any thoughts?

Ahem. What are you tryin' to do, start a holy war???

It's your tool.

- Bill

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#81761 From: "William K. Taggart" <ILikeRust@...>
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:32 pm
Subject: RE: Unusual small router ID?
ILikeRust@...
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> >Paul W wrote:
> >Anyone able to put a name to this little honey?
> >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1160092360
>
> Sure looks user-made to me.  Patternmakers seem to have had
> time to mix
> their own projects into casting runs quite easily.
>
> A few I've seen are really nice - better than the equivalent
> commercially
> available tool, both in appearance and design.
>
> Anybody out there collect homebrew stuff?

I have one or two user-made items, including a baby router which looks
manufactured, it's so nicely made. As I recall, Todd Hughes likes to acquire
interesting examples of user-made or modified/repaired old tools.

- Bill

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#81760 From: Don Stern <donstern@...>
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 10:38 pm
Subject: Public Service Annoucement, Radial Arm Saw retrofit (don't flame me)
donstern@...
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To be read only by RAS owners, all others stop here!

I know, I know, this list is for hand tools only but in the interest of
public safety I'm passing on the following info for any Sears Radial Arm
(Radio and Arm) saws.

There is a free upgrade for the guard/table of many RAS made by Emerson
for Sears. Check out: http://www.radialarmsawrecall.com/ for further
information. It's a free kit.

List Moms and others please excuse.


Don


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail
http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

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#81759 From: BruceRenfro@...
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 6:26 pm
Subject: Re: Rust Growing Season
BruceRenfro@...
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In a message dated 07/10/2001 10:49:58 AM Central Daylight Time,
keppler@... writes:


Rodgers Charles wrote:

>   How do you other galoots that live in rust prone areas (anywhere
> outside of Lalafornia and the Sahara Desert) deal with this issue?



I have used camellia oil for 10 years or so, and I haven't had any problem
with rust, even in humid Central Texas.  A little of the oil goes a loooong
way.   I also use small squares of synthetic camphor in my toolbox.  I read
years ago that this works, but I don't know whether it's an old wives tale or
what.  Anyway, there's no rust.  Somebody told me the camphor probably repels
elephants, 'cause I've never had a problem with them, either.  Where's a
trained chemist when you need one?

Bruce







#81758 From: "Bob Rackers" <rackersr@...>
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 9:34 pm
Subject: RE: WTB damaged chisels
rackersr@...
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I'd say none are beyond repair, if one knows how to repair them.
Better to make something else into plane blades than repairable chisels.
A lot of folks seem to paint saws they consider beyond repair.

Bob

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-oldtools@...
[mailto:owner-oldtools@...]On Behalf Of
WANDERSO@...
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 10:42 AM
To: oldtools@...
Subject: WTB damaged chisels


Hi All,

  I'm making another plea to the group for damaged chisels (socket beat beyond
repair). I'm looking for long straight sided (not bevel edged) chisels over
1/2"...wider the better. I will be reshaping to make plane irons. So please
rescue the pitiful hunks of steel from the bottom of the junk pail and let me
give them a new repectable life as a hand tool again.

Yours,
Wayne Anderson

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#81757 From: Tad <tja@...>
Date: Tue Jul 10, 2001 8:58 pm
Subject: The invasion of Indiana (oh the horror!)
tja@...
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GGs,

   Acting on the assumption of "better late than never", here's a little story
about one particularly galootish weekend this spring.

   No names have been changed to protect the guilty.  Except for the waitor at
"Chi-Chi's".  We forgot his name, but figured "Greg Brady" would work better
for comedic value.  If you ever get to Marion, IN and have him as a waitor,
you'll understand why.

   And make no mistake about it.  You _really need_ to get to Marion, IN.  Beg,
borrow, steal, wheedle, whine, stamp your feet, eat ramen noodles for a
month...  Whatever it takes.  Really.  Even if "Greg Brady" isn't around to
entertain and amuse...  One galoot to another, ya gotta go.

   With that out of the way, let's set the wayback machine for a few short
months ago.

   "Hey, we should take a wooddorking class."

   Startled, I tear myself out of the "code zone," blinking furiously in an
attempt to force my eyes to focus past 2 feet.  "Oh, hi Dave," I said lamely.

   Dave Kasper, galoot, renaissance man, wooddorker.  You'd all already know
him if he'd just post a bio.  But since that hasn't happened yet, (hint, hint)
you'll just have to take my word that he's one of the good guys.

   "Ya know, funny you should mention that, but some joker just posted to
oldtools with some harebrained story about taking a planemaking class from
Tod Herrli."  I began.  "Yeah, as a matter of fact, I was just looking at
his web page..."  Dave was looking at me kind of wierd at this point.  "It's
not that expensive, we could go over a weekend so's we'd only need one or
two days off..."  Definate scared look on Dave's face at this point.  "C'mon,
you know you want to go...  Heck, you're the one who brought this whole thing
up!"  I gushed out in a single breath.

   "Um, Okay, let's do it."  Or something to that effect.

   Thus began an odessey that started with a few casual emails to Tod and
ended with two snorting galoots sneaking my wife's car out of the driveway,
pointing it Eastward and hoping that no law enforcement would notice the
low flying Jetta as it loped across the plains towards Indiana.

   Heh, heh.  You know a weekends going well when an all day drive goes by in
a heartbeat.  And why shouldn't it.  Nice day, fun car, plenty to talk about.
Get to view the gun nut version of the old burma-shave signs in southern Ill.
I could do this every weekend!

   So here we are, driving through the industrial area of Marion, IN wondering
where in the world our hotel could be.  Hoping that the map is wrong and it's
nowhere near here...  Luckily it wasn't anywhere near there, but as these
things sometimes happen, it wasn't all that near Tod's place in Northern
Marion either.  Bummer.

   Next morning, we spring out of bed and...  Ok, Dave sprang, I kind of
fell out of bed and crawled to the car.

   I had met Tod at a Galootapalooza gathering a few years ago.  Much to my
dismay, Mark Van Roojen actually has a picture of me drooling on one of his
planes from that event. ;)  So I knew that I was in for a real treat with this
class.

   Tod's shop is located in the basement of his house and has a convenient
entry through the garage.  Having spent hour after hour trying to get lumber
through my kitchen and down the basement stairs...  Well, I was green with
jealousy right off the bat.  That was before I saw the _fireplace_ in his
shop.  Yeah, a fireplace.  With convenient shelves for displaying planes.
And on one of those shelves...  Yep, the same plane that I'd drooled on at
galootapalooza.  It was almost too much to take.

   Sitting in front of the fireplace is a bench with several vises and a quick
scan revealed yet another well made bench w/tail vise shoved in the corner.
Sheesh, I can't even finish the first one and this guy's got at least two!

   So I'm hanging my coat up and Tod says "Why don't you guys come back to
my shop and we can get started."  What?  This isn't the shop?  And he leads
us through a doorway and into one of the best set up workshops that I've seen
in a while.  You could have knocked me over with a feather.

   To my left is a very well layed out bench against the wall with a well
designed and well layed out tool rack, huge walnut face vise and a classic
tail vise on the end.  To my right is a neatly stacked wood rack complete with
toaster oven for those late-night snacks, err...  Tempering irons, as I was to
later find out.

   In the center of the room stands a (waterwheel powered, no doubt!) bandsore,
behind it, a fridge sits below a pretty sizable collection of Stanley planes.

   Above the screaming demon, attached to the ceiling, is a shelf full of
wooden planes.  Hollows, rounds, plows, cope, stick, you name it, Tod seems
to make it.

   on the left hand wall hangs a shelf with a few hand-cranked grinders and a
buffer that almost looked electrically powered (but I'm sure it wasn't ;).

   Above that, lord of lords, big chunks of _apple_!  Now, he's showing us
his collection of self-made apple planes!  Aaaaaaaaaah!  Has he no shame?
Thankfully, he does not and we burn lots of time passing around tools and
shooting the bull.  Much like a mini-galootapalooza.

   "What kind of wood do you guys want to make your planes out of?"
   "APPLE!"
   "Ok, beech it is, then."

   Seriously though, Dave and I decided on beech for our first plane and after
working with it over the course of that weekend, we fell in love.  Beech is
really a beautiful wood to work with, too bad it's so hard for us to get in
Iowa.

   After painstakingly sawing our blanks out of a chunk of laminated beech.
Well, it was painful to the electrons, I'm sure...  We gathered around the
workbench for a quick lesson on hollows and rounds.  You know, I always
thought I knew about hollows and rounds, but watching Tod lay out the profiles
on a sheet of paper (and after he answered all of our silly questions).  I
came to the conclusion that I didn't really know jack about H&Rs after all.
Don't know why that would be surprising, but there ya go.

   There's a lot of little things that would take a long time to figure out
on your own, but having Tod explain the what/why/wherefore of it all really
helps it all sink in.  And stick.

   You know, I still can't for the life of me remember which is "hollow" and
which is "round" even after Tod explained it several times, but that's
certainly not a failing on his part...

   A huge gyro at the local greek restaraunt and we were ready to start.  As
an aside, the food at this place is superb.  Be sure and beg Tod to take you
there for at least one lunch.  We were lucky enough to go twice ;)

   I didn't know what to expect, never having made a hollow (or is it round?)
before.

   Some of the things that I thought would be hard turned out to be easy and
some of the things that thought would be easy turned out to be hard.

   Luckily, we had Tod there to watch our backs and keep us from going too
far astray.

   Tod's method of instruction is IMHO, superb.  He cut his own blank and
would demonstrate each operation on his plane first, then let us attack our
blank while he either watched, gave advice, or just hung back and BSed as
appropriate.  Because he was performing each step shortly before us, things
kind of flowed along smoothly and there was practically zero chance of
anything important being forgotten along the way.

   The disadvantage, of course, is that Tod's a pro and he makes everything
look easy.  Even when it's not.  Although, he is very good at pointing out
both where the problems are going to crop up as well as good techniques to
help you through.  There's not a lot Tod can do to solve the problems of
inexperience, but his good humor and seemingly infinite patience sure helps!

   If I remember right, it seems like we got quite a lot done that first day.
Definately drilled and chopped the wedge mortice and escapement, etc.
Needless to say we were sweating this operation because Tod had brought
out the legendary "Posted" plane shortly before. (sorry Scott, I'm just
reporting events as they occurred ;)

   It was a good day.  We were exhausted and hungry, so after a yak session
on the sofa (yeah, he's got a sofa in his shop too) Dave and I decided to
go to Chi-Chi's and see if we could sight this "Greg Brady" fellow that
Tod had been telling us about earlier.

   Secretly, I thought Tod was pulling our leg, but much to our suprise...
Our waitor was Greg Brady's twin!  Really!  What are the chances that we'd
get the very waitor we'd come to see.  Right down to the Hawaiian shirt!

   Hah!  He turned out to be a very good waitor with a great sense of humor.
We got the impression that he was kind of amused by our reaction and that
he was well aware of his resemblance to a "legendary" actor.  We left him
a large tip though, just in case.

   Fast forward to the next morning.  Time to make an iron.  Whoohoo!

   Making an iron is mostly tedious sawing and filing (unless, like Tod, you
own a Bridgeport) and I'm not going to spend a lot of time reporting every
stroke of the saw, etc here.

   The one thing that I will say is that even if I didn't come home with a
plane from this class, I'd be satisfied solely with the instruction from
Tod on how to properly grind and sharpen a blade.  He really demystified
the whole process and it was a real eye opener to see him spend about 30
seconds at the grinder/buffer and end up with a sharper blade than I could
get after hours at scary sharp.  Then he showed us how to do it.  I can't
thank him enough.  Really.

   *insert lots of sawing, filing, grinding, etc. here*

   Ok, I admit it, I'm a wuss.  I let Tod heat treat my blade.  I couldn't
bear the thought of messing up something that I'd just spent so much time
hacking out.  Dave stepped up to the plate when it came to his turn, so the
Iowa contingent wasn't completely lost...

   This is a really fun part of the process.  Lots of flames, heat and tons
of sooty, black smoke!  Would be a good prop for Halloween!

   Stick the blade in the toaster oven for tempering, and off to lunch!

   *insert eating frenzy here*

   Ok, back from lunch and we check the bedding of the irons by sooting up the
blade with a real oil lamp!  Whoohoo!  playing with fire...

   I'm happy to report that both Dave and I were successful at making a matched
pair of H&Rs.  It's really amazing how well these things work with a sharp
blade and tight mouth.  Never having found an antique one with either of these
qualities, and not being very adept at sharpening curves, I was shocked.

   Our shavings didn't quite fall upwards and stick to the ceiling, but wow!
Talk about leaving a sweet surface finish!

   Now I just have to figure out how to get Dave to give me the other plane so
I can have a matched set ;)

   After saying our goodbyes to Tod and family, we loaded up the car and,
get this, Tod points to this enormous pile of beech logs and says.  "Hey guys,
you want to take some beech home?"

   Why, oh why didn't I take the truck ;)  We did manage to get a huge chunk of
it stuffed in the trunk though, so all was not lost.

   Hope you've enjoyed reading this tale as much as I enjoyed writing it.  Can't
wait to go back (if Tod can handle us again).

   So folks, what're you waiting for?  Give Tod a call and jump the next boat,
plane, motorcycle, car, bus, bike or motorhome heading towards Indiana.  You
won't be sorry.

Tad Anhalt
Des Moines, Ia.

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