Robin,

If you search on "mythopoeic society" in interests you will find several
of us.  And yes, there is now a group as of a few days ago.

Ellen Denham (on lj as ellen_denham)

Robin Reid wrote:
>
> Wow--is there a mythsoc group on LJ? Not just individual people over
> there?
>
> I'm robin_anne_reid on LJ, and would love to know where you all are!
>
> Robin
>
>
> _____
>
> From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com <mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com> on
> behalf of Sara Ciborski
> Sent: Sun 8/12/2007 9:31 AM
> To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com <mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Mythcon 38 Report
>
> I agree (about live journal). I would just express the hope that if a
> contributor to LJ offers there an opinion or perspective or
> information--anything of substance, originality, and (obviously) of
> mythsoc interest--that he or she post this also to the regular
> discussion group. Thanks.
> Sara Ciborski
>
> David Emerson wrote:
> >> Since David Emerson asked for one, here it is:
> >>
> >
> >
> > And I thank you very kindly for it.
> >
> > Yes, yes, yes, I know there are reports on LiveJournal, but I seem
> to have
> become an old fogy who finds LJ terribly confusing and inconvenient
> (why are
> there all those links? why doesn't anybody just say who they are? who are
> all these people who have time to write all this stuff?). Okay, so I
> joined
> LJ just to join the Mythsoc "community" but I doubt I will ever have any
> kind of online presence there. Some days I think I'm doing pretty good
> just
> to answer my email. :-)
> >
> > You'd never guess that I work with computers for a living.
> >
> > emerdavid
> >
> > ________________________________________
> > PeoplePC Online
> > A better way to Internet
> > http://www.peoplepc <http://www.peoplepc.com/
> <http://www.peoplepc.com/>> .com
> >
> >
> > The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.
> <http://www.mythsoc.org/ <http://www.mythsoc.org/>> org
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Does anyone who heard it have thoughts or opinions
on Douglas Kane's paper, on the construction of
the published Silmarillion?  I'm curious about
this because it seems what he's been doing
parallels something I did for my private amusement
about a decade ago.

Cool--I will go do so and friend you back!

Robin

(because actually I'm much more likely to be participating on LJ than a
listserv)

   _____

From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Ellen
Sent: Sun 8/12/2007 12:21 PM
To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Mythcon 38 Report



Robin,

If you search on "mythopoeic society" in interests you will find several
of us. And yes, there is now a group as of a few days ago.

Ellen Denham (on lj as ellen_denham)

Robin Reid wrote:
>
> Wow--is there a mythsoc group on LJ? Not just individual people over
> there?
>
> I'm robin_anne_reid on LJ, and would love to know where you all are!
>
> Robin
>
>
> _____
>
> From: mythsoc@yahoogroups <mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com> .com
<mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com> on
> behalf of Sara Ciborski
> Sent: Sun 8/12/2007 9:31 AM
> To: mythsoc@yahoogroups <mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com> .com
<mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: Re: [mythsoc] Mythcon 38 Report
>
> I agree (about live journal). I would just express the hope that if a
> contributor to LJ offers there an opinion or perspective or
> information--anything of substance, originality, and (obviously) of
> mythsoc interest--that he or she post this also to the regular
> discussion group. Thanks.
> Sara Ciborski
>
> David Emerson wrote:
> >> Since David Emerson asked for one, here it is:
> >>
> >
> >
> > And I thank you very kindly for it.
> >
> > Yes, yes, yes, I know there are reports on LiveJournal, but I seem
> to have
> become an old fogy who finds LJ terribly confusing and inconvenient
> (why are
> there all those links? why doesn't anybody just say who they are? who are
> all these people who have time to write all this stuff?). Okay, so I
> joined
> LJ just to join the Mythsoc "community" but I doubt I will ever have any
> kind of online presence there. Some days I think I'm doing pretty good
> just
> to answer my email. :-)
> >
> > You'd never guess that I work with computers for a living.
> >
> > emerdavid
> >
> > ________________________________________
> > PeoplePC Online
> > A better way to Internet
> > http://www.peoplepc <http://www.peoplepc/>  <http://www.peoplepc
<http://www.peoplepc.com/> .com/
> <http://www.peoplepc <http://www.peoplepc.com/> .com/>> .com
> >
> >
> > The Mythopoeic Society website http://www.mythsoc.
<http://www.mythsoc./>
> <http://www.mythsoc. <http://www.mythsoc.org/> org/ <http://www.mythsoc.
<http://www.mythsoc.org/> org/>> org
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Aha, so THAT'S a Mythcon! Further incentive to start saving my pennies.

Thanks for the thorough (and thoroughly entertaining) report.

Cole

I thought it was an excellent paper in terms of content.
He also made effective use of Powerpoint in his presentation.

I spoke to him briefly after the talk, and he told me that
he is currently in negociations with a publisher to print
his manuscript.

Ronnie Lakowski


--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "William Cloud Hicklin"
<solicitr@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone who heard it have thoughts or opinions
> on Douglas Kane's paper, on the construction of
> the published Silmarillion?  I'm curious about
> this because it seems what he's been doing
> parallels something I did for my private amusement
> about a decade ago.
>

I concur: the paper was lucid and detailed, especially good on how CJRT
put the published SILMARILLION together and the parts CJRT himself
created; I won't give away any spoilers, but what was said and read
squares with what Prof. Clyde Kilby told me in 1977 about the
SILMARILLION mss. he'd read during his visit to help JRRT put the book
together in 1966, including the absence of explanation of the Ents, for
one thing.

Absolutely the only fault with the paper was that it was scheduled
opposite Diana Pavlac Glyer's presentation on how she put her together,
which my wife Jo judged to be one of Mythcon 38's high points.
Bilocation skills attributed to Padre Pio would've come in handy a time
or six over the weekend.

Grateful congratulations for all the Mythcon 38 committee for creating
such a fine long-expected party.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com [mailto:mythsoc@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of lakowskir
Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2007 5:15 PM
To: mythsoc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [mythsoc] Re: Mythcon 38 reports?

I thought it was an excellent paper in terms of content.
He also made effective use of Powerpoint in his presentation.

I spoke to him briefly after the talk, and he told me that
he is currently in negociations with a publisher to print
his manuscript.

Ronnie Lakowski

--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups <mailto:mythsoc%40yahoogroups.com> .com,
"William Cloud Hicklin"
<solicitr@...> wrote:
>
> Does anyone who heard it have thoughts or opinions
> on Douglas Kane's paper, on the construction of
> the published Silmarillion? I'm curious about
> this because it seems what he's been doing
> parallels something I did for my private amusement
> about a decade ago.
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>>---"William Cloud Hicklin" <solicitr@...> wrote:
>>Does anyone who heard it have thoughts or opinions on Douglas
Kane's paper, on the construction of the published Silmarillion?  I'm
curious about this because it seems what he's been doing parallels
something I did for my private amusement about a decade ago.


It's a shame you didn't make your work known earlier!  Not that
Kane's project is badly done at all, but besides the repetition of
effort, that's ten years where people referring to something in _The
Silmarilion_ might have benefited from having at hand a valuable
resource like his or your analyses.  I know I was struck, a few years
ago, to learn that much of Ch. 22, "Of the Ruin of Doriath", was
almost without precedent in Tolkien's own writing (though Kane
emphasized that he finds _The Silmarillion's_ version of that chapter
to be a good solution by Christopher Tolkien and Guy Kay to a
difficult textual problem) -- a fact which most readers don't know
because it must dug out of _The War of the Jewels_.  And yet the
existence of some editorial invention like that has, I think, led to
the false impression among some readers that little of _The
Silmarillion_ is J.R.R. Tolkien's work.  A good checklist would be a
useful aid.

My impression was that Kane's paper was eye-opening even to the most
knowledgeable Tolkienists in the room, who were well aware of the
disparate sourcing of the published _Silmarillion_ but had not
encountered it in summary form, where general trends could be
observed.  On the other hand, as presented, though cleanly delivered
and nicely supported by the slides, it was too much a chapter-by-
chapter list of texts and alterations, and somewhat bewildering.

Also, apart from those few occasions where Christopher Tolkien has
explicitly acknowledged editorial invention, I think it would behoove
Kane to emphasize that his study is limited to tracing the history of
the published _Silmarillion_ to texts in _The History of Middle-
earth_; what doesn't appear there may yet be J.R.R.T.'s work.  The
appearance of _The Children of Hurin_, for instance, shows that there
seems always to be a little more Tolkien out there.  Likewise
Christopher Tolkien's choices in selecting one text over another may
have more justification than appears from HoMe.  Kane questioned
Christopher Tolkien's removal, from "Of the Coming of the Elves", of
a phrase attributing to Morgoth's malice the opinion that the Valar
were wrong to bring the elves to Valinor.  Then lo! on sale at
Mythcon is volume 17 of _Parma Eldalamberon_, where in a discussion
of the root "PHAN", J.R.R. Tolkien writes that the sequestering of
the Elves in Valinor "was not in fact according to the design of
Eru".  Who could know that before now?  And who could fault Kane for
expressing this concern over a decision that seems inexplicable based
on HoMe?  (Not that Christopher Tolkien, for the most part, claims to
have shown the full history of the 1977 _Silmarillion_ -- if he had,
there'd be no need for efforts like this.)  But it shows the dangers
inherent in this important project.

-Merlin DeTardo

At 12:02 AM 8/13/2007 +0000, Merlin DeTardo wrote:

>And yet the
>existence of some editorial invention like that has, I think, led to
>the false impression among some readers that little of _The
>Silmarillion_ is J.R.R. Tolkien's work.

A desire to correct that false impression was part of the impetus for
publishing the History of Middle-earth in the first place.  See the preface
to Book of Lost Tales vol. 1.

>My impression was that Kane's paper was eye-opening even to the most
>knowledgeable Tolkienists in the room, who were well aware of the
>disparate sourcing of the published _Silmarillion_ but had not
>encountered it in summary form, where general trends could be
>observed.

You can get a tiny sense of this by checking the entries for the individual
chapters of the 1977 Silmarillion in Scull & Hammond's Reader's Guide.  The
sources for individual chapters, and how much of each, are listed there,
though it doesn't go into much detail about exactly what came from where.
I wasn't at the paper; was Kane aware of this?

Also, doesn't Kane have a website with a lot of his material on it?  I
think someone told me that he did.

>On the other hand, as presented, though cleanly delivered
>and nicely supported by the slides, it was too much a chapter-by-
>chapter list of texts and alterations, and somewhat bewildering.

In a study like this, you need to compile all the details meticulously and
then stand back and look for the overall patterns.  It's a shame when a
scholar is too devoted to the trees to see the forest.

>Also, apart from those few occasions where Christopher Tolkien has
>explicitly acknowledged editorial invention, I think it would behoove
>Kane to emphasize that his study is limited to tracing the history of
>the published _Silmarillion_ to texts in _The History of Middle-
>earth_; what doesn't appear there may yet be J.R.R.T.'s work.

That is very true, and your following example is an excellent demonstration
of that.

But if one must be cautious of the Scylla of assuming that the published
material is all, I've also seen Tolkienists fall into the Charybdis of a
"it's just around the corner" attitude; that if only those inexplicably
greedy linguists would release the material, we could all speak fluent
Sindarin at our wedding ceremonies, and peace and joy would reign
throughout the world.

From: "Mike Foster" <mafoster@...>

> Absolutely the only fault with the paper was that it was scheduled
> opposite Diana Pavlac Glyer's presentation on how she put her together,
> which my wife Jo judged to be one of Mythcon 38's high points.
> Bilocation skills attributed to Padre Pio would've come in handy a time
> or six over the weekend.

Keep praying, Mike!  You'll get there!

<running away and hiding>
Berni

Hey, if I've made one person buy a Mythcon membership, I've done my job.

They really are a lot of fun.  Even ones with less than optimal sites are
fun because it gives you lots to bond over with your fellow Mythies.  (And
sometimes they're better than you can imagine.  I just dreaded going to last
year's: Oklahoma in August.  Yet it was a great site, Janet and her
committee did a wonderful job, and it was an outstanding Mythcon.)

the Bratwife

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cole C Matson" <ncm215@...>


> Aha, so THAT'S a Mythcon! Further incentive to start saving my pennies.
>
> Thanks for the thorough (and thoroughly entertaining) report.
>
> Cole
>

I've been thinking, once again, of what makes a Mythcon so special. A
big part of it is the "family reunion" quality to it, heavy on the
family members you really *love* seeing and never get enough time
with, and just a dash of old weird uncle XYZ. I suspect part of it is
that there's such a high percentage of people who are interconnected.

And yet I think we are expansive about receiving new people and
engaging with them (at least the interactions I see are welcoming).

Very special event...
   -- Lynn --

--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Berni Phillips" <bernip@...> wrote:
>
> Hey, if I've made one person buy a Mythcon membership, I've done my job.
>
> They really are a lot of fun.  Even ones with less than optimal
sites are
> fun because it gives you lots to bond over with your fellow Mythies.
  (And
> sometimes they're better than you can imagine.  I just dreaded going
to last
> year's: Oklahoma in August.  Yet it was a great site, Janet and her
> committee did a wonderful job, and it was an outstanding Mythcon.)
>
> the Bratwife
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cole C Matson" <ncm215@...>
>
>
> > Aha, so THAT'S a Mythcon! Further incentive to start saving my
pennies.
> >
> > Thanks for the thorough (and thoroughly entertaining) report.
> >
> > Cole
> >
>

--Not everything appears in HoME:

Yes, and that just leaves scope for the next round
of scholarship, I suppose.  Eventually somebody
will spend the requisite weeks in the Bodleian....
But it's important to keep in mind that HoME was
never intended to serve this purpose: its
intention was to trace the development of the
legendarium over JRRT's life.

HoME does allow source-tracing for the great
majority of the text.  The biggest gaps are those
sections where CRT doesn't print the source, but
simply lists 'significant' editorial changes, as
in the Luthien chapter, and where (it is
deducible) a given text carries a layer of later
authorial emendations not enumerated. (The last
chapters are not really a 'gap' in our knowledge,
since there the editorial hand is almost certainly
the source of untraceable material).

Some of the big questions I'm afraid will never be
answered, though, unless CRT breaks his silence-
the Why? questions.  Why for example the 1958
version of the death of the Trees was not
followed, or why the 'Feanor' chapters were so
drastically abridged?

Lynn said:

>I've been thinking, once again, of what makes a Mythcon so special. A
>big part of it is the "family reunion" quality to it, heavy on the
>family members you really *love* seeing and never get enough time
>with, and just a dash of old weird uncle XYZ. I suspect part of it is
>that there's such a high percentage of people who are interconnected.

>And yet I think we are expansive about receiving new people and
>engaging with them (at least the interactions I see are welcoming).



I think you are right, Lynn.  This was my third Mythcon, and I can speak to
both of your points.  The people at Mythcon are amazingly friendly to new
people.  You are so friendly and welcoming that after only three Mythcons, I
feel some of the "family reunion" quality.  I love attending because the
people are great, and I always go home with a list of books I have somehow
missed.

Mythcon was really good this year.  I especially liked the music (from
Beatles to Celtic) and the English Country dancing.  From the papers and
panels, I was impressed with G. Ronald Murphy and with Diana Glyer. (Of
course with books like theirs to discuss, how could they go wrong?)

Thanks for all the hard work that went into this year's Mythcon.

Ginger McElwee









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I agree with both David and Sara about Live Journal. I work with computers too
(*waves at David*) but also find Live Journal tedious and counterintuitive. Not
as bad as MySpace, but bad enough that I doubt I'll be over there very often.
Like Sara, I hope anyone who posts anything really interesting or substantial
will also do so here.

Jason Fisher
http://lingwe.blogspot.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hey all,
What fabulous memories and thoughts on the whole of it, many thanks
Berni for the wonderful report, I will make sure Jessie reads it and
thoughts on T-shirts, I must agree with Lynn and all, and stress this
to newer mythies, this was our 3rd MythCon and since the 1st one we
attended in Nashville we have deep heartfelt ties to everyone, it is
as leaving an extended family when we sing the last songs at closing
ceremonies--since meeting everyone and getting to know them I find it
very hard to leave and wish we could do it all over again now rather
than in a year....well Lynn, Ellie and the Stewards made sure I will
want to do it again...hopefully by chairing MC 39 and the plans we are
working out for it will show either I am incredibly nuts or happy for
the job...I think a lil of both ;-)


Anthony


--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Ginger McElwee" <gingermc@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> Lynn said:
>
> >I've been thinking, once again, of what makes a Mythcon so special. A
> >big part of it is the "family reunion" quality to it, heavy on the
> >family members you really *love* seeing and never get enough time
> >with, and just a dash of old weird uncle XYZ. I suspect part of it is
> >that there's such a high percentage of people who are interconnected.
>
> >And yet I think we are expansive about receiving new people and
> >engaging with them (at least the interactions I see are welcoming).
>
>
>
> I think you are right, Lynn.  This was my third Mythcon, and I can
speak to
> both of your points.  The people at Mythcon are amazingly friendly
to new
> people.  You are so friendly and welcoming that after only three
Mythcons, I
> feel some of the "family reunion" quality.  I love attending because the
> people are great, and I always go home with a list of books I have
somehow
> missed.
>
> Mythcon was really good this year.  I especially liked the music (from
> Beatles to Celtic) and the English Country dancing.  From the papers and
> panels, I was impressed with G. Ronald Murphy and with Diana Glyer. (Of
> course with books like theirs to discuss, how could they go wrong?)
>
> Thanks for all the hard work that went into this year's Mythcon.
>
> Ginger McElwee
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

Hey there all,
Thank you Lynn for posting the things to do items, indeed we plan to
get a nice document together of area interests and places to shops. I
especially loved how David created a doc for this years MC with
bookstores in the area, I plan doing this as well, and have also found
a great park in the area, perhaps we could do a bring your own grub
picnic in the park if time allows--the park looks amazing...but as of
right now honoring requests for travel directions I have been working
with mythwebhobbit Randy to get info up on MC 39, as posted on
Mythsoc.org and here tis:

http://mythsoc.org/mythcon39.html

I encourage everyone who plans to make it to MC 39 to get their early
memberships and contact anyone of us with questions. If you are in the
Northeast and would like to volunteer we are rounding out the cmte and
volunteers for positions. Also Jessie and I 's local mythopoeic
discussion group "The Northeast Tolkien Society" www.herenistarion.org
will be meeting soon and will cover a chat of MC 39. Stay tuned here
and there for news of that group.

Best,
Anthony




--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Lynn Maudlin" <lynnmaudlin@...> wrote:
>
> I'm glad that a Northeast Mythcon is so appealing--
>
> A little taste to whet your appetite:
>
> Central Connecticut State University, 1615 Stanley Street, New
> Britain, Connecticut, 06050. The campus is 24.5 miles from Bradley
> International Airport, according to Google Maps.
>
> http://www.ccsu.edu/virtualtour/virtualtourhome.html
> http://www.ccsu.edu/Things_ToDo.htm
>
> Down toward the bottom of the rather extensive "things to do" page
> there are links for transportation; it's too early to book travel
> (shoot, you can only book Amtrak 11 months in advance! who knew?!) but
> it's NEVER too early to start your Mythcon savings account!
>
>
> I'm sure Anthony and Jessica will post on this list when they start
> having meetings and I do indeed encourage local (even not-so-local)
> people to get involved - conferences are much more fun when we're
> really invested in the process.
>
>   -- Lynn --
>

Having served on the committee of one Mythcon (#30, in Milwaukee), as well as
several Minicons, and chaired a small Minneapolis convention for a few years, I
offer one piece of advice to Anthony & Jessica:

Do what you can, and if you come up with fun ideas and are able to implement
them, great.  But never forget that the convention is the people.  Even if all
you do is arrange for the site and publish the date, people will come, they will
do the things they always do at Mythcons, they will have a good time.

emerdavid

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

At 11:29 AM 8/13/2007 -0500, David Emerson wrote:

>Having served on the committee of one Mythcon (#30, in Milwaukee), as well
>as several Minicons, and chaired a small Minneapolis convention for a few
>years, I offer one piece of advice to Anthony & Jessica:
>
>Do what you can, and if you come up with fun ideas and are able to implement
>them, great. But never forget that the convention is the people. Even if all
>you do is arrange for the site and publish the date, people will come, they
>will do the things they always do at Mythcons, they will have a good time.


In a sense this is true.  Except for coming up with good topics for the
theme (and Anthony & Jessica have already done that) and panels, and
managing an aesthetically pleasing flow of events especially in the
evening, very little that the committee does makes the convention special.

What we do is lay the groundwork on which the special things can happen.
But it still has to be laid.

Consider:

How did all those nummy treats get to the hospitality suite?  A lot of
shopping, and a lot of sweat carrying things up stairs, that's how.

How did we have functioning AV equipment for the papers that needed it, and
the musical talks and the Saturday night programming and the film program?
A lot of pre-con planning, that's how.  (And in fact there was a serious
glitch in one of those items, that only turned up on the day.  But we
worked around it, and you'd never know there was a problem.)

And what about the program planning, carefully assuring that each member
found at least one moment when the two things he or she most wanted to
attend were on at the same time?  That takes _work_, pal, and don't you
forget it!

- ex-Mythcon chair

On Aug 10, 2007, at 2:56 PM, Eve Neuhaus wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> I've was waiting for the Mythcon to introduce myself to this group,
> but unfortunately I was felled by a wicked sore throat on Friday
> evening and it kept me away the rest of the conference. I was sorely
> disappointed, as you can imagine, and now I'm even more so, reading
> the reports.


Welcome to the list, Eve. Good luck on the project.


On Aug 11, 2007, at 9:51 PM, David Emerson wrote:
> Yes, yes, yes, I know there are reports on LiveJournal, but I seem
> to have become an old fogy who finds LJ terribly confusing and
> inconvenient (why are there all those links?  why doesn't anybody
> just say who they are?  who are all these people who have time to
> write all this stuff?).  Okay, so I joined LJ just to join the
> Mythsoc "community" but I doubt I will ever have any kind of online
> presence there.  Some days I think I'm doing pretty good just to
> answer my email.

Yes, there are some of us who prefer this mailing list to
LiveJournal, so I second David's hope for folks to keep posting here
as well. Which it looks like they will, based on the last day or
two's (very welcome) Mythcon reports.

--John R.

New arrivals: THE FRODO FRANCHISE (by Kristin Thompson), TOLKIEN AND
SHAKESPEARE (ed. Janet Brennen Croft), and TREE OF TALES: TOLKIEN,
LITERATURE, AND THEOLOGY (ed. Trevor Hart & Ivan Khovacs).

>And what about the program planning, carefully assuring that each member
>found at least one moment when the two things he or she most wanted to
>attend were on at the same time?  That takes _work_, pal, and don't you
>forget it!
>
>- ex-Mythcon chair

You're tellin' me!

-- ex-Mythcon programming head

(To clarify: my original comments to Anthony & Jessica were meant more to
reassure them of the high probability that they will do a good job, rather than
to encourage them to slack off!)    :-)


emerdavid

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

Thanks David and Dave for both of your pearls of wisdom and
reassurance in holding MC chair. It is most appreciative, --right now
I am at a point of collecting suggestions, ideas, seeing what the cmte
thinks and if they are doable. We may have done past events, but
MythCon holds a very special place for us--so we want to give back to
the community for having learned so much...ok its time for the sappy
tomatoes and mushy vegetables and I am not ducking :-o


Anthony


--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, David Emerson <emerdavid@...> wrote:
>
> >And what about the program planning, carefully assuring that each
member
> >found at least one moment when the two things he or she most wanted to
> >attend were on at the same time?  That takes _work_, pal, and don't you
> >forget it!
> >
> >- ex-Mythcon chair
>
> You're tellin' me!
>
> -- ex-Mythcon programming head
>
> (To clarify: my original comments to Anthony & Jessica were meant
more to reassure them of the high probability that they will do a good
job, rather than to encourage them to slack off!)    :-)
>
>
> emerdavid
>
> ________________________________________
> PeoplePC Online
> A better way to Internet
> http://www.peoplepc.com
>

>---David Bratman <dbratman@...> wrote:
>>Merlin DeTardo wrote:
>>And yet the existence of some editorial invention like that has, I
think, led to the false impression among some readers that little of
_The Silmarillion_ is J.R.R. Tolkien's work.
>A desire to correct that false impression was part of the impetus
for publishing the History of Middle-earth in the first place.  See
the preface to Book of Lost Tales vol. 1.

That preface is a fascinating document; I also like how it functions
as the middle third of a dialogue between Christopher Tolkien and Tom
Shippey: C. Tolkien replies to comments that Shippey made in _The
Road to Middle-earth_ (1982), and Shippey in turn responds in "Long
Evolution: The History of Middle-earth and Its Merits" in _Arda 1987_
(which was not published until 1992).


>You can get a tiny sense of this by checking the entries for the
individual chapters of the 1977 Silmarillion in Scull & Hammond's
Reader's Guide... was Kane aware of this?

I don't think he mentioned Scull & Hammond, or any other critics, in
his paper.  For questions of what should be in _The Silmarillion_,
Charles Noad's 2000 essay in _Tolkien's Legendarium_ would be another
good article to review.


>But if one must be cautious of the Scylla of assuming that the
published material is all, I've also seen Tolkienists fall into the
Charybdis of a "it's just around the corner" attitude; that if only
those inexplicably greedy linguists would release the material, we
could all speak fluent Sindarin at our wedding ceremonies, and peace
and joy would reign throughout the world.

I once read a comparison* of that attitude to the controversy
surrounding the publication of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

*Here, in 2005:
http://www.theonering.net/rumour_mill/rpg/viewer/readingroom/421516000
001FB4B.html

The planning and producing of a Mythcon lives in this position of
"tension" - Mythcon is the people and if you have it, they will come
(a certain core group, anyway) and make a fun event out of it. But if
the committee drops the ball, the verses of Drunken Hobbit will reveal
all!

This is my job, as Steward for Mythopoeic Conferences: to make sure
that the con committee (in this case, Anthony and Jessica et. al.)
knows what's expected and necessary and help them avoid the pitfalls.

Thank you, David, for a wonderful Mythcon this year, and thank you
David E. for a wonderful Mythcon back in Minnesota... (hmmm, have you
thought of holding another?).

-- <big grin> --
   -- Lynn --

--- In mythsoc@yahoogroups.com, "Merlin
DeTardo" <emptyD@...> wrote:
>
> >---David Bratman <dbratman@> wrote:

> >But if one must be cautious of the Scylla of assuming
that the
> published material is all, I've also seen Tolkienists
fall into the
> Charybdis of a "it's just around the corner" attitude;
that if only
> those inexplicably greedy linguists would release the
material, we
> could all speak fluent Sindarin at our wedding
ceremonies, and peace
> and joy would reign throughout the world.
>
> I once read a comparison* of that attitude to the
controversy
> surrounding the publication of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
>
> *Here, in 2005:
> http://www.theonering.net/rumour_mill/rpg/viewer/
readingroom/421516000
> 001FB4B.html
>

Weeeeeel,
Last I looked the copyrights in the Dead Sea Scrolls had
expired. Centuries ago.  Tolkien's haven't yet.

>Last I looked the copyrights in the Dead Sea Scrolls had
>expired.

LOL!!

emerdavid

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

>Thank you, David [B], for a wonderful Mythcon this year, and thank you
>David E. for a wonderful Mythcon back in Minnesota... (hmmm, have you
>thought of holding another?).
>
>-- <big grin> --
>  -- Lynn --

I regret that I cannot take credit for the previous Minnesota Mythcon, which
occurred before I was even aware of it.  :-(

We did have a very nice BreeMoot here in ninety-something, but of course that
required a much smaller planning effort (in fact, I think David Lenander may
have done the whole thing himself).

Personally, I feel torn about hosting a Mythcon here.  On the one hand, it would
be handy to have one in my own city.  On the other hand, I would probably end up
like you & David B this year, running around tending to things and hardly seeing
any of the actual con.  And even if I had the super-power of persuasion, and got
someone else to do all the work, I would then feel too guilty to enjoy the
weekend.

But still, hosting a Mythcon in the Twin Cities is worth thinking
about...............

emerdavid

________________________________________
PeoplePC Online
A better way to Internet
http://www.peoplepc.com

>---"William Cloud Hicklin" <solicitr@...> wrote:
>---"Merlin DeTardo" <emptyD@> wrote:
>>>---David Bratman <dbratman@> wrote:
>>>I've also seen Tolkienists fall into the Charybdis of a "it's just
around the corner" attitude; that if only those inexplicably greedy
linguists would release the material...
>>I once read a comparison* of that attitude to the controversy
surrounding the publication of the Dead Sea Scrolls.
>Last I looked the copyrights in the Dead Sea Scrolls had expired.
Centuries ago.  Tolkien's haven't yet.

Ha!  Another reason to beware of "allegory, in all its
manifestations".

On Aug 14, 2007, at 9:15 AM, David Emerson wrote:
> We did have a very nice BreeMoot here in ninety-something, but of
> course that required a much smaller planning effort (in fact, I
> think David Lenander may have done the whole thing himself).


That would be BreeMoot 3, in 1997. A v. nice little gathering indeed.
I believe that's where I met David Salo and Lisa Starr, and got to
spend some time with David (E) and David (L) and Nancy (M), as well
as a visiting Dane whose name I don't remember who had a lot of
interesting information about Tolkien fandom in Europe. I also
remember debating definitions of fantasy with Ruth Berman, who took a
much more inclusive view than I did (and do). Have BreeMoots fallen
into abeyance, or have I just missed the announcements?

--JDR

Edith L. Crowe | (408) 808-2037 | edith.crowe@...
Corresponding Secretary of the Mythopoeic Society (http://www.mythsoc.org)
----- Forwarded by Edith Crowe/SJSU on 08/15/2007 09:20 AM -----

lizzie.thelwell@...
08/09/2007 07:32 AM

To
izzie.thelwell@...
cc

Subject
The White Tree Fund Lecture Series






The White Tree Fund

News Release


For Immediate Release


The White Tree Fund launches Lecture Series to raise funds and books
for the International Reading Association and Parkdale Project Read of
Toronto

TORONTO (August 3, 2007) ? The White Tree Fund Inc. (TWTF) is
launching the inaugural series of its fund raising White Tree Lectures
program. The first series consists of three Tolkien-themed lectures at
the University of Toronto?s Hart House.

?The aim of the White Tree Lectures is to raise awareness and support
for TWTF's programs and charitable initiatives by holding a lecture
series with the Tolkien community in mind,? said TWTF President and
founding member Lara Sookoo.

On August 16, 2007, 7-9 pm, Dr. John Browne from the University of
Toronto will be speaking on "Tolkien as Wordsmith:  One Reader's
Journey Through the Lord of the Rings,? with discussion to follow.

The second event held on September 27, 2007, 7-9 pm, will be a
presentation of Daniel Timmons' documentary DVD, "A Legacy of The Lord
of the Rings," with discussion to follow.

   The final evening will be a panel discussion on the recently
released book The Children of Húrin, on October 25, 2007, 7-9 pm.

"Literature was a high priority for J.R.R. Tolkien, one of the most
important writers of the 20th century,? said Director Jo-Anna Dueck.
?Aside from his best-known works, The Hobbit and The Lord of the
Rings, he wrote a number of other books and contributed to numerous
books and periodicals. We at TWTF see the literacy need in our world
today as an opportunity to be an extension of Tolkien's love of
literature in providing quality books for those who need them.?

All proceeds will go to charity and the books donated will go to
Toronto's Parkdale Project Read. There will also be door prizes and
give-aways. To order tickets go to: www.whitetreefund.org

The White Tree Fund is an incorporated non-profit organization that
supports charities through organizing fund-raising and awareness
drives and events, and is dedicated to exploring fantasy and mythology
through study, literature, art, music and film.

This fall, The White Tree Fund is set to debut its journal, ?Silver
Leaves.? Each issue will contain a range of features from academic
essays, creative writing, artwork and puzzles to reviews, interviews
and event reports to artistic spotlights on costuming, weaponry, and
handmade items. Silver Leaves will also contain articles by guest
authors, as well as, humanitarian, community, and volunteer updates.
The journal is currently available for pre-order on the TWTF website.

For more information please visit the www.whitetreefund.org

                                      -30-



For further media inquiries contact:

Lizzie Thelwell
Marketing and Communications Manager
lizzie.thelwell@...




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From the Monday, August 13 Shelf Awareness (www.shelf-awareness.com):

In an unusual event, the Winterthur Museum and Country Estate--the decorative
arts museum on the du Pont estate in Wilmington, Del.--is celebrating
children's author Jane Yolen's body of work in an exhibition that opens
September 15 and runs until mid-July 2008.