Apparently some of the bacteria produce enzymes that help in converting grain
starch to sugars!
Commercial enzymes are also produced from bacteria and fungi.
wal

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "jamesonbeam1" <jamesonbeam1@...> wrote:
>
>
> Hello J,
>
> And welcome aboard...  I too as a wine maker was at first taken back a
> bit when reading about and learning some of the lack of sanitary
> techniques in this art of distilling.
>
> However, as you will soon understand,  its not the fermentations we are
> drinking...  Its the vapors from boiling the fermentations which are
> condensed into the "aqua vitae" we are seeking.
>
> Wine makers and brewers are very concerned about sanitary conditions,
> since their end products are fermented longer and kept in bottles, then
> drunk.  Any small amounts of bacteria in them will quickly multiply and
> distroy those products.
>
> In our hobby, it is necessary to keep your untensils clean and the
> fermentation covered and away from bacteria (especially the kind that
> produces vinegar).  However, due to the short fermentation times
> (usually less then a week to 2 weeks), any bacteria does not have time
> to build up.  In the next step - distillation, the boiling of the
> fermentation will immediately kill off any remaining bad boys and they
> definitly will not come out in the vapors we condense.
>
> If you really want to get freaked out, check out the process of making
> dunder for rum and look at some of the pictures we have around here
> [;)] .  Believe me, some of stuff I would'nt even consider using, but
> they say it adds to the flavors.
>
> Good luck and above all - Be Safe.
>
> Vino es Veritas,
>
> Jim aka Waldo.
>
>
> --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "j_klinck" <j_klinck@> wrote:
> >
> > I have been doing some reading about fermenting on grains (whiskey
> mash) and have a few question. I'm a homebrewer of many years and am
> very familiar with creating sanitary fermentation conditions. The whole
> idea of making a mash, letting it cool and then just pitching the yeast
> into it kind of freaks me out. Is there anything you do to keep the bugs
> from taking over and screwing up your fermentation?
> >
>

Your 100% Correct J,

The pasturization temp of 161 F is below the optimal temps for alpha amylase (162 F to 167 F) and does the job of killing off the wild yeasts and bacteria on grains very well.

However, there are several recipes around here that require the fermentation on grains with absolutly no heating at all,  believe it or not.  One of the more famous sourmash procedures is is called "Uncle Jesse's Simple Sourmash Method", or the UJSSM for short.

This is done with just cracked corn, water, sugar and yeast.  I have done this for several years with no problems (of course with several modifications - another topic).  Matter of fact, Uncle Jesse used to run the biggest distilling site on the net -  The Home Distillers Forum (he is now running his own distillery I believe).  See:  www.homedistiller.org.    For the recipe check out:  http://homedistiller.org/wiki/index.php/Uncle_Jesse's_Simple_Sour_Mash_Method

Vino es Veritas,

Jim aka Waldo.

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "j_klinck" <j_klinck@...> wrote:
>
> Well, regular mash temperatures are going to kill any bacteria/wild yeast/lactobacillus that is on the grain. So if you do the mash in a kettle with the lid on, let it cool for a day and then open it up and pitch the yeast. Then the spoiling organisms won't really have a way into the mash.

Sorry J,

For the forum its http://homedistiller.org/forum  the link http://homedistiller.org/ will get you to Tony Ackland's Home Distillers site - our bible.

JB.

Just wishing everyone Happy Holidays and a wonderful New Year.  Especially all the hundreds of new members who have joined since last year. 

For those who have not posted yet, Welcome aboard and enjoy.  Again, feel free to read our resources here and ask away at any questions you may have.

For all the regulars:

May we share our Holiday Spirits with all friends and family and 'Sláinte chuig na fir, agus go mairfidh na mná go deo.'

(Health to the men, and may the women live forever!)

Vino es Veritas,

Jim aka Waldo.

(and yes my ol' silly night before xmas for those who have'nt read it yet )

"A Distiller's Night Before Christmas"

'Twas after the Christmas Bash and all through the house,
the bottles all emptied, strewn about by some louse;
Our wet stockings were hung by the chimney to dry,
and the stench in the air caused me almost to cry.

My good buddy sound asleep, passed out like a log,
drempt of visions of mornings' "hair of the dawg";
And I a sipping from a full glass which was near,
distilling lots more of that new Christmas Cheer;

When out in the shed there rose such a clatter,
I jumped from the bench and broke my hydrometer;
Away to the shed, I crawled, stumbled, and ran,
Broke open the door, and saw a funny old man;

I threw on the switch and with lights all aglow,
gave a luster of gold to the pot-still below;
He had crawled through the window, knocked over me mash,
And I knew in a moment, he'd been into my damn stash!;

His eyes were so bloodshot, his clothes in a tatter,
His nose was all red, mumblin' just like the Mad Hatter;
The boots that he wore had torn white fur for trim,
And the way he staggered, must a been tanked to the brim;

He yelled, "Now Scotch! Now Bourbon!
We ain't got all night!
You too Gin and Vodka!
Let's all do it up right!"

With a look in his eye,
seeming almost lively and quick,
He slurred,"You want Really Good shine?
Well here, pake your tick.";

He broke open his sack, filled with rums,
whiskeys and white brew,
And asked me to try a samplin'! --
"Take more then a few!";

I tasted and tasted and said "Old Man,
Thats really great stuff",
He stuck middle finger up and said
"Ya, yours is kinda rough.";

He spoke not a word,
but got deep in his bag with great fun,
by givin' me another hydrometer, malt whisky
and new PDA-1;

Then back out the window he crawled with great haste,
Got in his red Ford pickup, taking one last big taste.
But I heard him exclaim, as he hit the post of my light:

"HAPPY AHRISTMAS TO CALL, AND TO ALL A GOOD-TIGHT."
(almost a real poem...)
J.B. 2008

Guten Tag jamesonbeam1,
Thank you for your greetings and this great forum.

A still only reader.My questions will come soon.

am Freitag, 25. Dezember 2009 um 07:14 schrieben Sie:




> Just wishing everyone Happy Holidays and a wonderful New Year.
> Especially all the hundreds of new members who have joined since last
> year.

> For those who have not posted yet, Welcome aboard and enjoy.  Again,
> feel free to read our resources here and ask away at any questions you
> may have.

> For all the regulars:

> May we share our Holiday Spirits with all friends and family and
> 'Sláinte chuig na fir, agus go mairfidh na mná go deo.'

> (Health to the men, and may the women live forever!)

> Vino es Veritas,

> Jim aka Waldo.

> (and yes my ol' silly night before xmas for those who have'nt read it
> yet  [:)] )

> "A Distiller's Night Before Christmas"

> 'Twas after the Christmas Bash and all through the house,
> the bottles all emptied, strewn about by some louse;
> Our wet stockings were hung by the chimney to dry,
> and the stench in the air caused me almost to cry.

> My good buddy sound asleep, passed out like a log,
> drempt of visions of mornings' "hair of the dawg";
> And I a sipping from a full glass which was near,
> distilling lots more of that new Christmas Cheer;

> When out in the shed there rose such a clatter,
> I jumped from the bench and broke my hydrometer;
> Away to the shed, I crawled, stumbled, and ran,
> Broke open the door, and saw a funny old man;

> I threw on the switch and with lights all aglow,
> gave a luster of gold to the pot-still below;
> He had crawled through the window, knocked over me mash,
> And I knew in a moment, he'd been into my damn stash!;

> His eyes were so bloodshot, his clothes in a tatter,
> His nose was all red, mumblin' just like the Mad Hatter;
> The boots that he wore had torn white fur for trim,
> And the way he staggered, must a been tanked to the brim;

> He yelled, "Now Scotch! Now Bourbon!
> We ain't got all night!
> You too Gin and Vodka!
> Let's all do it up right!"

> With a look in his eye,
> seeming almost lively and quick,
> He slurred,"You want Really Good shine?
> Well here, pake your tick.";

> He broke open his sack, filled with rums,
> whiskeys and white brew,
> And asked me to try a samplin'! --
> "Take more then a few!";

> I tasted and tasted and said "Old Man,
> Thats really great stuff",
> He stuck middle finger up and said
> "Ya, yours is kinda rough.";

> He spoke not a word,
> but got deep in his bag with great fun,
> by givin' me another hydrometer, malt whisky
> and new PDA-1;

> Then back out the window he crawled with great haste,
> Got in his red Ford pickup, taking one last big taste.
> But I heard him exclaim, as he hit the post of my light:


> "HAPPY AHRISTMAS TO CALL, AND TO ALL A GOOD-TIGHT."
> (almost a real poem...)
> J.B. 2008





--
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Uwe Goeritz
mailto:uwg58@...

From Italy, and a little bit late but not too late, my best wishes of a nice
X-mas and a wonderful Nwe Year.

And remember: drink but not be drunk.

micio felice

Hey Patch,

I've been a gin drinker for a long time, appreciating such varieties as Calvert,
Beefeaters, Bombay, and even USA's McCormicks(cheap).  Now that I am distilling,
I really like a pot still double distilled sugar wash to 70-80 % using a
generous tablespoon of baking soda per liter of wash in the second run and
running that through activated carbon into my collector bottle. I then dilute to
40-45% ABV and add a capfull+ of Prestige Bombay Gin essence( one of four of
their essences that I really like) per 1.75 L bottle . ( I buy the 500 ml
bottle; the cap is probably a little more than 1/2 a tablespoon). This gives a
significant juniper presence to a fairly clean alcohol without doing the whole
"juniper in a strainer bag in the wash" thing. It makes a good martini and a
good gin 'n squirt.
Merry Christmas to all!!


--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "thepatchworkdoll" <peter.coleman20@...>
wrote:
>
> Hi Guys whats the latest on GIN.  Is anyone out there making any.  How good
how sucessful and what recipe/method.  Any feedback will be very much
appreciated.
> Regards
> thepatchworkdoll
>

That's all very well but it is acknowledged that in open fermentation, which is
practiced by commercial distilleries, wild things add to the character. Ever
tried Belgian geuze beer?
wal

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "j_klinck" <j_klinck@...> wrote:
>
> Well, regular mash temperatures are going to kill any bacteria/wild
yeast/lactobacillus that is on the grain. So if you do the mash in a kettle with
the lid on, let it cool for a day and then open it up and pitch the yeast. Then
the spoiling organisms won't really have a way into the mash.
>
> --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "jamesonbeam1" <jamesonbeam1@> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hello J,
> >
> > And welcome aboard...  I too as a wine maker was at first taken back a
> > bit when reading about and learning some of the lack of sanitary
> > techniques in this art of distilling.
> >
> > However, as you will soon understand,  its not the fermentations we are
> > drinking...  Its the vapors from boiling the fermentations which are
> > condensed into the "aqua vitae" we are seeking.
> >
> > Wine makers and brewers are very concerned about sanitary conditions,
> > since their end products are fermented longer and kept in bottles, then
> > drunk.  Any small amounts of bacteria in them will quickly multiply and
> > distroy those products.
> >
> > In our hobby, it is necessary to keep your untensils clean and the
> > fermentation covered and away from bacteria (especially the kind that
> > produces vinegar).  However, due to the short fermentation times
> > (usually less then a week to 2 weeks), any bacteria does not have time
> > to build up.  In the next step - distillation, the boiling of the
> > fermentation will immediately kill off any remaining bad boys and they
> > definitly will not come out in the vapors we condense.
> >
> > If you really want to get freaked out, check out the process of making
> > dunder for rum and look at some of the pictures we have around here
> > [;)] .  Believe me, some of stuff I would'nt even consider using, but
> > they say it adds to the flavors.
> >
> > Good luck and above all - Be Safe.
> >
> > Vino es Veritas,
> >
> > Jim aka Waldo.
> >
> >
> > --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "j_klinck" <j_klinck@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I have been doing some reading about fermenting on grains (whiskey
> > mash) and have a few question. I'm a homebrewer of many years and am
> > very familiar with creating sanitary fermentation conditions. The whole
> > idea of making a mash, letting it cool and then just pitching the yeast
> > into it kind of freaks me out. Is there anything you do to keep the bugs
> > from taking over and screwing up your fermentation?
> > >
> >
>

Yuppers Wal,

Give J some time - he will soon learn theres a method to our madness lol .

Vino es Veritas,

Jim aka Waldo.

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "waljaco" <waljaco@...> wrote:
>
> That's all very well but it is acknowledged that in open fermentation, which is practiced by commercial distilleries, wild things add to the character. Ever tried Belgian geuze beer?
> wal
>
> --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "j_klinck" j_klinck@ wrote:
> >
> > Well, regular mash temperatures are going to kill any bacteria/wild yeast/lactobacillus that is on the grain. So if you do the mash in a kettle with the lid on, let it cool for a day and then open it up and pitch the yeast. Then the spoiling organisms won't really have a way into the mash.

DER BESTE FILTER IST DER WEISSE PAPIERFILTER AUS DEM LABOR
SOGENANNTE SPITZFILTER ;ICH SENDE MORGEN 1 FOTO ok
and now in english, the bet way for clear naps or alcohol is a so-called white
taper-filter
i will send a pic tommorow
Walter from Germany Hannover

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "just me" <hifa222@...> wrote:
>
> I put 2 cups in a gallon jug and swirl every day for week.
>
> just me
> A day without radiation is a day without sunshine.
>

Has anyone tried any of the turbo yeasts with a corn/grain mash? Are they too
fast and with too many imputities? What do most of you use? Or should I search
the archives. I've only been a member here for several months. I have used the
Prestige whiskey w/ AG yeast. Seems to take a long time for not a very low SG
but ends up with decent flavors coming through, but low ABV wash. Or am I just
impatient?
S

Has anyone tried to make a carbon snake out of copper?I've seen some made of
stainless steel like on mile high page for 100 bucks.If so ,does someone have a
design for it? also ,will the carbon react to the copper?

Harry,

Thanks. During the holiday I went looking for the
max 750ml for a 1.5 inch column and the 12/13ml max takeoff rate
you mentioned.

Where do you find these numbers? I looked all over homedistiller
in the reflux information, designs, calcs etc and don't exactly see
where this info comes from?

Thanks, Duane


--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "gnikomson2000" <gnikomson2000@...>
wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "dsmith1997" <dsmith1997@> wrote:
> >
> > Good questions Harry but I'll have to wait to give
> > precise detail as I'm traveling for the holiday. My heat
> > source is a "standard" propane turkey fryer burner. I dont
> > know exactly how many btu's it puts out but what I do is
> > crank it up till just before it boils, that back it way off
> > once the flow starts. My memory tells me that the take off
> > might be about 50ml/min but thats just a guess right now.
> > What is the recommended take off rate? Like I mentioned I've
> > been lax in recording the process but will start on my next
> > run. It's been obvious to me since researching this that data
> > is critical to getting this to sorted out and I'm short on that
> > right now :-(
> >
> > Duane
>
>
> If you were using electric I could give you exact figures.  Gas is another
story.  Your figures tell me you need to either...
>
> a) Back off the heat & slow down some.
>  1.1/2" column can't produce more than 750ml takeoff/hr as clean.  That's
about 12-13ml/min.  You're doing 4 times that.
> If you've got trouble going low enough on the flame, maybe you could block off
some of the holes for the spirit run?
>
> b)  go a bigger diameter column. 2" can do about 1.2 litres of clean azeotrope
per hr.  3" will get you up nearer 3 litres/hr but you'd have to extend the
height also to around 5 ft of packed column.
>
>
> Slainte!
> regards Harry
>

So, just me,

Could you tell me what yeasts you use for your different washes/mashes?
Why, when, and how long? and maybe where to get them? All I'm really familiar
with is the Gert Strand stuff from Brewhaus.

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "just me" <hifa222@...> wrote:
>
> turbo yeast can't turn out a tasty neutral much less a good grain. take your
time with anything with a grain.
>
> just me
> "If your going to walk on thin ice...HELL ya might as well dance"
>

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "dsmith1997" <dsmith1997@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Harry,
>
> Thanks. During the holiday I went looking for the
> max 750ml for a 1.5 inch column and the 12/13ml max takeoff rate
> you mentioned.
>
> Where do you find these numbers? I looked all over homedistiller
> in the reflux information, designs, calcs etc and don't exactly see
> where this info comes from?
>
> Thanks, Duane
>

Calculated from Mike Nixon's vapor speed figures kindly given to us.  The best guideline any budding still builder/operator can have.  Tried, true & proven over many years of testing and practice in the field.  You wanna design a reflux still?  start with this...

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Distillers/files/Vapor_Speed_101-Mike_Nixon.htm

...of course you should already know that the optimum vapor speed for clean azeotrope is between 12 -20 inches per second up the column. 
Extracts from Mike's book "The Compleat Distiller"... http://www.amphora-society.com/

Sam,

A 2-part answer: Yes, you can use that 240V element at 120V, but you will get
only 1/4 of the rated power output. More important, using a water heater element
with the kinds of mashes/washes you'll use making whiskeys and rums will leave
you open to scorching problems, unless you are very careful settling or
filtering your washes/mashes.

Water heater elements are more commonly used by the sugar-wash/vodka distillers,
because particulate matter, the cause of scorching, is more easily dealt with.

Hope this helps.

Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, Sam Billing <potstiller@...> wrote:
>
> Hello all
> I am in the stages of replacing my old 12 quart
> aluminum preasure coocker/potstill with a 15.5 gallon
> ss 1/2 keg.The old unit has served me well but its
> time to on to bigger and better. I am going to build
> another potstill as i'm not interested in high alc.
> spirits but more into wiskeys and rum.But i am going
> to leave my options open, I'm going to put a 2 inch
> union at the top of the pot in case i want to build a
> tower at a later time.The project will take most of
> the summer to build as i only have time to distill in
> the winter months. I have most of the parts that i
> need except that i need some info from an electrition
> or plumber that might know the answer. I have a 240
> volt hot water heating element that i found in a box
> of junk. The question is can i use this element on 120
> volt? Will it give me only half the wattage? or will i
> be better off just going out and buying a 120 volt
> unit. I know just enough about electricity to be
> dangerous. I have wired my own home and garage but
> don't want to rewire for another 240 receptical
> because i want the still to be completely
> portable.Thank you for any help you can give me.
> Sam
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/
>

I just got a 15 and a 7.5 gallon kegs ,thinking stick the 7.5 in the 15, weld
them together then drill two holes on top one to fill the 15 with water the
other for a extra relief .Now if I took a 1/4 inch hose and ran it in the hole
and stuck a burner or hot plate under it and turned it on just enough to heat
the bottom and dripped water in it  and make steam then I could make things like
a herbal drinks and leave the herb and not burn them or would itbe better tojust
fill the 15 gal full and heat that water for a double boiler?I guess I'm worried
about to much pressure and even heat,burning my herbs and making a burnt
product.

Actually, the capacity of the Brewhaus unit is 7.5 gallons, not 5 gallons.

        Rick

I just got a 15 and a 7.5 gallon kegs ,thinking stick the 7.5 in the 15, weld
them together then drill two holes on top one to fill the 15 with water the
other for a extra relief .Now if I took a 1/4 inch hose and ran it in the hole
and stuck a burner or hot plate under it and turned it on just enough to heat
the bottom and dripped water in it and make steam then I could make things like
a herbal drinks and leave the herb and not burn them or would itbe better tojust
fill the 15 gal full and heat that water for a double boiler?I guess I'm worried
about to much pressure and even heat,burning my herbs and making a burnt
product.

Has anyone tried to make a carbon snake out of copper?I've seen some made of
stainless steel like on mile high page for 100 bucks.If so ,does someone have a
design for it? also ,will the carbon react to the copper?

barred 4 life

For herbal distillation (including gin concentrate) the little stovetop
coffeepot still at homedistiller.org, under "flavouring/gin" is just about
perfect. They are quick and easy to make, deal nicely with smaller washes, and
work very well.

I've made several for friends, and have simplified the design to a no-solder
design.

Most people don't need gallons of herbal spirit.

Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller

--- In new_distillers@yahoogroups.com, "sadangoll1" <sadangoll1@...> wrote:
>
> I just got a 15 and a 7.5 gallon kegs ,thinking stick the 7.5 in the 15, weld
them together then drill two holes on top one to fill the 15 with water the
other for a extra relief .Now if I took a 1/4 inch hose and ran it in the hole
and stuck a burner or hot plate under it and turned it on just enough to heat
the bottom and dripped water in it  and make steam then I could make things like
a herbal drinks and leave the herb and not burn them or would itbe better tojust
fill the 15 gal full and heat that water for a double boiler?I guess I'm worried
about to much pressure and even heat,burning my herbs and making a burnt
product.
>

bliadhna mhath ùr

Slainte!
regards Harry