>> Apple //e + monitor + 1 drive

Also -- each //e has an 80-column card and of course the disk controller card --
I removed other cards, for example one had the Microsoft Softcard in it. That's
a keeper for the museum. Also these will each include a DOS 3.3 disk.

...Keep 'em simple!

No need to make Trenton exhibits all fancy as if they were VCF exhibits.

Details forthcoming re: setup times, parking, etc.

"PhillipP" <cooldude166861@...> writes:

>I don't consider myself an expert by any means on this topic, but assuming =
>that the tape is playable, wouldn't it be smarter to make a tape-to-tape co=
>py to allow for more precise digitization of that copy?

More noise!

--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

On Sun, 24 Feb 2013, Dan Roganti wrote:

> On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 5:49 PM, Dave <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:
>
>> On 24/02/2013 22:17, David Gesswein wrote:
>>> On Sun, Feb 24, 2013 at 05:01:21PM -0500, Mike Loewen wrote:
>>>>      I would like to come up with a hardware/software scheme to connect
>> a
>>>> vintage computer's serial port to some sort of WiFi module which would
>>>> allow me to use SSH or Telnet over SSL to connect to a server.
>>>>      Suggestions?  Do any of you microcontroller wizards have something
>> on
>>>> the bench?
>>
>
> If you want to a self-contained solution - versus a homebrew project - look
> here
> WiFly RN-171 802.11b/g Serial to WiFi Module, $29.99
> The RN-171 is a small form factor, standalone, ultra-low power embedded
> module with a complete TCP/IP stack in a wireless networking module.
> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11049

     That looks good, except for two things:

1. "We also currently do not support WPA2-Enterprise (radius server
authentication, EAP-TLS)"

     That, unfortunately is the mode used by our on-campus wireless
networks.

2. There's no SSH client or SSL connection capability.


Mike Loewen 		 mloewen@...
Old Technology       http://sturgeon.css.psu.edu/~mloewen/Oldtech/

Does anyone know where can I buy some 1" paper tape for a fair price?

Thanks
Josh

>> Does anyone know where can I buy some 1" paper tape for a fair price?

I think the club has extra. I defer to Jeff J. who knows the details.

 

I don't consider myself an expert by any means on this topic, but assuming that the tape is playable, wouldn't it be smarter to make a tape-to-tape copy to allow for more precise digitization of that copy?

-Phillip

--- In midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com, evan@... wrote:
>
> Guys,
>
> One of the items I got from Stephen Gray's daughter last weekend is an audio tape of Stephen giving a lecture. I want to be sure the tape's in good condition before I dare to play it. (When I do play it, I'll make a recording at the same time.)
>
> The tape is from 1976. I don't know when it was last played.
>
> What should I do to ensure its integrity before playing it? I would freak out if I started playing it and it got "eaten" or otherwise damaged.
>

Thanks everyone for the helpful advice. Cory Sickles ("Burning Image") is going
to digitize the tape for us.

evan@... wrote:

>>> Does anyone know where can I buy some 1" paper tape for a fair
>price?
>
>I think the club has extra. I defer to Jeff J. who knows the details.
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
Not a lot of 1 in.  Mostly badout
--
Sent from my PDP 8/e.

> If it's a typical 'era' cassette tape (not metal or CrO2)
> using only FeO3 and this tape has been
> sitting for a long while, you're likely to encounter
> quite a bit of print-through when played
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Print-through

I remember that effect on most of my tapes: Maxell or TDK. I'd hear the next
song softly in the blank spot between tracks. That sure burst my bubble when I
realized that my memory was NOT really so perfect!

I probably still have several blank TDK audio cassettes: silver and gold.

For 1970s authenticity, we ought to use a Kor/Sonic audio cassette from E.J.
Korvettes, but I suspect my bar-mitzvah lessons are still on it! That would
match Evans' Apple ][ being such a gift!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._J._Korvette
http://www.snopes.com/business/names/ejkorvette.asp

On 25/02/2013 02:06, joshbensadon wrote:
> Does anyone know where can I buy some 1" paper tape for a fair price?

It depends on what you think is fair. The going rate seems to be about
$10 to $15 a reel which is about what GNT quoted me in the UK. In the US
WestNC have it at the same price...

http://www.westnc.com/paper-tape-rolls.html

but if no one else has any to sell, then they can charge what they want.

http://sniff.numachi.com/pages/tiHAPNCEFT.html

or search "You Tube"

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Three+Ha%27Pence+a+Foot&oq=Three+Ha%\
27Pence+a+Foot

We seem to have got to the stage where random bits of tape with no
provenance or context are fetching stupid prices...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/290866896406


> Thanks
> Josh
>
>
>
Dave
G4UGM

Matt Patoray <mspproductions@...> writes:

>Direct to digital with a high quality cassette deck is best. Using an
>external ADC is also a good idea as most sound cards and mother board
>sound chips have a lot of noise.

Like my Apogee Duet or Symphony?



>Is there any indication if the tape was recorded with Dolby NR?=20
>
>What brand is the tape? Any markings like "Normal" "Chrome", "Type I"
>"Type II" or "Type III"?

I asked previously and I don't believe there was an answer.  Being a tape
lecture, I'd wager it was recorded on a low-quality Fe2O3 tape.  There's
likely to be print-through, dropout (from both print-through and adhesion
losses) and curl.



>A cassette to cassette copy would lower the S/N by at least 3 dB and
>add wow and flutter to the copy.

At least!
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker    VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

Well I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

On 25/02/2013 11:58, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote:
> Matt Patoray <mspproductions@...> writes:
>
>> Direct to digital with a high quality cassette deck is best. Using an
>> external ADC is also a good idea as most sound cards and mother board
>> sound chips have a lot of noise.
> Like my Apogee Duet or Symphony?
>
>
>
>> Is there any indication if the tape was recorded with Dolby NR?=20
>>
>> What brand is the tape? Any markings like "Normal" "Chrome", "Type I"
>> "Type II" or "Type III"?
> I asked previously and I don't believe there was an answer.
He is going to get it done elsewhere...

> Being a tape
> lecture, I'd wager it was recorded on a low-quality Fe2O3 tape.  There's
> likely to be print-through, dropout (from both print-through and adhesion
> losses) and curl.
>

I have had virtually no success in getting any thing that's even half
listen-able too off cassette tapes, even pro Dolby tapes. I have tried
reasonable quality tape players (there is a Sharp RT-100 connected into
this computer at the moment) and also dedicated external USB connected
dedicated archival devices. Frankly the quality I difference is so
dependant on the original material I don't think you could tell the
difference between my best efforts and for mono at least, playing the
sound back and recording into the Microphone built into my old M700
laptop. The degradation is minimal compared to the garbage that comes
off the tape. In fact the more you try and enhance them, often the worse
they sound. In this modern age of loss-less, noise free digital copying
we have forgotten how utterly appalling the quality of the "Compact
Cassette" was...

>
>> A cassette to cassette copy would lower the S/N by at least 3 dB and
>> add wow and flutter to the copy.
> At least!


--
Dave Wade G4UGM
Illegitimi Non Carborundum

On Feb 24, 2013, at 7:19 PM, PhillipP wrote:

> I don't consider myself an expert by any means on this topic, but
> assuming that the tape is playable, wouldn't it be smarter to make a
> tape-to-tape copy to allow for more precise digitization of that copy?
>
> -Phillip
>

In almost all cases, it's best to be able to digitize the original
tape, not an analog dub.  No dub is an exact clone in the analog
world, so there will be some form of degradation with the dubbed
copy.  High quality copying equipment can minimize the problems, but
the copy -will- be not as good as the original, other than being
recorded on new tape stock.  Sometimes, that trade-off is the better
choice, but usually not.  If the original is able to be played to make
an analog copy, then it can be played to make a digitized copy.

In the digital world, there are processes that can be used to improve
a not-so-good recording, like noise removal, and even peak distortion.

73 de Ray

On Mon, Feb 25, 2013 at 12:59:33AM -0600, Kyle Owen wrote:
> The DB-25 connector on the back
> is actually part of a removable module.
>
I would pull the module and trace the wiring to the connector. Do one or
both of pins 2 & 3 go to some RS-232 interface chip? Is 7 ground? Does
the module have a UART on it?  Is this the only connector on the printer?

From which pin goes to the receiver you can tell if its wired DTE or DCE.
You might need a null modem.

> I have some of these Bugbooks, so do many here including Dan R if I remember
> correctly.

I've got a pile of them, very useful references. I used to find them in the
Blacksburg YMCA store's book section now and then, which is how I found out
about them. The 8080/8085 two-book series is excellent and what got me started
in 8080/8085 assembly programming and low-level design.

The Floyd museum is something I've been meaning to check out...my parents live
an hour away in southern WV so perhaps we can make a stop next time we're down
on vacation. I'd heard of the Floyd country store when I was in school at
Virginia Tech, but didn't know a computer museum existed!

Thanks,
Jonathan

> Jon Chapman (? - do you want to bring your Altair 8800 instead and I can
> bring something else?)

I HAVE AN ALTAIR?! How'd I miss that?!

I was thinking about bringing my current long-term 8 bit
modern-homebrew-with-vintage-processors project, or my Intel SDK-85. I do have
the IMSAI up and going as well. Or I could bring the little 8085 SBC system I've
designed.

Thanks,
Jonathan

> For small odd little things like that I've been turning to ebay...mainly
> because folks there don't charge $5-10 minimum shipping charges for $1 worth
> of components like the big online electronics places do...

Mouser isn't too bad with their shipping, as long as you're OK with with using
modern parts. I almost always have a couple of things on the parts "waiting
list" that get thrown on when I have real reason to place an order.

Thanks,
Jonathan

--- On Mon, 2/25/13, Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:

> I have had virtually no success in getting any thing that's
> even half
> listen-able too off cassette tapes, even pro Dolby tapes.

You must be doing something wrong. I mean, sure, I've run across a few bad
recordings and damaged tapes, but by and large, cassettes sound quite good. I
use them regularly. A good recording on good tape can really sound fantastic.
Are you sure your cassette player is aligned properly? Do you live near a
massive power transformer or other source of magnetic interference? Indian
burial ground?

> In this modern age of loss-less, noise free
> digital copying
> we have forgotten how utterly appalling the quality of the
> "Compact
> Cassette" was...

Some low grade tape is truly bad. But, again, cassettes can sound very, very
good - don't dismiss the format entirely. It's not digital, no, but it's not
8-track either.

-Ian

> Since this is smaller event I was planning to go with what will fit in my
> Golf. I might be able to remove the Teletype from the stand to be able to
> bring it.  That does cause problems for chad collection.

Does the back seat still come out? We were able to get a PDP-11/05 comfortably
in the back of the Rabbit with the seat just folded up.

Thanks,
Jonathan

On 25/02/2013 15:16, Mr Ian Primus wrote:
> --- On Mon, 2/25/13, Dave Wade <dave.g4ugm@...> wrote:
>
>> I have had virtually no success in getting any thing that's
>> even half
>> listen-able too off cassette tapes, even pro Dolby tapes.
> You must be doing something wrong. I mean, sure, I've run across a few bad
recordings and damaged tapes, but by and large, cassettes sound quite good. I
use them regularly. A good recording on good tape can really sound fantastic.
Are you sure your cassette player is aligned properly? Do you live near a
massive power transformer or other source of magnetic interference? Indian
burial ground?
Nope the nearest thing is the local trams which are about 300yds (two
blocks) away.

http://www.altrincham.org.uk/PublicTransport.asp

I have tried a selection of cassette players, a selection of sound
cards, and it always sounds naff when I play back the resulting audio,
be it in the car, on a computer or via my Android phone....
>> In this modern age of loss-less, noise free
>> digital copying
>> we have forgotten how utterly appalling the quality of the
>> "Compact
>> Cassette" was...
> Some low grade tape is truly bad. But, again, cassettes can sound very, very
good - don't dismiss the format entirely. It's not digital, no, but it's not
8-track either.

No but compare to any reel to reel how can 1/16" tracks on  1/4" wide
tape at 1.75ips  ever sound "good". There were some less worse devices
that worked at double speed, but I still don't think they are/were
brilliant.

>
> -Ian
>
>
> ttp://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
Dave
G4UGM

-------- Original Message --------
> From: "Systems Glitch" <systems.glitch@...>
> Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 10:38 AM
> To: midatlanticretro@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [midatlanticretro] Roll Call for VCF E
>
> > Jon Chapman (? - do you want to bring your Altair 8800 instead and I
can
> > bring something else?)
>
> I HAVE AN ALTAIR?! How'd I miss that?!
>
> I was thinking about bringing my current long-term 8 bit
modern-homebrew-with-vintage-processors project, or my Intel SDK-85. I do
have the IMSAI up and going as well. Or I could bring the little 8085 SBC
system I've designed.
>

Please bring something that would have primarily made up of stuff from
1974-1976 if you can.  that's why I was suggesting the Altair 8800.  The
target theme for TCF is "homebrew" era.
bd

> Please bring something that would have primarily made up of stuff from
> 1974-1976 if you can.

Can I bring the Intel SDK-85? That's from 1977 and was popular as a hobbyist
controller board and educational tool. It'll talk to a teletype over current
loop too.

> that's why I was suggesting the Altair 8800

It would have to be someone else's Altair as I don't own one. If you want to
bring yours I can bring a bunch of the homebrew boards I've got. I can write a
program to scroll a message across the little LED display on one of my Solid
State Music IO-2 boards or control something else.

Thanks,
Jonathan